Ability Delay -- Character Responsiveness (This will make or break SW:TOR)

[HomeSlixe]

no one seems to be used to gcd, the reason it feels different than wow is because it is different than wow

[Zioep]

Signed. I cited the combat issue in my cancellation feedback. Hopefully this is addressed, and BW responds to these issues.

 

So did I. I can't keep playing if this stays.

[Halacs]

no one seems to be used to gcd, the reason it feels different than wow is because it is different than wow

 

If it was just the GCD that was the problem that would be another thing. The cast animation adding more time to spell is not right. When the cast bar is done its 1.5s cast, I should be able to shoot off an instant or move my toon without my cast being canceled or the second one not even going off.

 

If they want the animation to be the CD then remove the cast bar.

[ShadowMasterRP]

no one seems to be used to gcd, the reason it feels different than wow is because it is different than wow

 

...what? Are you seriously saying WoW has no global cooldown?

 

WoW has global cooldowns and has an ability queue.

SWTOR also has global cooldowns and an ability queue.

 

Yet SWTOR has this issue and WoW doesn't.

[hulduet]

no one seems to be used to gcd, the reason it feels different than wow is because it is different than wow

 

GCD isn't my problem. For me it works like in any other game that uses it. My problem is the delay(0.5s) before the game acknowledges my keyboard press and the character performs that action. In WoW it's instant, in EQ2 it's instant, in lotro it's instant, CO it's instant, DC Universe it's instant... the list goes on. This is the first mmo i've played where i have encountered this problem. I haven't played any game that has this sort of "delay" unless you count in *latency* well above 500ms+. At that point, yes, you would get these issues.

 

I remember playing WoW a couple of years ago when my isp had a bad day. My latency was around 700ms or so. At that point it felt like it does in swtor right now. Kinda funny because my latency in swtor is around 30-50.

[Bollah]

It got worst now, or it might be just me. For example, if you now mount up exactly when you are supposed to it will "lag" instead of the failed mounting animation.

 

In PvP it is impossible to play optimally due to this. I don't complain over anything but this is really really annoying.

[Opiatesalvation]

OK, I've played around with this issue a lot today. It did always seem to feel a bit unresponsive in combat and I felt out of control. This thread really hit the nail on the head. But now i think i've got something figured out.

 

First off, that queue delay seconds thing in preferences? Keep it at max, 1.0. Now what this does is you have 1 second before the finish of your current move to queue up your next move. Using this queue is really key to control in combat, something it took me 26 1/2 levels to realize.

 

You don't control this game like wow. It controls like KOTOR, except you queue 1 action rather than three. I think if the window to queue was increased to 1.5 seconds (that's how long GCD is right?) it would work a little better. I think everything in my rotations under this mind set works great now except when i queue too early into GCD.

 

I know, many are thinking i'm a drunk troll.

 

I first noticed control problems trying to throw affliction up on all targets, just like corrupting everything as a wow lock. Seemed like sometimes my spell just wouldn't go off. But that was because i was trying to do it like a wow lock instead of using this queue system. It's hard to explain. Now that i've figured out how this queue thing works i think it's actually easier to do than in wow. It's a totally different system than wow, more of an RPG feel than an action feel. I like it. Some will not even after understanding how it works.

 

Oh, PVP itself just seems laggy though. It takes a looong time after i queue anything before it really goes off.

[AngryWeaponX]

Not sure if this was already mentioned but the reason theres massive skill delay and GCD is cause BW wanted the animations to play out smoothly. Completely retarted notion i know. But thats how it is.

 

What i really want them to fix is the skill not ready yet error myself and guildmates are getting, particularly on marauder.

[Halacs]

OK, I've played around with this issue a lot today. It did always seem to feel a bit unresponsive in combat and I felt out of control. This thread really hit the nail on the head. But now i think i've got something figured out.

 

First off, that queue delay seconds thing in preferences? Keep it at max, 1.0. Now what this does is you have 1 second before the finish of your current move to queue up your next move. Using this queue is really key to control in combat, something it took me 26 1/2 levels to realize.

 

You don't control this game like wow. It controls like KOTOR, except you queue 1 action rather than three. I think if the window to queue was increased to 1.5 seconds (that's how long GCD is right?) it would work a little better. I think everything in my rotations under this mind set works great now except when i queue too early into GCD.

 

I know, many are thinking i'm a drunk troll.

 

I first noticed control problems trying to throw affliction up on all targets, just like corrupting everything as a wow lock. Seemed like sometimes my spell just wouldn't go off. But that was because i was trying to do it like a wow lock instead of using this queue system. It's hard to explain. Now that i've figured out how this queue thing works i think it's actually easier to do than in wow. It's a totally different system than wow, more of an RPG feel than an action feel. I like it. Some will not even after understanding how it works.

 

Oh, PVP itself just seems laggy though. It takes a looong time after i queue anything before it really goes off.

 

Yeah I tried some variations with the timer and it did help a bit but was not a full soulution. But others should try it for sure, might work for them since it seems like it works for some.

[SoleVillain]

This is completely false and ridiculous. I play a smuggler, scoundrel that heals on Port Nowhere. After reading this post I knew I had to run some tests. My heal spells activate the very INSTANT I press the hotkeys. This entire thread is BS, plain and simple.

[ShadowMasterRP]

Not sure if this was already mentioned but the reason theres massive skill delay and GCD is cause BW wanted the animations to play out smoothly. Completely retarted notion i know. But thats how it is.

 

The problem with that is... the animations STILL don't play out.

 

They are waaaaaaaaaay too long to actuall perform fully with a few exceptions for instant abilities with short animations.

 

Lots of other things get chewed up anyway, especially things like drinking, buffing, etc. etc. etc.

 

So not only do I not get to enjoy the animations, but I can't get proper responsiveness either.

 

Neither aspect is working as intended because animations are too long for an MMO to begin with. They need to be made much faster to allow players to have proper mobility and liveliness to their actions. And by faster I mean even faster than the GCD, not just barely fitting into it or being even longer.

[Halacs]

This is completely false and ridiculous. I play a smuggler, scoundrel that heals on Port Nowhere. After reading this post I knew I had to run some tests. My heal spells activate the very INSTANT I press the hotkeys. This entire thread is BS, plain and simple.

 

For you it works, thats fantastic. For me and my guild plus a lot of others this is a problem. Videos have been posted as well. But hey you come tell us its not real, it will go away.

[mrbiggggy]

tbh i have noticed what the OP is talking about

 

i just dont feel like im really there

 

its too laggy or disconnected

 

bw needs to fix this in addition to the ui bugs

 

AND they need to get mods working

 

this **** needs to be in beta still

 

pretty sure this one is going to be rift in a few months

 

really sad

[TipsyDrow]

This is completely false and ridiculous. I play a smuggler, scoundrel that heals on Port Nowhere. After reading this post I knew I had to run some tests. My heal spells activate the very INSTANT I press the hotkeys. This entire thread is BS, plain and simple.

 

You're wrong. use a skill that has an animation that last longer then the cast time, que up an instant, or move mbefore the animation is complete but the cast time is done. You will hten see what over 1000 of us know to be true.

[aureliastarr]

OK, I've played around with this issue a lot today. It did always seem to feel a bit unresponsive in combat and I felt out of control. This thread really hit the nail on the head. But now i think i've got something figured out.

 

First off, that queue delay seconds thing in preferences? Keep it at max, 1.0. Now what this does is you have 1 second before the finish of your current move to queue up your next move. Using this queue is really key to control in combat, something it took me 26 1/2 levels to realize.

 

You don't control this game like wow. It controls like KOTOR, except you queue 1 action rather than three. I think if the window to queue was increased to 1.5 seconds (that's how long GCD is right?) it would work a little better. I think everything in my rotations under this mind set works great now except when i queue too early into GCD.

 

I know, many are thinking i'm a drunk troll.

 

I first noticed control problems trying to throw affliction up on all targets, just like corrupting everything as a wow lock. Seemed like sometimes my spell just wouldn't go off. But that was because i was trying to do it like a wow lock instead of using this queue system. It's hard to explain. Now that i've figured out how this queue thing works i think it's actually easier to do than in wow. It's a totally different system than wow, more of an RPG feel than an action feel. I like it. Some will not even after understanding how it works.

 

Oh, PVP itself just seems laggy though. It takes a looong time after i queue anything before it really goes off.

 

But... But... I don't want to play "The Sims".... I want to play a MMO with a responsive ability system.

[SoleVillain]

You're wrong. use a skill that has an animation that last longer then the cast time, que up an instant, or move mbefore the animation is complete but the cast time is done. You will hten see what over 1000 of us know to be true.

 

Wrong. Everything is responsive on my end. What would make me believe you? Your numbers for "over 1000" came completely from your ***.

[aureliastarr]

Wrong. Everything is responsive on my end. What would make me believe you? Your numbers for "over 1000" came completely from your ***.

 

Please this is too important to just bicker needlessly. I understand why you feel the way you do... but have you watched any of the videos in this thread? Please read through this thread and watch the videos and if you have played any other MMOs before consider the point that is being made and ask yourself if it COULD be done as they are saying... would you prefer it that way or not.... if not that's fine. We can agree to disagree... but don't just dismiss this.

[Xcore]

Wrong. Everything is responsive on my end. What would make me believe you? Your numbers for "over 1000" came completely from your ***.

 

You have no grasp of the subject, read 20-80 pages (prior to page 100) and educate through this. Some (some meaning only parts of the problem) are documented in the videos edited into the original post.

[Halacs]

Wrong. Everything is responsive on my end. What would make me believe you? Your numbers for "over 1000" came completely from your ***.

 

You're here to try and discredit something that is real, or trolling hard. Either way it exists. Say what you want. I'm glad it works for you. Like I said before my guild and many other on the forums have to dissagree with you. Tons of posts talking about this problem, this is just the longest running one. Lots of videos to be found as well.

 

You have nothing to add to this conversation. You are only here to argue.

[TurtlesAWD]

Posting for agreement.

 

Bioware, please don't let the biodrones confuse you. If you change this to a more responsive system every single person who's saying nothing is wrong now will enjoy the changes just as much as the rest of us.

[Opiatesalvation]

But... But... I don't want to play "The Sims".... I want to play a MMO with a responsive ability system.

 

lol, well i guess that this isn't for you. I'm sure when people get used to queueing a skill and waiting for it to go off you'll either love or hate that. I think it rewards more fore-thought in skill usage and is trying to dissuade the playstyle in wow of button smashing that a lot of classes could do.

 

Some abilities may just be broken. I hear a lot of complaints out of smugglers and melee classes than casters/ranged. Healing is perfectlly smooth now. I don't mash my heal key rapidly like in wow. When my heal is almost finished a queue my next action, whether it's another heal, bubble, or lightning. My heal finishes and it goes straight into the action i queued up. Repeat. Now when the queue was set to 0 and i was smashing buttons rapidly after casts **** was unbearable.

 

Individual abilities may be bugged though, I've only played SI and BH. I hate how with my BH i click my rocket attack, so first the hand comes up, i hear some click sounds, and then the rocket launches. But I think all that is just intended by BW. Bring stuff like that up specifically.

 

TLDR- You're doing it wrong

Edited December 28, 2011 by Opiatesalvation

[MagicmanNC]

I haven't noticed it either on my Sentinel. In fact, I really like how the animations match up with the damage (numbers popping up when the lightsaber hits the enemy in the face etc.). I also like how the stun from Crippling Throw doesn't take effect until the animation shows the lightsaber hitting the Imp. I like how when I mount my speeder, I'm not able to take 3-4 fast-forward steps and then my mount appears after I'm already moving.

 

I'm not logging back in tonight to check (not am I slogging through 200+ pages of QQ to see if someone's tried this), but I wonder if after using Crippling Throw you are unable to use any lightsaber (or other) abilities until after you catch your lightsaber on its return trip, GCD be damned. I think it would be great if this is how it works.

 

This is what happens when the masses of people are so conditioned to DBM/GCDs/anything else on the screen that they don't pay attention what their character is actually doing.

[FobManX]

I haven't noticed it either on my Sentinel. In fact, I really like how the animations match up with the damage (numbers popping up when the lightsaber hits the enemy in the face etc.). I also like how the stun from Crippling Throw doesn't take effect until the animation shows the lightsaber hitting the Imp. I like how when I mount my speeder, I'm not able to take 3-4 fast-forward steps and then my mount appears after I'm already moving.

 

I'm not logging back in tonight to check (not am I slogging through 200+ pages of QQ to see if someone's tried this), but I wonder if after using Crippling Throw you are unable to use any lightsaber (or other) abilities until after you catch your lightsaber on its return trip, GCD be damned. I think it would be great if this is how it works.

 

This is what happens when the masses of people are so conditioned to DBM/GCDs/anything else on the screen that they don't pay attention what their character is actually doing.

 

I've had a few issues with Sentinel. It's really only with Cauterize, Zealous Strike, and occasionally Master Strike. Something about the animation of those abilities screws up the response system. Or sometimes I'll use, say Zealous Strike, it'll consume a GCD, but won't actually do anything. ZS wont be on CD, I won't have my 6 Focus, it'll basically be as if I wasted a GCD doing literally nothing.

[Xcore]

lol, well i guess that this isn't for you. I'm sure when people get used to queueing a skill and waiting for it to go off you'll either love or hate that. I think it rewards more fore-thought in skill usage and is trying to dissuade the playstyle in wow of button smashing that a lot of classes could do.

 

Some abilities may just be broken. I hear a lot of complaints out of smugglers and melee classes than casters/ranged. Healing is perfectlly smooth now. I don't mash my heal key rapidly like in wow. When my heal is almost finished a queue my next action, whether it's another heal, bubble, or lightning. My heal finishes and it goes straight into the action i queued up. Repeat. Now when the queue was set to 0 and i was smashing buttons rapidly after casts **** was unbearable.

 

Individual abilities may be bugged though, I've only played SI and BH. I hate how with my BH i click my rocket attack, so first the hand comes up, i hear some click sounds, and then the rocket launches. But I think all that is just intended by BW. Bring stuff like that up specifically.

 

TLDR- You're doing it wrong

 

I don't think you truly understand "Button-Mashing", it is not actually "HULK SMASH" button mashing to victory, the faster and harder you hit it the better you are. WoW style combat is not only every bit of strategic but even more so because it allows for greater movement, greater strategic elements such as fake casting, combinations of bursts, more complex rotations... etc.

 

Whats that Tank game? Scorched Earth? you know where you're a tank on a mountain side just shooting other tanks via trajectory calculation (factoring in wind effects)... by your logic this is the epitome of strategic combat...

 

Again, don't allow yourself to cloud your own understanding due to love or hate for one game or company or another. This system is not superior... no matter how you spin it.

[Hamstaxo]

This is completely false and ridiculous. I play a smuggler, scoundrel that heals on Port Nowhere. After reading this post I knew I had to run some tests. My heal spells activate the very INSTANT I press the hotkeys. This entire thread is BS, plain and simple.

 

join battleground -> try the same -> see difference -> be silent