I did the exploit...

[Infernixx]

You took bad advice. You made a mistake. Mistakes do have consequences many times. They have in fact acted on exploiters in the past.. and you know that.. so you accepted a rationalized lie.

 

Did you immediately /destroy the items gained and report the issue to Bioware via a ticket? No? Then no sympathy from me. But hey.. maybe they take your circumstances into consideration, maybe not.

 

Personally, I bet they are gentle with anyone that did it only once.. as the fact that you did not do it again indicates no negative motive to exploit for gain. Then again.. maybe not. 2015 could be the year of the exploiter smack-downs for SWTOR. /shrug.

 

The mistake I made was based on the fact that BW has an established history and pattern of ignoring exploiters and simply fixing exploits and moving on without punishing anyone involved.

 

If BW is all about remembering that they hate exploiters, then they can start with a clean slate as of now. But, if they insist on punishing people who acted according to BW's own patterns of behavior, then they're going to end up with far more anger and frustration than they currently have.

 

Was it a mistake? Sure. I admit that I exploited. Did I do so with the expectation that BW will simply fix it(and they did) and simply move on? Oh yes. Because that's how they've reacted every other time to every other major exploit.

 

Again, not an excuse. A reasoning and explanation. Simply put, if they'd come down on those who'd exploited Nefra, we wouldn't be in this mess.

[Drockter]

I did it a total of 5 times. 3 on one server, 2 on another.

 

My main reason for this is because I wanted to optimize my characters, and I was told if I didn't do the exploit I would be kicked from my raiding team entirely. That's my only reason for doing it.

 

I was also told to give a guild crafter one of those purple mats, so I gave him one and he gave me a barrel in return. I haven't done anything with the other mats as they are sitting in my inventory.

 

I know some guild members who have done it 10+ times, I know the people who told me about it. In fact the first time I did it, I didn't even know. Some guildie invited me to a group I was just told to set the ops group to 16m story and I told the I've already done Ravagers on 8 man, but he obviously went in and looted. I guess I must have unknowingly assisted with someone to do it.

 

I obviously regret doing it, but I was wondering what the circumstances have to be in order to be punished. What sort of punishment will there be? Will I be permabanned from the game? How many times is bannable? If you've got schematics from the items and made millions of credits, is that more of an offense?

 

You have guts to stand up and admit it, and I respect that. I hope it works out for you... you genuinely seem remorseful, hopefully that will be taken into account. EA/BW will need to make the final determination. While others have suggested you delete what ever you have... I'd recommend you just store it, and do not use it... and wait to see what BW is going to do... they haven't announced the plan. But by all means, follow-up with customer service.

 

Regardless of what happens... if this is the attitude of your guild... frankly... I'd find another one... on the very first "do this or else", my response would have been caught by the profanity filter, quickly followed by a /gquit and a report, with screen shots.

[Chewbacta]

Again, not an excuse. A reasoning and explanation. Simply put, if they'd come down on those who'd exploited Nefra, we wouldn't be in this mess.

 

Well, 'we' who don't exploit were never in a mess to begin with. You did the crime, I hope you do the time. No sympathy here.

[TheNahash]

I sent a ticket the very same day I did it thank you very much. No response yet though.

 

And you don't even realize what's wrong with that sentence, do you?

[Alexerjones]

So heres my thoughts. Remember when Dread Palace was bugged? Council was impossible to clear. How much gear was lost on just that bug? Any how many other massive bugs have hit flashpoints and ops over the years? Now that one bug throws free gear our way, Bioware is bringing out the knives. Think about it. Its not like this cost bioware money, and punishing people will.

[Savej]

This is a tough one. Things like PvP win trading doesn't have an obvious, easy fix and didn't result in anyone getting in game advantage so wasn't really a huge deal. But bugs like this one being allowed to go unchecked and exploiters of it unpunished in any way is a bit of a game killer for me. When I say "punish" I mean the exploit benefits need to be removed/reversed from those that used them. I don't blame the players and would hate it if we were expected/required to report each other, but their gains can't be allowed to persist. I've left other games i've really liked (AC1, CoH) after they've had similar breakdowns. Edited January 13, 2015 by Savej

[DyreMaker]

But, what we're getting is an inconsistent message. 'This' exploit is getting all kinds of attention and talk of punishment while all the rest are conveniently ignored and hand-waved away

 

There is so much blame to go around here. Releasing this software version with many known issues just before a 2 week vacation out of town by the entire company is completely unheard of, complete negligence. I heard players on the PTS knew about it on the first day it was released onto the open public servers. Then I had no idea what the exploit was until I read it on here. Coming from the same people who are asking for heads to roll. No idea they most likely were making it 100 times worse. Despite BW's efforts to remove the posts they are still cached on google, even today. Human nature is human nature, it is impossible to avoid but I am hoping they just punish the very first person/guild that started this whole mess even though I also feel BW has a lot to answer for. Punishing everyone that participated in it, all the way down to those who purchased exploited mods is too much just to appease a few hotheads, who BTW are insignificantly smaller than the number of those that will quit the game if too drastic of measures are taken.

Edited January 13, 2015 by DyreMaker

[EvenHardNiner]

And you don't even realize what's wrong with that sentence, do you?

 

I did the exploit then after regretting doing it I sent a ticket.

[arinbatastini]

I mentioned a little of this before, but I too used the exploit. I did 8 person SM and the final boss didn't drop a thing. The entire opperation was bugged, but the final boss didn't drop a thing. So I exited the operation and went back in. There was the loot. I am sure everyone in that operations group did this. There are 8 people everyone is saying to ban because BW delivered a release with known issues. This was a known issue.

 

If BW said... Hey everyone. There is a bug in the Ravegers and we concider it an exploit. Don't use it. Then we wouldn't have used it. THEY DIDN'T. They knew about it and they didn't say a word. That is the biggest problem with this entire thing. BW didn't say a word. Didn't try to fix it. Didn't do a thing.

 

I put in two tickets about this. BW sent back a form letter in one and I sent in another. The second response was, sorry the holidays are busy here and we can't do anything for you. Operation loot is sent out randomly and what you get is what you get.

[Rusah]

ON the issue of punishment i think fair would be to strip them of any gear (and not replace it with lower just leave the slots empty, they can grind old heroics for comms to replace it), cash, mats, basically anything at all gained through this exploit. Then slap them with a 1 week ban.

 

Yeah the raid was broken, but so what, that is not a valid reason to take advantage of it. If everyone said hey it is ok to rob a few corner shops would you. Of course not because it is wrong, just as this was wrong to do just on a smaller scale than the example i just provided.

 

End of the day people had a choice, do the right thing, or do the wrong thing. Those that chose the wrong thing (especially those that chose it because it was got away with last time), made a choice to do something they should not, and now there are consequences to that action.

 

The only ones i have any sympathy for are the ones that did it by accident and owned up to it straight away (and by straight away i mean the same day it happened). The rest deserve to be punished.

 

Personally i have not done ravagers raid yet, i learned about the exploit on the forums here from one of the many threads that popped up. Once i learned of this i stayed away from that raid so that i did not even accidentally become involved. I had the choice to exploit for easy gear, i chose not to do it.

 

I'm sure some people will say that myself and others that think like me are being harsh, but when it comes down to it people have free will, you make your choices, you deal with the consequences. Just the way it is.

Edited January 13, 2015 by Rusah

[Drockter]

If BW said... Hey everyone. There is a bug in the Ravegers and we concider it an exploit. Don't use it. Then we wouldn't have used it. THEY DIDN'T. They knew about it and they didn't say a word. That is the biggest problem with this entire thing. BW didn't say a word. Didn't try to fix it. Didn't do a thing.

 

This doesn't excuse ANYTHING. If people knowingly took part in the exploit, they have earned whatever consequence comes their way.

[TheNahash]

The mistake I made was based on the fact that BW has an established history and pattern of ignoring exploiters and simply fixing exploits and moving on without punishing anyone involved.

 

If BW is all about remembering that they hate exploiters, then they can start with a clean slate as of now. But, if they insist on punishing people who acted according to BW's own patterns of behavior, then they're going to end up with far more anger and frustration than they currently have.

 

Was it a mistake? Sure. I admit that I exploited. Did I do so with the expectation that BW will simply fix it(and they did) and simply move on? Oh yes. Because that's how they've reacted every other time to every other major exploit.

 

Again, not an excuse. A reasoning and explanation. Simply put, if they'd come down on those who'd exploited Nefra, we wouldn't be in this mess.

 

Yet, it somehow sounds like an excuse. And, I'm sorry but it isn't a good one.

 

The fact Bioware didn't punish people for the previous exploits was a very bad move and it set a terrible precedent of apathy. It also paints them in a negative light that they waited so long to fix it.

But, this is where your excuse or reasoning, explanation or whatever else you want to call it ends.

 

You did something you knew was against the rules.

I've read some of your posts here and there. I never really thought you were unreasonable.

The fact that you are trying to make what you did sound reasonable by saying that "other people in the past didn't get punished" is an extremely bad excuse. It's like saying I stole because people in the past have gotten away with it.

Just because someone does something wrong and doesn't get punished, doesn't make it alright for you to do it.

 

 

 

And again, I'm sorry but it seems like people in this forum have no idea whatsoever what "having guts" means.

 

Having guts means knowing how to do something that is against the rules that would clearly benefit you, and making the conscious decision to NOT do it.

 

Exploiting something, knowingly breaking the rules and then only coming clean once it's clear you are going to get punished is clearly, 100% NOT having guts.

 

Let's not make martyrs out of people who really do not deserve it.

 

Infernixx, this is probably going to sound like a personal attack, but I assure you it is not.

But, man, "I did it because others did it in the past and didn't get punished" doesn't really make what you did better.

[DyreMaker]

I mentioned a little of this before, but I too used the exploit. I did 8 person SM and the final boss didn't drop a thing. The entire opperation was bugged, but the final boss didn't drop a thing. So I exited the operation and went back in. There was the loot. I am sure everyone in that operations group did this. There are 8 people everyone is saying to ban because BW delivered a release with known issues. This was a known issue.

 

If BW said... Hey everyone. There is a bug in the Ravegers and we concider it an exploit. Don't use it. Then we wouldn't have used it. THEY DIDN'T. They knew about it and they didn't say a word. That is the biggest problem with this entire thing. BW didn't say a word. Didn't try to fix it. Didn't do a thing.

 

I put in two tickets about this. BW sent back a form letter in one and I sent in another. The second response was, sorry the holidays are busy here and we can't do anything for you. Operation loot is sent out randomly and what you get is what you get.

 

That is starting to make sense. The story I heard was that the operation was not dropping loot, customer service got tired of the calls while there was no one in the office but a skeleton crew to handle calls so they 'fixed it", somehow turned the loot on to the extent it could be exploited. So it sounds like loot was not dropping in PTS, they knew about it, CS tried to fix it alone without development's help and that started the whole thing, the rest was simply a naturally occurring avalanche of human nature.

Edited January 13, 2015 by DyreMaker

[TominatorBriss]

Tbh from my point of veiw those who exploited are a disgrace, call yourself gamers? meh

dont care what reasons you had for doing it, you got a brain put 2 and 2 together think about what your doing

next time play with some pride and respect for the games rules

 

sorry if its harsh but its true

[grombrinda]

Tbh from my point of veiw those who exploited are a disgrace, call yourself gamers? meh

dont care what reasons you had for doing it, you got a brain put 2 and 2 together think about what your doing

next time play with some pride and respect for the games rules

 

sorry if its harsh but its true

 

And you never used the Mario glitch to get infinite lives??.....Or maybe the good old left right nintendo trick??

 

Omg when you guys fight this much for pixels, man it's time to stand back and do a little rethinking.....

[Feargal]

All this from the guy who was crowing in another thread how he sold a single unit of a crafting mat for millions. I hope karma is the ***** she is claimed to be.

[Tsillah]

I mentioned a little of this before, but I too used the exploit. I did 8 person SM and the final boss didn't drop a thing. The entire opperation was bugged, but the final boss didn't drop a thing. So I exited the operation and went back in. There was the loot. I am sure everyone in that operations group did this. There are 8 people everyone is saying to ban because BW delivered a release with known issues. This was a known issue.

 

If BW said... Hey everyone. There is a bug in the Ravegers and we concider it an exploit. Don't use it. Then we wouldn't have used it. THEY DIDN'T. They knew about it and they didn't say a word. That is the biggest problem with this entire thing. BW didn't say a word. Didn't try to fix it. Didn't do a thing.

 

I put in two tickets about this. BW sent back a form letter in one and I sent in another. The second response was, sorry the holidays are busy here and we can't do anything for you. Operation loot is sent out randomly and what you get is what you get.

 

Listen, we are all accountable ourselves. If you didn't get loot from a fight and went back in and there's loot, there is no reason to assume it was a bug and you got lucky. However, anything beyond that could be considered an exploit depending on the situation. That's why I am sure BW will investigate and set a more fair threshold for what was exploiting and what wasn't.

 

The ticket is standard CS ********. They clearly didn't even read it. They just scanned it and did an auto-reply. Total piss poor CS. But that's another topic, albeit my main gripe with BW.

[thetimetraveler-]

It take guts to admit it, though you could have said no there was some social pressure on you. If I was in your place, I would delete all the mats right now and contact CS and explain it to them. They might ban you or they might thank you for coming forward, however, for me I think it is too little too late as this should have been done before Eric's post.

 

Yeah it takes guts, especially after they already posted that they know who did it and that they will be punished. Hahahahahahaaha! Nooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooob.

[znihilist]

Not everyone gives in to social or peer pressure. Not everyone is uncomfortable with "social discomfort". Some even specialize in bucking social pressures.

 

See.. for a good number of human beings.. ethics and honesty are more important then mutual back scratching and supporting each others sins.

 

Yes, but one doesn't negate the other. Just because you or I don't fall into it, it doesn't mean it is not real. You are gravely underestimating the need to fit in.

 

 

In the end it doesn't negate OP's guilt on the issue.

[LanceCorporalDan]

Because it would force most of the very active and dedicated userbase to quit swtor.

 

In theory, banning everyone who used this exploit might sound nice, the same way throwing everyone who used drugs into jail and throwing away the key might sound nice. I mean, then there would be very little organized crime since all their customers are gone! The issue with both scenarios is that it will cause a lot of more harm than it will do good. No MMO can survive long term without an active, core user base.

 

Are they the most active and dedicated?

 

No MMO can survive long term without an active, core user base.

 

I seriously doubt they make up the core of this game's player base.

[VulgarMercurius]

BW knew about it, released it anyway and didn't say a word. No punishments in the past for gear exploits and no punishment for PVP exploiting which actually interferes with others enjoyment of the game.

As Infernix (I believe it was him) said, they released a shoddy piece of crap for $20 with little content (finished in an afternoon as some on here have said) and now they want to punish people for their bugs they left in there and didn't say anything about. It's ABSURD! I truly believe BW hype on this is to divide and distract the player base from the sub par and skimpy content of this release.

 

I never used the exploit. I don't care that people got free gear. And the snide people in this thread are the ones I believe should be banned.

[Bruceme]

something that took this long to correct should not be a banned offense. depending the severity of how EA comes down on the playerbase will have an effect on my continuing relationship with them.

[undiess]

*in the most snooty voice possible*

Uh, excuse me? I was told this was my Christmas present. No take backs.

 

#noragrets

Edited January 13, 2015 by undiess

[fordpre]

I think the harshest punishments will be meted out to those that organised and advertised the exploit of this bug rather than people who just took advantage. I doubt they will permaban anyone who merely joined in. Organisers are likely to be more harshly punished. Personally I say nuke all the toons on any exploiters account back to level 1

[Tsillah]

I did it a total of 5 times. 3 on one server, 2 on another.

 

My main reason for this is because I wanted to optimize my characters, and I was told if I didn't do the exploit I would be kicked from my raiding team entirely. That's my only reason for doing it.

 

I was also told to give a guild crafter one of those purple mats, so I gave him one and he gave me a barrel in return. I haven't done anything with the other mats as they are sitting in my inventory.

 

I know some guild members who have done it 10+ times, I know the people who told me about it. In fact the first time I did it, I didn't even know. Some guildie invited me to a group I was just told to set the ops group to 16m story and I told the I've already done Ravagers on 8 man, but he obviously went in and looted. I guess I must have unknowingly assisted with someone to do it.

 

I obviously regret doing it, but I was wondering what the circumstances have to be in order to be punished. What sort of punishment will there be? Will I be permabanned from the game? How many times is bannable? If you've got schematics from the items and made millions of credits, is that more of an offense?

 

If you really, truly regret what you did you will accept the punishment for it.

 

I don't know if you're an adult or not but allowing others to push you into this sort of behaviour requires a punishment so that you will remember not to do it next time and it's not your best moment. It's still up to BW to decide how they handle each case and they said they will take action in the next week or so, so you'll find out.

 

But really, it sounds more like you're afraid that you got caught and now blame it on your guild. Honestly, if you haven't left this guild, you don't deserve any pity or compassion. If you are still in this guild you simply chose again to stay amongst such players.