Dual Spec is coming - but will it 'solve everything'?

[Kharik]

Very reasonable statement. That was really the main focus of the post, is to point out that this won't be a cure-all. Sooner or later, problems can be fixed, but this is one of the glaring ones of MMO's that regardless of how hard you work, continues to loom over you.

 

What do you believe, after creating a Dual-Spec system, would be another step in the right direction? Do you agree that we, as players, need to take some accountability for the environment we have created? Our own attitude damns us more than one would think. If we simply choose to treat other with respect and help eachother, I think there would be more tanks/Healers, because they wouldn't feel the weight of the world on their shoulders.

 

Beyond that, I suppose it is up to the Devs to make a class that feels fun to play.

 

I will say, however, that last night I had a lot of fun tanking on my BH PowerTech. It was my first Heroic, and it was on level on the third planet. I could hold hate just fine, but with 4 enemies using Full-Auto at the same time (Interrupting one didn't help) my HP dropped like a rock. I died once or twice in the course of the fights, but no one ever said 'boot this ****** tank' or told me off. They worked together with me to overcome the challenge, and it made the game overall more fun.

 

There was nothing stopping them from ducking out. It's just the good nature of people that will keep me playing as a tank to help others.

 

I find that simply by having a friendly manner about yourself usually gets a friendly treatment in return. You may not be the best tank in the world but if you're a nice fella and you're trying you'll be treated alright. You will run into jerks now and then most definitely, but it's not worth judging a feature, a quest, an entire game based on your experience with a jerk who's just being a jerk.

 

Honestly the next step in my opinion would be to address instancing. Whatever system they choose, really. We don't *need* a dungeon finder - we would do just as well with a well designed, thoroughly thought out LFG system. A few menus, a nice interface to it - rather than a flag and spam system.

 

However while working on these things they of course need to be addressing real playability problems - interface delays, mobility issues, real bugs.

 

And keeping the community as a whole informed at the same time. This one is key - we like to know what they're up to! What's on the block to be worked on this week? What's being addressed right now? What's your first and last priority?

 

I like being a part of the early days of mmos - no matter how frustrating they are. If you stick through it, if you give some honest to goodness real feedback, and you support the game while your developers learn and slog through it, you'll be rewarded with a gem of a game.

[Shanerion]

It always starts out "we want to be able to do one roll for PvE and one for PvP".

What it turns into very quickly is "I use both specs for PvE. So we need 3 specs" when that wasnt what dual specs was even meant for.

 

If they have dual specs I hope they make it so the second one is only available in

warfronts and comes up automaticly when you enter one.

Or just make it very clear the answer is NO when the "we need 3 specs" starts showing up.

 

Not sure where you're getting this, cause "we need 3 specs" hasn't even popped up in WoW, and if it isn't there, don't worry about it coming here first. There needs to be some modicum of choice, I think we all realize that. When you get dual spec, you need to choose, do you take two PvE specs or a PvE and a PvP spec?

 

Thing is, it's much much easier in this game to PvP in whatever spec you please. A Tank spec is fully viable in PvP due to the way taunt works. Heals are always welcome. And any DPS spec will at least be able to perform in PvP.

 

Personally (until I hit the level cap) I would always take my first spec as whatever was most efficient to level with, combined with whatever was most useful in a Flashpoint.

 

At level cap I would take my first spec as probably Tank/Heal, and second as a solo spec that was also usable in PvP.

[Qeuzolt]

I think your point of loot whoring is moot in this game. I'm a loot whore, I know it, I try my best to not be an dick about it but when I see something that is a minor upgrade I want it and don't really care about other people in most instances.

 

With the companion system in its current state I think a Sith Sorc should be able to roll on Heavy Armor and tanking gear for their companion if no main spec tank is going to use it. What is the difference between that and a person rolling for offspec gear? None imo.

[mattperk]

i know the developers said they "want to add it soon after launch" but has there been any word on an actual time table for this?

[WilV]

i know the developers said they "want to add it soon after launch" but has there been any word on an actual time table for this?

 

"Soon" is probably the single most common and overused word by devs in every mmo. It basically means they have no time table for it but it's something hey "hope" to get in.

Edited January 9, 2012 by WilV

[Shinjin]

If I wanted to play Rift, I'd be playing Rift.

 

An important part of BioWare games is your characters having to live with the choices they make. Being able to have everything your way all the time makes everything dull and homogenous. Just like the ability to toggle off Sith corruption; again, no need to wrestle with the effects of your choices.

 

The current respec solution offers a few do overs in your character's career. That should be enough. Please stop crusading to turn this game into another "I can haz cheezeburger too" clone.

 

2c

[Barathos]

If I wanted to play Rift, I'd be playing Rift.

 

An important part of BioWare games is your characters having to live with the choices they make. Being able to have everything your way all the time makes everything dull and homogenous. Just like the ability to toggle off Sith corruption; again, no need to wrestle with the effects of your choices.

 

The current respec solution offers a few do overs in your character's career. That should be enough. Please stop crusading to turn this game into another "I can haz cheezeburger too" clone.

 

2c

 

Mass Effect 2 gave you the option to turn off Renegade corruption... Just sayin'.

[Varghjerta]

"Soon" is probably the single most common and overused word by devs in every mmo. It basically means they have no time table for it but it's something hey "hope" to get in.

 

Actually in the latest Q/A with Reid he backtracked abit and said that ofcourse had they talked about Dual specc but nothing more.

 

But people must realise that there is nothing at all determined that this game is gonna have dual Specc.-

 

Bioware have never stated that they will or will not implement it into the game

 

soon and wish and talked doesnt mean 100 % that they will do it.

Can aswell take that they wish that every Pve abilty should be useful in PvP aswell doesnt mean it will happen

 

 

 

People that are saying otherwise have either havent read what they have said or they are just lying

Edited January 9, 2012 by Varghjerta

[DoubleSpoiler]

Needing for my offspec!

[ferroz]

Now, bare with me for a second,

*bear

 

But one of the things I don't understand 100% is if this will solve PVE problems or not.

I don't think anyone says that it will solve everything. Just that it will make it better.

 

TL;DR For Part 1: The first problem is lootwhores, which is easily remedied by people working together as an efficient team. This is inconsequential, but is a slightly lesser evil to be brought in. On to the main point -

You're making a mountain out of a molehill.

 

 

 

TL;DR: Tanking and Healing won't always be chosen as the Dual-Spec. This means even with the system added, while it will surely alleviate the problem SLIGHTLY, it won't garuntee a fix. We need to find a way to really alleviate the problem, instead of a temporary band-aid!

As far as I'm aware, no one says that it will. To me it looks like you're just arguing with a strawman with this.

[GarbonzotheDude]

No one ever said it would solve everything. Simply allows for more flexibility and a person to have a build for PvE and and PvP if they choose.

 

Nothing more...nothing less

 

Far as loot rolls go a person should only be rolling for loot related to the spec they are currently using in the group. Unless no one in the group can use the item themselves then they ask if it is okay that they roll need for their other spec. Assuming you're playing with some decent folks and not complete [insert random expletive].

Edited January 9, 2012 by GarbonzotheDude

[Shinjin]

Mass Effect 2 gave you the option to turn off Renegade corruption... Just sayin'.

 

Damnit!

 

*shakes fists for pointing out flaws in my argument*

[Seyyal]

if i want a tank and dps, i will just roll another toon.

 

in fact i already have.

[Toraxa]

It may not always cause people who can heal or can tank to do so, but it will in many cases.

 

I like to heal. I've healed for years in WoW. It's a fun role to me. I want to do it here too. However, while I can technically solo all but heroic 4 quests as a healer, I have to do it very, very slowly. My tank companion does too little damage, my dps companions take too much. I sit there, healing the tank for several times as long as it'd take for any dps/dps person to just blow through it.

 

Friends of mine who quest dps can do it much quicker. Sure they can't solo the group 2 stuff, but they can blow through whole planets, grabbing a group for heroics or skipping them, two or three times faster than I can.

 

What are my options in this situation?

 

I can suck it up and stay a healer, and have to spend 4-5 minutes slowly grinding down a quest boss in the 40s, get a group for heroic 2/4 even though I can solo the former because it's just plain faster to do so, and overall be slower, and weaker.

 

Alternatively, I can spec dps for my solo quests. I can blow through them easily with a dps companion. Then swap to healer for group 2/4 and flashpoints. This is the "fastest" option, but it costs a lot of credits when I'm having to switch both directions multiple times per planet.

 

Finally, I can just tell the system to screw itself, give up the role which I want to play, because it's too inconvenient, and just stay dps. I can still swap once in a while for a flashpoint with my friends, but that's the extent of it.

 

 

People need to stop looking at PvE as one big thing. Questing and other solo content is a whole different beast to group content. Just like PvE is different from PvP. Whatever the system is, it needs to make it possible for every player to be able to do solo content at a reasonable speed, group PvE content, and contribute, and PvP to some level of success. I should not get punished in solo content so that I can be viable in group content. I should not suffer in PvE because I want to focus on PvP, or visa versa.

 

Heck, I would be happy with a system where you simply have two trees, and one is only available while in a group, and the other only available while you're not. I wouldn't be able to swap at will without paying for a respec, so all the purists can stop whining that it's ruining their "identities", but I'd still be able to be viable in both aspects.

 

In the end, why is it fair to ask more of the tanks and healers in groups, then to also make them worse in soloing, and tell them the only way to make up for these, is to pay credits to swap back and forth? Why is it fair that dps roles can do anything they want, competently, for free?