Warrgames Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 (edited) How exactly is that a problem? It's a miniscule reward to a guild for what they do. Guilds are good for this game. Guilds form raid groups, ranked PvP groups, un-ranked PvP groups, they craft the latest items because they run the high end content, they sell mats that others might otherwise never get, they write guides, they teach new players ops/FPs/WZs, they strengthen the community in every way. There's absolutely no reason in my mind why you shouldn't be able to reward a guild bank a few credits for the actions of their members. It would be a tiny perk, nothing more. Don't forget these. They exploit new players. They only benefit the core group and not ever member. They guilds that do all the right things and bring benefits to the game don't have to worry about raising money because people want to give to them. The rest of the guilds.... Edited October 30, 2014 by Warrgames Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TUXs Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 Don't forget these. They exploit new players. They only benefit the core group and not ever member. Sounds like you just joined a bad guild. How exactly were you "exploited"? The idea that they only benefit a few is ridiculous...they benefit those who act to be a part of it, not just a few. The problem I see frequently is that too few people want to put any effort into anything, they simply want to join things and have others do the work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Calsetes Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 Sounds like you just joined a bad guild. How exactly were you "exploited"? The idea that they only benefit a few is ridiculous...they benefit those who act to be a part of it, not just a few. The problem I see frequently is that too few people want to put any effort into anything, they simply want to join things and have others do the work. I think his point is that if you're in a guild that taxes its members - a relatively new member to this guild - and you want to get in on Ops, Raids, and whatever else the group does and uses those funds for, you might not get a shot at doing it because "we already have our raiders - but if a slot opens up, then we'll let you know." And slots open up. And you're not picked because you're not buddy-buddy with the guy who's in charge of picking people. I've seen it in other guilds. I've seen it happen outside of guild-related things in the real world - offices and workplaces and whatnot. People play favorites and anyone who;s not part of the "in crowd" ends up basically being enablers for that clique to keep doing what it's doing. If you're in a guild, and giving money ,and getting literally no benefit to it, then why stay in that guild? Logically speaking, a guild that acts like that wouldn't last long. But if your guild is big enough because you're always recruiting, and you have enough people just coming through the gates, doing a few things, and walking out, then not too many people would notice it and the "core group" - the real guild - would keep making money hand over iron fist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TUXs Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 I think his point is that if you're in a guild that taxes its members - a relatively new member to this guild - and you want to get in on Ops, Raids, and whatever else the group does and uses those funds for, you might not get a shot at doing it because "we already have our raiders - but if a slot opens up, then we'll let you know." And slots open up. And you're not picked because you're not buddy-buddy with the guy who's in charge of picking people. I've seen it in other guilds. I've seen it happen outside of guild-related things in the real world - offices and workplaces and whatnot. People play favorites and anyone who;s not part of the "in crowd" ends up basically being enablers for that clique to keep doing what it's doing. If you're in a guild, and giving money ,and getting literally no benefit to it, then why stay in that guild? Logically speaking, a guild that acts like that wouldn't last long. But if your guild is big enough because you're always recruiting, and you have enough people just coming through the gates, doing a few things, and walking out, then not too many people would notice it and the "core group" - the real guild - would keep making money hand over iron fist. What exactly is stopping that member from starting a 2nd Ops group? Just because you're not in the "core" group, doesn't mean you're incapable of starting your own group. I'm not in any NiM groups, but I don't whine about it...I realize it's hard content that people don't want to waste their time explaining to me just so I can go one time...know why? Because it's THEIR TIME too. If I want to run NiM Ops, I'm very capable of starting my own group. Don't blame a guild for your lack of ambition. Nobody is here to babysit other players. Guilds provide bodies and opportunities, they don't enable laziness. And really?! Hand over fist? We're talking petty amounts, not insane returns. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
azudelphi Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 (edited) I propose a new type of mission with [GUILD] as the tag. These missions would be granted from terminals that can only be placed in guild strongholds or flagships. Quick idea is to have objectives to complete certain existing dailies and weeklies or similar objectives like complete X PVP matches, GSF matches, defeat a certain world boss, raid boss, etc. These missions would be restricted by daily and weekly repeatability. There would be two tiers of rewards... [GUILD] missions would grant a few comms to the player (something like 8 basic and 5 elite for a daily, 10-12 ultimates for a weekly) and would indicate a guild reward amount of credits; estimated amount around 5k-10k for a daily, 15-25k for a weekly. If you really wanted to control inflation, you could make it such that the Guild Rewards are in a non-withdraw credit account that can be accessed for Flagship and Stronghold expansion, Flagship summoning and moving, and repairs only. Not advocating this separate account, but it would mitigate the inflationary concern. Edited October 30, 2014 by azudelphi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warrgames Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 Sounds like you just joined a bad guild. How exactly were you "exploited"? The idea that they only benefit a few is ridiculous...they benefit those who act to be a part of it, not just a few. The problem I see frequently is that too few people want to put any effort into anything, they simply want to join things and have others do the work. When WoW started this system, guilds went to the starting areas and recruited making promise that they never lived up too. Just to get the free gold from what these player looted. Guild asking for credits for guild repair fund that only benefits a group of the guild. Guild asking for crafting mats that only benefit the a group. I've been in some bad guilds and some good guilds. One thing I've noticed is the good guilds don't need this type of thing, its only the bad ones that use other players to support their core group. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TUXs Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 When WoW started this system, guilds went to the starting areas and recruited making promise that they never lived up too. Just to get the free gold from what these player looted. Guild asking for credits for guild repair fund that only benefits a group of the guild. Guild asking for crafting mats that only benefit the a group. I've been in some bad guilds and some good guilds. One thing I've noticed is the good guilds don't need this type of thing, its only the bad ones that use other players to support their core group. Yeah, at 2%-5% I see the huge exploitation you're worried about. It's not like it would be more beneficial to just run a daily mission or 2 in that time than it is to do something stupid like try to recruit players just to reap a tiny % of their tiny income... Good guilds or bad guilds has nothing to do with this...ALL guilds could use the reward from members. If your guild doesn't, go throw the $ away if you want...good guilds will find good ways to use the new funds, bad guilds will squander it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ImmortalLowlife Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 Guild tax? Hell....don't I ALREADY pay enough taxes? Sales tax, federal tax, state tax, real estate taxes, business taxes... Ohh well...this would just be another reason for me to continue playing as a solo player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TUXs Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 Guild tax? Hell....don't I ALREADY pay enough taxes? Sales tax, federal tax, state tax, real estate taxes, business taxes... Ohh well...this would just be another reason for me to continue playing as a solo player. I agree, no "tax", but a guild bonus (you get full amount, extra 2-5% gets generated for the guild) that the guild gets, to fund future guild 'stuff', would be a great idea. Guilds are good for this game! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drockter Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 Sorry Tux, just not agreeing. I see what you are saying, and no you are not proposing a "tax". But a bonus... but unlike the other bonuses that benefit the player, this would benefit who... the person the GM deems worthy of access to the funds generated? I don't see how adding more credits to the game is beneficial. Guilds have raised credits for years now by donation... (credit neutral as far as the game is concerned). Why change it now? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bdatt Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 Probably already been mentioned, but I liked wildstar' approach. Likely similar to others, but I wouldnt know. 1. Guild perk giving credit boost 8% on mob kills 2. Optional 5% guild tax on credits earned from mob kills (not quest rewards) Your benefit to being in the guild was the credit boost (and xp/rep boosts, etc), which was only partially taken away into the guild bank. Seemed fair and was blind to the player. I'd vote for my guild leader to activate if it was an option. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elfa Posted October 30, 2014 Share Posted October 30, 2014 I'm totally for a guild tax. That way its just automatically comes out and I don't have to worry about it. I also think its something that should be chosen by the player and in return for the tax, they receive full guild repair. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oyranos Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 (edited) Sorry Tux, just not agreeing. the person the GM deems worthy of access to the funds generated? I don't see how adding more credits to the game is beneficial. Guilds have raised credits for years now by donation... (credit neutral as far as the game is concerned). Why change it now? Because I have my own brand new guild and I need money, without money, there is no honey. Anyway, it would be a great as an option, 1% for smaller guilds and 2-3-4-5% for bigger guilds with more honey on them. I would also love an option for the players members of a guild, to auto configure their donation.... For example I have many alts and instead of getting credits and mail them after... to auto transfer in my guild bank And you know... its not about me asking tax from my members.. My guild is still empty because I want to offer all the comforts to my guild before I start inviting people. And that is a guild ship with all the necessary comforts (guild bank, legacy bank, some decos, etc) also a stronghold.... And all that are from my game... So logical to have a kind of a request as a minimum 1% or 0.5% ... But not mandatory. Let me give you another example. Lets say I have 20.000 or 50.000 credits per week for each member in guild bank, for their repairs managed .... Who is going to pay that for every week? I have to pay all? the 0.5 or 1% tax from questing and looting, is meaningless... ESO mmo, with the guild thing they have, they add tax's up to 10% I think from each member sales... and we speak about 1% here! Edited October 31, 2014 by Oyranos Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ratajack Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 (edited) Because I have my own brand new guild and I need money, without money, there is no honey. Anyway, it would be a great as an option, 1% for smaller guilds and 2-3-4-5% for bigger guilds with more honey on them. I would also love an option for the players members of a guild, to auto configure their donation.... For example I have many alts and instead of getting credits and mail them after... to auto transfer in my guild bank And you know... its not about me asking tax from my members.. My guild is still empty because I want to offer all the comforts to my guild before I start inviting people. And that is a guild ship with all the necessary comforts (guild bank, legacy bank, some decos, etc) also a stronghold.... And all that are from my game... So logical to have a kind of a request as a minimum 1% or 0.5% ... But not mandatory. That sounds like "BW, I just made a new guild and I want you to subsidize it so I can get all the bells and whistles without having to actually have any other members." Seriously, if you want to invite people, you do not need all the comforts and bells and whistles to do so. Recruit members and then you won't need BW to subsidize you. The great thing about guilds is the GM does not have to do it all alone. A good guild is full of players who contribute. Edited October 31, 2014 by Ratajack Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jrr_hypernova Posted October 31, 2014 Share Posted October 31, 2014 Op made statement that guilds lost lots of credtis during the conquest That was kind of the whole bloody point of conquest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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