SW:TOR 4th biggest Sub MMO in the world

[TUXs]

What makes you think they are not looking? http://careersearch.ea.com/austin

Well that's more positive news about SWTOR, wouldn't you agree?

[hadoken]

What makes you think they are not looking? http://careersearch.ea.com/austin

 

heh new job postings less than a month old don't give a lot of hope for content coming anytime soon

 

That said it is very good to see them attempting to expand now, assuming that isn't just replacing people recently departing.

Edited July 21, 2014 by hadoken

[TX_Angel]

Yea I like the implication that they're having a hard time finding people.

 

The answer is they have to look first.

 

And after looking, they have to be willing to pay a good wage and provide other benefits.

[AlienEyeTX]

heh new job postings less than a month old don't give a lot of hope for content coming anytime soon

 

That said it is very good to see them attempting to expand now, assuming that isn't just replacing people recently departing.

 

Even so, replacing people who leave is still a good sign. Anyone who's worked for a medium to large company knows exactly what I'm getting at.

Edited July 21, 2014 by AlienEyeTX

[OddballEasyEight]

heh new job postings less than a month old don't give a lot of hope for content coming anytime soon

 

That said it is very good to see them attempting to expand now, assuming that isn't just replacing people recently departing.

 

One thing people seem to miss when it comes to big corporations is that it usually takes a while for them to get moving.

"oh this game made 160+ million dollars last year? We'd better get moving on that and make sure it stays profitable" and then they take another 6 months planning and hiring people... so that's 1 year and 6 months after the game was actually proven to be profitable.

 

That kind of stuff happens all the time in large companies... It takes a while for them to catch on to what's working and what's not.

Just look at the movie industry and how every time there's a good movie with an unusual theme (let's say a western movie becomes hugely popular) it takes about a year and a half before there suddenly are TONS of movies of the same genre flooding the market (some good, but most are rushed crappy things just there to catch on to the trend).

That kind of stuff happens with computer companies too... especially if a game is at first not very successful (like TOR was, first hugely successful selling over 2 million copies and then suddenly nearly at the brink of death. It takes a while for the company to realize it's back and profitable)

Edited July 21, 2014 by OddballEasyEight

[Bluejayoo]

Actually, comparing to rift is a much more accurate comparison (due to them being released almost at the same time).

Here's from another thread:

I tend to agree with him.

 

I agree as well. I am not sure why everyone tries to compare WOW to SWTOR. As I mentioned at the start of my post, I think that comparison is flawed. Though rather you look at RIFT or WOW, SWTOR still seems to be on track to match them as far as content releases are concerned.

 

GW2 is probably worth mentioning though. They are relatively unique in the MMO market in that they release content at an insanely fast rate. They are essentially on a monthly release schedule and I think they will have an impact on how MMO's approach content releases in the future.

[DarthOvertone]

Both of you guys really need to brush up on your math skills. If it were subscriptions alone at $165m per year it'd be ~917k subscribers. Ultimately that's not what it is so this entire exercise is pointless.

 

It's definitely not all subs though. Many of you may recall a previous report on the top PC microtransaction games. That report lists SWTOR's 2013 revenue as $139 Million, just in microtransactions, i.e. the Cartel Market.

 

Now ultimately we don't know the real numbers for these things. Companies keep them close to the vest for a reason. However, just a general deduction of the microtransaction revenue from the overall revenue leaves one with the sense that SWTOR's subscription base is actually extremely small. I would be surprised if the sub base was over 200K at this point and that would be charitable considering there is only approximately $26 Million remaining.

[Graydon]

Revenue != Profit

SWTOR has captured a whole 6% of the subscriber share??? And the defenders are gloating???

 

Desperation leads to the Dark Side

[yoomazir]

Revenue != Profit

SWTOR has captured a whole 6% of the subscriber share??? And the defenders are gloating???

 

Desperation leads to the Dark Side

 

You okay bro?

[hadoken]

It's definitely not all subs though. Many of you may recall a previous report on the top PC microtransaction games. That report lists SWTOR's 2013 revenue as $139 Million, just in microtransactions, i.e. the Cartel Market.

 

Now ultimately we don't know the real numbers for these things. Companies keep them close to the vest for a reason. However, just a general deduction of the microtransaction revenue from the overall revenue leaves one with the sense that SWTOR's subscription base is actually extremely small. I would be surprised if the sub base was over 200K at this point and that would be charitable considering there is only approximately $26 Million remaining.

 

Yea that's where I think we're at too. It's still sufficient to keep the game going providing the CM continues to draw in the cash - but I think it stymies growth too in that likely that's where most of the focus will go (and has gone, if you look at updates).

[LordArtemis]

It's definitely not all subs though. Many of you may recall a previous report on the top PC microtransaction games. That report lists SWTOR's 2013 revenue as $139 Million, just in microtransactions, i.e. the Cartel Market.

 

Now ultimately we don't know the real numbers for these things. Companies keep them close to the vest for a reason. However, just a general deduction of the microtransaction revenue from the overall revenue leaves one with the sense that SWTOR's subscription base is actually extremely small. I would be surprised if the sub base was over 200K at this point and that would be charitable considering there is only approximately $26 Million remaining.

 

Which is actually fine in my unqualified opinion, but does raise a few concerns for me personally.

 

1) If subs have dropped that low, and the majority of revenue in MT comes from subs at present, I do not believe that the revenue point they have now is sustainable.

2) The CM design is fantastic and healthy IMO...though it has a few small flaws. The design as it stands, and the content released is helpful to the game IMO.

3) The current setup for F2P, GSF, GS, Bounty missions, double XP, Cartel, crafting, PVE space and Tacticals needs to be modified IMO however.

 

a. GSF - Reduce reticule size, add joystick capability, revamp tutorial, reduce strength of upper equipment to reduce power and capabilities of higher ships or add bolster, add on foot element and capital ship combat ala BF2

 

b. GS - Add credit bank to Legacy storage, add free movement hooks to each room, fleet chat as an option, direct travel to fleet, mannequins for armor storage and display.

 

c. Redesign of Bounty missions, install as normal game feature.

d. Revamp of crafting system.

e. Add double Xp buff item that can be purchased on the CM, convert current double XP event to a buff that can be dispelled by players if desired.

f. Make the Cartel event a normal game feature, add more items to vendor, slightly increase certificate drops, allow certs to be sold to vendor.

g. Add multiplayer to current PVE space feature (turret play, ability for players to join you in the pipe in their own ships), make XP for PVE space it's own that can be leveled separately (but adds to legacy).

h. Create tactical versions of current SM flashpoints in the game.

i. Create a new access tier for free play called VETERAN, remove email limits between legacy, increase credit cap, allow quick travel unlocks unmodified. Requires 360.00 spent total.

j. Add ability for subscribers to earn small amounts of CC running current SM, HM flashpoints, Ops and engaging in PVP oriented content.

 

This would go a LONG way IMO toward not only retaining the current sub base, but increasing it. Not to mention the likelihood, again, IMO, that it would boost CM revenue substantially.

Edited July 21, 2014 by LordArtemis

[Kantaso]

Revenue != Profit

SWTOR has captured a whole 6% of the subscriber share??? And the defenders are gloating???

 

Desperation leads to the Dark Side

 

R u mad bro?

[Draqsko]

I am gonna wager we'll still be talking about this a year from now, which is fine by me because it'll mean I'll still be playing SWTOR..

[Kalfear]

Man I just started to get my feet wet with the Imperial side after doing 4 Reps and wow momma!!!! this is fun.

 

it is

 

Love my Trooper and Sage (and loving my Vangard and Shadow)

but the imp side classes just seem that little bit better

 

Sage-Sorc basically same thing but Sorc Lightning so out does Sage rocks and eartquake abilities

Merc double blaster is just better then Commando autocannon and lets not comment on Death From Above vrs Morter Volley

 

Imps are just fun, no ifs ands or ors about it

[Tsillah]

Oh you are not an idiot. We all want to see this game grow faster, but apparently EA does not see that and they don't care. Or they do care (because it could mean more money for them in long run), but new (skilled) people are hard to come by.

 

It's a tricky thing really. I mean I am sure the guys at BW are working hard and are probably equally frustrated by the limitations they've been set. I hope it will get better with what comes out still this year. All in all this is my fave MMO so far and with single player games there are lots of BW games in my top ten, with ME as my fave there. I think BW has made mistakes but also has done some tremendously awesome things.

[yoomazir]

They can't throw this game away anyway, with the upcoming SW movies there will be people that will join this game due to the movies hype, and before some ******** tell us "but tiz gaem haz nothing to do with di moviez UUR DUUUR" it has SW on this, and it actually delivers the SW vibe.

 

This game is bound to generate more money, hopefully that means more meaty content in the future.

[Jandi]

They can't throw this game away anyway, with the upcoming SW movies there will be people that will join this game due to the movies hype, and before some ******** tell us "but tiz gaem haz nothing to do with di moviez UUR DUUUR" it has SW on this, and it actually delivers the SW vibe.

 

This game is bound to generate more money, hopefully that means more meaty content in the future.

 

Don't know... the game might be too mature for the target audience of the new movies.

[Arkerus]

The only real conclusion that anyone can make is the data that we have. The game IS making money and has been since the F2P conversion. I see a ton of speculation in this thread (both bad and good). That's all well and good and drives an interesting conversation. Some folks though...yikes. Not very connected to the real world.

 

The most troubling comments I see is that people say "well, obviously that money is not being reinvested back into the game."

 

1. That's absurd to begin with because no company on the planet NORMALLY reinvests 100% of the profits from a product unless there is some special case (or they are willing to take a loss for a long term gain). Projects are slated at a certain cost + overhead. Any more money beyond that is considered profit for the company. Budgets for the game go up and down depending on the budget and projects/upgrades needed for the game.

 

2. We are not privy to any of the internal costs and scheduling. You have no clue what anything costs. This game could have an absurdly large margin or it could be thin, but rest assured it is not in the red.

 

3. The doom and gloom and argument is effectively dead. No rational company shuts down a game that is successful. You can argue what successful means to YOU, but to a company, it means sustainable revenue (and from that profit). This game would have been shut down a long time ago if the revenue stream was not sustainable. The next person who utters anything like "this game will be shut down in a year" or similar, gets an instant trip to the ignore list.

[Deewe]

What makes you think they are not looking? http://careersearch.ea.com/austin

Actually very interesting.

 

Few things to note: from the jobs posting history they set in motion to do something with moblies at least since April.

 

Then looking at how they are after people from all range of skills: network, DBA, programmers, UI, data-center, artists, community managers, program managers all the way up to product and business owners tells us something big is in motion. (Notice fall 2014 here)

 

So either they are building the core team to make a new game or they are making a big X-Pack.

In short the benefits from the CM will either let them make a new game or improve that one.

 

 

Now take into consideration the Strongholds.

 

Form a design and a business point of view they invested a lot in that feature.

I mean, while from a game play experience it mostly sucks, it's far from a cheap quick fix.

A simpler free 3D positioning system would have been way less costly and less complex to implement.

 

Imagine the work it takes to design all hook patterns, set them in the strongholds, then add all items, associate them with hook size and categories, QA everything and so: a daunting task!

 

In short would they think SWTOR isn't profitable they would not have done all this.

So added to the jobs posting it's a positive news for SWTOR but for the fact that the leads still are clueless of how to properly deliver as good content as what we can find if others MMO.

Edited July 22, 2014 by Deewe

[Anaesha]

BW Austin's sole job is SWTOR so the odds of them making a new game is slim to none but I also wouldn't hold much faith in them making an expansion bigger then 3.0.

[Arkerus]

Actually very interesting.

 

Few things to note: from the jobs posting history they set in motion to do something with moblies at least since April.

 

Then looking at how they are after people from all range of skills: network, DBA, programmers, UI, data-center, artists, community managers, program managers all the way up to product and business owners tells us something big is in motion. (Notice fall 2014 here)

 

So either they are building the core team to make a new game or they are making a big X-Pack.

In short the benefits from the CM will either let them make a new game or improve that one.

 

 

Now take into consideration the Strongholds.

 

Form a design and a business point of view they invested a lot in that feature.

I mean, while from a game play experience it mostly sucks, it's far from a cheap quick fix.

A simpler free 3D positioning system would have been way less costly and less complex to implement.

 

Imagine the work it takes to design all hook patterns, set them in the strongholds, then add all items, associate them with hook size and categories, QA everything and so: a daunting task!

 

In short would they think SWTOR isn't profitable they would not have done all this.

So added to the jobs posting it's a positive news for SWTOR but for the fact that the leads still are clueless of how to properly deliver as good content as what we can find if others MMO.

 

Everything in your conjecture about 3d positioning and cost of the housing system is just that. Utter conjecture. You have nothing to back it up. I personally have engine experience and I can tell you with confidence free placement has a lot of client and design concerns and as for cost, my experience is that its about the same.

 

Hooks are fine.

[TravelersWay]

Don't know... the game might be too mature for the target audience of the new movies.

 

And it lacks the necessary amount of lens flare.

[Deewe]

Everything in your conjecture about 3d positioning and cost of the housing system is just that. Utter conjecture. You have nothing to back it up. I personally have engine experience and I can tell you with confidence free placement has a lot of client and design concerns and as for cost, my experience is that its about the same.

 

Hooks are fine.

For a hook system you need all the bells and whistles of a free placement system plus all the constraints, more data storage, layouts and so on for the hooks.

 

Let's see: for a grounded object or ceiling object you need to move it along X and Y axis.

For a wall item now you move it along X and Z axis.

 

Long story short story you also need 3D positioning for a hook system.

 

Then take into consideration they went further as making hooks have two kinds of categories: the first being the size the second being the type.

 

So for each item they had to decide and test which size of slot it would fit and then in which category it would be populated: vehicles, chairs, pets and so on.

 

You don't need that with a free placement system and that's just an example.

 

 

The only issue with free positioning is collision detection management and creating a simple yet efficient UI.

And even in some game designs you'd like to allow players have collision so they can create objects of their own.

[Arkerus]

For a hook system you need all the bells and whistles of a free placement system plus all the constraints, more data storage, layouts and so on for the hooks.

 

Let's see: for a grounded object or ceiling object you need to move it along X and Y axis.

For a wall item now you move it along X and Z axis.

 

Long story short story you also need 3D positioning for a hook system.

 

Then take into consideration they went further as making hooks have two kinds of categories: the first being the size the second being the type.

 

So for each item they had to decide and test which size of slot it would fit and then in which category it would be populated: vehicles, chairs, pets and so on.

 

You don't need that with a free placement system and that's just an example.

 

 

The only issue with free positioning is collision detection management and creating a simple yet efficient UI.

And even in some game designs you'd like to allow players have collision so they can create objects of their own.

 

I don't even know where to start with you. Hooking allows for a convenient back end to be designed and save on a ton of I/O. It was also a conscious design decision based on their audience. You avoid a ton of unforeseen, frankly, BS, with hooks. I could list all the BS you have to put up and just make up things like you. But I wont.

[Deewe]

I don't even know where to start with you. Hooking allows for a convenient back end to be designed and save on a ton of I/O. It was also a conscious design decision based on their audience. You avoid a ton of unforeseen, frankly, BS, with hooks. I could list all the BS you have to put up and just make up things like you. But I wont.

Want to be technical, ok be my guest.

 

Server side whatever system you do you have to store and transmit the item position, be it relative to a hook or to a room or a building.

 

Then for each item on top of the above requirements for a an object with a simpler 3d positioning, with hooks you also need at least:

• Item hook size parameter
  
• Item hook type parameter
  

 

With only these simple sample it's already using more I/O and data storage, server side, than a simpler 3D system.

 

So please enlighten us of how it would save IO on the back end?

Because honestly I'm puzzled here.