LordArtemis Posted July 3, 2014 Share Posted July 3, 2014 I can contend it is a great system because I have seen it. I have been with this game before there was even a site and have put my ideas into it. I have been with this game for a VERY long time. I'm just trying to reassure you it's not going to be as bad as you think. Though I appreciate your positive outlook (obviously I hope folks take to it as well), you really cant judge folks for judging it harshly without trying it if you judge it well without trying it. That was really my point. Like you, I would imagine they only saw the video and like you they are drawing conclusions based on it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordArtemis Posted July 3, 2014 Share Posted July 3, 2014 And complaining about people complaining about complainers ACK!!!!! The dreaded roll eyes emote!! My eyes, my eyes!!! lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TUXs Posted July 3, 2014 Share Posted July 3, 2014 It's going to be a fine system for SWTOR. It's robust and quite well done... However, it's not at all "unlike any other system"...in fact, it's VERY MUCH like the lotro system, which is regarded by many as the worst housing system in MMOs. Quite obviously it's exponentially better than lotro's, but it lacks the freedom that makes housing unique in MMOs and retains a hook based system, the very system that makes lotro's so pathetic. I'm not suggesting SWTOR housing is as bad as lotro, but the limiting hook system is obviously the key component of both MMOs housing systems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarsherMeow Posted July 3, 2014 Share Posted July 3, 2014 Hooks limit your ability to be creative, they are a great aid but they limit what you can do. The whole point of decorating your stronghold is to be creative with it. Why would you artificially limit how creative the player base can be? It's like telling Michael Angelo that any painting he does must be limited to coloring within the lines. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reno_Tarshil Posted July 3, 2014 Share Posted July 3, 2014 It's going to be a fine system for SWTOR. It's robust and quite well done... However, it's not at all "unlike any other system"...in fact, it's VERY MUCH like the lotro system, which is regarded by many as the worst housing system in MMOs. Quite obviously it's exponentially better than lotro's, but it lacks the freedom that makes housing unique in MMOs and retains a hook based system, the very system that makes lotro's so pathetic. I'm not suggesting SWTOR housing is as bad as lotro, but the limiting hook system is obviously the key component of both MMOs housing systems. Since you missed what I said earlier to you in a previous thread I'll repeat myself. Yes TUXs they are hooks, but from all the stuff I've read so far they're very customizable hooks where as another user pointed Daekurus I think it was said he was a player in LOTRO and that is way better than the Hooks in there. Also judging by all the screenshots there are hooks seemingly everywhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarsherMeow Posted July 3, 2014 Share Posted July 3, 2014 Since you missed what I said earlier to you in a previous thread I'll repeat myself. Yes TUXs they are hooks, but from all the stuff I've read so far they're very customizable hooks where as another user pointed Daekurus I think it was said he was a player in LOTRO and that is way better than the Hooks in there. Also judging by all the screenshots there are hooks seemingly everywhere. The hooks are around quite a lot of the room yes but they aren't on top of objects, and it seems like very few was on the walkway between the star ships and the first room. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reno_Tarshil Posted July 3, 2014 Share Posted July 3, 2014 The hooks are around quite a lot of the room yes but they aren't on top of objects, and it seems like very few was on the walkway between the star ships and the first room. Well idk then, have to see it fully then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drudenfusz Posted July 3, 2014 Share Posted July 3, 2014 I see some people really complaining about this system. It's not the average hook system at all. It's something completely different than anything that has ever been in a system in an mmorpg ever. It's more a less for simple placement at first with the hooks to put the stuff down then you'll be able to move it around. It's freedom but with organization. Also, I feel like some people don't know what "hooks" are and they are just going along with the negativity and have in their mind how "omg horrible!" it is because they won't get to move that chair 1mm over than where it is. Or maybe you will? I wish sometimes people would stop jumping to conclusions and being negative all the time. This is a great system that will again, grow as it comes out and keep getting worked on. Sometimes it seems expectations for these things are not to realistic and some just have ridiculous thoughts about it. It is a great system that goes with the game, not your average hook system, not a complete lack of control system either. It is a sensible approach that will still let you have freedom and control of where you want to put things. I am very, very pleased with this. Time for some creativity! A sophisticated hook system is still a hook system. Some of us would have like to get a little more free placement, which would actually allow people to build things rather than just put stuff somewhere. Like I said, I thought about building a jumping puzzle, which I cannot do with a hook system in place. I thought about placing my star fighter model pets beneith the ceiling as decorations, but I doubt they will count as ceiling decorations and thus I cannot do that with a hook system in place. And for those intent and purposes it is just a hook system! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TUXs Posted July 3, 2014 Share Posted July 3, 2014 A sophisticated hook system is still a hook system. Some of us would have like to get a little more free placement, which would actually allow people to build things rather than just put stuff somewhere. Like I said, I thought about building a jumping puzzle, which I cannot do with a hook system in place. I thought about placing my star fighter model pets beneith the ceiling as decorations, but I doubt they will count as ceiling decorations and thus I cannot do that with a hook system in place. And for those intent and purposes it is just a hook system! This is exactly it. Call it whatever you want, tell me how amazing it is that I can shimmy objects slightly within their "hook" space...but there are still HOOKS! Hooks restrict my ability to customize the home and limit it to only what the Devs deem worthy of the hook. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Never_Hesitate Posted July 3, 2014 Share Posted July 3, 2014 A sophisticated hook system is still a hook system. Some of us would have like to get a little more free placement, which would actually allow people to build things rather than just put stuff somewhere. Like I said, I thought about building a jumping puzzle, which I cannot do with a hook system in place. I thought about placing my star fighter model pets beneith the ceiling as decorations, but I doubt they will count as ceiling decorations and thus I cannot do that with a hook system in place. And for those intent and purposes it is just a hook system! Then we'll be getting a hook system, which is fine because they never told us it wouldn't be a hook system. If you want free item placement this housing system won't be what you're looking for and if that's such a huge dealbreaker to anyone, they should feel free to play WS which has a free placement system Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarsherMeow Posted July 3, 2014 Share Posted July 3, 2014 Then we'll be getting a hook system, which is fine because they never told us it wouldn't be a hook system. If you want free item placement this housing system won't be what you're looking for and if that's such a huge dealbreaker to anyone, they should feel free to play WS which has a free placement system It was heavily implied at a Cantina event a few weeks ago by Eric that it would be free placement. Limiting the creativity in a activity that is purely about creative expression is a deal breaker for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OddballEasyEight Posted July 3, 2014 Share Posted July 3, 2014 It was heavily implied at a Cantina event a few weeks ago by Eric that it would be free placement. Limiting the creativity in a activity that is purely about creative expression is a deal breaker for me. I'm guessing you hate the sims and think it's extremely limiting eh? (Oh and he didn't "heavily imply" it... you just enterpreted it that way) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andryah Posted July 3, 2014 Share Posted July 3, 2014 It was heavily implied at a Cantina event a few weeks ago by Eric that it would be free placement. Limiting the creativity in a activity that is purely about creative expression is a deal breaker for me. Which Cantina Event? Can you provide a link to a quote of Eric saying what you are accusing him of saying? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brutall Posted July 3, 2014 Author Share Posted July 3, 2014 Hooks limit your ability to be creative, they are a great aid but they limit what you can do. The whole point of decorating your stronghold is to be creative with it. Why would you artificially limit how creative the player base can be? It's like telling Michael Angelo that any painting he does must be limited to coloring within the lines. agree. give us the option to turn of hooks and this will be one of the best housing in any mmo out to date! if not its just better then lotro Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarsherMeow Posted July 3, 2014 Share Posted July 3, 2014 Which Cantina Event? Can you provide a link to a quote of Eric saying what you are accusing him of saying? Actually it was Jack Wood my bad. http://42gaming.com/blog/community-cantina-q-a-with-eric-musco-los-angeles-2014.html Question: How intricate will the decorations for the strongholds be? Will it be anything like Wildstar? Answer: Strongholds will be extremely intricate in that you will be able to place items as you see fit. Décor items can be created through trade skills and will be drops from mobs, flashpoints, and operations. This intricacy will be inherently Star Wars and will rival the housing of other games and it will very customizable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TUXs Posted July 3, 2014 Share Posted July 3, 2014 Which Cantina Event? Can you provide a link to a quote of Eric saying what you are accusing him of saying? http://42gaming.com/blog/community-cantina-q-a-with-eric-musco-los-angeles-2014.html Question: How intricate will the decorations for the strongholds be? Will it be anything like Wildstar? Answer: Strongholds will be extremely intricate in that you will be able to place items as you see fit. Décor items can be created through trade skills and will be drops from mobs, flashpoints, and operations. This intricacy will be inherently Star Wars and will rival the housing of other games and it will very customizable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TUXs Posted July 3, 2014 Share Posted July 3, 2014 Actually it was Jack Wood my bad. http://42gaming.com/blog/community-cantina-q-a-with-eric-musco-los-angeles-2014.html True, but it was titled as this, so you're correct in associating it with the bar hop: Community Cantina Q & A with Eric Musco, Los Angeles 2014 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Infernixx Posted July 3, 2014 Share Posted July 3, 2014 It was heavily implied at a Cantina event a few weeks ago by Eric that it would be free placement. Limiting the creativity in a activity that is purely about creative expression is a deal breaker for me. It was never implied. You saw what you wanted to see. And now you're mad that they didn't deliver on something that was never even hinted at. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TUXs Posted July 3, 2014 Share Posted July 3, 2014 (edited) It was never implied. You saw what you wanted to see. And now you're mad that they didn't deliver on something that was never even hinted at. Not implied? Please tell me, what do YOU hear in this statement: "you will be able to place items as you see fit". How would YOU interpret that exactly? "as you see fit" to me, means however I like. What does that mean to YOU? Edited July 3, 2014 by TUXs Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarsherMeow Posted July 3, 2014 Share Posted July 3, 2014 It was never implied. You saw what you wanted to see. And now you're mad that they didn't deliver on something that was never even hinted at. It was directly being compared to Wildstar and the developer replied with "able to place items as you see fit". To me this would indicate free form placement since they was directly comparing it to Wildstar. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graydon Posted July 3, 2014 Share Posted July 3, 2014 Since you missed what I said earlier to you in a previous thread I'll repeat myself. Yes TUXs they are hooks, but from all the stuff I've read so far they're very customizable hooks where as another user pointed Daekurus I think it was said he was a player in LOTRO and that is way better than the Hooks in there. Also judging by all the screenshots there are hooks seemingly everywhere. Well it can only be better because LOTRO is one of the worse and most disappointing housing systems ever created. Placement hooks restrict a player's creativity. In other MMO's I have seen some amazing decorating ideas with free form placement. What seems absurd, such as placing book shelves on the ceiling or tables placed on top of a flower vase have created some extraordinary designs of an unexpected spiraling stair case or a secret room...etc. SWTOR had a chance to outshine its competitors and they failed miserably. Sure it will be a nice little system. The Devoted will adore, defend, and accept the inferior setup. But why strive for mediocrity when there was an opportunity for excellence? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sangrar Posted July 3, 2014 Share Posted July 3, 2014 Well it can only be better because LOTRO is one of the worse and most disappointing housing systems ever created. Placement hooks restrict a player's creativity. In other MMO's I have seen some amazing decorating ideas with free form placement. What seems absurd, such as placing book shelves on the ceiling or tables placed on top of a flower vase have created some extraordinary designs of an unexpected spiraling stair case or a secret room...etc. SWTOR had a chance to outshine its competitors and they failed miserably. Sure it will be a nice little system. The Devoted will adore, defend, and accept the inferior setup. But why strive for mediocrity when there was an opportunity for excellence? while I can honestly say it probably won't be better than some of the housing systems out there, I would not call this mediocre either, even though they used hooks at least they gave a lot more options and places to go with it than some other hooks users and you can tell they put work into it. Its not perfect, its not what people expected, not as good as we thought it would be, but still I disagree when people just outright call it mediocre either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Infernixx Posted July 3, 2014 Share Posted July 3, 2014 Not implied? Please tell me, what do YOU hear in this statement: "you will be able to place items as you see fit". How would YOU interpret that exactly? "as you see fit" to me, means however I like. What does that mean to YOU? I wouldn't interpret it as being Free Placement since they've gone out of their way to avoid labeling it as Free Placement. And guess what? It turned out to not be Free Placement. When you take a single statement and fixate on that single statement and ignore the context of the entirety of the rest of the dialogue, then you're obviously doing so for a reason. You 'wanted' it desperately to be Free Placement and when someone offered up one statement that could be construed as being a hinting toward Free Placement, you got excited and hyped up. You ignored everything else in the very long dialogue regarding the Housing system and focused solely on that single statement. it would have been very easy and simple for them to say "It's Free Placement, put anything you want, anywhere you want" if that was the case. Instead, they said "It's a complicated system and we don't want to tell you about it so much as 'show' you how it works." Why? Because some people freak out and have prejudiced views regarding a Hook System, no matter how robust and vigorous and how much customization comes with that unique system that they've developed. And, as this very thread has shown, the mere mention of "hook system" leaves people cold and disappointed without them even bothering to examine the system in detail. Now, maybe you can grasp why they didn't explain the system before as a hook system and why they certainly give you any reason to believe that it was a Free Placement system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarsherMeow Posted July 3, 2014 Share Posted July 3, 2014 while I can honestly say it probably won't be better than some of the housing systems out there, I would not call this mediocre either, even though they used hooks at least they gave a lot more options and places to go with it than some other hooks users and you can tell they put work into it. Its not perfect, its not what people expected, not as good as we thought it would be, but still I disagree when people just outright call it mediocre either. It's great for a hook system, I will give it that. But overall compared to other housing in other MMOs it is mediocre. A great hook system still limits you. It would be great if you could turn it off or the hooks became just a guide line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Infernixx Posted July 3, 2014 Share Posted July 3, 2014 Well it can only be better because LOTRO is one of the worse and most disappointing housing systems ever created. Placement hooks restrict a player's creativity. In other MMO's I have seen some amazing decorating ideas with free form placement. What seems absurd, such as placing book shelves on the ceiling or tables placed on top of a flower vase have created some extraordinary designs of an unexpected spiraling stair case or a secret room...etc. SWTOR had a chance to outshine its competitors and they failed miserably. Sure it will be a nice little system. The Devoted will adore, defend, and accept the inferior setup. But why strive for mediocrity when there was an opportunity for excellence? Well, I'm going to say outright that if you're bucking for a system that allows us to put tables on top of vases, then you're out of your mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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