Ask me anything / Training

[EazyWin]

I am sorry to be taking up more space in this extremely useful thread with my response. However, I would like to clear up some misconceptions that I probably generated by my original post. Was I frustrated over missed shots that caused me to get killed more often and not be as effective in matches? Yes. Was it a spur of the moment, drunken rage post in all caps? I did have a bit to drink, but I was hardly raging, and I had been thinking about evasion's purpose off and on for the last couple of weeks. Just because I have a post count in the single digits (this will be 10) does not mean I subbed last week.

 

TL;DR: Drakkolich is awesome, he answered my question in a respectful and understandable manner. Verain, not so much.

 

 

Drako isn't here this weekend, but please try to ask questions he can actually help you with. Drako is an ace, not a game designer. If this game didn't have evasion, he'd still play it, and be good at it, as would most or all of us.

 

Having read his post (#66, or Order 66 if you're easily amused like me), he was able to help me with it, and he did it a lot better than you did. I never asked for a coding class. His explanation of evasion as a hard counter to certain builds took up 10% of the space yours did, and he used 100% less insults.

 

It is ONLY a QQ question. It is meaningless as well. If you want the answer: By adding a hit table, they were able to create a different method of defense, one that is "all or nothing", which is fundamentally interesting. It injects RNG into a situation that would otherwise be static, and that can make for exciting (or frustrating) moments. I had a game earlier where my disto shield got railgunned through disto seven times in a row, whereas every shot that I made into a disto got dodged (many of these shots had wingman active). The odds of this? Ludic small.

 

What this does is dial back what is going on, and your connection to it. Some of it is out of your control- some of it is in the hands of the character you are playing. It's an RPG![/Quote]

 

More insults. Yay. Moving along... "fundamentally interesting" is subjective, as a completely skill based game would be more interesting to me, as well as a good number of other people. Ground pvp does allow for misses too, but other than having a defensive cd pop on your target, when was the last time you saw a miss? Also, I am willing to bet that during your distortion field example you probably weren't going "Hmmm, this is really interesting. Wow, what are the odds? Oh well."

 

It is fair to be frustrated, but understand that skill only takes you so far. Misses and crits are on the combat table, for sure.

 

Skill only takes me so far? Well, guess I should go out and get some 4 leaf clovers tomorrow instead of practicing. Misses and crits seem to be on the combat table far more than in other modes, but that is just my point of view as I have no data to back it up with. If there are extra crits and they are just there to make up for the extra misses, then why bother with such an extreme percentage of both? Variety from the other modes is the only reason I can think of.

 

But, much more importantly, Drako can't help you with this. Nor can he explain "why it is necessary"... so, I guess, you can argue with him. It isn't necessary. But it is, to me, fun. If they removed it and turned it into something fully deterministic, I'd probably like that too.

 

He did help, nice of you to support him before he had a chance to respond. You also would like less RNG? Then why belittle me for asking about it?

 

But don't crap this thread up with QQ. It's a good thread.

 

It is a good thread. Your rude response and my endless rebuttal are crapping it up.

 

Counters to evasion are:

 

> Ensure you ONLY go into battle with a 6% accuracy offensive crewman. This is super mandatory.

> While you are charging your railgun on a target that isn't likely to be dead center of your scope, whip your mouse in that direction, overshooting them, so that your ship turns (yaw is faster than pitch). This is easier if you are zoomed out fully, which you should be in the habit of doing the moment you enter scope mode, and as your charge reaches full, move the cursor back for the snipe. This greatly reduces the chance of your shot missing, as you won't be gaining any accuracy debuff for them not being precisely on target.

> Ensure you are using ion or slug, and that you have the 3% accuracy and tracking talent (this is a choice on slug, and you always pick it). You can't get this on plasma, and it results in a ludicrous number of misses.

> Just as you are about to fire your shot at a scout, press 4, and have that be "wingman". This ability gives you a 20% accuarcy boost- quite a lot. You can fire several shots under the effects of "wingman", and your odds of connection go way up.

> When you have ion aoe, switch to ion and hit an adjacent ship, dealing some damage to an evasive target.

 

HOLY MOTHER OF SKYWALKER, you CAN be helpful, once you've established your obvious mental superiority over me.

 

With all this, you'll still miss, and you'll still get hit through disto. Part of the game is not under your control. The scout that builds for full evasion gets wrecked by mines (he colud have taken 30% less damage from mines, but instead he chose to have a chance to avoid your shot). Remember he gave something up to have that dodge chance.

 

Again, something that was actually useful. Still not as effective as a hard counter explanation, but points for effort. Shame I had to read through the first 2/3 of the post asking if I wanted a tissue for my tears of rage.

 

Edited May 27, 2014 by EazyWin
Added spoiler tags to reduce clutter

[phoenixjon]

Hey drak,

 

I was just wondering on my starguard I use heavy/rapid with CF. I was wondering, do you think on the 4th tier of RFL do you think the crit or the acc/track is better. Also, wingman or CF depending. I know what I think would work for me, but I want your opinion.

[Slinktress]

Confused about another thread full of jargon and acronyms!

 

What constitutes a T3 ship?? I figured "T2" must mean the ships you can only get with pink fleet comms, but "T3"?

 

What is "TT" and "CC"?

[Kuciwalker]

Confused about another thread full of jargon and acronyms!

 

What constitutes a T3 ship?? I figured "T2" must mean the ships you can only get with pink fleet comms, but "T3"?

 

They refer to "Type 2" and "Type 3" ships, based on the order that the ships appear in the ship list (and ignoring the cartel variants). So:

 

Type 1 = Starguard, Novadive, Quarrel

Type 2 = Pike, Flashfire, some ****** thing no one flies

Type 3 = Clarion, Spearpoint, the new gunship that isn't out yet

 

What is "TT" and "CC"?

 

TT = Targeting Telementry

CC = depending on context, crowd control (i.e. stuns, slows, debuffs, etc.) or cartel coins.

[tunewalker]

Confused about another thread full of jargon and acronyms!

 

What constitutes a T3 ship?? I figured "T2" must mean the ships you can only get with pink fleet comms, but "T3"?

 

What is "TT" and "CC"?

 

It has to do with when they were released. The T3 ship would be either the Spearpoint/Bloodmark for the scout (or command scout) since it was the third scout released while the other 2 shipped with the game. The T1 scout is obviously the one you start with and the T2 scout would be the battle scout or Flashfire/Sting.

 

For Strikes again obviously the T1 Strike is the one you start with and the T3 would be the "command Strike" aka Clarion/Imperium While the T2 strike would be the one the game shipped with but you had to buy the "Missile Boat" aka Pike/ Quell.

 

For Gunships/ Bombers the T1's would be the ships that only cost 2500 while the T2 would be the ones that currently cost 5k. Though we have a new bomber and a New GS that will be released both of these will be the "T3" of their respective ship class. I dont know if any generalized names for the new T3 have been made for the GS or Bomber but currently the T1 Bomber is refered to as either "Boy Bomber or Minelayer" and the T2 Bomber is refered to as the "Girl Bomber or Drone Carrier"

 

The T1 Gunship is usually refered to as "good gunship" while the T2 Gunships is ussually refered to as "Crud Gunship".

 

 

TT stands for the scout Systems component known as Target Telemetry. And CC is standard MMO Jargan standing for Crowd Control, ussually reffering to slows and stuns in one manner or another. CF stands for the Co-pilot ability Concentrated Fire which is a crit buff that is often used.

 

 

Edit: If you are refering to the target telem vs Combat command thread, then CC actually stands for Combat Command another systems ability available on the "T3" strikes and scouts aka the "Command" Strike and Scout AkA The Clarion/Imperium and the Spearpoint/Bloodmark.

Edited May 30, 2014 by tunewalker

[Drakkolich]

Hey drak,

 

I was just wondering on my starguard I use heavy/rapid with CF. I was wondering, do you think on the 4th tier of RFL do you think the crit or the acc/track is better. Also, wingman or CF depending. I know what I think would work for me, but I want your opinion.

 

If you're going to use heavy/rapid (which can def be a good combo) I'd always use the acc/track for rapids since you're going to be using rapids for chasing people around at short range, and heavys for shooting straight and at range. I prefer using wingman myself over concentrated fire, because without targeting telemetry, concentrated fire doesn't really last long enough to do the damage you want from it. Wingman also benefits your allies.

[phoenixjon]

Bumping this important thread

[ReavetheJ]

Been playing abit and am living long enough to enjoy the game. Being hunted is making me a much better pilot as far as defensive flying. The issue and question involves shooting. Any tips on it? Can fly fairly well but can not shoot worth crap!

 

I think i was being schooled by Stasi on TEH the other night, it was ... educational & fun.

Edited June 5, 2014 by ReavetheJ
adding to post

[Drakkolich]

Been playing abit and am living long enough to enjoy the game. Being hunted is making me a much better pilot as far as defensive flying. The issue and question involves shooting. Any tips on it? Can fly fairly well but can not shoot worth crap!

 

I think i was being schooled by Stasi on TEH the other night, it was ... educational & fun.

 

So shooting for the most part is a lot of practice and finding that mouse sensitivity that works for you. However there are a few lasers techniques that can help you, for example when using any of the high tracking penalty weapons like quads or heavys you really want to keep the reticule you're aiming at as close to the center as possible. Moving you're cursor past the reticule to turn fast to bring it to the middle is a standard technique to do this. Using accuracy buffs or passives will also really help you see more shots hit other. The 6% accuracy passive from offensive crew members does help a lot, and if you use wingman as you're copilot ability I think you'll see way more shots actually hit.

 

I hope that helps

[TrinityLyre]

shooting. Any tips on it? Can fly fairly well but can not shoot worth crap!

 

I think i was being schooled by Stasi on TEH the other night, it was ... educational & fun.

 

Not sure if you're referring to me, I play Dementia on the Empire side of TEH. If you were, thanks for being a good sport about it. I'll detail what Drak is talking about a little.

 

I think firing accurately is largely based on "playing the laser." Are you firing something that is capable of extended-range or is it only effective at short distances (like Burst Laser Cannon)? Does the weapon you're firing have a terrible tracking penalty? Does it fire frequently? I take all these items into account when deciding how and where to take shots. Twitch-firing is largely skill based, but I'm sure most pilots can handle what GSF has to offer (as far as this subject goes):

 

If you're firing a laser with a terrible tracking accuracy (Heavy Lasers are the worst offenders), take the huge majority of your shots towards the center of your firing arc. I try and do this regardless of laser (to overcome enemy evasion) because it's generally a good practice. You can do this by overcompensating your movements and quickly dragging your targeting reticle back to the center to take snap shots the game believes is "more accurate." I do this a lot on a gunship: swing my ship around while the railgun is charging and aiming far ahead of my target's lateral movements, then quickly swing the reticle back to the center onto the target (once my railgun is charged) to deliver a far more accurate shot.

 

If you fire something like Burst Laser Cannons (short range, low tracking penalty), scoot in as close as you can and take shots wherever they present themselves on your reticle. I tend to "click" these shots instead of click and hold. I click shots when it's a killing shot, as well (the target has 2% hull and I'm using Heavy Lasers with shield piercing, etc.). It feels more accurate and you know what to expect. When using Burst Lasers, Rapid-fires and Light Lasers, I take shots all over my firing arc and as close as possible. Firing close means more burst damage since firing opportunities usually don't extend farther than a second or two (against skilled pilots). Weapons do increased damage at a shorter range, and without a terrible tracking penalty there's nothing you really need to compensate for. Their penalties are low and you can still do good damage in almost all cases.

 

If you're not firing Burst Laser Cannon, try and take your shots at least 500m away from an opponent. Laser shots closer than 500m can act very wonky. Additionally, try and always keep shots centered (this becomes easier the farther you are from a target). Quads and Heavies do tremendous damage when firing near the center of your arc, but next to nothing when firing at the edge (due to evasion, tracking penalty, etc.). I tend to play at a slightly longer range with these lasers. Again, shorter range means each shot does more damage, but you need to compensate more for tracking penalty. With slower turning ships, firing at longer ranges is typically a better idea. Reverse that for those ships you equip with Turning Thrusters/Turning upgrade on your engine component.

 

Frequency of the cannon is a whole other story (and part of the reason I tend to run Frequency Capacitor with Heavy Lasers, I love the feel!). I could've organized this a bit better but really everything devolves down to practice. Maybe stop trying too hard to fly evasively and try and practice taking accurate shots, especially against skilled opponents. Skilled opponents will attempt evading you, and you will be juking around trying to hit them so much that you will naturally be evading enemies attacking you. Once you've mastered that, combine the two.

 

Hope it helps some. Pew pew pew!!!

Edited June 5, 2014 by TrinityLyre

[ReavetheJ]

Thanks for the feedback and suggestions. Adjusting my mouse has helped a lot . Will be working on shooting more and dodging less.

 

I started rebuilding my clarion as a heavy strike and am liking it a lot more. Dying less and killing more.

[Ryuku-sama]

@ Trinity.... LLC isn't a dogfight cannon... their tracking penalty are worst than both BLC and RFL... and I find that, at the edge, I miss more with LLC than with RFL at the same angle . Edited June 7, 2014 by Ryuku-sama

[TrinityLyre]

their tracking penalty are worst than both BLC and RFL... and I find that, at the edge, I miss more with LLC than with RFL at the same angle .

 

That is definitely true, but it doesn't have as severe a penalty as say, Quads or Heavies. To say you can't dogfight with it is a bit silly, IMO. For many ships, BLC isn't an option and LLC is superior to RFL in more situations than not (despite all their similarities). I still find that I hit a huge number of edge shots with LLC, especially at extremely close range (which is where they are deadliest). Under a node, you will be extremely close range but still have to fire off-center, LLC still excels here - at 500m with +6% accuracy offensive crew you're at 116% accuracy dead center, allowing you to fire *16* degrees off center and still have 100% chance to hit before evasion is applied. If you're firing LLCs at max range, you're not utilizing it as effectively as you could (and sacrificing a boatload of damage).

 

If you're trying to play tag against a skilled BLC-wielding opponent though, you are probably making a mistake. lol.

Edited June 7, 2014 by TrinityLyre

[Ryuku-sama]

Bof... I used quads in a dogfight And made RFL work almost well.... but you're right... LLC are deadly.. I just find them better between 1500 and 3000m... where there higer than BLC tracking won't be too bad...

[LilSaihah]

Hello Drakolich!

 

The T5 Thermite Torpedo upgrade, Plasma Warheads; does it deal more damage based on the initial hit, or the sum of the direct damage + DOT?

[Drakkolich]

Hello Drakolich!

 

The T5 Thermite Torpedo upgrade, Plasma Warheads; does it deal more damage based on the initial hit, or the sum of the direct damage + DOT?

 

The upgrade Plasma Warheads adds 15% of the total damage that the thermite torpedo does. All 15% of that damage is added to the dot.

 

Hope that helps.

[Drakkolich]

I'm surprised no one has been interested in some 1 on 1 training yet, but answering all the questions has been really fun, so keep em coming.

 

I've been trying to stream more lately so feel free to drop by and ask questions there as well. The stream link is in my signature.

[Drakkolich]

For some more thermite knowledge turns out if you hit the same person with 2 of them, the dot refreshes instead of stacking, so you only end up with 1 dot on the person.

[Naz_Palehorse]

What days and times do you typically stream GSF? I'd like to check it out next time you're streaming.

[Drakkolich]

What days and times do you typically stream GSF? I'd like to check it out next time you're streaming.

 

I don't really have a set time, I do post it on the forums when i start streaming. You can also follow my stream and will get a notification when I turn it on.

If you really had your heart set on watching give me a time and day between 6pm-4am EST and I can set something up.

[Verain]

For some more thermite knowledge turns out if you hit the same person with 2 of them, the dot refreshes instead of stacking, so you only end up with 1 dot on the person.

 

I'll also say that the initial thermite hit does benefit from the dot on the previous one- you'll get the extra 20% shield piercing on the initial hit.

[phoenixjon]

If a railgun whizzes by you, do you know that in 2.7 seconds another railgun will be fired at you? Also, if you get hit by a railgun should you just lay down and give up? Edited July 7, 2014 by phoenixjon

[Verain]

I thought railguns always one shot? Every time I get hit I tab out to complain on the forums.

 

 

 

Ok but seriously, I'm surprised there aren't more forumites asking Drako for help. He's a massive resource on like three servers, you shouldn't have to wait for him to make an alt and soloQ you down on a Rycer or whatever minivan the empire starts with when you can ask him here!

[TrinityLyre]

Drako, every game you're in is with 3 friends running a gunship wall. Why is that? Can you elaborate on your choice of ship? Do you feel that gunships are overpowered? Is spewing random garbage like what I'm typing to you overpowered or barely balanced? Please advise.

 

Love,

 

me.

Edited July 8, 2014 by TrinityLyre

[dancezwithnubz]

For some more thermite knowledge turns out if you hit the same person with 2 of them, the dot refreshes instead of stacking, so you only end up with 1 dot on the person.

 

I can't help but wonder, does it actually refresh or just extend the timer by 15s?

 

I'm assuming two different ships flipped a thermite at the same target, between the reload time + lockon time, there's not a lot of 'double DoT' opportunity.

 

Ever gotten a critical hit with a thermite torp? I haven't. Yet