VenomBry Posted January 29, 2014 Share Posted January 29, 2014 I completely understand the need for bolstering for warzones from levels 10 to 54. I do not understand why level 55 warzones are bolstered. The first time I played a warzone as a 55 I was quite surprised to see the bolster buff. You should have to earn your stats for 55 warzones -- no bolster. That also solves the exploits that people are using. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vodrin Posted January 29, 2014 Share Posted January 29, 2014 I completely understand the need for bolstering for warzones from levels 10 to 54. I do not understand why level 55 warzones are bolstered. The first time I played a warzone as a 55 I was quite surprised to see the bolster buff. You should have to earn your stats for 55 warzones -- no bolster. That also solves the exploits that people are using. If BW adopted this attitude it would do a terrific job of killing what little PvP the game has left. Hell, I'd prefer to see every new 55 get handed a full set of PvP gear over what you are talking about. The one thing the 55 bolster does very well is encourage participation by new players and casuals. No one wants to go into a warzone at 55 knowing they will be absolutely destroyed because their gear sucks, and personally I find the idea that I can faceroll my keyboard when facing a new player, due to gear advantage, a detriment to enjoyable PvP. Bolster needs to stay for these reasons, but it does need to be altered so PvP gear is always better than PvE gear. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pistols Posted January 29, 2014 Share Posted January 29, 2014 (edited) If BW adopted this attitude it would do a terrific job of killing what little PvP the game has left. Hell, I'd prefer to see every new 55 get handed a full set of PvP gear over what you are talking about. It used to be this exact way, but Development did a terribad job on the Free gear they gave out (low endurance/expertise and unmoddable) and failed horribly. Players opted to just "take the cash" from the token they gave as opposed to getting the gear. From here, the bad implementation of bolster was given, which was yet another debacle on the development. People need to understand, I think most would be fine with bolster, if it actually did what it was intended to do, but since this team can hardly ever do what is in fact intended, stop making it more difficult and re-introduce another Recruit gear set (free) with higher Endurance and allow it to be moddable. /end Edited January 29, 2014 by Pistols Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Technohic Posted January 29, 2014 Share Posted January 29, 2014 (edited) It used to be this exact way, but Development did a terribad job on the Free gear they gave out (low endurance and unmoddable) and failed horribly. Players opted to just "take the cash" from the token they gave as opposed to getting the gear. From here, the bad implementation of bolster was given, which was yet another debacle on the development. People need to understand, I think most would be fine with bolster, if it actually did what it was intended to do, but since this team can hardly ever do what is in fact intended, stop making it more difficult and re-introduce another Recruit gear set (free) with higher Endurance and allow it to be moddable. /end They used the excuse that the gear replaced entry level PvE gear and it was free, but PvE gear seems to outpace the PvP gear enough to where I don't really see the issue. Maybe then, when max expertise wasn't as high; were other stats closer to PvE raid gear? They didn't even have to do a new set of gear for recruit. This last time, for example; when conq became tier one and Obroan became the tier 2, they could have made Partisan the new free set. Then if you were mid progression, it wouldn't be a waste and it does decent enough in WZs with Obroan opponents as it has the 2018 expertise. Only thing you'd have to worry about now is the PvE weapons being BIS, but with expertise on the PvP ones, maybe they just need a boost on those. Edited January 29, 2014 by Technohic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vodrin Posted January 29, 2014 Share Posted January 29, 2014 I still think the best fix is a better, more transparent bolster system. If they simply had any non-expertise change to one specific set of stats appropriate to the class and stop trying to simply scale gear I think we would be fine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pistols Posted January 29, 2014 Share Posted January 29, 2014 (edited) I still think the best fix is a better, more transparent bolster system. Do you honestly believe they will EVER have a "transparent" bolster system? How long has the current failure of bolster been live? We will never have a transparent bolster system until we get a better development team. /end Edited January 29, 2014 by Pistols Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cashogy_reborn Posted January 29, 2014 Share Posted January 29, 2014 (edited) Bolster is already too convoluted for even the devs to understand. Look at this post; it has nothing we didnt already know, but is straight from the 'combat team' to help clear up confusion about bolster. So either the devs really dont pay attention to any of our feedback, or they dont have an answer so just reiterate what we know hoping that the sheer presence of some yellow text calms people down. Either way, not good. This iteration of bolster is here to stay sadly. It would be great if the community would take responsibility and not abuse the stat exploits you can gain through its mechanics, but that appears to be asking way too much. Edited January 29, 2014 by cashogy_reborn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AdmiralParmesan Posted January 29, 2014 Share Posted January 29, 2014 Bolster is already too convoluted for even the devs to understand. Look at this post; it has nothing we didnt already know, but is straight from the 'combat team' to help clear up confusion about bolster. So either the devs really dont pay attention to any of our feedback, or they dont have an answer so just reiterate what we know hoping that the sheer presence of some yellow text calms people down. Either way, not good. This iteration of bolster is here to stay sadly. It would be great if the community would take responsibility and not abuse the stat exploits you can gain through its mechanics, but that appears to be asking way too much. It's human nature to take the easiest way out. The devs do it by deleting bolster bug threads. The players do it by bolster bugging weapons. After all why grind high level pvp weapons when you could just spend a fraction of the time collecting the correct mods/enhancements you need to complete? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
funkiestj Posted January 29, 2014 Share Posted January 29, 2014 I still think the best fix is a better, more transparent bolster system. If they simply had any non-expertise change to one specific set of stats appropriate to the class and stop trying to simply scale gear I think we would be fine. We are never getting the best fix. An equally opaque bolster system that actually achieves its stated objectives (e.g. bolstered 46s in MH < Obr MH) would be plenty good enough. Just be happy that we have the excellent guide / thread on bolsterthe (literally) game breaking bugs (e.g. PTS one shot bolster bug) have been fixed. The current situation offends sensibility but is plenty playable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zoom_VI Posted January 29, 2014 Share Posted January 29, 2014 The current situation offends sensibility but is plenty playable. ^^this Also for perspective the PvE gear that does bolster improperly are no more than 1% of the PvE gear in the game. Stop raising hell over minor inconsistencies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vodrin Posted January 29, 2014 Share Posted January 29, 2014 ^^this Also for perspective the PvE gear that does bolster improperly are no more than 1% of the PvE gear in the game. Stop raising hell over minor inconsistencies. While I agree that it is not unplayable, the fact that PvP gear is outshined by some PvE gear due to the bolster is s significant problem that should be fixed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zoom_VI Posted January 29, 2014 Share Posted January 29, 2014 While I agree that it is not unplayable, the fact that PvP gear is outshined by some PvE gear due to the bolster is s significant problem that should be fixed. And it is. The bolster "exploits" have been steadily diminishing since bolsters implementation. Human beings just have a tendency to only remember things that support their own beliefs, so all the progress made on bolster is conveniently forgotten. Also all the cool kids QQ about bolster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aetideus Posted January 29, 2014 Share Posted January 29, 2014 (edited) And it is. The bolster "exploits" have been steadily diminishing since bolsters implementation. Human beings just have a tendency to only remember things that support their own beliefs, so all the progress made on bolster is conveniently forgotten. Also all the cool kids QQ about bolster. Of my latest findings on Bolster is, that using light/dark III relics with conqueror gear gives 100 Max damage Iol. I have posted a bug about another bolster exploit but nobody cares. Edited January 29, 2014 by Aetideus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
varietasplus Posted January 29, 2014 Share Posted January 29, 2014 (edited) ^^this Also for perspective the PvE gear that does bolster improperly are no more than 1% of the PvE gear in the game. Stop raising hell over minor inconsistencies. The mainhand/offhand issue is not a minor inconsistency but a major flaw. Also, I started playing on a long forgotten toon and it turned out that my Dread Guard gear with prototype Microfilament implants was better than the Conqueror gear I could exchange. I did not intend the exploit the system, did not even bother to further min-max it, but I had it on me during levelling to 55 and I thought I would quickly swap for PVP gear once I became level 55. How wrong I was... Exchangable gear is the carrot that keeps players playing, without it what is the incentive? Edited January 29, 2014 by varietasplus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Killtastrophe Posted January 29, 2014 Share Posted January 29, 2014 I want to take a second to talk about my feelings. Sometimes bolster makes me sad and sometimes bolster makes me angry. Not once has it made me happy. But then we get events like the Rakghoul Tunnels, where my companion has more expertise than the average red name. Happiness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pistols Posted January 29, 2014 Share Posted January 29, 2014 And it is. The bolster "exploits" have been steadily diminishing since bolsters implementation. Human beings just have a tendency to only remember things that support their own beliefs, so all the progress made on bolster is conveniently forgotten. Also all the cool kids QQ about bolster. Lol ummm no. You go right ahead and keep drinking that koolaid though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
funkiestj Posted January 29, 2014 Share Posted January 29, 2014 While I agree that it is not unplayable, the fact that PvP gear is outshined by some PvE gear due to the bolster is s significant problem that should be fixed. I whole heartedly agree. My pragmatic side looks at how long we went between introduction of ranked PvP preseason and season 1 and says "as much as this annoys me, it ain't getting fixed in 2014". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HotStuff_SW Posted February 3, 2014 Share Posted February 3, 2014 Did a Dev ever get back to us on the whole "Why is PvE Gear EVER > PvP Gear, in PvP" issue? I'm guessing "No"..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EzioMessi Posted February 3, 2014 Share Posted February 3, 2014 Did a Dev ever get back to us on the whole "Why is PvE Gear EVER > PvP Gear, in PvP" issue? I'm guessing "No"..... I have sent multiple ticjets in-gane, and there have been tons of threads about it. It's funny how a tiny bug with the Revan Armor got an immediate reply from Tait, but a stupidly designed bolster system has received 2 posts in over 8 months. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Technohic Posted February 3, 2014 Share Posted February 3, 2014 New guy wanted to get this out there, but after that, dropped the mic. They are famous for that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fellow-Canadian Posted February 3, 2014 Share Posted February 3, 2014 New guy wanted to get this out there, but after that, dropped the mic. They are famous for that. Yup, this is a case of a seriously game changing issue of PVE mods making PVP gear negligible and the Devs don't comment on if they plan to fix it. You don't have to tell us when the fix is going to be patched. Just that the dev team doesn't like PVE mods in PVP and is going to make changes so PVP gear is king. That would be enough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
varietasplus Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 (edited) As promised, I pulled a few questions from this discussion and took them to the Combat team for some answers! I have also collected your reports of certain PvE items becoming more viable in PvP than PvP gear when it comes to stats after bolster. The Combat team is actively looking into this, and I will update you with information as I get it. How actively are they looking into it? Almost a month passed... It is a question how you define "actively" though... Dear Mr. Tait Watson, For a long time you have been the first one to give us hope there might be finally some changes to the way PVP community is handled in this game, yet silence on the issue of bolster is falling upon us again. Yes, we understand it is a sensitive problem, there is no elegant way out of it, but there is no turning back. There is only one thing worse than ignorance - Promising something, making us hope and letting us down again. Edited February 10, 2014 by varietasplus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SW-TORtanic Posted February 10, 2014 Share Posted February 10, 2014 And it is. The bolster "exploits" have been steadily diminishing since bolsters implementation. Human beings just have a tendency to only remember things that support their own beliefs, so all the progress made on bolster is conveniently forgotten. Also all the cool kids QQ about bolster. u must be a bad... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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