NERF : Guardian Tanks

[Panzerfire]

yea I realize that I simply wasn't sure if you seriously thought that would help or if you tried to make a joke.

 

The worst case scenario of a *fix* for Shadow/Assassin tanks would be a buff which doesn't help with spikiness or something so minor as 1% DR just to keep the masses happy.

I wonder if we would have more luck by shouting out *rework the current content so it's easier for Shadow/Assassins to survive* instead of the buff/nerf game. And just changing damage spikes to I/E damage would not work since people will again (rightly) complain that we have an unfair advantage with Force Shroud/Resilience if all dangerous mechanics are I/E damage types.

[Kitru]

And just changing damage spikes to I/E damage would not work since people will again (rightly) complain that we have an unfair advantage with Force Shroud/Resilience if all dangerous mechanics are I/E damage types.

 

Well, even *if* all spikes were converted to I/E rather than K/E, the spikes come faster than Resilience comes off of CD. On top of that, Saber Reflect would work just as well for all but a tiny portion of them. It's not really a question of "Shadows have it better than everyone else" at that point but instead "VGs are screwed because they *don't* have a CD and also have the lowest I/E DR".

 

Honestly, the current state of tanks is a confluence of multiple bad decisions on the part of the devs. They overbuffed Guardians, did nothing to address the single weakness that VGs had that *needed* to be addressed, and developed content that specifically demolishes Shadows based upon their own ignorance of tanks other than Guardians.

 

There's no *single* thing that could be done to solve the problem amongst all of the tanks, which is why it, honestly, needs to be a reanalysis of the entire structure: spike damage needs to be reevaluated and constructed as either a *large* (re: 5-8) number of attacks or as I/E damage; Shadows and Guardians both need to have their spikiness reigned in (Shadows reduced, Guardians increased); VGs and Guardians both need to have their CD suite reevaluated (Guardians weakened to some extent; VGs strengthened with the addition of an anti-F/T CD). The first is to prevent unfair spike danger between the tanks. The second is to make it so that Guardians aren't stepping on the toes of VGs (since smoothness of incoming damage is *supposed* to be their schtick) and that Shadows don't live or die at the mercy of the RNG. The third is to prevent Guardians from stepping on the toes of Shadows (since "amazing CD suite" is *supposed* to be the Shadow schtick). The last is to prevent the devs from creating content that obliterates one tank more than the others by allowing them to actually prevent the amount of damage a spike does from varying wildly (either dealing too little damage or dealing too much).

Edited August 2, 2013 by Kitru

[Grumpftard]

I agree Shadows are spikey and need some love. I have read several of your post and others about the subject. Can you really claim this post has added anything new?

 

IIRC that was really the whole point of Leafy's post.

Nobody *really* cares about nerfing guardians. But since the devs have continually maintained an attitude of "shrmkthxbai" when it comes to Shadow spikiness and have the perpetuating appearance that Guardians are the only class they care about.

The *newness* of this post comes in that maybe if we attack their precious guardian, we might get Shadows fixed.

It's kinda like trying to cure high blood pressure with a heart transplant. A little extreme, but I for one agree that this is getting a little too frustrating. It's getting to the point where I want to just give up and find another game.

 

So if the only way to get the devs attention and get Shadow/Sin fixed is this, then I say....

 

NERF THE BASTAGIS!

Edited August 2, 2013 by Grumpftard

[ArchangelLBC]

I agree Shadows are spikey and need some love. I have read several of your post and others about the subject. Can you really claim this post has added anything new?

 

If this thread had actually gotten some attention from the devs besides "we're aware and looking into it", then that would have been something new.

[Dragonexadon]

If this thread had actually gotten some attention from the devs besides "we're aware and looking into it", then that would have been something new.

 

True, but devs have often stated several times before that post like these are not the post they are looking for.

 

Edit: As compassion the post that finally got a dev response was well thought out (even though short in terms of a Kitru post). Not a post stating

 

"Guardian tanks faceroll, nerf guardians"

Edited August 2, 2013 by Dragonexadon

[MillionsKNives]

True, but devs have often stated several times before that post like these are not the post they are looking for.

 

Edit: As compassion the post that finally got a dev response was well thought out (even though short in terms of a Kitru post). Not a post stating

 

"Guardian tanks faceroll, nerf guardians"

 

Actually that's not true. The only reason they posted in that thread was because Leafy was posting threads all over the forums DEMANDING that they take a look at the problem. Them posting the response in Kitru's thread was only to save face from looking like they were giving in to the demands of a raving lunatic (sorry Leafy ).

Edited August 2, 2013 by MillionsKNives

[WillLongstick]

Honestly, the current state of tanks is a confluence of multiple bad decisions on the part of the devs. They overbuffed Guardians, did nothing to address the single weakness that VGs had that *needed* to be addressed, and developed content that specifically demolishes Shadows based upon their own ignorance of tanks other than Guardians.

 

If the single weakness of VG's is their cooldown suite then I have to ask if you paid attention to the 2.0 patch notes. Kolto Overload got taken from nearly useless all the way up to the best heal in the game. Energy Shield got its duration increased, and is now the longest cooldown in the game. Oil Slick had its effect increased by 50% making it quite a powerful cooldown.

 

There's no *single* thing that could be done to solve the problem amongst all of the tanks, which is why it, honestly, needs to be a reanalysis of the entire structure: spike damage needs to be reevaluated and constructed as either a *large* (re: 5-8) number of attacks or as I/E damage; Shadows and Guardians both need to have their spikiness reigned in (Shadows reduced, Guardians increased); VGs and Guardians both need to have their CD suite reevaluated (Guardians weakened to some extent; VGs strengthened with the addition of an anti-F/T CD). The first is to prevent unfair spike danger between the tanks. The second is to make it so that Guardians aren't stepping on the toes of VGs (since smoothness of incoming damage is *supposed* to be their schtick) and that Shadows don't live or die at the mercy of the RNG. The third is to prevent Guardians from stepping on the toes of Shadows (since "amazing CD suite" is *supposed* to be the Shadow schtick). The last is to prevent the devs from creating content that obliterates one tank more than the others by allowing them to actually prevent the amount of damage a spike does from varying wildly (either dealing too little damage or dealing too much).

 

Increase Sin tank armor while decreasing their other stats, and decrease Jugg tank armor while increasing other stats. All tanks have roughly the right amount of average mitigation, it's just the spikiness that's causing imbalances. I've played with KeyboardNinja's Ops Chief and Thrasher spikiness code, and there are only 2 parameters with a significant effect on spikiness; armor rating and health pool. Right now Sin tanks can greatly increase their chances to live through spikes by taking B lettered mods and UW/KD ears and implants over the Veracity ones (which is why I roll my eyes at any tank, but especially a Sin who claims to be BIS with 34k health). But that increased chance to live still leaves them far behind Jugg tank spikiness, and only tweaking armor will fix that.

 

As for your quip about current content being designed to obliterate 1 tank more than the other, I'll kindly point out that a lot of the NIM content is designed to accommodate Sin tanks. Huge Grenade is 7 simultaneous attacks, the Writhing Horror's melee attack is 3 simultaneous attacks and his force attack is 2 simultaneous attacks. Any time 1 attack is broken down into several hits a Sin tank. And before you chime in about many attacks blowing through your Dark Ward stacks, a Sin tank should be expected to continuously have Dark Ward up if the APS is 1.67 or less, meaning bosses that attack on a 1.5 second GCD, attack with an average of 2.5 simultaneous attacks.

 

I'll spot you Terminate. I think the intention was for it to force tank swaps to cycle good cooldowns, but the design of the attack allows Jugg tanks to just cycle their own cooldowns, and allows Powertechs to just eat it.

[Dragonexadon]

Actually that's not true. The only reason they posted in that thread was because Leafy was posting threads all over the forums DEMANDING that they take a look at the problem. Them posting the response in Kitru's thread was only to save face from looking like they were giving in to the demands of a raving lunatic (sorry Leafy ).

 

haha fair enough. I never thought trolling the devs was the best way to fish a response. But if it works, what can I really say?

[Berjiz]

Increase Sin tank armor while decreasing their other stats, and decrease Jugg tank armor while increasing other stats. All tanks have roughly the right amount of average mitigation, it's just the spikiness that's causing imbalances. I've played with KeyboardNinja's Ops Chief and Thrasher spikiness code, and there are only 2 parameters with a significant effect on spikiness; armor rating and health pool. Right now Sin tanks can greatly increase their chances to live through spikes by taking B lettered mods and UW/KD ears and implants over the Veracity ones (which is why I roll my eyes at any tank, but especially a Sin who claims to be BIS with 34k health). But that increased chance to live still leaves them far behind Jugg tank spikiness, and only tweaking armor will fix that.

It doesn't only still leave them behind spikness it also makes their mean migation worse than juggs(is a KBN post about it somewhere). So it kinda doesn't work. Your are scarificing a lot of stats for it. KD ears/implants are worth it, just 10 stats for 72 endurance.

 

As for your quip about current content being designed to obliterate 1 tank more than the other, I'll kindly point out that a lot of the NIM content is designed to accommodate Sin tanks. Huge Grenade is 7 simultaneous attacks, the Writhing Horror's melee attack is 3 simultaneous attacks and his force attack is 2 simultaneous attacks. Any time 1 attack is broken down into several hits a Sin tank. And before you chime in about many attacks blowing through your Dark Ward stacks, a Sin tank should be expected to continuously have Dark Ward up if the APS is 1.67 or less, meaning bosses that attack on a 1.5 second GCD, attack with an average of 2.5 simultaneous attacks.

 

I'll spot you Terminate. I think the intention was for it to force tank swaps to cycle good cooldowns, but the design of the attack allows Jugg tanks to just cycle their own cooldowns, and allows Powertechs to just eat it.

2 or 3 hits might be to little 4 or 5 is probably better at reducing the rng. Part of the problem with terminte is that more cooldowns doesn't solve it since said cooldowns aren't guaranted. With deflection up it's still about 10% chance for it go through.

Edited August 2, 2013 by Berjiz

[Kitru]

If the single weakness of VG's is their cooldown suite then I have to ask if you paid attention to the 2.0 patch notes. Kolto Overload got taken from nearly useless all the way up to the best heal in the game. Energy Shield got its duration increased, and is now the longest cooldown in the game. Oil Slick had its effect increased by 50% making it quite a powerful cooldown.

 

Adrenaline Rush is almost useless in its current state. Yes, it's great if you're knocked down to sub-30% hp while taking moderate-to-low DPS but, in *any* other situation, it's terrible. It's simply *too* conditional, especially since it's not like VGs ever really drop low enough to activate it.

 

Reactive Shield getting pushed up to 18 seconds from 15 seconds for tanks isn't really an amazing change. Yes, it means that it's fully 6 seconds longer than the other tank CDs, but that's not really saying much since they have a *single* major tank CD that lasts 18 seconds whereas the other tanks have 2 major tank CDs that last 12 seconds apiece, allowing for 24 seconds of major survivability.

 

Riot Gas is, and has *always*, been questionable in its application as an actual tank CD rather than an averageable commodity that should be used on CD, like Energy Blast. *I* have always considered it an ability that should be used on CD because that's how it gets used by pretty much *every* VG tank I know, including myself. Yes, you can reserve it for CD specific usage, but it's not as powerful as the other tank CDs by a long shot, nor does it afford appreciable F/T protection, which is the *major* VG weakness now that Guardians get to ignore a large amount of it. Also, it wasn't doubled. It got pulled up to 30% from 18%, which is a 67% increase.

 

The VG CD suite is *still* the weakest CD suite. Yes, it got buffed, but the weakness to which I was referring was the lack of an F/T CD which is a glaring weakness considering what Saber Reflect did to the basic status of tank CD suites.

[CgSquall]

Adrenaline Rush is almost useless in its current state. Yes, it's great if you're knocked down to sub-30% hp while taking moderate-to-low DPS but, in *any* other situation, it's terrible. It's simply *too* conditional, especially since it's not like VGs ever really drop low enough to activate it.

 

Reactive Shield getting pushed up to 18 seconds from 15 seconds for tanks isn't really an amazing change. Yes, it means that it's fully 6 seconds longer than the other tank CDs, but that's not really saying much since they have a *single* major tank CD that lasts 18 seconds whereas the other tanks have 2 major tank CDs that last 12 seconds apiece, allowing for 24 seconds of major survivability.

 

Riot Gas is, and has *always*, been questionable in its application as an actual tank CD rather than an averageable commodity that should be used on CD, like Energy Blast. *I* have always considered it an ability that should be used on CD because that's how it gets used by pretty much *every* VG tank I know, including myself. Yes, you can reserve it for CD specific usage, but it's not as powerful as the other tank CDs by a long shot, nor does it afford appreciable F/T protection, which is the *major* VG weakness now that Guardians get to ignore a large amount of it. Also, it wasn't doubled. It got pulled up to 30% from 18%, which is a 67% increase.

 

The VG CD suite is *still* the weakest CD suite. Yes, it got buffed, but the weakness to which I was referring was the lack of an F/T CD which is a glaring weakness considering what Saber Reflect did to the basic status of tank CD suites.

 

 

Honestly, as a PT tank main, I'm okay with us having the weakest of the CD suites, because in very comparable gear, both min/maxed to dipstick's mitigation numbers, my PT has an incredibly smooth damage curve compared to my Juggernaut. If they would just fix Kolto/Adrenaline to be useful in ANY way - in an average HM operation run, I don't use it, and in NiM I'll go from 40% to dead, so it'll never trigger - it would make the CD suite acceptable.

 

I personally feel that PT/VG's are the better tank over Juggernauts with the singular exception of that ridiculous CD suite that they have. Saber Ward is by far the best cooldown in the game, bar none. Juggernauts can still die due to RNG, and since spikiness is the main issue in NiM currently, this is why I feel that PT's make the "best" tank, they are least likely to die due to bad RNG and spikiness, with Juggernauts not too far behind.

 

The differences come down to a better CD suite for a ~20% increased likeliness to die due to poor RNG in Jugg vs PT. I land on the side of making the damage less spiky for the healers, since there are no "tank heal checks" in this game, any "heal check" is AOE, and only if people don't do mechanics right.

 

It's sad the current state of the game for tanks is "How well can you manage damage spikes?" instead of "damage mitigation". It's why I am seriously considering just dropping defense and stacking shield chance to all oblivion.

[Agidius]

as far as I see:

 

PT: good tank for beginners, with a strong rotation excellent damage reduction

 

Jugg: mid-tier tank, which was for more than a year a sub-par tank, finally buffed up to the other two tanks. That's it.

 

Assa tank: clearly the op tank before 2.0, totally unbalanced, huge advantage of TTK so all the FOTM fans instantly switched to it, and now after 2.0 they altered the mechanics so in response day after day they just whine on the forums. Interesting fact, no one complained about themselves to be op and requiring a nerf before 2.0

 

Many guilds use assa tanks for NiM content, so plz stop whining, and adapt to the changes.

[Kitru]

The differences come down to a better CD suite for a ~20% increased likeliness to die due to poor RNG in Jugg vs PT. I land on the side of making the damage less spiky for the healers, since there are no "tank heal checks" in this game, any "heal check" is AOE, and only if people don't do mechanics right.

 

Actually, the Guardian worst case is actually pretty much identical to the VG worst case. The only thing that makes them spikier is having higher Defense and lower Shield/Abs. They're no more likely to die to a spike than a VG but they're simply *slightly* more likely to have one of those spikes happen.

[CgSquall]

as far as I see:

 

PT: good tank for beginners, with a strong rotation excellent damage reduction

 

Jugg: mid-tier tank, which was for more than a year a sub-par tank, finally buffed up to the other two tanks. That's it.

 

Assa tank: clearly the op tank before 2.0, totally unbalanced, huge advantage of TTK so all the FOTM fans instantly switched to it, and now after 2.0 they altered the mechanics so in response day after day they just whine on the forums. Interesting fact, no one complained about themselves to be op and requiring a nerf before 2.0

 

Many guilds use assa tanks for NiM content, so plz stop whining, and adapt to the changes.

 

Two things: many guilds still use assassin tanks for NiM content because of the player behind the tank, and the fact that they're already geared, not because assassins are the best tanks for the content.

 

Second thing: I would actually never suggest a powertech/vanguard to a beginner, I would suggest a Juggernaut. Powertechs/Vanguards have heat/ammo management and more procs to watch than Juggernauts, and some people may disagree with me, but I have no real set rotation on my PT tank, it relies on procs and more of a priority list, Juggernauts have become an attack string with one small variance - hit Retaliation/Riposte when possible. That's it. Otherwise it's simply Crushing Blow, Smash, Force Scream, Sundering Assault, rinse, repeat.

 

Edit: Powertech/Vanguard tanks heat/ammo management can destroy beginner tanks, Juggernauts have nearly zero resource issues is the short version of what I was getting at.

Edited August 2, 2013 by CgSquall

[Kitru]

Jugg: mid-tier tank, which was for more than a year a sub-par tank, finally buffed up to the other two tanks. That's it.

 

Is that based off of math or your own feeling about your own class? Because every single method of analysis very aptly demonstrates that Guardians are the absolute *best* tanks. Guardians weren't just buffed to be equal to the other tanks. They were buffed to be *better* than the other tanks because everything the other tanks do well Guardians do *just* as well. They *have* no weaknesses and have all of the strengths of the other tanks.

 

Assa tank: clearly the op tank before 2.0, totally unbalanced

 

It's pretty obvious from your description that you never played a Shad/Sin and *do* play a Guard/Jugg. Shadows performed the best because their survivability was tied the most to the player behind the character. A skilled player could do *amazing* things with a Shadow whereas a *bad* player would die insanely fast.

 

There was a balance between the tanks pre-2.0: VGs were incredibly hard to screw up but topped out the lowest; Shadows were *very* easy to screw up but topped out the highest when you used all of the tools available to you properly; Guardians were the middle ground. The *only* disadvantage that Guardians had pre-2.0 was in threat/damage generation which was a non-issue because of the threat state in the game. Anyone claiming otherwise is deluding themselves. Anyone claiming that their threat issues somehow give them *reason* to be overpowered at the moment is simply suffering from entitlement issues.

[Agidius]

I have vanguard-shadow and a jugg, thank you for the assumptions

 

I tank on all of them. I did not require math to see how easy i died with huge RNG hits on my jugg pre 2.0 and how different it was on my vanguard and shadow.

 

Since 2.0 I feel the difference between them in terms of rotation or timing CD's, but that's it, no THE SKY IS FALLING OMG OMG THEY KILLED THE SHADOW TANKING.

 

I know that your main is a shadow so you're biased,that's understandable, it must be hard after getting used to an op tank for 1.5 years to adapt to some changes now, maybe it's me but I don't find it that disastrous.

[Kitru]

I tank on all of them. I did not require math to see how easy i died with huge RNG hits on my jugg pre 2.0 and how different it was on my vanguard and shadow.

 

Where the hell did spike RNG *ever* have a major impact pre-2.0? There simply *weren't* any big "def/shield or dead" situations pre-2.0. The *only* issue that Guardians ever had was damage/threat. Trying to concoct scenarios where you were somehow more disadvantaged than that is simply rewriting history to fit your own viewpoints.

[Yngow]

lol rng on juggs before 2.0 thats new

[TridusSWTOR]

Love how pre-2.0 Juggs only dealt with threat issues, according to biased assassin tanks. Hrmm bring in a tank that the DPS have to wait to build up threat or pick a tank class that can never lose threat even at the very start of a fight. Gee, wonder who a raid leader would pick?

 

Let's just ignore the fact they had to spec out of their own tank tree to get the most out of their class.

 

Kinda hard to get certain people to see some form of logic, when they dismiss an ability to provide a healing bonus.

 

If you didn't realize the clear advantage of bringing double sins pre 2.0 then you just grouped with bad DPS and bad healers.

 

Entitlement indeed....

[MillionsKNives]

Love how pre-2.0 Juggs only dealt with threat issues, according to biased assassin tanks. Hrmm bring in a tank that the DPS have to wait to build up threat or pick a tank class that can never lose threat even at the very start of a fight. Gee, wonder who a raid leader would pick?

 

Let's just ignore the fact they had to spec out of their own tank tree to get the most out of their class.

 

Kinda hard to get certain people to see some form of logic, when they dismiss an ability to provide a healing bonus.

 

If you didn't realize the clear advantage of bringing double sins pre 2.0 then you just grouped with bad DPS and bad healers.

 

Entitlement indeed....

 

You claim that Jugs had more than just threat issues, and then go on to only mention things related to threat issues. Strong argument you make.

[Kitru]

Love how pre-2.0 Juggs only dealt with threat issues, according to biased assassin tanks. Hrmm bring in a tank that the DPS have to wait to build up threat or pick a tank class that can never lose threat even at the very start of a fight. Gee, wonder who a raid leader would pick?

 

Cuz, you know, losing all of 3-5 seconds of DPS or telling your DPS to not open up with *everything* right off the bat is *such* a terrible thing to have to deal with. I ran a Guardian tank pre-2.0. The threat problems weren't a big deal in the *least* unless your DPS were complete and total idiots.

 

The hyperbolic and ignorant arguments about Guardians having a hard time pre-2.0 are going *all* kinds of crazy. Having to spec into a different tree because your home tree is poorly built isn't a reason for the class itself to be labelled terrible, especially since the actual difference in performance wasn't actually all that big.

 

How any tank performed pre-2.0 has *no* bearing upon how they're supposed to perform right now. Anyone attempting to bring up pre-2.0 performance as justification for *current* performance is simply arguing that they're *entitled* to their current level of performance rather than actually making a case for balanced performance.

[Fallen_Dragon]

As a Juggernaught tank that has an Assassin and a Powertech I say go ahead and nerf saber reflect, and boost up Shadow mitigation. However if you do this we go back to pre 2.0 issues with threat so on the flip side buff up my Juggernaught's damage so I don't have threat issues. And I want my jug to hit extremely hard. This will balance it as far as I'm concerned because when I hit the mob I want that group to see only one threat ME! I grow tired of the Assassin that I tank with ripping threat off me because he hits harder therefore without taunt fluffing I'm hard pressed to hold threat even against him unless I get there first and drop SR, so give me the one thing I should have and that is power. Malgus and Vader were force's to be feared and I should be as well. The Shadows/Assassins want to sneak up on people and hit from behind that's their choice, but I'm a Juggernaught so I chose to go in head first and lead the charge. Let the Shadow/Assassin crowd keep cheesing their way through content while I step up to what ever is in front of me grab it by the face and twist without having to go back to my hybrid spec or hybrid out my gear which will decrease my mitigation just like the other two tanks are able to do. After all fair is fair.

[Arator]

Shouldn't you be asking for Sin/Shadow tanks to be buffed instead of asking for the other tanks to be nerfed?

[ArchangelLBC]

Shouldn't you be asking for Sin/Shadow tanks to be buffed instead of asking for the other tanks to be nerfed?

 

People been trying that for months to no effect.

They've been officially "been looking into it" for 31 days now.

 

Hey guys,

 

Apologies for the silence on this. I wanted to pass this back to the combat guys and make sure we had an in-depth conversation about Shadow/Assassin tanks before coming back to you guys. What I can say is that we are investigating the Shadow/Assassin tank’s performance against hard-hitting Operations bosses. I have no timeline on any potential changes right now but I at least wanted you guys to know that we are aware of your concerns.

 

-eric

 

That's from the 3rd of July.

Edited August 3, 2013 by ArchangelLBC

[Leafy_Bug]

People been trying that for months to no effect.

They've been officially "been looking into it" for 31 days now.

 

 

 

That's from the 3rd of July.

 

I guess we need 12 x 31 days for a change .

 

 

Sure I can ask Friendly Fire anytime what they think of your great ideas to nerf their main tanks.

 

 

Friendly fire were using 1 Shadow Tank +1 Guardian Tank (Kanre) and one guardian off tank (Donal, szia te faszi! ) pre 2.0. They switched according to the FOTM. Colley can't use the shadow he enjoys he has to use Coltan his guardian because its superior in every way. So BioWare screwed these guilds as well. Read a bit more into this before you snap . In addition, just because FF uses guardians as main tanks, we have to keep it low when this class is clearly OP and needs a nerf? What about all these other guilds who had progress postponed by 4 weeks due to the need to reroll guardian? They don't count, yes? Oh crap, I forgot, we have bad healers if we had to reroll guardian

 

 

 

I have a vanguard 55, I tanked SV HM it was a snooze fest. I was shocked at how steady damage is at thrasher and pretty much everywhere. Not seeing 10k hp taken away with one hit was pleasant. Play style for me is a no no and I cannot stand ammo based classes. I also have a guardian who yesterday hit 21 (after 1.5 months) I go in lowbie fps and it is a complete bore. My shadow was way more entertaining at low levels than this. I am aware things will change when i hit 55 but I simply do not have the motivation.

 

I have a sentinel 55, 3k dps, and a while back I rolled a slinger as we had none in our composition. Slinger is level 35 and i cannot stand it. Just because it is FOTM, I should not be forced to play it. In the original Dread NiM release, he who had no slingers/snipers had no chance. So I got back to my sentinel as I cannot get into gunslinger. I also have a sage/sorc, scoundrel, operative, mara and little juggie for achievements. I am done with leveling on BioWare's whims. They need to provide an EQUAL CHANCE for classes to finish content. At this point in time Shadow tanks and Shadow DPS are the worst out there.

 

 

 

NERF GUARDIAN TANKS!

Edited August 3, 2013 by Leafy_Bug