Please nerf Flash Bang insta-AOE "mez"!

[jedcjedcjedc]

2/3 sniper trees have 19,723 CC abilities. Apparently, everything is a CC now.

 

leg shot, flashbang, debilitate, cover pulse and ambush if spec'd in marksman. replace aimed shot with plasma probe for engi. pretty sure no other class has this much.

[Brunner_Venda]

leg shot, flashbang, debilitate, cover pulse and ambush if spec'd in marksman. replace aimed shot with plasma probe for engi. pretty sure no other class has this much.

 

I hate CC as much as you do, but isn't leg shot a snare?

 

My snare breaker isn't on a 2 minute CD. No harm no foul.

[NoTomorrow]

leg shot, flashbang, debilitate, cover pulse and ambush if spec'd in marksman. replace aimed shot with plasma probe for engi. pretty sure no other class has this much.

 

You speak easily refutable nonsense:

 

Deception Assassin:

whirlwind

stun

lowslash

mindtrap

overload

spike

 

Oh and legshot is not a CC. so that's basicaly 4 CC vs 6 CC.

Edited June 12, 2013 by NoTomorrow

[SettGirkkurn]

Yeah! Nerf operative! The only way to do it properly is to nerf operative nao!

Btw, do you want some cheese with that whine?

[Polymerize]

I just rolled a sniper.

 

I am an advocate of 'NoTmrw' not being the sniper's *poster child*.

 

Anyone who plays a sniper and complains about anything other than how OP they are is bad. I am going to win games single handedly on this mother fckr.

 

That is all.

Edited June 12, 2013 by Polymerize

[JP_Legatus]

You speak easily refutable nonsense:

 

Deception Assassin:

whirlwind

stun

lowslash

mindtrap

overload

spike

 

Oh and legshot is not a CC. so that's basicaly 4 CC vs 6 CC.

 

Except that your aoe mezz basically performs the same role as our 2s/1.5s cast whirlwind (easily interruptable) and 4 mind traps (melee range from stealth and out of combat) since it can hit 5 targets, and is instant from 30m away. The fact that it does this all in one move makes it superior to either. In the case of operatives, they ALSO get an 8s mezz.

 

Overload and cover pulse work differently but are essentially equal, except that overload doesn't include a root for sins and cover pulse does (and our knockback doesn't do much in combat since we're a melee class).

 

Spike is a 2s melee stun (only one free global) with a 30s cd that requires stealth (or you can't get low slash) and leg shot is a 2-5s root from 30m (can be 2 free globals) with a 15s cd. Both can be talented to provide a 3s snare afterwards.

 

Low slash is a 4s mezz that amounts to 1 free global assuming nobody hits you. Ambush knocks someone back and will probably also be 1 free global, except that ambush also happens to do a stupid **** ton of damage, and low slash basically does saber strike damage.

 

As for immunity, sins get a 3/5s force shroud and snipers get a TWENTY SECOND entrench, which also activates for 3s after every roll (20s cooldown). So for every 60s, a sin will spend 3-5s immune to cc and a sniper will spend TWENTY SIX seconds immune to cc and are always immune to interrupts.

 

Our force speed gives us a little extra distance (I think) over covered escape, and can be talented to break roots. Meanwhile, covered escape not only breaks roots, it also DODGES EVERYTHING THAT OCCURS during its execution and provides 3s of entrench afterwards. On top of that, you also get 50% speed boost after leaving cover for 6s.

 

Meanwhile, your class also does more dps on every measurable standard that exists and does it from 35m away while sins do it from melee range in light armor. Please go on about how sins are more op than your sniper.

Edited June 12, 2013 by JP_Legatus

[vimm]

Nerf all mezzes to 6s, restore instant force lift. No more ninja caps, but Balance Sages/Shadows get some of their lost survivability and utility back.

 

Ninja capping through 2 8s mezzes is stupid anyways. The possiblity is stupid, that is.

 

That Lambaste picture is great, lol.

[JP_Legatus]

That Lambaste picture is great, lol.

 

Agree that is the most awesome picture ever

[davaniel]

You speak easily refutable nonsense:

 

Deception Assassin:

whirlwind

stun

lowslash

mindtrap

overload

spike

 

Oh and legshot is not a CC. so that's basicaly 4 CC vs 6 CC.

 

Oh come on now...

Whirlwind is interruptable

Spike only usable from stealth and lasts only 2 seconds (30 second cooldown, it's like calling conceal ops hidden strike a cc, but worse)

Overload is NOT a cc. Maybe you got deception assassin confused with lightning sorc?

 

If spike counts as a cc then legshot most definitely counts as a cc. Ok officially it's a root. But that guy burning in the fire isn't going to be very interested in the technical difference.

 

Flashbang is fine, stop the ******** on snipers when you never play yourself

[JP_Legatus]

Oh come on now...

Whirlwind is interruptable

Spike only usable from stealth and lasts only 2 seconds (30 second cooldown, it's like calling conceal ops hidden strike a cc, but worse)

Overload is NOT a cc. Maybe you got deception assassin confused with lightning sorc?

 

If spike counts as a cc then legshot most definitely counts as a cc. Ok officially it's a root. But that guy burning in the fire isn't going to be very interested in the technical difference.

 

Flashbang is fine, stop the ******** on snipers when you never play yourself

 

At least you seem more reasonable than the other guy, but flash bang is still the most op mezz by far and snipers are easily the most op dps, and I do plan to level one during double xp weekend. I played mine up to 33 and I basically took a giant **** on anyone who attacked me.

[AngusFTW]

I think all mezzes should be 6s and that 8s is too long. I don't see it making that much of an impact on sniper gameplay since most of them are lethality and are breaking everyones mezzes anyway trololololol

[NoTomorrow]

I think all mezzes should be 6s and that 8s is too long. I don't see it making that much of an impact on sniper gameplay since most of them are lethality and are breaking everyones mezzes anyway trololololol

 

Bleez, take a look on lethality tree once again please. You are not very well informed.

[Ottoattack]

I am not sure if you are defending 8 sec instant CC with 30 meters range what are you trying to proof. Quite frankly, there should be no CCs that last more than 4 secs that do not require setup, especially aoe... I am against warrior instant 6 sec mez, same with sniper and operatives. While I may understand it for operatives dps, operative healers, snipers and warriors do not and should not have these skills. They slow down game play significantly, and are borderline OP for classes that are not lacking defensive capabilities.

 

Another option would be to increase their CD, since they are barely used in PvE anyway. With the current state (even before expansion) aoe instant 6-8 sec CCs. Is too much, especially that they are given to classes that are not lacking on survivability.

[Polymerize]

Sure let us advocate changes to the game that would break PvP warzones because we want '1v1's' to be more balanced.

 

L2P

 

(Flash bang could use some tweaking; rest is fine.)

Edited June 12, 2013 by Polymerize

[Jorojus]

Some arguments I read here are about reduced cd to 30 seconds and from 30 m away, all true and all for snipers (reduced cd if they are specced in it only).

 

Then I see a comparison with the assassin (inquisitor) who also has an 8 second mezz but single target and wich is interruptable (you can spec in it so its instant, if you don't play fotm spec and I am not talking about the tanking tree)

I find it laughable if players that only play assassin would complain about an ability that also would affect the operative class, more precisely the dps specs. Operatives flashbang is a 1 minute cd and has a max range of 10m. This is why operatives are, together with assassins the best 1v1 or 2v2 cappers of an objective if they play it smart.

 

Ever tought about why an objective cap is 8 seconds and some specific stealth classes have an 8 second mezz ? It's to easy cap the people who don't know when to use their cc breaker or don't know how to effectively guard an objective.

 

Assassins are still among the fotm classes and always have been since the start of this game, sorcerers don't have anything to complain about either. Any assasin that complains at this moment that the dps specs they can play are worse then the other dps specs that can also stealth and in that aspect have a similar role in the warzones really should just learn how to play or at least try a different spec if they think that one of their specs has been numbed down too much.

 

Now I don't want to make this into a discussion about wich stealth class is the most viable in warzones, but seriously, don't go comparing classes in this game.

All classes have a few abilites that another class doesn't have, in return they get something in return, either utility, damage, extra healing or tanking. It's what brings the diversity into this game and makes it fun to re-roll other classes.

If you want every class to have the exact same abilities you better go play some COD, everyone has a flashbang there ...

 

 

I can understand that people complain about the utility agent snipers have right now together with the dps they can put out but don't go yelling for nerfs for the full agent class ...

In my opinion snipers were already viable before they got the dps buff, people just didn't know how to utilize all the utility. Its only now that they got a dps buff that everyone is here to complain about the utility they have.

Edited June 12, 2013 by Jorojus

[Polymerize]

Some arguments I read here are about reduced cd to 30 seconds and from 30 m away, all true and all for snipers (reduced cd if they are specced in it only).

 

Then I see a comparison with the assassin (inquisitor) who also has an 8 second mezz but single target and wich is interruptable (you can spec in it so its instant, if you don't play fotm spec and I am not talking about the tanking tree)

I find it laughable if players that only play assassin would complain about an ability that also would affect the operative class, more precisely the dps specs. Operatives flashbang is a 1 minute cd and has a max range of 10m. This is why operatives are, together with assassins the best 1v1 or 2v2 cappers of an objective if they play it smart.

 

Ever tought about why an objective cap is 8 seconds and some specific stealth classes have an 8 second mezz ? It's to easy cap the people who don't know when to use their cc breaker or don't know how to effectively guard an objective.

 

Assassins are still among the fotm classes and always have been since the start of this game, sorcerers don't have anything to complain about either. Any assasin that complains at this moment that the dps specs they can play are worse then the other dps specs that can also stealth and in that aspect have a similar role in the warzones really should just learn how to play or at least try a different spec if they think that one of their specs has been numbed down too much.

 

Now I don't want to make this into a discussion about wich stealth class is the most viable in warzones, but seriously, don't go comparing classes in this game.

All classes have a few abilites that another class doesn't have, in return they get something in return, either utility, damage, extra healing or tanking. It's what brings the diversity into this game and makes it fun to re-roll other classes.

If you want every class to have the exact same abilities you better go play some COD, everyone has a flashbang there ...

 

 

I can understand that people complain about the utility agent snipers have right now together with the dps they can put out but don't go yelling for nerfs for the full agent class ...

In my opinion snipers were already viable before they got the dps buff, people just didn't know how to utilize all the utility. Its only now that they got a dps buff that everyone is here to complain about the utility they have.

 

Not all of this was bad, but most of it was.

[DarthOvertone]

This thread doesn't deliver.

 

0/10...would not bang

[foxmob]

0/10...would not bang

ha! nice.

[Glower]

Then I see a comparison with the assassin (inquisitor) who also has an 8 second mezz but single target and wich is interruptable (you can spec in it so its instant, if you don't play fotm spec and I am not talking about the tanking tree) [/b]

 

 

Not after 2.0!

1.5sec cast time with 2/2 talents vs free 8 sec insta AOE.

[foxmob]

I hate CC as much as you do, but isn't leg shot a snare?

 

My snare breaker isn't on a 2 minute CD. No harm no foul.

 

CC means "crowd control" or "control." snares and roots are every bit as much forms of CC as stuns and mezzes. And the classes with the most combat CC are the tanks, particularly the guardian tanks. shared tree sorcs/sages also have a boat load of CC (I haven't played the sin version to judge).

 

when it comes to stuns/mezzes, nothing can touch those of a deception sin in 2.0. low slash will even work through shroud/resil. however, all stealth classes have an advantage in this department, and that is as it should be. control (in every sense of the word: controlling the conditions of the engagement) is the underlying philosophy of ALL stealth classes in every game I've ever played.

 

I don't object to snipers having a 30m aoe in-combat mezz that lasts a considerably long time (but not necessarily long for that kind of CC). what I object to is the fact that they -- alone of all the ranged dps ACs -- got to keep their ranged mezz (which was already the best in game for its aoe and/or instant aspects). how the hell is 30m flash more important to a sniper (any spec) than a gunnery commando? I can kind of understand its uselessness to a dot sage, but again...what about the lightning spec? they're ALL turrets. they ALL need to sit there and cast. the most laughable thing of all is that snipers are the least vulnerable ranged dps EVEN WITHOUT A MEZZ. argue that. I dare you. tell me how much more difficult it is to interrupt or approach a mando or sage than a sniper. yeah. right. you cannot. again. explain to me exactly how a sniper's play style -- what he's trying to do and what he needs to do in order to accomplish said goal -- is so fundamentally different from a middle tree mando or sorc. I dare you. and you cannot.

 

BW gutted every other ranged dps's CC. sniper's, who already had it best, were the only ones NOT to be nerfed. what sane human being WOULDN'T see this as favortism? this was a 1.4 event, btw. mandos didn't even have electro net at the time. what a joke. BW, you're a joke. go back to single player games.

Edited June 12, 2013 by foxmob

[Jayshames]

Make all stuns last 2 seconds, longer cooldowns and cleansable. Stuns should only be a last resort to help you win a close fight. As of right now stuns are basically just a means of preventing someone doing any damage to you while you kill them for free. And they are practically usable every time you engage in a new fight.

[Ybini]

If you take away my insta mez, you should lose your Insta heal or insta AOE dmg or insta knockback that our class doesn't have.

 

Honestly its fills your resolve 100 per clock tick, and thats only if some goofball doesn't go AOEing around and breaking it.

Edited June 12, 2013 by Ybini

[Helig]

Nerf all mezzes to 6s, restore instant force lift. No more ninja caps, but Balance Sages/Shadows get some of their lost survivability and utility back.

 

Ninja capping through 2 8s mezzes is stupid anyways. The possiblity is stupid, that is.

I agree. All mez skills should have the same duration. Pisses me off when I log on my Guardian after a Sniper.

[itsmymillertime]

Only read the 1st page.

 

Flashbang is an instant ability where the action is delayed slightly, to match the physical act of the flashbang hitting you. Just like saber throw where the damage occurs when the saber hits you and not when you press the button.

[dcgregorya]

leg shot, flashbang, debilitate, cover pulse and ambush if spec'd in marksman. replace aimed shot with plasma probe for engi. pretty sure no other class has this much.

 

Merc has knockback, root rocket punch, concussion missile, electro dart and snare on unload. Sorc has lightning bubble, whirlwind, snare from lightning, their hard stun (forget its name) and overload (plus a root on overload). Etc.

 

Plenty of classes have ridiculous amounts of CC if you include knockbacks, roots and snares.

 

I'd actually prefer, as someone who has a slinger and sniper (and every other class), that snipers get less roots and instead get more defensive cooldowns so that they aren't minced to pieces every time a melee gets more than 2 shots off on them.

Edited June 12, 2013 by dcgregorya