ETA on Advanced Class change?

[SavingPrincess]

So sometimes the fun factor has to trump other things.

 

Yes, games should not be chores. Some people think chores are fun...

 

... those people are wrong and weird.

[LordArtemis]

the is the reason everyone wants it... they are too lazy to level the other AC, which IMO is not the right reason to let people change classes.

 

That is assumptive and a bit narrow minded IMO. I think the VAST majority of folks in this thread alone indicated they wanted it because they discovered they did not like the AC they had chosen after level 45 or when they hit max level.

 

That is an attempt to vilify the suggestion, which I think is in poor taste.

 

EA ware is not going to allow this, if they do it will kill the game.

 

Generally speaking one should probably not contradict themselves in the same post...or the same sentence for that matter. I also think it will likely not have the dramatically negative effect many folks seem to believe.

 

That "kill the game" opinion was used against...lets see....respec, customization, orange adaptive gear, allowing classes to wear cross class gear, consolidating planetary comms, F2P, market, legacy, speeders early in the game, speeder legacy unlocks, XP unlocks, paying for unlocks with EC, paying for game unlocks with CC...the list goes on and on.

 

The game has improved IMO immensely. It is time to throw out the rule book and create the game the gamers want...not the hardcore crowd.

 

Just my slant.

[LordArtemis]

How long do you think it would be before we started seeing the "we can already change classes from sorcerer to assassin. Why can't we just change to any class? I want to be a powertech now and I have all this time invested and all this gear that is no longer available on my assassin, so I'm not going to reroll." posts on these forums?

 

Just as fast as we have seen it in most other games that have allowed something like this to happen.

 

Somewhere between rarely to never.

[Ratajack]

Ah, I see. Do you have any posts where folks said "I refuse to put the effort into leveling another character"?

 

Because then, in all fairness, one could perhaps claim a player was being lazy...ignoring the fact that this is a video game and were probably not riding treadmills or exercise bikes as we play.

 

I just think that calling a player lazy, when folks do that, based on the idea that they do not desire rolling yet another toon after leveling multiple toons...well.

 

To me that sounds a bit silly.

 

Once again, the definition of lazy is "averse to work or EFFORT". That effort does not have to be physical effort. The work does not have to be physical work. If a player refuses to take the time or to put the EFFORT into leveling another character, then they could be considered averse to the effort required to do so, and by definition could be called lazy. I do not care if someone already took the time to level 12 characters. If they simply refuse to level number 13 so they can have that tank they want, instead opting to ask BW to allow them to change class, then that person could very well be called lazy, and rightly so.

[Ratajack]

Just as fast as we have seen it in most other games that have allowed something like this to happen.

 

Somewhere between rarely to never.

 

How many other games have allowed class changes?

 

How many other games have allowed something like this to happen?

 

The closest I can think of is WOW implementing dual spec, which many were against and predicted would not be enough to satisfy the instant gratification crowd as well as lead to problems in the game. Dual spec did add to the "ninja looting" as people call it, and it took almost no time at all for the "we need tri spec" and "dual spec is not enough" threads to start popping up and they continue to surface to this day.

[astrobearx]

How long do you think it would be before we started seeing the "we can already change classes from sorcerer to assassin. Why can't we just change to any class? I want to be a powertech now and I have all this time invested and all this gear that is no longer available on my assassin, so I'm not going to reroll." posts on these forums?

what a ridiculous straw man and a weak slippery slope

 

AC =/= core classes

 

a AC is a subset of a core classes, what you are proposing is so stupid as AC switch is completely different than core classes switching. a sorc is still a inquisitor as well a sin; however, a sorc isnt a IA as a inq and a IA is TWO COMPLETELY DIFFERENT CORE CLASSES AND HAVE TWO COMPLETELY DIFFERENT STORIES .what you just said is making you look a moron.

Edited May 31, 2013 by astrobearx

[LordArtemis]

Once again, the definition of lazy is "averse to work or EFFORT". That effort does not have to be physical effort. The work does not have to be physical work. If a player refuses to take the time or to put the EFFORT into leveling another character, then they could be considered averse to the effort required to do so, and by definition could be called lazy. I do not care if someone already took the time to level 12 characters. If they simply refuse to level number 13 so they can have that tank they want, instead opting to ask BW to allow them to change class, then that person could very well be called lazy, and rightly so.

 

Well, then I think after 12 characters they have earned the right to be a bit lazy if the definition has to stick. This is, after all, a video game, not football tryouts.

 

Remember...I have said more than once that there are good arguments on both sides. I don't really buy into the "people want it because they are lazy" or "people want to block it because they are elitist" arguments on either side. I think the crowd that is against the idea have some reputable concerns.

 

I just think arguing that laziness is the main motivation is a weak argument at best. Hand someone a single max toon and then see them argue that they want to change the AC...then perhaps I would agree.

 

Should one reroll a toon if they want to change their look? How about if they wish to get into PVP play? The argument just doesn't stand as one posed as folks trying to get out of making an effort.

 

That argument can apply to almost ANY convenience feature in the game that has been implemented in the recent months. I wouldn't be lazy if I didnt want to wait for 2 hours to use my QT, I wouldnt be lazy if I wanted a speeder at level 10 or sprint at level 1, I wouldnt be lazy if I wanted to have 4 quickbars, direct speeder routes, unlocks for speeder upgrades in legacy, XP boosts in legacy....nor would I be lazy because I would like the convenience of being able to switch advanced classes for a few toons that lay dormant because the design of the AC was terrible at max level.

 

Can I be required to reroll? Sure. Would it be nice if I didn't have to? Yes. Do I demand it? Of course not. I am actually fine with the current setup and would not be upset if it didn't change. Choice is good in my eyes but this is not something that I need personally. But like any other QoL change I think it could be a nice addition if done properly, though some reputable concerns remain.

Edited June 1, 2013 by LordArtemis

[Xeperi]

To make a point I made earlier more succinct:

 

The end-logic of the OP (and I don't think it is intentional) is to be able to pretty much change your character in any way you want? That is where it ends up. BW sees that when it gives players options, they will pay to take them, so eventually all options are on the table.

 

Field re-speccing. Appearance changes. Advanced Class changes. Faction changes. Dark side or light side point changes. So eventually all you have to do is level a character to 55 and then you can make it into whatever you want.

Choices you make as a player which affect your experience of the game should not matter?

 

If advanced class change is ever allowed it should force your character back to level 10 as soon as the change is made. To me, THAT is the only acceptable route for advanced class change.

 

Options are half of what make a game fun, the other half is the reward of accomplishing something in game. More options for advanced classes at level 10 would be great.

 

Even better would be Elite Classes at level 55, with brand new spec trees.

 

Instead of gaining levels at 55, you would still gain the skill points. That would be better than being able to switch advanced classes because it would only make sense for some of these Elite Classes to be much like other Advanced Classes.

 

This could even be a reward for gaining specific accomplishments, and I would argue a new accomplishment such as an impossibly hard new lvl 55 Operation open only to characters who have earned the required accomplishments.

 

End-Game players are clamoring for new content. Forgive me OP (and I mean that) but I really think at the heart of the Advanced Class change push is really the desire for new content. But all that it would bring is recycled old content. Demand more than that, you guys deserve it as loyal customers and committed, passionate players!

 

Thoughts?

Edited May 31, 2013 by Xeperi

[branmakmuffin]

If advanced class change is ever allowed it should force your character back to level 10 as soon as the change is made. To me, THAT is the only acceptable route for advanced class change.

Well, if it ever comes about, your narrow-minded "The universe will explode if we make it easy-peasy" attitude will not prevail.

 

Options are half of what make a game fun, the other half is the reward of accomplishing something in game.

And what you think is fun is by definition fun for everyone.

 

So sometimes the fun factor has to trump other things.

It's a game. Fun always trumps any other consideration (for players; making money trumps all other concerns for the maker). But we all have different definitions of "fun."

Edited May 31, 2013 by branmakmuffin

[Xeperi]

Well, if it ever comes about, your narrow-minded "The universe will explode if we make it easy-peasy" attitude will not prevail.

 

 

And what you think is fun is by definition fun for everyone.

 

 

It's a game. Fun always trumps any other consideration (for players; making money trumps all other concerns for the maker). But we all have different definitions of "fun."

 

We all have different definitions of "fun", but we also all have different definitions of anything, yet somehow there are coherent and consistent threads (principles) that run through most, if not all such definitions. We can argue everything from the origins and evolution of gaming and even fiction and no where in that argument will you find a total lack of resistance or challenge. If it comes to that, just go ahead and buy Star Wars dolls and dress them and call them whatever you like. Cut out a roughly human shaped figure from a piece of printer paper and call it a "level 55 Assassin Juggernaut Trooper" and color it any way you want. Take the resistance and challenge out of swtor and you essentially have the digital version of coloring in cut-out paper dolls (and calling them whatever you want).

[Azoic]

So, the Species Change and Barber Shop mentioned in the Dulfy interview from months ago are finally realities. That's a good sign! It means the devs are actually serious about their "Yeah, we'd like to do that" statements.

 

In that same interview, it was mentioned that Advanced Class changes were also on the table and likely to happen. I'm curious if the community team can update us on whether there's any time-table for when this will be implemented.

 

Ideally, I'd love it to be a switch you can unlock, then flip any time — finally allowing me to Tank & Heal with one character.

 

I'd imagine it'd come in the major expansion if/when they add new classes.

 

In order to remove the hassle and cost of re-voicing the 1-50 content, it could just be a new advanced class that is chosen at 10 that branches off of one of the pre-existing base classes. So we'd still have Inquisitor, Warrior, Agent, and Bounty Hunter. BUT instead of choosing one of two advanced classes (say Sorcerer or Assassin), they could add in a third. So the story voice-over is the same, since they're written for the base class, and it isn't a waste or needing to be re-done.

 

If this happens, I'd imagine it'd be logical to add the advanced class change soon after that so people who already have a max level character that shares the same base class can choose to become the new advanced class that was released in the expansion. It's the only thing that makes sense to me but I may be crazy. I don't know if I agree with being able to toggle back and forth, but at least a one time change makes sense if they do an advanced class launch like that.

Edited May 31, 2013 by Azoic

[Themanthatisi]

Those against class changes have no jobs? Let's see, I work 50+ hours a week , bowl three nights a week, have a family and other obligations outside of this game. If I get to play more than three hours a week, I'm lucky and just in case you hadn't noticed, I'm most definitely AGAINST allowing class changes.

 

You've seen no "good" justification? Have you been ignoring the countless posts laying out reasonable and cogent arguments as to why allowing class changes is not necessary and could hurt the game? No, I will not go find them for you. I refuse to spoon feed you and hand you everything as you want BW to do.

 

Yes, I have not seen ANYTHING in this thread to make me think a AC change is bad.... To me, the reasons many give are out of their own fears. Show me, or anyone that wants a AC change, PROOF or FACTS of how this will somehow ruin the game. If the system is abused, it would be annoying at most.... Why some restrictions should be made. However, there is no good reason I can see to not allow anyone to correct a past mistake.

 

you are the same bunch of people that did not want species changes or body type changes, guess what, they are here and BW makes money off it. Players that wanted it are happy, it was a win win, except for the people that play this game in total fear that a new feature to make customers happier, will destroy your experience. NOT A ONE OF YOU have yet to explain this out..... Its just fear, nothing more.

 

You will lose this fight, the AC change will come, question is when, not if.....

Edited May 31, 2013 by Themanthatisi

[Themanthatisi]

These debates are all the same. A few souper lee7 d0odz or Hard Core or <insert current meme here> think they should dictate how everyone else plays the game. If it's not this then it's something else. Here are some of my favorites:

 

SWTOR

 

SPEEDER TRAINING

In beta and for a good portion of the live game you couldn't get your speeder until level 25. Super lame. Most people who bought the CE felt lied to because they prominently advertised the CE speeder. All of the little forum trolls thought it was fun to lobby against reducing this gate. Probably because their mommies wouldn't buy them the CE.

 

End Result: You can now purchase speeder piloting 3 as a character perk with a level 1 character.

 

SPRINT

In beta and for a good portion of the live game you didn't have sprint until level 14-16 (depending on the build). You had to walk slowly (very slowly) until then. Imagine walking all the way through DK LOL. Oh that was SO fun. Another endless forum forum battle ensued.

 

End Result: You get sprint at level 1 as a subscriber

 

Respec Fees

In beta and for a good portion of the live game respec fees would become astronomically and exponentially expensive. Just like other debates, the little forum trolls were SOOOOOOOO interested in what everyone else's spec was. The QQing over the idea of someone changing their spec without some kind of massive penalty was legendary.

 

End Result: You can respec for free, at will if you are a subscriber.

 

Legacy Unlock

When the Legacy system was first introduced you had to complete Chapter 1 of your class story before choosing a legacy name. There was an other forum battle at the thought of potentially lowering it. All of the super leet trolls felt it was cool to keep it gated. Surprised yet?

 

End Result: You can now unlock your legacy at like level 10.

 

SWG

 

ENCUMBRANCE

SWG launched with this little gem of a concept. For every piece of armor you equipped you would become more "encumbered". If you put on a full set you would literally fall over from exhaustion. Fun right? Massive forum wars ensued. All of the trolls felt that falling over dead from wearing armor was an awesome idea.

 

End Result: Encumbrance was removed. Period.

 

DECAY

Every single time you used an item it would "decay". Eventually it would break and become usable. The only way to fix it was to buy a kit from a crafter. The kits worked like 50% of the time LOL. People hated this. Again, MASSIVE forum wars.

 

End Result: Decay was removed. Period.

 

 

10 MINUTE SHUTTLE TIMES

Originally to get from point A to point B (aside from **walking**) you had to wait 10 minutes for a shuttle. Doesn't that sound fun? You have 2 hours to play a game and you spend like 40 minutes or more standing in one spot waiting for a shuttle. Imagine if you had to wait 10 minutes for every taxi in SWTOR and there were no mounts of any kind yet. Fun right? No? Well all of the forum tough guys thought it was so fashionable.

 

End Result: Shuttle times were reduced to ONE MINUTE.

 

Etc. Etc. Etc.

Internet Tough Guys are all the same. They don't care about the good of the game. They're not here to have fun. Heck, most of them don't even play the damned game. They spend all day here on the forums trying to sound tough or cool and spew whatever the latest dog crap is that all of the other trolls find fashionable.

 

Raph Koster (Lead Designer for Ultima Online and Creative Director for SWG) wrote an excellent piece on this back in 2006:

 

Players who post, posters who play

 

Basically, some people are only here to bad mouth the game and troll the people who actually do. But for some unknown reason publishers keep listening to them. I wonder what will happen with AC Switching?

 

Anzel,

 

I wish I had the "cool" head you have to be honest, even though I agree with you in many posts you make, this QUALITY post by you can teach many of us a lesson, especially me, that anger does not relate to good posting. A well thought out post, with examples of things, like you mention, is the way to get the job done.

 

Very well done!

 

They are just in fear of change, people like you and others, are the people that help change come and why things, like this game, has vastly improved.

 

The sky has not yet fallen.... But they will still fear it.

Edited May 31, 2013 by Themanthatisi

[Kilora]

you are the same bunch of people that did not want species changes or body type changes, guess what, they are here and BW makes money off it. Players that wanted it are happy, it was a win win, except for the people that play this game in total fear that a new feature to make customers happier, will destroy your experience. NOT A ONE OF YOU have yet to explain this out..... Its just fear, nothing more.

 

You will lose this fight, the AC change will come, question is when, not if.....

 

First of all, no. Please don't generalize about people who are against it.

 

I'm against AC changes, and yes it is based off of "fears" -- because no other MMO has implemented this. We DON'T know what will happen. You could be dead wrong, and this could lead to horrible things. Or, we could be dead wrong with all of our fears, and it could be a wonderous thing.

 

No one knows. But I was CERTAINLY not against species changes. Or body type changes. I can UNDERSTAND the species change argument, because it doesn't make sense from an immersion standpoint -- but it is also 100% cosmetic, and not required in any way.

 

Nothing you're saying is anything more than hopes, either, so don't act as if you have a superior view. Both sides are entitled to their opinion, and I'm sure we will see the arguments revived when they announce a date for AC changes.

 

We KNOW they have it on the list to add. A list that is constantly changing for billions of reasons. They could add this in with 2.3, or maybe we won't see it for more than a year. They could also come out and say, "This actually is taking a backseat because of the amount of work we need to do to change our system" and we may never see it after that.

 

Both sides need to realize they are entitled to an opinion, and attacking others is useless, and NEITHER side has any good reason beyond "I want it" or "I don't want it"

[Themanthatisi]

First of all, no. Please don't generalize about people who are against it.

 

I'm against AC changes, and yes it is based off of "fears" -- because no other MMO has implemented this. We DON'T know what will happen. You could be dead wrong, and this could lead to horrible things. Or, we could be dead wrong with all of our fears, and it could be a wonderous thing.

 

No one knows. But I was CERTAINLY not against species changes. Or body type changes. I can UNDERSTAND the species change argument, because it doesn't make sense from an immersion standpoint -- but it is also 100% cosmetic, and not required in any way.

 

Nothing you're saying is anything more than hopes, either, so don't act as if you have a superior view. Both sides are entitled to their opinion, and I'm sure we will see the arguments revived when they announce a date for AC changes.

 

We KNOW they have it on the list to add. A list that is constantly changing for billions of reasons. They could add this in with 2.3, or maybe we won't see it for more than a year. They could also come out and say, "This actually is taking a backseat because of the amount of work we need to do to change our system" and we may never see it after that.

 

Both sides need to realize they are entitled to an opinion, and attacking others is useless, and NEITHER side has any good reason beyond "I want it" or "I don't want it"

 

I think with ESO coming out this year, especially with its more versatile classes, the AC change would be stepped up, as another way to entice many to stay. To allow them to knock the dust off not only one toon but an entire faction, they maybe will not play, because they did not like how the classes played out by end game.

 

I do have to disagree with you on the fact both sides have no good reason, the people that do not want it, have points made, but the points show to be "fear of the unknown". I think many understand that fear, but to have change, people have to overcome fear, weather though discussion or even though more aggressive styles.

 

Anzel wrote a great post, pointing out many things many of the ones in fear, tried to stop.... maybe not you, but others, and yet, the game has improved since the beginning.

 

People that fear things without justification, usually fear change itself in my opinion. They fear the unknown, as you honorably admitted yourself. My weakness, is the lack of fear and my overly aggressive style, neither is wrong or right, it what makes us all unique.

 

I will admit this here, like I told my wife, who has 14 toons and also wants AC change, that when ESO comes out, with its more versatile class system, its touted rich exploration experience and winds up being a good game (officially), we will jump ship. The biggest draw to TOR is the name Star Wars on it and its connection to the classic KOTOR games, but that all dried up after you complete the 8 class stories. TOR can have an edge on other games by beating BACK fear and showing the ones in fear that change is a good thing.

 

Great leaders all had to overcome fear to achieve greatness... Why not look at a video game in the same way? Why allow TOR to keep being like the other games? You mention, no other MMO has tried it, to me, that in itself is a GREAT reason to try it. Be different, be a leader and set an example.

 

“Only Thing We Have to Fear Is Fear Itself” - FDR

Edited May 31, 2013 by Themanthatisi

[Kilora]

Anzel wrote a great post, pointing out many things many of the ones in fear, tried to stop.... maybe not you, but others, and yet, the game has improved since the beginning.

 

I will admit this here, like I told my wife, who has 14 toons and also wants AC change, that when ESO comes out, with its more versatile class system, its touted rich exploration experience and winds up being a good game (officially), we will jump ship. The biggest draw to TOR is the name Star Wars on it and its connection to the classic KOTOR games, but that all dried up after you complete the 8 class stories. TOR can have an edge on other games by beating BACK fear and showing the ones in fear that change is a good thing.

Above quote snipped for some brevity.

 

Anzel also fails to mention things like Bolster, which people were afraid of, that caused massive anger in the community and was improperly implemented. In fact, it still isn't working as intended.

 

TOR cannot have an edge on games with more than double the development team. They've already shown that these aren't seasoned developers with years of experience -- we've gotten an incredible amount of bugs every time they've attempted to implement a new system. I don't think AC changes will be any different.

 

As far as TOR vs ESO -- two different styles. FFXI has a multi-class system that works great -- but it was also planned from day 1, and implemented properly.

 

AC changes, if released in a state similar to Bolster-2.0 -- will drive MORE people away from the game, as opposed to getting people to stay. And, I don't believe for a moment that this is worth implementing to get people to stay. It also isn't worth saying "So many people will leave if you DO implement it."

 

Neither being true is the most likely reality. The majority of people I know, who actually enjoy the game, re-rolled instead of complaining for months that they wanted to change the AC. I'm re-rolling an assassin right now, because I forget 99% of the SI story (first story completed at launch). Most of the others, I've made a Republic toon of the other AC.

 

Both sides are blowing it out of proportion. This isn't an incredibly requested feature. It isn't a feature people expect. It isn't something people will ragequit over if it is or isn't implemented. At most, it is a QoL issue that ranks below dozens of others that people have asked about.

 

If it is a simple system? Put it in sooner than later. If it isn't? I don't want to see it in-game until it has been properly thought out and tested. If there are no limits on AC-changes, I will leave, and call BW out on the moronic business move.

 

 

TL;DR - AC change is not wanted enough, or "change" enough, to make this game magically better. There are far more important things to fix and implement, and my fear comes from a completely logical place. If AC changes are another Bolster, there will be many ruffled feathers.

[LordArtemis]

If i remember correctly, similar arguments were made against respec, especially when it was going to free for subs. Many folks were dead set against the idea. Edited May 31, 2013 by LordArtemis

[Themanthatisi]

Above quote snipped for some brevity.

 

Anzel also fails to mention things like Bolster, which people were afraid of, that caused massive anger in the community and was improperly implemented. In fact, it still isn't working as intended.

 

TOR cannot have an edge on games with more than double the development team. They've already shown that these aren't seasoned developers with years of experience -- we've gotten an incredible amount of bugs every time they've attempted to implement a new system. I don't think AC changes will be any different.

 

As far as TOR vs ESO -- two different styles. FFXI has a multi-class system that works great -- but it was also planned from day 1, and implemented properly.

 

AC changes, if released in a state similar to Bolster-2.0 -- will drive MORE people away from the game, as opposed to getting people to stay. And, I don't believe for a moment that this is worth implementing to get people to stay. It also isn't worth saying "So many people will leave if you DO implement it."

 

Neither being true is the most likely reality. The majority of people I know, who actually enjoy the game, re-rolled instead of complaining for months that they wanted to change the AC. I'm re-rolling an assassin right now, because I forget 99% of the SI story (first story completed at launch). Most of the others, I've made a Republic toon of the other AC.

 

Both sides are blowing it out of proportion. This isn't an incredibly requested feature. It isn't a feature people expect. It isn't something people will ragequit over if it is or isn't implemented. At most, it is a QoL issue that ranks below dozens of others that people have asked about.

 

If it is a simple system? Put it in sooner than later. If it isn't? I don't want to see it in-game until it has been properly thought out and tested. If there are no limits on AC-changes, I will leave, and call BW out on the moronic business move.

 

 

TL;DR - AC change is not wanted enough, or "change" enough, to make this game magically better. There are far more important things to fix and implement, and my fear comes from a completely logical place. If AC changes are another Bolster, there will be many ruffled feathers.

 

I all honesty, I am enjoying the game too and not having AC changes will not really be the reason I would jump ship, all this game lacks I really wanted was more in the way of exploration, but that is a different topic. I am sorry i am not educated enough on the bolster issue, since I do not enjoy PvP, i generally do not follow those issues, but I am not going to discount the fact you are accurate on that.

 

I would also agree that a poorly implemented AC change could be a problem. I am also not sure you are aware, but I am not for an all out change, i want one with limitations, so its not used like its a field re-spec of the skill tree. I want to see it as a way for someone to correct past toons they made before they knew any better. I know the motivation of others wanting this may not be on the same page as myself, but I will support the change idea, up to a point.

 

I would like to see the change happen, but if it does not, Ill just play the IMP side until I am board and move on.... If they allow AC changes, Ill go back to playing pub side as well.

 

Either way, im in the game for fun, unless ESO does come out and score big with the fans.... the only game I would jump ship for.

 

A tad bit about me, this is my first MMO, like many others, came here to play KOTOR 3, I did not know anything about classes in a traditional MMO, or what they even did in a team. Once I did learn this, I was already getting into the tanks and none of my pubs are, so I only play Imp now. I will never make toon 13, I am at my limit with leveling and burnt out on it.

 

I am not the only one...

 

NOW, if many are wanting change and they only have one toon, they should roll another alt, I am on here to defend the change idea only, but with limitations and for people that earned it through leveling enough other toons. Lets say, a min of Legacy level 25, only one change per 30 days and a few others that have been mentioned perhaps, like it needing to be expensive, the toon must be a lvl 50/55 first.

 

Based on these thoughts, and unless we know there would be bugs or issues, the change itself would not chase people away as long as it goes smooth and they do implement limits, even if for nothing more than "compromise". If we have learned one thing in the forums lately, there is plenty of people "claiming" to quit, but the game is still doing well. so far.....

 

I love to venture into the unknown... I see it as exciting.

Edited May 31, 2013 by Themanthatisi

[Anzel]

Anzel,

 

I wish I had the "cool" head you have to be honest, even though I agree with you in many posts you make, this QUALITY post by you can teach many of us a lesson, especially me, that anger does not relate to good posting. A well thought out post, with examples of things, like you mention, is the way to get the job done.

 

Very well done!

 

They are just in fear of change, people like you and others, are the people that help change come and why things, like this game, has vastly improved.

 

The sky has not yet fallen.... But they will still fear it.

 

Hey thanks... and while I may not always have a, "cool head" I really do care about this game and its success. I loved SWG and I hated to see it drown the way it did. My nerd rage does sometimes boil over when I see some of the same mistakes being made all over again. It's like Groundhog Day LOL.

 

One thing I always tell customers here at work is that you first have to get people to use your product, then monetize it. Look at Google. Look at Facebook. Look at YouTube. Three of the biggest online IPs and they are all free to use. FREE. They are also all worth billions of dollars. Why? Because people USE their services. They brought people in and then they found a way to monetize.

 

The good folks at EA need to take note of this. Their revenue model has always been the exact same. Gate gate gate gate. Want more ammo in your clip? Pay up. Want that DLC? Pay up. Want that shiny new armor? Pay up.

 

Now look at WoW. It's a really good game. I understand and I appreciate both what they've done technically and artistically but it's not THAT much better than the competition. What they've done is make their game accessible. They've made it enjoyable. They understand that you don't have to make the game "easy" in order to make it "easy to enjoy". There is a huge difference.

 

For this game to succeed EA needs to rethink their revenue model. They need to make this game more accessible. They need to make it easier to enjoy... and they need to find different revenue opportunities than they have in the past. Star Wars is such an amazing IP to have and it kills me to see them squander it like this.

[Levity]

Isnt that what many said would happen if F2P happened?

 

And a bunch of people did quit... Just you got a wave of fresh f2pers!

[LordHartigan]

This is not as out there an idea as some are making sound. SWTOR wouldn't even be the first MMO to do it. I can think at least a few MMO's that allow players to switch between classes. Freely, I might add. That's not to say it might not be problematic here. First it would be kind of jarring from a truel role playing stand point to go from being a Jedi to smuggler and the class specific story content causes a problem, though I suppose they could keep each story line seperate for each class.

[WildbloodX]

Hopefully never... so like.. 2020... March.. 15th.

 

^ This. Advance class change would be a huge mistake!

[Themanthatisi]

Hey thanks... and while I may not always have a, "cool head" I really do care about this game and its success. I loved SWG and I hated to see it drown the way it did. My nerd rage does sometimes boil over when I see some of the same mistakes being made all over again. It's like Groundhog Day LOL.

 

One thing I always tell customers here at work is that you first have to get people to use your product, then monetize it. Look at Google. Look at Facebook. Look at YouTube. Three of the biggest online IPs and they are all free to use. FREE. They are also all worth billions of dollars. Why? Because people USE their services. They brought people in and then they found a way to monetize.

 

The good folks at EA need to take note of this. Their revenue model has always been the exact same. Gate gate gate gate. Want more ammo in your clip? Pay up. Want that DLC? Pay up. Want that shiny new armor? Pay up.

 

Now look at WoW. It's a really good game. I understand and I appreciate both what they've done technically and artistically but it's not THAT much better than the competition. What they've done is make their game accessible. They've made it enjoyable. They understand that you don't have to make the game "easy" in order to make it "easy to enjoy". There is a huge difference.

 

For this game to succeed EA needs to rethink their revenue model. They need to make this game more accessible. They need to make it easier to enjoy... and they need to find different revenue opportunities than they have in the past. Star Wars is such an amazing IP to have and it kills me to see them squander it like this.

 

Anzel,

 

I am not sure when or if we would ever see "free" like Facebook or others you mention, since they do get money through advertisers and ongoing investor interest. However, I have been standing with you one some of their practices, like gambling packs (especially jawagrams as rare items) and gamble dyes, as if they needed to do that to the community that was wanting it from day one, but without the need to gamble for color.

 

I don't want to change the topic... we will fire up the few that constantly defend all things BW does. lol. You know who they are....

 

AC changes, to me would be positive as a whole, some will always gripe, no matter the change made, you know this all too well. I do think both sides love the game, but one side wants it to evolve, the other, leave it alone, its fine as it is.... You other post, was a great example of changes that were feared, but overcame and the sky is still blue and never fell.

 

Kilora made a good point about it though, if its too wide open, it could create too much anger and more than desired would quit. Also, if not tested, they could break things, which, as we know, this dev team is very good at doing, not because of incompetence, but more likely because they rush out the updates without proper testing.

 

Keep up the good work in the forums.....

 

Without the complaints, this game would probably already be dead....

Edited May 31, 2013 by Themanthatisi

[Kilora]

This is not as out there an idea as some are making sound. SWTOR wouldn't even be the first MMO to do it. I can think at least a few MMO's that allow players to switch between classes. Freely, I might add. That's not to say it might not be problematic here. First it would be kind of jarring from a truel role playing stand point to go from being a Jedi to smuggler and the class specific story content causes a problem, though I suppose they could keep each story line seperate for each class.

 

Care to enlighten us?

 

I've yet to see a single game with a "permanent" class choice allow you to switch. If you can think of at least a few, why didn't you bother to list them?

[Themanthatisi]

This is not as out there an idea as some are making sound. SWTOR wouldn't even be the first MMO to do it. I can think at least a few MMO's that allow players to switch between classes. Freely, I might add. That's not to say it might not be problematic here. First it would be kind of jarring from a truel role playing stand point to go from being a Jedi to smuggler and the class specific story content causes a problem, though I suppose they could keep each story line seperate for each class.

 

I do not think I could support a base class change.... If they keep it to only the AC, so a Jedi Knight Sentinel, can only switch the a JK Guardian, for example, at least the stories and romances do not get affected, as well as all the companions remaining the same. The way this game set up its classes, AC changes look logical, without a big impact to story progression, however, that same story progression, would make base class changes a disaster, IMO.

 

i do not suspect, RP'ers would be on board with AC changes.... I am curious though to where that community does stand.

 

from my perspective, I want people to be able to correct past mistakes, after already pulling time, effort and money, real or in game, into a toon, they discovered does not play as they wish, or to a style they have developed.

 

In the end really, as long as new features to not impact my game play in a negative fashion, I am on the side of change is good, it shows the game evolving into something more, better or different, and sets it apart from the others.