ETA on Advanced Class change?

[psandak]

He was demonstrating that just because they one time said one thing, it's not unchangeable.

 

ALL the base class skills are IDENTICAL! Half of any classes "rotation" is based around BASE skills. Left tree, right tree, middle tree...the class is the class, AC is just an artificial wall separating the two.

 

Again, this boils down to the fact that there hasn't been even ONE valid reason not to allow AC change. NOT ONE after all these freaking pages. NONE!

 

So let me get this straight:

- A guardian wielding one lightsaber and has a tank tree is the EXACT same as a sentinel wielding two sabers and is pure DPS?

- A scoundrel wielding a blaster and scattergun, is mostly melee dps and has a healing tree is the EXACT same as a gunslinger wielding two blaster and is pure ranged DPS?

- A sage wielding a single saber, that is exclusively ranged DPS and has a healing tree is the EXACT same as a shadow wielding a double-bladed saber, that is mostly melee DPS, and has a tank tree?

- A commando carrying an assault cannon, that is near exclusively ranged DPS, and has a healing tree is the EXACT same as a vanguard that carries a blaster rifle, that is mostly short range and melee DPS, and has a tank tree?

 

Oh yeah, those ACs are exactly the same....

[Ratajack]

No...that's not how it works, if you think you know a valid reason, list it Rat. Gimme ONE...make it good.

 

Ok. You give me a VALID reason why class changes should be allowed. Remember, though, I get to decide if it's valid, since you seem to want to decide whether a reason NOT to allow class changes if valid.

[TUXs]

So let me get this straight:

- A guardian wielding one lightsaber and has a tank tree is the EXACT same as a sentinel wielding two sabers and is pure DPS?

- A scoundrel wielding a blaster and scattergun, is mostly melee dps and has a healing tree is the EXACT same as a gunslinger wielding two blaster and is pure ranged DPS?

- A sage wielding a single saber, that is exclusively ranged DPS and has a healing tree is the EXACT same as a shadow wielding a double-bladed saber, that is mostly melee DPS, and has a tank tree?

- A commando carrying an assault cannon, that is near exclusively ranged DPS, and has a healing tree is the EXACT same as a vanguard that carries a blaster rifle, that is mostly short range and melee DPS, and has a tank tree?

 

Oh yeah, those ACs are exactly the same....

 

What part of "BASE CLASS" didn't you understand? Does "Hammer shot" differ between Vanguard or Commando? It doesn't matter what the hell weapon I fire it with, it's the same freaking skill! So is HiB, and Cryo grenade, and Full Auto and HtL and my stun break and my defensive cooldowns and my ammo recharge and my free shot...the BASE skills are identical...no matter what freaking weapon you use to animate the move.

[DOHboy]

No...that's not how it works, if you think you know a valid reason, list it Rat. Gimme ONE...make it good.

 

1) AC ties the player to a specific main hand weapon. Allowing AC changes causes the player to incur an extremely high cost of acquiring new gear and gearing a companion.

 

2) AC swapping reduces the number of quality players for a particular class. Playing a class effectively requires some level of practice and time investment. Swappign AC eliminates that practice reducing the quality of the overall player base for the class.

 

3) There needs to be some level of "investment" by a player into their characters otherwise there is not sense of long term commitment. Thus allowing AC swapping removes the long term investment cost of a player into their character.

4) reduces replay ability since wanting to play additional mechanics would simply cost a person credits/money and not require any time. MMOs are typically fighting for your time (i.e subscriptions) and thus are filled with ways of spending that time, in the hopes that you will continue to play AND (in the new f2p market) invest $$ for cosmetic changes to enhance your time.

 

So there are 4 off the bat..any further questions?

[TUXs]

Ok. You give me a VALID reason why class changes should be allowed. Remember, though, I get to decide if it's valid, since you seem to want to decide whether a reason NOT to allow class changes if valid.

 

Sure...but then you answer my question.

 

I'd rather have someone who called heads instead of tails at level 10, be allowed to swap their AC if they think it would improve their experience in the game.

[TUXs]

1) AC ties the player to a specific main hand weapon.

 

2) AC swapping reduces the number of quality players for a particular class.

 

3) There needs to be some level of "investment" by a player into their characters otherwise there is not sense of long term commitment.

 

4) reduces replay ability since wanting to play additional mechanics would simply cost a person credits/money and not require any time.

 

1) The need to buy/acquire new gear would BENEFIT the game. Crafters would sell more, GF queues would have more players who need their new gear and WZ's would have players regrinding new gear.

 

2) That's an assumption, not a fact. I'd argue that any player willing to change their AC, is likely a better player than your average player because they are probably swapping for a reason.

 

3) I'd argue that the ability to swap AC's would ENHANCE the connection to the character because you'd be on ONE toon vs swapping to alts.

 

4) Replayablity? It's 100% the EXACT SAME experience AC to AC. This has NO impact on that at all.

[Ratajack]

Sure...but then you answer my question.

 

I'd rather have someone who called heads instead of tails at level 10, be allowed to swap their AC if they think it would improve their experience in the game.

 

Nope. I decide that's not a valid reason. They can re-roll.

 

Seriously, every player is given plenty information in game about the classes. If they do not feel the information in game is enough, then there are plenty of websites that could provide more information.

[mdob]

DPS to tank/heals tends to get ugly quickly.

 

For better or worse, 6 of 8 ACs has the ability to do this today, without any leveling experience.

 

Talent trees evolved to provide more customization on a per class basis.

 

Allowing AC changes would just be the next evolution of that.

 

The biggest difference between ACs is playing a melee class versus a ranged class.

 

I would suggest that people tend to enjoy playing what they are good at, so unless you're good at both, you won't switch repeatedly.

 

At minimum, you should be able to switch your AC before you hit 50 because you may not even know you are better at melee than ranged or vice versa.

[TUXs]

Nope. I decide that's not a valid reason. They can re-roll.

 

Seriously, every player is given plenty information in game about the classes. If they do not feel the information in game is enough, then there are plenty of websites that could provide more information.

 

Ok, so you just want to make it punitive. Got it. I'm actually trying to support an option that would IMPROVE the player experience, not punish players.

[LordArtemis]

This is the so-called con list?

 

Please let me know when you have an actual con list.

 

This is not my con list.....this is the threads con list, compiled from all the reasons given against by folks that participated in the thread. The pro list is there as well.

 

So I am letting you know...it is the actual con list according to those that participated in the thread. Whether or not you accept them as valid is up to you.

[LordArtemis]

I couldn't find any new ideas, or new pros/cons, so the list remains unchanged for now.

 

Current list, pros and cons as reported by participants.

 

 

Option 1

 

Level 10 to 15 - Allow AC Change - max 2 changes allowed - reduction to level 10 with change - 24 hour cooldown - once you reach level 16 AC is permanent - everything except XP and quests are unaffected - armor/earpieces/weapons for character and companions are removed and must be reequipped.

 

Option 2

 

Level 10 to 55 - Allow AC Change - max 1 change allowed - reduction to level 10 with change - no cooldown - no level gate for permanent AC choice - everything except XP and quests are unaffected - armor/earpieces/weapons for character and companions are removed and must be reequipped.

 

Option 3

 

Level 10 to 55 - Allow AC Change - max 2 changes allowed - no reduction in level - one month cooldown - no level gate for permanent AC choice - everything is unaffected - armor/earpieces/weapons for character and companions are removed and must be reequipped.

 

Option 4

 

Level 10 to 30 - Allow AC Change - max 1 change allowed - no reduction in level - no cooldown - no level gate for permanent AC choice - everything is unaffected - armor/earpieces/weapons for character and companions are removed and must be reequipped.

 

Option 5

 

Level 10 to 46 - Allow AC Change - no maximum changes, can change at will up to 46 - no reduction in level - no cooldown - once you reach level 47 AC is permanent - everything is unaffected - armor/earpieces/weapons for character and companions are removed and must be reequipped.

 

Option 6

 

Level 10 to 55 - Allow AC Change - no maximum changes, can change at will - no reduction in level - no cooldown - no level gate for permanent AC choice - everything is unaffected - armor/earpieces/weapons for character and companions are removed and must be reequipped.

 

Option 7

 

Level 10 to 55 - Allow AC Change - no maximum changes, can change at will - no reduction in level - no cooldown - no level gate for permanent AC choice - Must level one character to max level in an AC to unlock legacy ability to switch AC for that class - everything is unaffected - armor/earpieces/weapons for character and companions are removed and must be reequipped.

 

Option 8

 

Level 10 to 55 - Allow AC Change - maximum 8 changes per account, can change at will - no reduction in level - no cooldown - no level gate for permanent AC choice - everything is unaffected - armor/earpieces/weapons for character and companions are removed and must be reequipped.

 

Option 9

 

Level 10 to 55 - Allow AC Change - no maximum number of changes - must change at AC trainers on fleet - 1 Week cooldown - Option for AC change unlocked as Character Perk for 600 cartel Coins (or 1.5 million credits) - Each subsequent AC change costs 40 cartel coins (or 100,000 credits).

 

Option 10

 

Level 40 to 55 - Allow AC Change - max 1 change allowed - no reduction in level - no cooldown - no level gate for permanent AC choice - everything is unaffected - armor/earpieces/weapons for character and companions are removed and must be reequipped.

 

 

Option 11

 

No AC change allowed.

 

 

 

And this is the pro and con list as it stands right now. It is certainly open for more additions or corrections.

 

 

PROS

 

1. breathing life into characters that may have been abandoned and thus extending someone's stay in game, their enjoyment in game.

2. allowing people who only have fun playing through a story once - experiment with their character without having to suffer through the story they already know and aren't having fun replaying.

3. allowing people to keep using unique, no longer acquirable items, that include pets, speeders, crystals, armor shells, as well as legacy perk unlocks on a character they have grown attached to, while enjoying the game play style that works better for them, within the same archetype, rather than having to reroll from scratch and lose all the investment they made into a character.

4. making extra money for bioware by making ac switch purchasable with cartel coins.

 

CONS

 

1) I would expect that many folks are not going to react well to this change if implemented.

2) They flirted with the idea before launch, even talked about it publicly, but in the end decided not to allow it. At the time folks were pretty dead set against it. I don't think it's likely the current environment has changed much since then.

3) Some classes could end up underrepresented due to bad design. Right now some folks stick with an AC they choose because they would have to reroll and do not wish to do so I would guess.

4) If restrictions are not in place this could end up being abused or exploited.

5) This will likely further demean AC choice.

6) Could cause FOTM issues.

7) If late game AC change is allowed it could end up causing folks that have an AC but do not know how to properly play it running Raids and Operations, making an existing problem worse.

 

 

I am willing to begrudgingly support option 1, option 7 but would prefer option 11. The idea of option 7 has some appeal...you have to level an AC to max level to get a legacy unlock you can use to switch to that AC inside the class for another character account wide. That still give AC meaning IMO.

 

I still prefer no AC change, but I'm somewhat willing to support 1 and 7. I personally do not feel option 10 is a good idea as I think it would possibly have a negative impact on the game, more likely than an early change.

 

I would also add what I would like to see happen with respect to AC.

 

1) Bioware would come out and publicly state, in no uncertain terms, that AC IS YOUR CLASS.

 

2) Make AC choice mandatory at level 10, move all abilities under the AC heading in the abilities pane and remove the base class header, move all trainable abilities from that point forward under the AC header on the trainer.

 

3) Remove all references in the game to your base class that can be removed once you choose your AC.

 

4) Add a small quest line at max level that is AC specific, where they refer to your AC directly.

 

IMO this would make the choice more meaningful.

 

I do think, however, that Dual Spec would be fine.

 

Dual spec - Allowed when you choose your spec onward, but open use is only allowed after you conclude your class story.

 

Before your story conclusion dual spec would be restricted to use inside heroics, flashpoints, operations and warzones UNLESS the groupfinder tool allows you a free spec swap while qued to fill missing roles. It would be a permanent unlock feature, allowing you to save a particular setup...it saves point allocation and bar locations of specials but not gear setup. it would have a one hour cooldown, and would cost either EC or CC.

 

After conclusion of your storyline you are unlocked to spec swap any time you wish.

 

This does not remove the cost of respecing...only saves the spec loadouts, positions of abilities on action bars, etc....you can still choose to forgo the dual spec route and manually redeploy your points and abilities.

[Ratajack]

1) The need to buy/acquire new gear would BENEFIT the game. Crafters would sell more, GF queues would have more players who need their new gear and WZ's would have players regrinding new gear.

 

2) That's an assumption, not a fact. I'd argue that any player willing to change their AC, is likely a better player than your average player because they are probably swapping for a reason.

 

3) I'd argue that the ability to swap AC's would ENHANCE the connection to the character because you'd be on ONE toon vs swapping to alts.

 

4) Replayablity? It's 100% the EXACT SAME experience AC to AC. This has NO impact on that at all.

 

None of those are valid reasons. I have decided.

 

See, I can do it, too.

 

1. Crafters would sell more? Are you for real? Do you expect us to believe that? Do you think we do not see all the threads about how useless crafting is due to the CM? The CM will likely not even see any benefit from a player re-rolling due to the collections interface. That player can just create a new set of armor, weapon(s) and crystals for free, most likely.

 

2. I'd argue that most players wanting to change class are NOT better players. I'd argue that most players wanting to change class want to do so for one of two reasons. 1. They wanted to level easy mode, say as marauder, and then change classes for the role they want to play at end game, say juggernaut to tank.

 

3. I'd argue that class changes would decrease the connection to the player because although the name and appearance stays the same, the character changes. A class change is a character change.

 

4. The wonderful thing about this game is the various decisions that we have to make. Although the basic story may be the same, it is possible to drastically change the leveling experience by changing the decisions.

[Ratajack]

Ok, so you just want to make it punitive. Got it. I'm actually trying to support an option that would IMPROVE the player experience, not punish players.

 

Still not a valid reason.

 

What you desire would adversely affect those against class changes. I'm trying to support an option that will not have an adverse impact on those who prefer that some things be earned.

[TUXs]

None of those are valid reasons. I have decided.

 

See, I can do it, too.

Yeah Rat...you're a real winner huh?! It's obvious with this you're simply trolling and I'm done feeding you.

[DOHboy]

1) The need to buy/acquire new gear would BENEFIT the game. Crafters would sell more, GF queues would have more players who need their new gear and WZ's would have players regrinding new gear.

 

2) That's an assumption, not a fact. I'd argue that any player willing to change their AC, is likely a better player than your average player because they are probably swapping for a reason.

 

3) I'd argue that the ability to swap AC's would ENHANCE the connection to the character because you'd be on ONE toon vs swapping to alts.

 

4) Replayablity? It's 100% the EXACT SAME experience AC to AC. This has NO impact on that at all.

 

well

1) people already complain about the grind and gear costs, depending on when the swap occurs, char may be virtually unplayable unless significant investment is spent.

2) Again that is an assumption on your part, granted it is somewhere in the middle, but a person who is simply bored with their AC and swaps to a new one and has little or no practice does not mean they are skilled. Even swapping trees can be difficult for some.

 

3) is subjective at best depending on your view point I guess

 

4) the experience is not 100% the same. Leveling a sage healer is about the exact opposite of leveling a shadow tank/dps. As would be a scoundrel dps (more melee/stealth) vs say a gunslinger (ranged). They are vastly different play styles.

[Ratajack]

For better or worse, 6 of 8 ACs has the ability to do this today, without any leveling experience.

 

Talent trees evolved to provide more customization on a per class basis.

 

Allowing AC changes would just be the next evolution of that.

 

The biggest difference between ACs is playing a melee class versus a ranged class.

 

I would suggest that people tend to enjoy playing what they are good at, so unless you're good at both, you won't switch repeatedly.

 

At minimum, you should be able to switch your AC before you hit 50 because you may not even know you are better at melee than ranged or vice versa.

 

If you think going DPS to tank or heals gets ugly fast, imagine going from heals to tank, or tank to heals. Thankfully, we do not have to worry about that right now. We will, though, if they ever decide to allow class changes.

[Ratajack]

Yeah Rat...you're a real winner huh?! It's obvious with this you're simply trolling and I'm done feeding you.

 

I'm not trolling. I just decided to play your game, with the change that I have not just said "invalid" and left it at that.

 

If you are ready to accept that those against class changes have valid reasons, even if you do not agree with them, then perhaps we can move on to having an actual discussion.

[Vhaegrant]

swapping AC is not a cosmetic thing. You can't go from a dual wielding sentinel to a single bladed guardian with a shield off hand at the flip of a switch. Nor would I expect a healing Commando with an Assault Cannon to switch AC and then become a blaster rifle vanguard tank. People think its just cosmetic, people also think its super expensive just swapping out gear mods and armor, or fully augmenting gear. Now take that with the AC change and your swapping out basically every piece of armor you have, fully augmenting it, new relics, new companion gear. People think its purely a cosmetic change, that only thing it involves is the skill tree.

 

Take into account skill of the player involved (people complain enough about bad tanks) now take into consideration a dps sage swapping to shadow tanking, or dps commando to vanguard tank. dps vanguard to commando heals. DPS to DPS swap is probably fine, DPS to tank/heals tends to get ugly quickly.

 

You would basically be starting from scratch which is why it would just be easier to swing an alt.

 

I currently play a Powertech as my main, due to the activities I take part in I have a full set of gear for Tanking (off hand shield), a set for running dailies (dps offhand generator) and a set put aside for PvP (although with bolster I'd probably be better off in my PvE gear as it has a higher rating).

 

The bottom line is that the game already requires ACs that have DPS -> Tank to have a full set of gear for both. If you have DPS -> Heal you can probably get away with the same gear (I tend to stack Alacrity and Power which works well enough in both roles). Even a DPS -> DPS transition may warrant a full gear swap (Marauder using an Anihilation or Carnage build used to need crit and surge, the Rage build can get away with just power and surge due to the auto-crit).

 

The learning curve is not so steep. And to be honest not one that you tend to learn while you level anyway. It's only once you start to get the full skill rotation and hit the endgame difficulty barrier and taking part in group content you start to need to learn to play. The players that have issues coping with this barrier aren't going to be able to complete endgame (NiM) content on their current build.3

 

You step back to level an alt and you take your foot of the credit earning potential. Depending on how often you feel the need to upgrade your gear as you level you have the potential to enter a negative equity where you have to supply the character with credits from a high level alt to keep them viable. Just stepped back onto my low level (23) Mercenary and levelled so fast with the xp buffs that over 7 levels managed to clear only 10k profit after training costs had been paid for. Levelling an alt is not a 'cheaper option' it is a very expensive option.

 

A high level character can do a full run of weeklies and earn a million credits (takes about 3-5 hours depending on focus and ability), that's a good chunk towards buying mods/ augments. Not to mention the 180+ basic commendations towards level 69 gear.

 

SWTOR is reasonably cheap to get a semi-decent set of gear together for entry to higher level endgame content. The cost of gaining a new set of gear certainly isn't an impediment to providing an AC swap function.

 

Oh and why do you need to gear up a companion again?

[Ratajack]

I currently play a Powertech as my main, due to the activities I take part in I have a full set of gear for Tanking (off hand shield), a set for running dailies (dps offhand generator) and a set put aside for PvP (although with bolster I'd probably be better off in my PvE gear as it has a higher rating).

 

The bottom line is that the game already requires ACs that have DPS -> Tank to have a full set of gear for both. If you have DPS -> Heal you can probably get away with the same gear (I tend to stack Alacrity and Power which works well enough in both roles). Even a DPS -> DPS transition may warrant a full gear swap (Marauder using an Anihilation or Carnage build used to need crit and surge, the Rage build can get away with just power and surge due to the auto-crit).

 

The learning curve is not so steep. And to be honest not one that you tend to learn while you level anyway. It's only once you start to get the full skill rotation and hit the endgame difficulty barrier and taking part in group content you start to need to learn to play. The players that have issues coping with this barrier aren't going to be able to complete endgame (NiM) content on their current build.3

 

You step back to level an alt and you take your foot of the credit earning potential. Depending on how often you feel the need to upgrade your gear as you level you have the potential to enter a negative equity where you have to supply the character with credits from a high level alt to keep them viable. Just stepped back onto my low level (23) Mercenary and levelled so fast with the xp buffs that over 7 levels managed to clear only 10k profit after training costs had been paid for. Levelling an alt is not a 'cheaper option' it is a very expensive option.

 

A high level character can do a full run of weeklies and earn a million credits (takes about 3-5 hours depending on focus and ability), that's a good chunk towards buying mods/ augments. Not to mention the 180+ basic commendations towards level 69 gear.

 

SWTOR is reasonably cheap to get a semi-decent set of gear together for entry to higher level endgame content. The cost of gaining a new set of gear certainly isn't an impediment to providing an AC swap function.

 

Oh and why do you need to gear up a companion again?

 

The cost of leveling certainly isn't an impediment to requiring that that new class actually be leveled and earned. . It is not a valid reason to allow class changes.

 

 

Nowhere is it written that if you level an alt to play that other class that you can ONLY play that alt. You can do the dailies and earn those credits with your high level main, even if it is a class you do not want to play, and then log onto the alt to continue leveling the class you DO want to play. You get the best of both worlds, the credit earning potential of the main and the new class you want to play.

[TUXs]

I'm not trolling. I just decided to play your game, with the change that I have not just said "invalid" and left it at that.

 

If you are ready to accept that those against class changes have valid reasons, even if you do not agree with them, then perhaps we can move on to having an actual discussion.

 

Except you haven't presented ONE valid reason arguing against this - when asked to, you refused. There's no discussing this with you when you refuse to make an argument against it...you're just "against" it...for nor apparent reason.

[DOHboy]

I currently play a Powertech as my main, due to the activities I take part in I have a full set of gear for Tanking (off hand shield), a set for running dailies (dps offhand generator) and a set put aside for PvP (although with bolster I'd probably be better off in my PvE gear as it has a higher rating).

 

The bottom line is that the game already requires ACs that have DPS -> Tank to have a full set of gear for both. If you have DPS -> Heal you can probably get away with the same gear (I tend to stack Alacrity and Power which works well enough in both roles). Even a DPS -> DPS transition may warrant a full gear swap (Marauder using an Anihilation or Carnage build used to need crit and surge, the Rage build can get away with just power and surge due to the auto-crit).

 

The learning curve is not so steep. And to be honest not one that you tend to learn while you level anyway. It's only once you start to get the full skill rotation and hit the endgame difficulty barrier and taking part in group content you start to need to learn to play. The players that have issues coping with this barrier aren't going to be able to complete endgame (NiM) content on their current build.3

 

You step back to level an alt and you take your foot of the credit earning potential. Depending on how often you feel the need to upgrade your gear as you level you have the potential to enter a negative equity where you have to supply the character with credits from a high level alt to keep them viable. Just stepped back onto my low level (23) Mercenary and levelled so fast with the xp buffs that over 7 levels managed to clear only 10k profit after training costs had been paid for. Levelling an alt is not a 'cheaper option' it is a very expensive option.

 

A high level character can do a full run of weeklies and earn a million credits (takes about 3-5 hours depending on focus and ability), that's a good chunk towards buying mods/ augments. Not to mention the 180+ basic commendations towards level 69 gear.

 

SWTOR is reasonably cheap to get a semi-decent set of gear together for entry to higher level endgame content. The cost of gaining a new set of gear certainly isn't an impediment to providing an AC swap function.

 

Oh and why do you need to gear up a companion again?

 

As for gear, you are currently within your AC meaning regardless of role it is the same weapon. Swapping AC would require entirely new weapons and armor.

 

Think of going from a merc healer, to a powertech tank, how much of a gear swap would you require? going from DPS to DPS would be somewhat neutral, however, mainhand/off hands are directly tied to your AC.

 

In the context of say the Inquisitor/counselor your AC swaps from either a single light saber to a saber staff.

 

Knights/Warriars would go from a single saber to dual saber requiring significant investment in new offhands/main hands.

 

Commando/vanguard would be similar, you go from an Assault cannon on the commando to a blaster rifle on the vanguard. It is not as simple as having 2x the gear, (pvp to pve, healer to dps) but entirely new gear.

[DOHboy]

Except you haven't presented ONE valid reason arguing against this - when asked to, you refused. There's no discussing this with you when you refuse to make an argument against it...you're just "against" it...for nor apparent reason.

 

I presented 4 reasons which you promptly said were "invalid" and ignored. Which is what he/she was referring too in your dismissal of our "reasons" They are only valid if you deem them valid. Otherwise they are invalid and thus we have failed to state even on reason against this.

 

I.e basically this comes down to those that think its a bad thing for X reasons. Those for it dismiss those reasons as invalid thus there are zero reasons to NOT implement it.

[TUXs]

As for gear, you are currently within your AC meaning regardless of role it is the same weapon. Swapping AC would require entirely new weapons and armor.

 

Think of going from a merc healer, to a powertech tank, how much of a gear swap would you require? going from DPS to DPS would be somewhat neutral, however, mainhand/off hands are directly tied to your AC.

 

In the context of say the Inquisitor/counselor your AC swaps from either a single light saber to a saber staff.

 

Knights/Warriars would go from a single saber to dual saber requiring significant investment in new offhands/main hands.

 

Commando/vanguard would be similar, you go from an Assault cannon on the commando to a blaster rifle on the vanguard. It is not as simple as having 2x the gear, (pvp to pve, healer to dps) but entirely new gear.

What does this have to do with anything though? Someone would need a new weapon...ok?! So? Why do you think that suddenly overrides the idea that this would benefit the game?

[Vhaegrant]

1) AC ties the player to a specific main hand weapon. Allowing AC changes causes the player to incur an extremely high cost of acquiring new gear and gearing a companion.

First of all there is no need to regear a companion, most endgame solo content can be cleared with any companion you want.

SWTOR does not have a high cost of equipping a character in new gear, in fact with the recent addition of Oricon they are literally giving it away.

 

2) AC swapping reduces the number of quality players for a particular class. Playing a class effectively requires some level of practice and time investment. Swappign AC eliminates that practice reducing the quality of the overall player base for the class.

Actual numbers of quality players for a particular class would remain the same, you are not getting rid of them. You may slightly increase the number of players that have not been grouped before, but that happens anyway and players have to learn their craft somewhere. If you want to avoid this join a guild or put good players you like on your friends list, or maybe be a bit understanding and offer tips and advice to novice players so they can become the better player you want them to be.

 

3) There needs to be some level of "investment" by a player into their characters otherwise there is not sense of long term commitment. Thus allowing AC swapping removes the long term investment cost of a player into their character.

AC swapping actually increases the long term investment into a character. This is the main reason many of the pro-AC swap camp want it for, so they can carry on playing a character they have invested time in and enjoy the class story of but have tired of the mechanics or found their endgame role not one of their liking.

 

4) reduces replay ability since wanting to play additional mechanics would simply cost a person credits/money and not require any time. MMOs are typically fighting for your time (i.e subscriptions) and thus are filled with ways of spending that time, in the hopes that you will continue to play AND (in the new f2p market) invest $$ for cosmetic changes to enhance your time.

Replay ability remains for those that want to replay content. Bare in mind that AC swapping only eliminates the need to replay through the same class story, it does not eliminate the option of needing to play through the 8 individual class storylines. There is plenty of game time still there. I would say that a character that is invested enough in a character to want to pay out some CCs to swap the AC so they can continue to play them and have fun with them is a player who is more likely to pay out for the vanity items from the cartel market.

 

So there are 4 off the bat..any further questions?

I think you need to find a different bat

 

And just to be fair I'll put my own concern about an AC swap here, it's about the only 'Con' I've seen that bears any merit....

 

Con

1) It diverts development time away from quality of life features that the game has greater need for.

 

That's it really. Given that AC Swapping would likely fall on the shoulder of the 'QoL' team rather than the 'Engine Optimisation' team or the 'New Content' team or even the 'Cartel Market' team. I would much rather their time be spent developing features like, and in no particular preference....

 

- Legacy bank tab (communal bank tab, pretty much for crafting materials and legacy bound items)

- Legacy based address book (ability to friend a legacy or ignore a legacy)

- More UI features (remove 'unlock' and 'UI customisation' button from the left of button one and place the options on the 'esc' key menu) and colour settings.

- The ability to save out ability UI configurations/ Keybinds on a character by character basis.

- Companion role kits (apparently they were in during Beta, I know you can use just about any companion when you hit end game but my mercenary wants their melee tank now and doesn't want to have to wait till the end of Belsavis)

 

 

If the Devs ever do get around to rolling out AC swapping I think it most likely to come at a time new AC options are introduced to the class system.

Edited October 25, 2013 by Vhaegrant

[TUXs]

I presented 4 reasons which you promptly said were "invalid" and ignored.

Re-read my reply dohboy, I actually DID reply to each of your 4 whines.