Smash isn't that bad

[United_Strafes]

Good post if you know, there was one guy running around smashing and not 7......

[rainbow]

A thing that might help would be removing the auto crit and instead increase surge rating bonus to maybe 40% base. Just a wild guess, the damage on smash with surge in effect would be greater, without crit it would be less, so they have to sacrifice surge/power for critical rating to reliably deal damage... but every other class and spec will crit higher that way.

[POPsi]

that's just bull OP. Problem is not a single derpsmasher, but when you face a team of 4+ monkeys at the same time. All you see is jumpjumpjump smashsmashsmash, ohwait, I'm dead again. That's the problem.

[DweezillKagemand]

Just give it a flat 30% nerf. I'm happy.

[Megatfx]

You guys must all be from the Bastion where you haven't figured out how to deal with Smash. The spec is an afterthought on PoT5 nowadays.

[MidichIorian]

While I agree that smash is a little OP, I don't really get that people keep bemoaning the fact that a "Tank class" has it. There are no "Tank Classes" there are only 'tank specs', and Rage is a dps spec.

That's weird because sorcs, operatives and mercs always get to hear that they're not "pure" dps AC'es, based on the fact that they have heal trees. So why is it ok that those three are left in the crapper, on behalf of being able to spec something els, while an AC with a tank tree can be perfectly fine as dps?

 

Now, I personally don't think the option of specing another role should make the AC any less "pure" dps (and that applies to juggs too). You usually pick one role so if you're not interested in the other you shouldnt have to suffer for it. It is weird though that it only applies to certain AC'es.

[rainbow]

That's weird because sorcs, operatives and mercs always get to hear that they're not "pure" dps AC'es, based on the fact that they have heal trees. So why is it ok that those three are left in the crapper, on behalf of being able to spec something els, while an AC with a tank tree can be perfectly fine as dps?

 

"DPS Class": But... but... but... they should heal me, because I am the ub0rpwnz0r and will kill all and everything and damn... why am I dead?

 

Usual answer you'd like to shout but don't because he won't understand it: BECAUSE YOU BAD EXCUSE FOR AN APE RAN AROUND 3 CORNERS OUT OF SIGHT AND OUT OF HEALING RANGE BECAUSE YOU PUT THE ENTIRE ENEMY TEAM IN BETWEEN US!

 

And then they call us not pure dps classes because we didn't try to die horribly to save their sorry asses.

Edited January 24, 2013 by rainbow

[OpeningToEndgame]

I think the more players complain. The more these companies are inclined to NOT change things that need to be changed. Bioware can't be this dumb to not see the damage this one ability is causing a ruckus over. As for "turn and kill that guy." Well, I've seen my entire fully EWH geared team turn and attempt to kill Knights and see one healer keep him alive.

[Chlomamf]

You guys must all be from the Bastion where you haven't figured out how to deal with Smash. The spec is an afterthought on PoT5 nowadays.

 

I'm not from the Bastion, but I would like to hear your theory of how to deal with Smashers please.

 

They have a leap, which makes running away near impossible. Knock them back, they can spec into a 10-metre Leap, meaning they can leap to you again. Once they leap they can Smash immediatley afterwards (last I checked) meaning they can still do damage to you before you knock them back. It's hard to avoid them when their at objectives, and you can't spread out when all the enemies are in one big pile around the objective.

 

I'd say Snipers have a good defence against Lolderpsmashers (they can Spec into a 60% AoE reduction when Entrench is active). But other than that it would seem the other classes are screwed. I don't know.

 

So please, tell me how to avoid these Lolderpsmashers when on my Melee class?

[Tankqull]

simply give it a severe drop off - centre 1m in diameter 100% from there starting with 80% at 1.01m down to 0.0% on max diameter. and everything would be fine. Edited January 24, 2013 by Tankqull

[Aetideus]

People need to realize that smash spec is not as severely overpowered as people say it is. With some simple warzone awareness, a group could realize that the jugg that's placed himself between 4-5 enemies is actually guaranteed to die if those targets would just turn and attack him.

 

The weakness of this spec needs to be exploited, and it is that the smasher is constantly putting himself in harms way surrounded by multiple enemies, and before you know it, you don't have a smash problem anymore.

 

A melee class would not complain about ranged damage without actually trying to close the gap and fight the range and stop him from free casting. The advantage ranged has is that they can place themselves somewhere in range of their healers but out of range of the enemy dps.

 

Stop complaining about a spec that is really not that powerful; it hits hard but that's required since if they can't do damage quickly they won't do any at all since they're dead so soon. People suggesting 3-5 different changes to the spec don't understand how the spec works... nerf it and no one will play it, whats the point of that?

 

May be the point is that 3 Smashers can deal 3*3*7k 63k damage and the others cannot play.

[Kynbote]

 

This is directly from my combat log, I haven't changed anything except for the names:

[20:36:05.303] [@juggernaut] [@scoundrel] [smash {807801743998976}] [ApplyEffect {836045448945477}: Damage {836045448945501}] (5934* kinetic {836045448940873}) <13650>

 

[20:36:06.947] [@juggernaut] [@scoundrel] [Vicious Throw {2145542322782208}] [ApplyEffect {836045448945477}: Damage {836045448945501}] (2830 energy {836045448940874}) <5661>

 

I have 1000 expertise with full battlemaster gear. I know, it's not the best in slot gear or anything but I don't think anyone should be taking 19311 damage within 1.65 seconds...

 

 

edit: I was reading the combat log wrong so my example is way off. Nevermind me. (Thanks, Wainamoinen for pointing that out).

Edited January 24, 2013 by Kynbote

[-IceHawk-]

With 1,288 Expertise on my Sorc the equivalent yesterday from a Marauder was a 6,850 damage smash followed by a 3,500 throw.

 

Trying to think what combination of abilities I could use as a Sorc to produce over 10K damage with only two button presses...

 

...

..

.

 

[POPsi]

You guys must all be from the Bastion where you haven't figured out how to deal with Smash. The spec is an afterthought on PoT5 nowadays.

 

let me guess... it's been either banned from rated or limited to 1 smash spec per team?

[Wainamoinen]

This is directly from my combat log, I haven't changed anything except for the names:

 

 

I have 1000 expertise with full battlemaster gear. I know, it's not the best in slot gear or anything but I don't think anyone should be taking 19311 damage within 1.65 seconds...

 

Combat Logs: the figure in angle brackets is threat, damage is the figure in a normal bracket before damage type, i.e. "(5934* energy...". The asterisk marks a crit. Threat has no function I'm aware of for PvP. The smasher will have threat greater than damage because he's a Jugg smasher in Soresu form (tank stance) that boosts threat.

 

Checking your logs is good, and don't feel bad about the error, I made precisely the same one when I started looking at them months ago. I was convinced a tankassin was doing insane damage until I guessed what was going on and had it confirmed. He was doing damage alright, jsut not that insane.

 

If you want an example of insane Smash damage, I'm in c.1300 expertise and got smashed for 7127. Ow. So your point's fair though the numbers aren't as bad as you thought in your example.

[TUXs]

that's just bull OP. Problem is not a single derpsmasher, but when you face a team of 4+ monkeys at the same time. All you see is jumpjumpjump smashsmashsmash, ohwait, I'm dead again. That's the problem.

 

I've played against a full team of 8, but 4-5 seems to be the norm lately.

 

You guys must all be from the Bastion where you haven't figured out how to deal with Smash. The spec is an afterthought on PoT5 nowadays.

 

I'm on PoT5 - I missed the memo. Care to enlighten me? How am I supposed to "deal" with it?

[WaywardOne]

I've played against a full team of 8, but 4-5 seems to be the norm lately.

 

 

 

I'm on PoT5 - I missed the memo. Care to enlighten me? How am I supposed to "deal" with it?

 

Spread out, use guards, taunts, roots, mezzes and kbs.

 

Try saving screenshots of all of your scoreboards. Come back with numbers to back up your accusations (everyone's a smasher, smashers top damage/kills in every game they are in) and maybe I'll believe you. Curiously I haven't seen anyone who has done a little data analysis complain about smashers.

[TUXs]

Spread out, use guards, taunts, roots, mezzes and kbs.

 

Sadly, this games PvP tends to focus on singular objectives in an area (node, door, ball carrier). As I'm trying to cap a node/plant a bomb, my ability to "spread out" is limited by my ability to actually reach the objective. Since I'm mezzed as soon as I'm lept to, it's also impossible for me to get off a KB/Mez prior to the SMASH(s).

 

There's no possible way I feel someone can justify just how OP this skill is. It's AoE, it's auto crit, it's MASSIVE spike damage and it's on a negligible cooldown to where it can be virtually spammed.

 

And since some of you have figured out how to defend against it so well, I can't understand your concern for whether it's nerfed or not?! Why would it matter to you guys that scoff it off and counter it so well??

[-IceHawk-]

Mainly because they are defending smash in the forums and not defending against it in warzones... Edited January 24, 2013 by -IceHawk-

[Wainamoinen]

Curiously I haven't seen anyone who has done a little data analysis complain about smashers.

 

Some data analysis on big hits in WZs and how many are Smashes.

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=588575

[TUXs]

Some data analysis on big hits in WZs and how many are Smashes.

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=588575

 

Wow...nice chart.

 

I liked this:

- Hit for 5k or more 460 times.

- Biggest hit was a 7271 Smash.

- 88.5% of hits over 5k were either Smash or Force Sweep.

Edited January 24, 2013 by TUXs

[LuciferinDNA]

I agree with the OP! Smash is not that bad.. I suggest to bring smash and all its connecting skills to all classes till its a non-factor spell!

[Technohic]

Some data analysis on big hits in WZs and how many are Smashes.

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=588575

 

I don't see the problem here.

 

 

 

 

 

 

/sarcasm

[TUXs]

I don't see the problem here.

 

 

 

 

 

 

/sarcasm

 

LOL! The hidden /sarcasm was off my screen just enough that I almost hit reply

[Coldin]

There's only one thing I've seen that really shuts a smash spec down. And that's getting stunned, knocked back, or otherwise controlled just as Smash goes off. It burns the cooldown and the stacks of singularity. Now, timing such a thing seems pretty much impossible, but occasionally feels like some teams get that down really easily. Of course, those are the teams that are usually wiping the board with us anyway, and are simply stacking as much CC on their team as possible. So maybe it's just luck.