Dabrixmgp Posted January 9, 2013 Share Posted January 9, 2013 I always just assume every OP and Sorc in a WZ is heals and guard them. I mean why would they play an inferior DPS spec when they could actually benefit their team and help us win by healing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smellmop Posted January 9, 2013 Share Posted January 9, 2013 what do you guys think about removing placing target markers in pvp? i honestly don't have a problem healing in wz (lowbie...don't have a 50 healer). Though I find it much easier on my sorc/sage with the ability to keep my team bubbled, and having a quick knockback and then speed run way from trouble. To my first question...it is really easy to know when you've been marked....run into battle where there are 6 teammates and 6 enemies and immediately all the enemies break off and chase you down lol. I like the huttball map the best as a healer.....always try and position myself where i can knock back into acid or fire, free dps amirite? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
smellmop Posted January 9, 2013 Share Posted January 9, 2013 This is bad not only for you but also for another (real) tank. He's cant guard u cuz u already guarded! Drop ur guard buff pls in this case. ya a bit of l2p on the healers part there as well...click the guard off your bar Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rob_y Posted January 9, 2013 Share Posted January 9, 2013 I always just assume every OP and Sorc in a WZ is heals and guard them. I mean why would they play an inferior DPS spec when they could actually benefit their team and help us win by healing. I hope you're an Assassin, because otherwise (if you're a Powertech or Juggernaut), I could ask why you're playing an inferior spec instead of helping your team win. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Master_Nate Posted January 9, 2013 Share Posted January 9, 2013 I still heal and have been for pretty much my entire time in this game which is since early access. I have rolled a DPS class but find that there are just never many healers in the Q's I get. Mind you, I started a Marauder back in feb. and just finished him at the end of November so I've been pretty dedicated to healing the entire time in PvP. I used to heal as a sorc but then they kind of took a hit around 1.2, then servers began to bleed out and I was FF to no end in every game by the ones that did remain and that was no fun. Once the xfer happened, I rolled operative heals and have been running it ever since. My point being there are a few of us dedicated healers left. Sometimes we just try out different classes. I know I do as it helps me survive facing them in the end and improves my game play. I'm sure some healers are discouraged with the dmg going out from smash. While bubble does help counter it, AOE ring helps bring a lot of HP back up but you can't have one and then the other so it's kind of a mess atm in my opinion. The other negative to the AOE ring at times in pug groups is people stand in it. Funny I know but you don't HAVE to stand in it....just have to be near it, but it just opens smashers to rack in dmg and big sweeps. This is why you see lots of bubble spec's I think, at least this is why I figure the bubble stun is used so much. Yes, it's kind of a "must have" right now sadly but I still think it's highly abusive at the moment. I'd rather see a dedicated healer and a hybrid dps sorc that pays attention and bubbles players under focus fire, but that requires too much work for some, and I understand that. As a full time healer and objective based player, I can really tell when tanks and dps are working their butt off to help me heal them up, those games are by far the best. As a healer, I see quite a bit and even when I don't get a guard, as long as I get protection from my team it usually means they recognize me as a healer. I didn't call out in the beginning I was a healer, they can just see the difference from what they are used too without heals on a team. This is why I enjoy healing. Now some games...I get my face smashed in and I don't get that protection(I solo que as much as I run with friends) but sometimes just have to roll with the punches and I don't mind those. Back to the topic at hand, how to entice them back into WZs? What keeps me playing mine is the amount of thanks and nice comments I can receive during a game or after a game. All classes and roles are necessary but unless a healer just blows it out of the water, 500k or above, they usually go unnoticed because they aren't ALWAYS needed depending on how the opposing team is set up. You face a bunch of squish's and your teams is dps heavy you won't be dong much healing. Bottom line, for me as a healer I don't enjoy every game I get into but the ones that are super close and actual battles, make up for those lack luster ones and this is why I keep on healing. If anything, I'd say need more dedicated tanks and not just the smash spec ones! When I do see these on my team, which can be rare, I'm sure to thank them if they do a good job. I mean let's be honest, a tank taunting and peeling is extremely helpful too but they get left out too because most people don't notice it. Again, as a healer I do. P.S. Sorry for the long post Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Master_Nate Posted January 9, 2013 Share Posted January 9, 2013 (edited) ya a bit of l2p on the healers part there as well...click the guard off your bar This is a good point to be made and idk if all healers, or those being guarded, realize it but you bring up a good point. If I choose to transition, meaning someone is calling for help and we have the position under control, I do toggle off the guard. Even if the person I'm running to can't guard me, it leaves me open for anyone to pick me up if need be. Edited January 9, 2013 by Master_Nate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Master_Nate Posted January 9, 2013 Share Posted January 9, 2013 what do you guys think about removing placing target markers in pvp? i honestly don't have a problem healing in wz (lowbie...don't have a 50 healer). Though I find it much easier on my sorc/sage with the ability to keep my team bubbled, and having a quick knockback and then speed run way from trouble. To my first question...it is really easy to know when you've been marked....run into battle where there are 6 teammates and 6 enemies and immediately all the enemies break off and chase you down lol. I like the huttball map the best as a healer.....always try and position myself where i can knock back into acid or fire, free dps amirite? Honestly, I see lots of healers on the opposing team with target markers on their head and no one even checking them. Personally, I'd like to see them taken out. They really only work in coordinated teams anyways and I don't think coordinated teams even need these to FF a healer down. When I do run a dps class, I do think I'd like the ability to put a marker on players head and not have my team see it. Not cause I want my team to FF them, but so that I, personally, can monitor their movement easier. Kind of different than the way it is now of course. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leafy_Bug Posted January 9, 2013 Share Posted January 9, 2013 I play a shadow min max stalker dps and full survivor EWH/WH. I guard healers, constantly guard swap, for as long as I live when I am surrounded by 4-5 smashers. I'd rather die than let my healers go unprotected and I often jump vs 6, guard the attacked healer, resilience, aoe taunt, and I keep that guy alive because it is my duty to do so. Now some of you healers do not deserve a guard at all. You heal everyone except the tank that keeps you alive. You have your priorities so wrong that it makes me cringe. You are all happy casting your heals and getting those healing numbers but you don't even see that I used my battlereadiness, deflection, warzone medpac / rakata medpack and resilience. You have the attention span of a tree and I practically heal myself while you keep ignoring me and I die. Healers like this do not get my guard next time. I also have a scoundrel healer and when I do daily with it, 75 % I run without a guard as the tank will guard the dps or even the other tank. Yes, I have seen soresu guardians putting a guard on vanguard tanks, while I run around with my scoundrel using my ccs just to stay alive longer. These guys do not deserve one single heal. They have no clue when to taunt and how to PVP and at the end when you healed 200k and you died 15 times they tell you 'you are not a healer, check the imp one and l2p'. You reply, if he does not quit cos he is so thick like a forest, have you seen how many times i died? The imp healer died 2 times I died 15 times! They don't care about this, they just want the heals but do not do anything in return. I play both sides of the coin and I really got used to the idea that when I pug with my shadow, I won't get healed if I guard and when I pug with my scoundrel I will not get a guard. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NurseDonut Posted January 9, 2013 Share Posted January 9, 2013 (edited) What would entice me to heal more? Less CC. Fewer interrupts. Fewer gap closers. Fewer punts and pulls. Longer time to kill. Honestly, I would prefer to heal. I've healed in every MMO I played. But in TOR, 75% of the time being the healer means getting marked, leapt to, interrupted, stunned, snared, stunned again, and sent back to the spawn area. It's just not fun. But healing is very important. So now I play my tank. I guard healers. I stick close. I taunt, I peel, I stun. And if they do their thing right, we can hold the main node for a long, long time. We win more than if I try to heal. And I spend almost no time at all in the spawn area. It's much more fun. Edited January 9, 2013 by NurseDonut Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Master_Nate Posted January 9, 2013 Share Posted January 9, 2013 (edited) I play both sides of the coin and I really got used to the idea that when I pug with my shadow, I won't get healed if I guard and when I pug with my scoundrel I will not get a guard. Sad truth to this is if they did give you protection, you alone could probably help sway a lot of lost games. I run with an assassin buddy at times and with their pull, spike, knockback, taunts....it's super nice and can really tell the difference in games when we are are mitigating lots of the damage so other players can play their roles more effectively. I do feel your pain though. Edited January 9, 2013 by Master_Nate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
truchaos Posted January 9, 2013 Share Posted January 9, 2013 I've gone entire days without logging into my healer because I know when I do, I enter the same picture again. I am instantly marked, mauled by 3+ of the other team (while my team's ballcarrier runs past them...) and taken out, my pots, heals, LoS, skill, gear, stuns, all of it, completely all for naught. /wave Zek-anlai! I know the feeling all too well and *sigh* when I get random apologies from dps for hunting me. As 'known' healers on the server we are marked the second we hit the warzone and the next thing we see is 2-3 smashmonkies licking their lips as they fly through the air at us. Rinse, repeat for the entire match. Players also seem to be clueless in regards to what it means to protect a healer as well. Simply tossing a taunt at the mara that is getting all too personal with me helps, but should be followed up with an active peel. Sure, you reduced his damage, but if that is all that is done it does nothing to stop the true bane of a healer: interrupts, cc's, and pushbacks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PerinnAybara Posted January 9, 2013 Share Posted January 9, 2013 I'd start playing my Mercenary more as a healer again if they would actually change him up a bit. http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=581989 My list of things that would entice me as a healer back into the warzones are there. Well not all of it. I have an entire book of material I'm waiting to offload on all you people. Honestly though, if I could maneuver better while being focused would be nice. There's not enough little objects, line of sight, stairs that I can utilize to lose the people chasing me. That snare on kolto bomb was nice, but it's still not enough for running away. Corner hugging can only take me so far! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrewFromPhilly Posted January 9, 2013 Share Posted January 9, 2013 Honestly, a lot of the healers I see in warzones are quite frankly....terrible. They stand in the same clearly visible spot indefinetely and pay no attention to anything other than the ops frame (and never use cleanse, despite this). When they're inevitably focused they do little to nothing to defend themselves and are honestly just a helpless liability. Now, I've played commando healer, sorc healer, and operative healer in warzones. Sorc is probably my favorite tbh, and the one i see myself playing most. But anyway, they all have tools to avoid and evade being attacked and all of which do nothing if you're only tactic is "slowly walk away from anyone who attacks me then yell at my team in ops chat" I actually like the challenge of being targeted when I'm healing in a warzone, and honestly if it was just me standing there casting like pve I'd be bored out of my mind. I won't turn down a guard if I get it, but its hardly the crutch bad healers think it is. That kind of annoys me too, tbh, because tanks just effortlessly press their guard key on me then farm protection off me, and of course expect me to follow them when 9/10 times they don't know what they're doing and following them would prevent me from healing teammates actually doing something worthwhile. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Master_Nate Posted January 9, 2013 Share Posted January 9, 2013 (edited) I actually like the challenge of being targeted when I'm healing in a warzone, and honestly if it was just me standing there casting like pve I'd be bored out of my mind. I won't turn down a guard if I get it, but its hardly the crutch bad healers think it is. That kind of annoys me too, tbh, because tanks just effortlessly press their guard key on me then farm protection off me, and of course expect me to follow them when 9/10 times they don't know what they're doing and following them would prevent me from healing teammates actually doing something worthwhile. I agree completely here with this. Sometimes, it's not that I don't want guard but I don't need it unless I'm being focused. I'd rather a tank distribute their guard to those being focused so healing is actually easier for me. Heal tank, heal his guarded player, heal team. If the guard is on me and no one is on me, it's wasted. And yes, I don't follow a tank around solely based on whether or not he guarded me, I'd rather stay with the team. Just cause I get guard doesn't mean you own me. It just means you care about your team and their well being but I'm not a slave. Also good points on the cleansing, it's widely overlooked. As an operative I can cleanse the hated blind, at least off of one player of my choice, but I choose that player wisely if at all possible. Sadly wish I could cleanse more or faster with the state of the bubble blind but that would be too OP. Edited January 9, 2013 by Master_Nate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aragost Posted January 9, 2013 Share Posted January 9, 2013 The worst, the absolulte worst, is when a tank puts Guard on you before the match starts, then speeds into the distance and you never see them again. I play a tanksin, one of the few on my server that oftens pvps in a full set of survivor/defense relics/augs, and I get juggies throwing guard on me then dissapearing Makes it a tad awkard when Im trying to guard a sorc, wondering why it wont guard him, then realising its me thats guarded and having to try and remove that from the middle of 3rows of buffs/debuffs midfight Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daxy Posted January 9, 2013 Share Posted January 9, 2013 simple give healers an ability that poisons his own teammates so when the derp train goes off the rails said healer can inject some liquid death instead of kolto on some unsuspecting teammate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DanAxe Posted January 9, 2013 Share Posted January 9, 2013 Hello, I have a Sage seer, and i've been healer since day 1 of the game more than one year ago. I do a lot more pvp than i do pve, and i try to do at least the daily every single day. I have 3 other toons i pvp with, and i have the most fun with the healer actually. It is true that when u start (recruit gear) u need to be patient until u got better gear and its really frustrating. The moment u start casting 1 heal u get 2-3 juggs jumping on you and smashing u to death and u can do nothing about it. Thats when its most important to have ur teammates back you up. But after u get ur War Hero gear, healing is just.. awesome! I know people are afraid because of that first part of undergeared, but trust me, its gets better, much better. Not saying you not gonna die a lot, especially if you're up against a good team that knows to focus dps the healers. But if u got a tank or some dps watching ur back, its loads of fun. At the moment i have almost my full elite war hero set, and its virtually impossible for anyone to solo kill me (even the lolsmashers). Get me a good dps or a good tank, and both of us can bring chaos to the other team. So what i'm trying to say is: it all depends on the people you got playing with you. My suggestion would be (for people who PUG) - just keep an eye for players who actually help you do your job, and ask them if they want to join you for the next match. Eventually you will have a full list of friends of good pvp'ers and you wont have to suffer it alone any longer. But still, i do a lot of pugs and can still have fun. Its just a matter of enduring the first pvp set, when u got ur expertise up to 1150 and some good willpower (talking about the sage ofc) you will love being a healer. Ever had the feeling your team just won Hutball 6-0 in 5ms because of you alone? If you havent u should consider a healer. Just try to endure the worst teams and gear, that the good ones will make up for everything else. Its the most fun i get out of this game Jerod - Sage Seer The Red Eclipse Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Solarenergy Posted January 9, 2013 Share Posted January 9, 2013 simple give healers an ability that poisons his own teammates so when the derp train goes off the rails said healer can inject some liquid death instead of kolto on some unsuspecting teammate That would really make things interesting actually. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NurseDonut Posted January 9, 2013 Share Posted January 9, 2013 (edited) simple give healers an ability that poisons his own teammates so when the derp train goes off the rails said healer can inject some liquid death instead of kolto on some unsuspecting teammate I giggle every time I see a sage healer getting focused, and pull a team-mate over to help. Edited January 9, 2013 by NurseDonut Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cycao Posted January 9, 2013 Share Posted January 9, 2013 I giggle every time I see a sage healer getting focused, and pull a team-mate over to help. This actually happened to me the other day...I was like da*** is this?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoFishing Posted January 9, 2013 Share Posted January 9, 2013 First, I don't see healers as all that rare...at least not on Harbinger on the republic side. Lots of matches at 50 we end up with 3 or 4 healers in the group, and I respec for DPS. What would you, healers, like to see or change in WZs so you would be more inclined to focus on healing? Remove the ability to mark people in WZs. Healers get marked and die within seconds of showing their face at a contested node, unless they have a pocket tank guarding them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cashogy Posted January 9, 2013 Share Posted January 9, 2013 i havent noticed a lack of healers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoFishing Posted January 9, 2013 Share Posted January 9, 2013 I've already been told that the best tank for guarding healer in WZ is a Guardian, so I will start on one as soon as possible. Maybe I will be able to do some good and if I manage to "convince" at least one healer to continue healing in WZs, I think I will do enough for start. Nah, the best is the shadow/assassin that puts guard on and then stands around in stealth just mezzing people. Makes the healer nigh unkillable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SlimsPicken Posted January 9, 2013 Share Posted January 9, 2013 learn to guard/taunt/peel and I might heal again. As a healer you are guaranteed being marked, therefore every tunnel visioned dps will jump all over you all game, so without a true tank who knows how to protect a healer, it just becomes me healing me and running and LOS juking... which serves no real team purpose except to get the dps off the other players for a little while... Its quite simply too stressful and no fun at all to constantly play defend your life against 2+ dps with no guard or peels. Id rather just respec dps and be the guy doing the raeping rather than receiving it. So, until people learn to guard/peel/taunt theres absolutely no reason to heal in PUG style WZs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
symke Posted January 10, 2013 Author Share Posted January 10, 2013 learn to guard/taunt/peel and I might heal again. As a healer you are guaranteed being marked, therefore every tunnel visioned dps will jump all over you all game, so without a true tank who knows how to protect a healer, it just becomes me healing me and running and LOS juking... which serves no real team purpose except to get the dps off the other players for a little while... Its quite simply too stressful and no fun at all to constantly play defend your life against 2+ dps with no guard or peels. Id rather just respec dps and be the guy doing the raeping rather than receiving it. So, until people learn to guard/peel/taunt theres absolutely no reason to heal in PUG style WZs. Do you have any class in particular in mind for guarding? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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