Malastare Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 /signed I fully Support this idea. Can't stand non-white core sabers. I can't stand the metal-face helms for Inquisitors and Consulars. They weren't in the Original Series. Can I get a toggle for that, too? I can't stand Jedi wearing helmets. That wasn't in the Original Series. Can I get a toggle for that, too? I can't stand hair on Zabraks. That wasn't in the Original Series. Can I get a toggle for that, too? Now... As an exercise, tell me how any of those three requests --requests to visually remove stylistic elements that are established in the Extended Universe, but weren't part of some arbitrarily small subset of the canon-- are any different than the OP's request. In the end, that's all it is. The OP doesn't like some lightsaber colors, despite the fact that the relevant lore has plenty of examples of lightsabers with very similar colors, and demonstrates the flexibility of lightsaber color. Then, he makes a nonsense argument --that there are no examples in a small subset of lore which is outside the lore of the game-- to support his opinion. You might as well say that we should remove all green lightsabers because there were no green lightsabers in 'Star Wars' (aka: A New Hope) and that is the movie most people remember when thinking of the term "Star Wars". (Why is it nonsensical: Because people's perceptions do not determine reality. Fact is not defined by the majority. The game is set in the EU, and should follow the lore set down in the EU. The fact that some people are wholly ignorant or dismissive of the EU does not change the fact that the game is set in the EU) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Meepbot Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 I can't stand the metal-face helms for Inquisitors and Consulars. They weren't in the Original Series. Can I get a toggle for that, too? I can't stand Jedi wearing helmets. That wasn't in the Original Series. Can I get a toggle for that, too? I can't stand hair on Zabraks. That wasn't in the Original Series. Can I get a toggle for that, too? Now... As an exercise, tell me how any of those three requests --requests to visually remove stylistic elements that are established in the Extended Universe, but weren't part of some arbitrarily small subset of the canon-- are any different than the OP's request. In the end, that's all it is. The OP doesn't like some lightsaber colors, despite the fact that the relevant lore has plenty of examples of lightsabers with very similar colors, and demonstrates the flexibility of lightsaber color. Then, he makes a nonsense argument --that there are no examples in a small subset of lore which is outside the lore of the game-- to support his opinion. You might as well say that we should remove all green lightsabers because there were no green lightsabers in 'Star Wars' (aka: A New Hope) and that is the movie most people remember when thinking of the term "Star Wars". (Why is it nonsensical: Because people's perceptions do not determine reality. Fact is not defined by the majority. The game is set in the EU, and should follow the lore set down in the EU. The fact that some people are wholly ignorant or dismissive of the EU does not change the fact that the game is set in the EU) I dont want my sniper to exist, IAs weren't in the original series, can I get a toggle so I never see IAs or play with them? that'd be great, thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HerrAwesome Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 (edited) TIL everyone in this thread was born in the late 90s/early 2000s. There is an attachment to the only backbone word-of-god canon there is (the original trilogy). Black-core lightsabers (and the new pink-core lightsabers) look very cheesy and not at all reminiscent of the franchise we've come to know and love. Edited November 20, 2012 by HerrAwesome Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
murshawursha Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 Sorry, but that "CGI show" is more authoritative in SW lore than the game you're playing. That is, if Clone Wars says that the leader of Havok Squad later betrayed the Republic and decided to marry a Hutt and herd monkey-lizards, then that's how it happened. At best, the game is on par with (most of) the obscure comic books. I'm sorry if that annoys you, but that's the way it is. That's the universe you're playing in. You're not playing a game based on the Original Trilogy. The Troopers? Those are inspired by Clone Wars (even more than Attack of the Clones or Empire). The Bounty Hunters? Clone Wars and comics, again. Smugglers? They get a lot of inspiration from the books. Inquisitors? Those are based more on the books/comics, too (with visuals obviously borrowed from Darth Maul). Remember that Sith Blade you start off with at the beginning of the Sith Warrior story? Yeah, that's from the books and comics. And Ragnos, Kresh, Sadow, etc? Books and comics. Tukata, Kath hounds, Advozse? Comics. Rattataki? Clone Wars. Pureblood Sith? Comics and books. If you're insisting on following just the Original Series, then we should ditch all of those things to protect your immersion, yes? Actually it can. As a software developer one of the first things that needs to be learned when designing a user experience is: "Making it an option is not always a good solution" Especially in a game that is based on the established lore of a universe --where the game itself is building and expanding that lore-- there is a strong motivation to create a single, authoritative view of the world. Having an option to turn off weather would be fine. Having an option to make Dromund Kaas sunny is not. To that end: Continuing the pre-existing pattern of multiple colors and alternate core colors that was set up by the lore at the same canon level as the game would be a default behavior. Providing an option to go against the current surrounding canon would actually run contrary to immersion. ...that is, assuming you define immersion to be "matching the lore of the universe the game is set in" rather than "matching the lore of just the part of the universe that I like". I'm gonna just go ahead and quote this again, because it's an excellent argument, and the OP seems to have conveniently completely ignored it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LordPhelan Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 How dare anyone add new colors and designs to a fictional weapon in a fictional universe that has been in a constant state of "remastering" since the 70's. HOW DARE THEY! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HerrAwesome Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 I don't get why so many of you are frustrated over the ability for people to just not see lightsaber crystals that weren't in the movies. It doesn't stop you from seeing them or using them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shoogli Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 I don't get why so many of you are frustrated over the ability for people to just not see lightsaber crystals that weren't in the movies. It doesn't stop you from seeing them or using them. You do understand that we sometimes get messages from the devs stating that this or that features is on hold because they don't have the time to work on everything at once ? Example : Hood up and hood down is still in the works. Unfortunately, it requires a few changes to our art pipeline and reprocessing those assets by the artists. The team has been hard at work on our upcoming content, and priorities put hood up/down on the back burner just a bit, but it's still on the To Do list and we are still very much aware of the demand - by developers and players alike! And that's been asked by tons of people. Now of course it doesn't mean the OP couldn't express a different desire, EXCEPT for the fact he's very dismissive of other people's opinions and is arguing semantics, logics, etc... And to answer you specifically : it's not frustration. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Khanic Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 Bud they wouldnt give us a toggle for the giggle on ops/scounds, you arent getting a toggle for lightsaber cores. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Divona Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 I have to agree it is step to strange direction can it be Disney buying up LA? I could tolerate magenta (many call it pink) but purple-pink is a meh. I guess from here on there is no limit what Bioware can do, there are not color combos left that can be more ugly than this. I even despise black core sabers, but this new is even worse. There are great colors what Bioware should have introduced - Dark orange is great. Also crystal colors can have slight effects like radiant energy, pulsing or unstable effects like in SW force unleashed. I can imagine Disney can make next SW movie with pink color... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scerge Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 Do want,. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ImperialSun Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 Just because you hate the color doesn't mean everyone else does. You don't like it don't use it simple as that. OP made it quite clear that he did not like the new colours, does not consider them canon and would not be using them. He was not asking to stop others using them. He was asking for some kind of client side toggle in order that he did not have to see them on his screen. Try reading the words in front of you next time. It's as simple as that Driz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Revanchis Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 (edited) This is a good example of how BW is out of touch with what so many SW fans want! We want NORMAL lightsabers with a white core. We want NORMAL/TRADITIONAL Jedi/Sith Robes just like the movies, not running around looking like clowns. We want NORMAL looking (white) Trooper gear (like the original Star Wars) without all the extra color designs to be an option! Most of what the majority of people want in this game are visual items that looks traditionally like the Star Wars we all know and love. Seems to be too much WoW (retarded) type visuals in this game. Speak for yourself. I want to see all kinds of different colours, maybe even a rainbow saber. I love the awesome capes for jedi, a plain robe is a little too boring. So, if they started allowing males to wear the Slave Bikini you wouldn't find that immersion breaking at all? And you would be just fine running around a Star Wars universe full of cross dressers? Yeah, right. What's so bad about that? If people want their dudes to wear the slave bikini I say whatever, let them. Edited November 20, 2012 by Revanchis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ImperialSun Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 (edited) That's fair enough, but is a dislike for color really a valid enough reason to add a toggle? Also, is a pink lightsaber really that much of a jump from, say, purple or orange? I don't really see how its at odds with the Star Wars style. I'm sure the amour of my Jedi's and Sith are far more outer-Star Wars then the color of their blades! Doesnt matter. Some people just do not get on with the colour and even feel sick looking at it. How would a toggle affect YOUR game play experience? Answer: it wouldn't. Options are always good.... Driz Edited November 20, 2012 by ImperialSun Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malastare Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 (edited) OP made it quite clear that he did not like the new colours, does not consider them canon and would not be using them. He was not asking to stop others using them. He was asking for some kind of client side toggle in order that he did not have to see them on his screen. Again: I dislike Zabraks, I don't consider them Canon as they were not in A New Hope, and would not use them. I demand a client side toggle to render all Zabraks as humans. Dumb, right? A waste of dev resources, right? Nonsensical restriction of what is canon, right? An open invitation to hundreds of other people to demand toggles based on their definitions of canon, right? I'm not saying that black-core sabers are the coolest ever. I'm not planning to buy the purple/pink crystal anytime soon. What really annoys me are people who think they get to declare what is and isn't canon. I was born in the 70's, but I can use my brain and I can see that this game is not based on the movies. It's based on the EU. Do I need to list examples again? There are loads of core game elements here that are firmly sourced from EU comics and EU books. Those are things that are defining the universe we're playing in. The reason people are demanding that the game only model what was seen in the Original Trilogy is not based on logic or research. It's based on personal preference and the desire to only use elements that they like. So, the OP's argument should simply be: "I want a toggle to remove black-core or non-red/green/blue crystals because I don't like them and the game should give me options to re-make the visuals based on what I think is cool" And the answer to: "Shouldn't we give players the ability to make lore elements in the game look however they want?" is simply: No. Edited November 20, 2012 by Malastare Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-Silver- Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 You want a toggle for your screen only? Doesn't that defeat the point of customization? "Bioware, I don't like human female characters using any face model other than face model 2. Please give me a toggle option that changes all human female characters in the game to use face model 2, so the player still gets to see the one they chose, and I am not burdened by their poor choices." Wouldn't it be better to suggest that colour crystals become statless? Bump the stats of hilts slightly, and allow crystals to be 100% decorative. Players no longer feel railroaded into using the dark core crystals for the stats, and their usage should drop dramatically. They will become purely cosmetic, which is fine because that's what creating a character in an RPG is all about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
waterdaemon Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 Seems the pink purple does what it should... Strikes horror into your foes. BTW, why can't it be sold on GTN even thought it is not bound? People constantly spam chat with them as a result. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elear Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 What really annoys me are people who think they get to declare what is and isn't canon. I was born in the 70's, but I can use my brain and I can see that this game is not based on the movies. It's based on the EU. Do I need to list examples again? Examples? What examples? Like KotOR? Game, just like this one? Game that made new things into canon? It's dumb to even think that anything in this game is against canon. It's like saying Yoda in Episode V was against canon because he wasn't in Episode IV. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goretzu Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 Pink/Purple is not Star Wars. Yeah I have to agree, basically if they allow that colour combination then there isn't a colour combination they won't allow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malastare Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 Yeah I have to agree, basically if they allow that colour combination then there isn't a colour combination they won't allow. I'd agree, but why is this shocking to you? Established canon already has pink crystals, purple crystals, violet crystals, "pearl" white crystals, bronze crystals... Why is a pink or violet crystal so different than the pink/purple crystal? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Goretzu Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 (edited) I'd agree, but why is this shocking to you? Established canon already has pink crystals, purple crystals, violet crystals, "pearl" white crystals, bronze crystals... Why is a pink or violet crystal so different than the pink/purple crystal? Asethetics has to come into it, comics often protray things differently, but would Luke have had such precense in the films if he'd confronted the Emperor wielding a My Little Pony Pink coloured lightsaber? Personally I'm up for the red-blue crystal, although I think it'll look horrible to most in game. Edited November 20, 2012 by Goretzu Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarcoGouveia Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 as far as i know up until recently it was lucas who decides what is lore and what is jedi. purple blue green red yellow and the white/colour from originals are all lore so for you to be here saying they are otherwise is silly. I personally dont like this pink crap i see all over the place eiher but i just pretend its red and move on. Can the Devs please focus on the new planet + char story instead of wasting time on pointless stuff like this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EcrirTwyLar Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 I personally would just like to have stats removed from color crystals. That way everyone could have the color they prefer without giving up stats. I just want to have a regular green lightsaber. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rayla_Felana Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 (edited) I for one love my pink-purple saber, makes them much easier to attain at lower levels as before there was literally no purple colored sabers for lower levels. Whilst some may not like it, others do and the game caters to a large audience all with different tastes. If you don't like them, don't use them, that's why there is a choice in what color crystal you can use. This. Oh and Darth Vader's original saber was a dark pink. Edited November 20, 2012 by Rayla_Felana Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malastare Posted November 20, 2012 Share Posted November 20, 2012 Examples? What examples? Like KotOR? Game, just like this one? Game that made new things into canon? No, I'm referring to all the things in the game that are taken from books and comics in the Star Wars Extended Universe, and the animated series which is of even higher canon level. The OP seems to think that the game is based on lore from the Original Trilogy, but this is just some sort of hallucination or selective vision. Large amounts of thematic, environmental, and lore elements are directly brought in from those non-Original-Trilogy sources. Bioware only created part of the story for SWTOR, and a lot of things that people like are taken from lore set up by books or comics. The old Sith lords in Korriban? Comics. Korriban itself? Comics Belsavis? Books. Dromund Kaas? Books and early video games. Tython? Books. The examples go on and on and they make up the foundation for all of the stories in SWTOR. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim-ONeil Posted November 20, 2012 Author Share Posted November 20, 2012 (edited) I certainly love the enthusiasm in those who are opposed to something that they wouldn't ever use or know others are using. Actually something like this takes very little dev power since no new objects are created but thanks for the bumps guys. Just to clarify the reason hood up hood down is on hold is because of the art resources. This is a simple change script request and they could make money off it. A coder could complete this in under an hour. Haters gonna hate Edited November 20, 2012 by Tim-ONeil Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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