Premades are ruining non-ranked warzones

[Veniras]

*Sigh* And people wonder why America's going down the dumps...

 

In Japan they too have these things called "Casual Gamers." Guess what...

 

... THEY PLAY CASUAL GAMES!

 

Edit: Like "Hello Kitty Adventure" and "Angry Birds."

 

Any game without perm death is "casual". Your point is void.

[Doomsdaycomes]

Nothing ever changes am I right? I don't think you have the right to complain since you have admitted you can't find 7 similarly minded friends to queue exclusively for RWZ. If you aren't a casual gamer you should be able to put the time in with similarly minded people to do the real endgame PvP content. Until then enjoy your casual bracket since it does the finding 4 more friends to PvP with for you.

 

Try that again pal.

 

8 people is no problem. We can form that for about 6 hours every evening. Problem comes into find 16 people, since even when we're queue'd there isn't a ranked WZ pop. Don't try and tell me I can't do my part, when peeps here are asking that they not even have to find 4 for their easy wins.

 

Pfft. As I said before, and people wonder why America's going down the dumps. We're less and less competitive, less self improving. Instead of raising the masses up to the exceptional level, we lowered the exceptional level down to the masses, then told them they're all special and unique and don't listen when someone tells them that they in fact... suck.

[Larry_Dallas]

There are two sides to every coin, and some excellent points made by both sides in this discussion. Also a lot of trolls and QQ, but hey, this is the PvP forum after all.

 

To the solo queuer:

Unless you're a horrible player and/or no one on your server likes you (hint hint), there is absolutely nothing stopping you from forming or joining your own premade to queue up with. UGLYMRJ said it best: there is strength in numbers. If you solo queue, expect the worst, because that's exactly what you're going to get. 8-man teams comprised of solo queuers are almost certainly: uncoordinated, unskilled, undergeared, and poor team composition. There may be individuals on your team who don't fall into one of those 4, maybe even a couple players. But as a team, you're shooting yourself in the foot before the match even starts.

 

Even if you can't manage a full 4-man premade, surely there is at least 1 other person you can group with for your next queue. Maybe it's someone you don't really know, but you see him PUGging it all the time too. I'd be willing to bet he'd jump at the chance to not have to solo queue. Putting together a group doesn't have to be a perfectly ideal situation either, such as friends or guildies with Ventrillo. Any time you can stack the odds in your favor by rolling with better players you increase your odds of winning.

 

 

To the herpaderps who should be playing ranked:

We all know who you are. Your guild PvPs 24/7 and is geared. Y U NO RANKED? The answer is simple: because you suck. You can't be competitive in ranked matches, so you troll the normal queue. You have multiple groups running. You coordinate pressing the queue button in Vent in the hopes that you can get 6-8 into the same match. Why fail at ranked when you can just blow up PUGs all day, amirite?

 

Yeah, there really are some ranked teams who are very good and have to do normals because no one will queue up against them. Or maybe they're just waiting for ranked queue pops, or there's not enough guildies online to form a full ranked team. It happens. I'm not talking to you.

 

Theron about nailed it with this post.

[FrozenPlague]

One of the main problems now for me is that even all my best friends in game are about sick of running into squads and getting facerolled. Ever think of having more options for a que? Like a solo only que and a group que? Just a thought. Many other games have them options and seems to be a real hit, I don't mind losing and 99% of the time I see just how bad teams are. People are sooo Focused on getting a kill they totally ignore the guy capped the node... How and why these people play wz's will always be one of my Eternal questions.

[RyanReagan]

One of the main problems now for me is that even all my best friends in game are about sick of running into squads and getting facerolled. Ever think of having more options for a que? Like a solo only que and a group que? Just a thought. Many other games have them options and seems to be a real hit, I don't mind losing and 99% of the time I see just how bad teams are. People are sooo Focused on getting a kill they totally ignore the guy capped the node... How and why these people play wz's will always be one of my Eternal questions.

 

Maybe you should get friends who are better?

[Conser]

Premades are part of what's ruining random wzs. The other part of what's ruining it is the 3+ consular/inquisitors you tend to see there too. I had just resubscribed for 3 months to see what changes had happened in my absence (since a little after explosive conflict came out), and I decided to do a random wz. Guess what, went against a pub team that had 5 consulars on it. I'm afraid I'm going to cancel again and just go with the f2p version from now on.

[arunav]

They should just give everyone a set of WH when they hit 50 and be done with it...when this happens I will be waiting on pins and needles as to what will be the next big complaint.

 

Once there is a new tier out, I actually think this isn't a bad idea, though the poster is being sarcastic. Give people a WH set, let them put it in whatever armor they'd like, have them get augments, and the playing field is generally level, with some room for improvement and progression.

 

Also, make PvP gear (any piece with expertise on it) unusable in FPs and OPs, so the WH gear doesn't outpace the current PVE progression scale.

 

It takes months to get a top-tier PvP set playing casually, so this shouldn't insult the people that play 24/7. More people will PvP because it's still fun at 50 when the gear gap isn't ridiculous, and the matches will be better overall for everyone.

 

This is coming from someone who has a full WH set augmented. Getting it on more than one character is just ridiculous and doesn't make sense in a game that's designed to roll alts and play through all the stories.

 

I like playing an alt better than my main now. It's a lot more fun being a Guardian. PvP is the best part of endgame to me.

 

Now, I have a job, family obligations, want to hang out with friends and get some drinks a couple times a week, etc. Do I really want to stay subbed to SWTOR and get mauled for a while, get BM and augment it to be functional but look terrible, then play for months to get WH on a new character, to be competitive and not look terrible? Not really.

 

Can I grind it all on my main and put it in legacy gear that costs too much? Yeah, but is that really fun? Not really.

 

Your queue times are going to start getting longer again, even on super servers, because people like me are leaving the game. It's boring and tedious, not fun, to play PvP at 50 if under-geared, and it takes way too long to get geared up.

 

BW is betting on monetizing revolving-door FTP players and subscribers who can't help but open packs and buy mounts/pets/whatever other useless thing, and maybe they'll do well. Your 50 PvP is still going to get worse, though, unless you enjoy having no competition.

Edited November 2, 2012 by arunav

[Ssfbistimg]

I said it before in this post (but I'm sure bioware deleted it)

Only thing ruining regular warzones are the people who can't figure out how to type Inc 3 Grass (as soon as you see them, not after you die). And the people who ignore perfectly timed Inc Calls cause they are too busy going 7 vs 2. Warzones are being ruined by people who dont play the objectives, instead they spend all 15 minutes randomly fighting someone 50M away from the node. They are being ruined by the (insert derogatory comment here) who as soon as you start losing say in chat well its over mine as well farm defender medals.

I know very few premades who do these things (sure might be one or two who do) But if they are then they should be real easy to beat.

[Ordo]

Want to know the best way to avoid being in a pug when going up against a pre-made? Make some friends and get a pre-made together.

 

I've won against pre-mades in a PuG

I've lost against pre-mades in a PuG

I've won against PuGs in a PuG

I've lost against PuGs in a PuG

I've won against pre-mades in a pre-made

I've lost against pre-mades in a pre-made

I've won against PuGs in a pre-made

I've lost against PuGs in a pre-made

 

If it's bothering you that much it's an easy solution that doesn't require whining to the devs. Really and truly, why are we having this conversation?

[LenrocNewDawn]

The poster above me refuses to admit the problem hoping that denial will resolve the issue. I do know to call incoming and I win well above 50% of the war-zones I play but still sometimes I get in a team that is stomped that badly that sucks the desire to play the game out of me. That usually happens when my PuG team is facing a pre-made that should be in ranked WZs but since those are dead they are having their fun in regular ones. I don't blame them at all since I occasionally do it with my friends. I don't think pre-mades are ruining the normal WZs but utterly unbalanced matches do that (sometimes it happens in same faction games so there is no excuse of population balance there).

I don't think separate queues are the answer to the problem either. With the risk of repeating myself, I'll say again, the match-making system should make sure that if in a team it puts a 4 man premade then the opposing team should get one too (mandatory, not ifs and buts). That should give an almost equal footing for the teams. And yes, I know that some pre-mades are better then others but at least the lesser one should put a good enough fight so the match is at least enjoyable.

In all honesty I can live with the actual system but if BW wants to attract subscribers from the F2P base then they should make sure those won't get ROFL stomped the second they set foot in a WZ. But again maybe the F2Pers will have their separate queue (bad idea IMHO but much better then pitting them against fully geared 10months on the game PvPers).

[LenrocNewDawn]

Want to know the best way to avoid being in a pug when going up against a pre-made? Make some friends and get a pre-made together.

 

I've won against pre-mades in a PuG

I've lost against pre-mades in a PuG

I've won against PuGs in a PuG

I've lost against PuGs in a PuG

I've won against pre-mades in a pre-made

I've lost against pre-mades in a pre-made

I've won against PuGs in a pre-made

I've lost against PuGs in a pre-made

 

If it's bothering you that much it's an easy solution that doesn't require whining to the devs. Really and truly, why are we having this conversation?

 

Or you should get 4 more friends and go do ranked. How about that? I bet you don't like me telling you how to play the game but what goes around comes around .

[Larry_Dallas]

I said it before in this post (but I'm sure bioware deleted it)

Only thing ruining regular warzones are the people who can't figure out how to type Inc 3 Grass (as soon as you see them, not after you die). And the people who ignore perfectly timed Inc Calls cause they are too busy going 7 vs 2. Warzones are being ruined by people who dont play the objectives, instead they spend all 15 minutes randomly fighting someone 50M away from the node. They are being ruined by the (insert derogatory comment here) who as soon as you start losing say in chat well its over mine as well farm defender medals.

I know very few premades who do these things (sure might be one or two who do) But if they are then they should be real easy to beat.

 

That's a whole different issue. Other day in a match I joined halfway through 3 sorcs were standing behind a node in NC spamming consumption and self healing. I told them that they do that instead of try to take nodes is why they lose. They answered "I don't care about winning, I just want my 8 medals"

 

Come to think of it, there should be an I just want my 8 medals not to compete bracket.

[Atramar]

Or you should get 4 more friends and go do ranked. How about that? I bet you don't like me telling you how to play the game but what goes around comes around .

 

I would suggest you read your own sig

“Being defeated is often a temporary condition. Giving up is what makes it permanent.”

[Frakkensteinse]

I wish they had some system like LoL. In that game the system ranks you and calculates how good chances you have to win. It aims for 50%. If grouped/premade the system first tries to match you against other premades. If thats not possible it matches the group against solo players (Pugs?) that seem to give a 50% chance to win. While time is running that goal of 50% weathers down so that a game is started. Or so i understand it. MArvellous.

[LenrocNewDawn]

I did not give up. The minute I'll do that you won't hear from me again on the forums or in the game (I find people that threaten to unsub, if not this or that, ridiculous). I can live with how the things are now but that doesn't mean that all is perfect and there is no room for improvement. If you really want to know my view on the issue you should read a couple of posts above.

[cub-lover]

i do a mix of premades and pugging, though i will pug more than premade. and i can tell isntantly wich is a premade an wich is a pug. within the first few minutes of the game.

 

but hte main problem with bads is you give solid advice, or beneficial adivce to that bad's class, and all you eitherg et is abuse or a lot of nerd rage.

 

or even when you say soemthign simple like please can every oen call incs early, and not after you die.

 

though my favoret lack of team spirit is when you suggest to go for both side turrets, and peopel agree, yet half the team goes straight for mid leaving 2-3 people that follow the plan discussed before the game started

[TonyDragonflame]

There is no fun playing in pug against high-ranked guild premade on regular WZ, and I leave these wz's immediately as far as I see it.

[Theodulus]

Try that again pal.

 

8 people is no problem. We can form that for about 6 hours every evening. Problem comes into find 16 people, since even when we're queue'd there isn't a ranked WZ pop. Don't try and tell me I can't do my part, when peeps here are asking that they not even have to find 4 for their easy wins.

PvE people has to find 16 people to do the endgame content so can you. So exactly what is the problem? Is there a magical 8 friend limit in MMOs? Don't come here claiming the queue is bugged for your rwz trading farm. If it certainly was bugged then you should /bug it. I've not seen any other post on this PvP forum claiming the RWZ queue doesn't work.

Pfft. As I said before, and people wonder why America's going down the dumps. We're less and less competitive, less self improving. Instead of raising the masses up to the exceptional level, we lowered the exceptional level down to the masses, then told them they're all special and unique and don't listen when someone tells them that they in fact... suck.

This is offtopic and I don't see how it connects with playing a game on your free time. If I wanted to play competitive professional sports I would not chose a video game with focus on light-sabers. I also don't live on the American continent so I can't tell why USA has been in a moral and economical decline for at least the past 30 years. Other countries' internal politics doesn't interest me. Instead of complaining how about you put in some effort to fix the current situation in your country? Playing a commercial MMO and preaching on its game forum hardly counts as doing something to fix it. If you don't like the situation and don't see a way out you can always move to another country with similar views as your own. I did that for a few years for work and it was a good decision.

[HuaRya]

Since this is THE MOST important thread in this section as it effects PVP as it currently is I'm going to continue to contribute.

 

 

This game should have a separate group and solo queue.

 

1. Group PVP - Consisting of Groups of 2 or more

 

2. Solo PVP - Individual players only

 

 

 

The trolls on this thread are AFRAID this Rational FIX would ever occur as it would be the end of them collecting medals with their buddies in mostly non-ranked PVP. The truly messed up thing is that most of these kids are already MAX'ed out with WH and Augs. The only thing they are doing is preventing newcomers to lvl 50 pvp from ever attaining WH gear. But they know they are doing that.

[UGLYMRJ]

Since this is THE MOST important thread in this section as it effects PVP as it currently is I'm going to continue to contribute.

 

 

This game should have a separate group and solo queue.

 

1. Group PVP - Consisting of Groups of 2 or more

 

2. Solo PVP - Individual players only

 

 

 

The trolls on this thread are AFRAID this Rational FIX would ever occur as it would be the end of them collecting medals with their buddies in mostly non-ranked PVP. The truly messed up thing is that most of these kids are already MAX'ed out with WH and Augs. The only thing they are doing is preventing newcomers to lvl 50 pvp from ever attaining WH gear. But they know they are doing that.

 

It's not that we're against the idea entirely. Options are good. We don't want to suffer longer queue times because you refuse to play the game as it's intended.

 

It's a team based, social, massively multi-player online game.

[cycao]

Since this is THE MOST important thread in this section as it effects PVP as it currently is I'm going to continue to contribute.

 

 

This game should have a separate group and solo queue.

 

1. Group PVP - Consisting of Groups of 2 or more

 

2. Solo PVP - Individual players only

 

 

 

The trolls on this thread are AFRAID this Rational FIX would ever occur as it would be the end of them collecting medals with their buddies in mostly non-ranked PVP. The truly messed up thing is that most of these kids are already MAX'ed out with WH and Augs. The only thing they are doing is preventing newcomers to lvl 50 pvp from ever attaining WH gear. But they know they are doing that.

 

I would be all for this if they had cross server queues, which they don't and from what I know will not be in the future.

[Theodulus]

It's a team based, social, massively multi-player online game.

Yes but most PvPers only seem to be capable of making 4 friends though and do NWZ. They just aren't social enough to do the real endgame PvP where they can better themselves as a team.

[Theodulus]

I would be all for this if they had cross server queues, which they don't and from what I know will not be in the future.

The state this game is in now I doubt cross server queues will help much at all. Level 50 PvP will suffer a slow but certain death due to population issues and non-existing matching algorithms.

[Kalfear]

The state this game is in now I doubt cross server queues will help much at all. Level 50 PvP will suffer a slow but certain death due to population issues and non-existing matching algorithms.

 

kinda gotta agree

 

this fix was needed BEFORE this issue became a glaring issues that was out of control (like it is now)

 

Yesterday I did 10 WZs, 6 as my Commando and 4 as my sage healer

 

Now I could hurt and effect my opponentes and came in over 200k damage in 5 wzs and 300 k in 1.

No one else on my teams had more then 100 k damage in any match because of gear and us facing non stop pre mades.

Im pretty sure at least 4 of those new to pvp players will cancel in near future based on the demoralizing outcomes where try as they might they could not affect the outcome in any fashion. Based on what they were saying.

 

As my sage it was moronic, the first WZ myself and a guild commando healer I was playing with actually helped win a game by cross healing at south in denova. But after that in next 3 warzones neither of us were allowed to even make it to a node.

 

Oh im sure some out there will congradulate each other for smart playing but fact of matter is its not a tactic PUGs can (or will appearently) fight against so teams just gave up. Pre made unbalanced voice communication to create a level of organization was to much for the pug to over come.

 

As for this BS nonsesnse of "oh our ques will be longer if they go pug vrs pug and pre made vrs pre made" BULL PUCKY, thats just a BS excuse by someone that refuses already to play ranked against people on same gear/organization level.

 

BOTH Republic and Imp sides are sick and tired of being roilled by the low class pre mades that cant hack it in ranked. So if there is pre mades rolling pugs on both sides at same time, there is no more extended que times if the pre mades got put against the pre mades. They already there at same time, just game refuses to pit pre made vrs pre made as the TRUE BADS (the premades that roll pugs as to cowardly to go ranked) as they would cry to high hell about not being able to grief those just learning.

 

As I said, I doubt anything gets done now and if it does I doubt it solves issue as this fix needed to be in BEFORE this issue hit this level of severity.

 

Once again EA is months behind the curve and ultimately to slow to act and respond when the issue in its infant stages.

[Brool]

I find it funny how people say they get matched up against premades all day every day, I solo queue only and find that I get matched up against a premade group maybe 25% of the time or less.

 

Quit exaggerating the numbers.