This is not Star Wars

[cronpants]

I was talking to a couple of people about this game and tried to persuade them to sign up and play, but they said the game was "Not star Wars" i asked them to explain and they stated that to them star wars was Episode 1-6 and if the game was set in that time period they would be more than happy to join us all online. they were not interested in Luke, Leah Or Han Solo they just wanted to play Star Wars in the time line of the movies as this is Star Wars as they understand it.

 

I showed them the game and they said that this games story is too foreign from the original movies universe and this just seems like a space MMO with Light Sabers and Blasters.

 

This got me thinking, could this be one of the reasons there is such an exodus from the game is because people expected to play in the universe of Episode 1-6, but found that they where thousands of years before that and that all that they know as Star Wars is no where to be seen?

 

They are not Star Wars fans and should be put down.........

[TheNahash]

So, if people don't support something you do or like you basic reaction is to dismiss them?

 

I never said it was THE reason that people left, read my post.

 

My "friends" have a right to their opinion, if that make them ignorant and close minded then i prefer them over those blindly led.

 

Everyone has a right to their opinion, including those who don't like the time line of the game.

 

That would've been a very hard thing to pull off. LotrO did exactly that and people still felt like like something was missing, because even though you followed the books' time line, you didn't get to experience many of the things you read about in the trilogy or watched happen in the movies. You merely knew that although you "lived" in the same era, key events of the books were happening "somewhere else" while you were busy killing jungle cats.

 

I'm personally fine with the time line of the game. Whatever we needed to know about the time line of the movies has been said. There is an enormous amount of books, tv shows and fan faction that covers pretty much every side of that story. We needed a new story, one that might have been said before but not to the extent that is being experienced in the game.

Edited September 13, 2012 by TheNahash

[Macheath]

The OP's onto something, but I think he and his friends missed the mark just a little.

 

1. This game feels like fantasy. Yes, Star Wars is a "Space Fantasy" or "Space Opera" at it's core, but Lucas (at least in the original trilogy) did a better job of blending the fantasy elements in with the sci-fi setting. Most fans don't view Star Wars as fantasy, unless they know a lot about the EU (and even then, there's a healthy debate about fantasy vs. sci-fi as it relates to Star Wars.)

 

2. The game feels like any other MMO. It might have a Star Wars skin, but a lot of the promises BioWare made to us about the nature of the game have been broken ("heroic" fights that aren't your standard MMO tank n' spank, for example.) Missions are all about killing or retrieving (another broken promise) with even the bonus missions containing "kill xx more of the same thing you're already killing."

 

3. Combat is just like any other MMO that players have become disenfranchised with. Even GW2 has a "dodge" feature, despite still using tab-targeting. This is Star Wars, where Jedi jump/flip/etc all over the place. Bounty Hunters have jet packs they can activate whenever they want, not just as part of predetermined abilities. Yoda fights like he's stuck in a pinball machine. BioWare should have looked to games with more action style combat if they wanted to capture the feel of Star Wars (imagine ToR with TERA's combat style... *drool*).

 

Now, all this said, I think his friends aren't giving ToR a chance. The Old Republic era is almost a carbon copy of Episodes I-III. We even have "separatists," which I always thought was weird. BioWare modeled their bounty hunters after the Fett's, Sith Warriors after Vader, Inquisitors after Palpatine and Maul, Troopers after the clones, etc... I don't know what more his friends could ask for, if these types of superficial appearances are what they care about. In Episodes I-III, the "Republic" is really the same Republic we see in ToR. Slightly corrupt good guys. The Jedi Order in Episodes I-III is full of thousands of Jedi, just like ToR. I don't see what is so irreconcilably different about the timelines, except that there's a ton of Sith in this one (unavoidable if you're going to make them a playable class.)

 

I think his friends really mean, "I want Rebels versus the evil Empire." In other words, Episodes 4-6, not 1-6. Well, that's not going to happen. I doubt there's another MMO set in that time period, ever, to be honest with you. That whole time period is saturated with lore, there's nothing new to learn or explore, no timeline to expand upon with an MMO's worth of material.

 

-Macheath.

[AERHAE]

LOL ! no this time period is great that is not the issue at all.Lots of good things about this game but i think

some issues might be:

 

No minigames no space combat little to no real star wars outfits and no epic war on the planets.

And bad customazation, everything is a money sink,bad class balance and no star wars stories after lvl 50-

thinking about the stories in the raids is total crap, nothing faction vs faction as in both faction do the same raids

so bioware can save time and money.No story world arc after 50, i mean who cares about the dread masters.

People did care about Satele/Revan/Malgus/Vitiate etc but bioware did a very poor job with those characters.

 

No the time period is great but bioware wanted a rail game with no freediom were players are bored to death

in the no immersive box know as fleet.

 

Ding Ding Ding

We have a winner!

[Quraswren]

It's a pretty narrow minded view to call this game "Not SW" just cause it's not in the time of the 6 movies.

 

Especially knows the extended universe thats out there which had moments much better than 1-3 and some on par with movies 4-6.

 

I say it's time for the OP's friends to broaden there horizons. Like it or not, the extend universe is where the SW story continues, not ends.

Edited September 13, 2012 by Quraswren

[Kubernetic]

I was talking to a couple of people about this game and tried to persuade them to sign up and play, but they said the game was "Not star Wars" i asked them to explain and they stated that to them star wars was Episode 1-6 and if the game was set in that time period they would be more than happy to join us all online. they were not interested in Luke, Leah Or Han Solo they just wanted to play Star Wars in the time line of the movies as this is Star Wars as they understand it.

 

I showed them the game and they said that this games story is too foreign from the original movies universe and this just seems like a space MMO with Light Sabers and Blasters.

 

This got me thinking, could this be one of the reasons there is such an exodus from the game is because people expected to play in the universe of Episode 1-6, but found that they where thousands of years before that and that all that they know as Star Wars is no where to be seen?

 

If so, it really has nothing to do with the way the game is built.

 

This game is Star Wars through and through. The fact that people claim it isn't is really down to the most extremely nitpicking customers and sentiments, IMHO.

 

I don't see how the game would be much different if set in the Star Wars universe we know.

 

What, Admiral Ackbar instead of General Varsutra?

 

Round-top astromech droids instead of angled-tops? Front stabilizer wheels instead of rear stabilizer wheels?

 

The armors are such that you can take your Troopers and dress them up either in what is known to be Imperial armors in the Star Wars ABY time line, or you can find other armors that make them look very much like Rebel Alliance troopers.

 

Coruscant. Hoth. Tatooine.

 

Just because Yavin, Bespin and the Endor moon is missing, that means it isn't Star Wars?

 

Pffffft.

[TUXs]

The thing is though: because SWG was a flawed game, it doesn't make SWTOR a good game. Any more than SWTOR being a flawed game makes SWG a good one.

 

But a game with SWTOR and SWG strengths without the flaws of either, would have truly been a GREAT game.

 

*sigh* God do I agree. That's the secret little goldmine Lucas Arts has for when they wanna make some serious $. A hybrid of the 2 games would be a massive success.

[AERHAE]

It's a pretty narrow minded view to call this game "Not SW" just cause it's not in the time of the 6 movies.

 

Especially knows the extended universe thats out there which had moments much better than 1-3 and some on par with movies 4-6.

 

I say it's time for the OP's friends to broaden there horizons. Like it or not, the extend universe is where the SW story continues, not ends.

 

Its Naive to think we all know all the story lines before and after the 6 movie series.

Its common since to relate what we have seen in a move to the same name in Star wars.

Most don't care about the books,they want immersion/features for there money which this game lacks and does not deliver.

You can have the best story in any MMO to date,but if you don't deliver on immersion and features you will start loosing players like we are seeing now and have been seeing for months.

People are not paying for hype,they may buy the game over hype,but hype does not give you immersion or great features in MMO that keeps you logging in every day.

[Nastynas]

Uh, dude, it says Star Wars on the box.

 

They can't just lie like that, they'd get sued.

[Voranis]

Uh, dude, it says Star Wars on the box.

 

They can't just lie like that, they'd get sued.

 

And a box of 'lucky charms' has never brought anyone luck, or charm.

 

Did you really just say that?

[ImperialSun]

For as many people who will want to play Jedi, this is the era to play in. You're far enough back Jedi are "common" and not so close to the Rise Of The Sith that- A) You have the rule of two, and B) You know your Jedi isn't going to get a blaster bolt to the head when the Emperor unleashes his secret order.

 

Who on earth would want to play a Jedi he knew was going to get shot in the back by his trooper in 6 months?

 

And for the poster above me, I think your signature is exaggerating a bit. WAR was a black hole of Fail. It sucked the fail right out of other nearby lameness just to bolster its own fail. It was little more than a first person shooter with a barely functional paperdoll.

 

To the folks talking about SWG. Am I the only one who wants to take half of SWG and just port it over into SWTOR? The housing, space, and tradeskills?[/QUOTE]

 

No, you most cerainly are not the only one

 

Driz

[AscendantOps]

Mandalorians, Jedi and Sith are a rare sight during Luke Skywalker's era. You have many options and roles to choose from and fill in this timeline.

[anstalt]

I definitely agree with the OPs friends: this is not Star Wars as the general public knows it.

 

Is it Star Wars? Of course it is. It fits with the extended universe, has most of the hallmarks of the star wars universe (sabers, blasters, space, aliens etc) and kind of looks the part too.

 

However, if you are a Star Wars fan who has only really seen the movies and played some computer games, then this game simply does not fit with your expectations of the Star Wars universe. In fact, its downright rubbish, for the following reasons:

 

1) Art style. The original movies (4-6) were gritty and felt more realistic. It wasn't a future full of squeeky clean corridors and smart uniforms (star trek....). There was a real sense of being on the frontier, so whilst there was some awesome tech, there was also a basic lifestyle. The art style of TOR completely distances itself from that original feeling to the universe.

 

2) Locations. Again, much of the original movies, and even the newer movies, were set on massive planets and you got a real feeling for the sheer scale of where you were and a good feel for the wilderness. Again, that is almost completely lacking in TOR. Most planets feel linear and too many of them are set on cities. It does not feel like I'm in the same universe.

 

3) Epic Battles. The original films were full of epic battles on an epic scale. Even within those battles, the outcome wasn't often decided by one singular person, but more often there was a feeling of a community coming together to overcome an obstacle, fighting for the common cause. There is none of that in TOR. In TOR, we are our own miniature army. There are no fights with epic scales, only epic creatures.

 

4) Player journeys. Every single star wars movie is ultimately about character growth. Granted, Lucas was rubbish with dialogue but never the less he portrayed the growth of most of his characters. Most people were and remained ordinary people, but were part of something larger. Luke went on his journey from iritating teen to wise jedi master. Solo went of his journey from self-centred smuggler to cheeky nice-guy following a cause. Leia went from spoiled brat to someone calmer and wiser. That does not happen in TOR in my experience. There doesn't seem to be any character growth once you've left your starter planet.

 

 

Anyways, your view may vary and its all just opinions, but personally I only watched the movies (recorded off tv on tape, then vhs, then dvd, then blu-ray....) and played most SW games and I don't feel like I'm living my Star Wars experience. In fact, there are precisely 2 moments in the entirity of the game where I've felt like I'm playing Star Wars:

 

1) Acquiring my lightsaber on Tython and the following fight

2) Warlord Kephess when you kill a bomber and have to use the bomb on the warstrider.

 

Thats it. The rest has been too generic to feel star warsy.

[Jett-Rinn]

To me SWTOR is much more Star Wars than SWG ever was...I guess different people have different opinions of what Star Wars is.

[Quraswren]

Its Naive to think we all know all the story lines before and after the 6 movie series.

 

Whats niave is to think the movies are the end all be all. You don't have to know anything about an extend SW universe to know there is more to it. You might personally want it to be in a certain time period but SWTOR is not in the movie settings. Never has been, never announced as and most likely never will be.

 

Its common since to relate what we have seen in a move to the same name in Star wars.

 

No, whats common sense is people relating to the movies. The game is not a direct extension of those movies but a prequel of sorts. Our expereince may be the movies but if you came into the game thinking SWTOR was that then I'd say you didn't play any of TOR games or read anything about SWTOR MMO before it came out.

 

Most don't care about the books,they want immersion/features for there money which this game lacks and does not deliver.

Point of view only (AKA opinion), we all have one.

 

I'm more attached to my SW toons they I have ever been in other MMO's simply cause of the individual stories. Even when making dialogue choices that mean nothing at the end of the day, it's more fun to answer quest dialogue in a way I want than some automatic text driven read through. The game does deliver, just not to you.

 

You can have the best story in any MMO to date,but if you don't deliver on immersion and features you will start loosing players like we are seeing now and have been seeing for months.

 

It's not immersion that causing people to leave. If anything, it's lack of content to be played.

 

People are not paying for hype,they may buy the game over hype,but hype does not give you immersion or great features in MMO that keeps you logging in every day.

 

Content is what keeps you logging in, not immersion. The game has immersion but the content needs to expand and grow and at the rate we consume it, it's very hard for any new MMO to keep up. It's the same I see in a secert world, or GW2 - We race through the leveling, finish the end game and then grip cause there is no content. Immersion is a very distant second for holding gamers.

 

But of course all that is also my POv and opinion so you see how the rest of the debate might go. Probably no where.

 

However, this game is very much SW. Wanting it to be set in the movie period is one thing but claiming it's not SW cause it's not played out during those times is silly at best.

[Altheran]

Everyone who know a little about Star Wars and who want a MMORPG about Star Wars should be ready to play in another timeline than the movies because they have to know that in the movie timeline there is only 2 siths, and so logic says that there would be no Jedi and no Siths playable... A Star Wars MMO without Jedi/Sith, could it be success ?

[Nastynas]

And a box of 'lucky charms' has never brought anyone luck, or charm.

 

Did you really just say that?

 

I always found a toy in my Lucky Charms box. I consider that lucky.

Edited September 13, 2012 by Nastynas

[liammozz]

This is Star Wars, most definitely Star Wars, just because it isn't primary G-canon doesn't make it anything less, your EU newbies should get to know the lore better, hell just get them to play the KotOR series.

 

is this the same EU that's so far tried to make revan and the emperor, better stronger and more force adept than palpatine and (anikin minus the force adept)

 

i would listen to the EU more if it wasn't written by people who make up characters who have to be the biggest and best

[Urael]

Did you show them the Expanded Universe?

 

^This.

 

Star Wars is more than the 6 movies and has been since before movies 1,2 &, 3.

 

@OP show your friends wookieepedia so they can get a full impression of what Star Wars has become.

[CosmicKat]

"This is not Star Wars"

 

If that statement refers to Star Wars, Empire and RotJ, then it's a bad thing.

 

If it refers to the craptacular prequels, it's a very, very, very good thing.

 

Star Wars is about as mutidimensional as a sheet of paper. It's good vs. evil, nothing more. The only differentiation in "plot" between any of them is just which of the white hats or black hats are the power and which are the underdogs. The timelines of all the various incarnations make no sense at all. Any one of the installments could take place a week or an eon before or after any of the others. Technology (and even fashion) in the SW universe seems to have been in a state of complete stagnation for thousands of years. The whole universe is stuck in a bizarro mix of Tolkein/DnD fantasy, old west cowboys, samurais, Nazis, and Star Trek pseudo-science.

 

As a fan (and not a fanatic) TOR is Star Wars enough for me. It's has much more of a SW feel than the prequels. It's also better written, better acted, and tells a better story.

[Urael]

is this the same EU that's so far tried to make revan and the emperor, better stronger and more force adept than palpatine and (anikin minus the force adept)

 

i would listen to the EU more if it wasn't written by people who make up characters who have to be the biggest and best

 

You obviously are speaking from a point of weakness concerning the entire body of the EU. It matters not "who is more powerful" due to the fact that these are not direct competetors. They are points along a continuum of "history". If Reven is more powerful than Palpatine so what? Reven was long dead before palpatine rose to power. This could be said of Exar Kun, or Darth Bane, points in the continuum of sith history and power. Don't make the all too common mistake of bashing something about which you are ignorant and you don't understand. Many do this in more than just discussing Star Wars.

[ImperialSun]

To me SWTOR is much more Star Wars than SWG ever was...I guess different people have different opinions of what Star Wars is.

 

Yeah it is very interesting...I have the completely opposite view.

 

For me, SWG was great because it allowed you to be that unknown farmer or low level criminal, it allowed you to be an Imperial loyalist or a rebel sympathiser and the same time as being the unknown musician or crafter or businessman....it was the fact that you could play a normal person in SW universe and make your own way that was so appealing.

 

For me, particularly the original saga was all about the normal people coming together and finding a way, it was about conquering insurmountable odds through the whole being more than a sum of the component parts.

 

When everything kicked off in Ep 4....did they do what they need to with what they had? Yes. Did they call the Power Rangers? No.

 

SWTOR by going down the "You are the hero" route dilutes this feeling for me. In a single player RPG devs can get away with it but in an MMO I feel like Robocop rather than being a cog in the wheels of a galactic civil war...

 

Like I said, very interesting what Star Wars "means" to different people

 

Driz

[Swerto]

First of all

 

1-3 is trash, anyone who says otherwise is under the age of 13 or not a star wars fan at all.

 

Second of all, SWG was set in the GCW era, and we all know how that turned out.

 

Nobody could play jedi, sot hey *****ed.

 

Then everyone coudl play jedi, and everyone *****ed.

 

GCW era while awesome does not let everyone play the 'iconic stuff' in star wars.

 

In an era like this people can roleplay pretty much whatever they want, do whatever they want. It's WIDE open.

 

 

 

And if you REALLY want to get them interested in the era, get them a copy of Knights of the Old Republic to play on their PC, i's like $5 on steam. It's their choice if thy want to play the incomplete game KOTOR2 or not.

[Swerto]

Yeah it is very interesting...I have the completely opposite view.

 

For me, SWG was great because it allowed you to be that unknown farmer or low level criminal, it allowed you to be an Imperial loyalist or a rebel sympathiser and the same time as being the unknown musician or crafter or businessman....it was the fact that you could play a normal person in SW universe and make your own way that was so appealing.

 

For me, particularly the original saga was all about the normal people coming together and finding a way, it was about conquering insurmountable odds through the whole being more than a sum of the component parts.

 

When everything kicked off in Ep 4....did they do what they need to with what they had? Yes. Did they call the Power Rangers? No.

 

SWTOR by going down the "You are the hero" route dilutes this feeling for me. In a single player RPG devs can get away with it but in an MMO I feel like Robocop rather than being a cog in the wheels of a galactic civil war...

 

Like I said, very interesting what Star Wars "means" to different people

 

Driz

 

See, SWG had this.

 

RP playground that was unrivaled by any others when it comes to Star Wars.

 

What it lacked was non ****** gameplay, with the exception of space combat, which was amazing.

 

It was a sandbox with bad gameplay, such bad gameplay they completely redid it three times and it was still not good. It was playable sure, but it just couldn't compete with MMO's on the market, by 2010 it was extremely dated and it was obvious. It was unresponsive, animations bled into eachother, sounds bugged out, the graphics were deplorable, and your options wre limited since NGE as to what you could do.

 

What SWG had going for it was literally the greatest RP playground in existance, you could literally do anything. That is why a lot of people stayed, because they could decorate homes, make cities, use storyteller stuff, be anything they wanted to be. The issue with that was lore wouldn't let you do whatever you wanted, becuase the GCW era is locked up pretty tight for a lot of types of roleplay. There is no room for 100 or so Jedi to be running around after the purge.

 

This game on the other hand has amazing gameplay, it's graphics are great, it's animations are great, everything about it is great. IT's got the best 1-50 leveling of any game, it's got good content at the end (just not enough). But it doens't have that RP playground aspect of SWG. You're stuck doing the same kind of RP you were doing in other MMORPGs, but hey star wars!

 

It's cool, I liked both games. SWG was my first MMORPG, I can look at it objectively. I went to bigger and better things after it, but TOR's my end result and where I'm sticking until something comes aorund that interests me more, and then hey TOR's still free to play.

[Rayla_Felana]

First of all

 

1-3 is trash, anyone who says otherwise is under the age of 13 or not a star wars fan at all.

 

Second of all, SWG was set in the GCW era, and we all know how that turned out.

 

Nobody could play jedi, sot hey *****ed.

 

Then everyone coudl play jedi, and everyone *****ed.

 

GCW era while awesome does not let everyone play the 'iconic stuff' in star wars.

 

In an era like this people can roleplay pretty much whatever they want, do whatever they want. It's WIDE open.

 

 

 

And if you REALLY want to get them interested in the era, get them a copy of Knights of the Old Republic to play on their PC, i's like $5 on steam. It's their choice if thy want to play the incomplete game KOTOR2 or not.

 

Reading this makes me wonder if you are the 13 year old.