remember back at launch? early access?

[Goretzu]

actually everyone was demanding more capacities on servers. But BW chose to add a ****load of servers. Even a monkey could have foreseen that most of them will become "ghosttowns" after a while.

 

That increasing the capacity is possible, showed that they did it some weeks after launch.

 

We have around 90 EU servers where just one dozen was Standard tonight at 8pm cet and all thers were light.

 

seriously epic fail.

 

Even most of the early access servers are Light in PT now.

[Stalkobot]

It was smooth alright. So smooth infact that i can still see the effects of it 4,5 months later on my server. It's great to be standing alone at fleet on peak time wondering were all those servers really needed just to be safe.

 

To be fair for a MMO it was incredibly smooth and trouble free for most (some had monster problems though) The lack of population stems from the BW design of a singleplayer "mmo"

[Enochx]

To be fair for a MMO it was incredibly smooth and trouble free for most (some had monster problems though) The lack of population stems from the BW design of a singleplayer "mmo"

 

I disagree. I think there are only two problems with this game. ONE is it is only 5 months old. TWO is there are too many servers with population thinned out. But I had this problem in WoW as well. I joined a server that had just opened up so I could participate in the whole anh quin thing (or whatever it is called...you know what I mean. the vanilla end game thingy) and stayed on that server. But the population soon dropped from high to medium. I could never find any groups. So I quit playing. Came back a few months later and joined a high to full server. Best idea ever.

 

Thats why I try to tell people, just bite the bullet and go to a high populated server. It will be the best thing you could ever do. I did it in this game and am extremly happy.

[patjd]

Doesn't matter this game is over once John Carter Online goes live.

[V-Serp]

So Bioware listened to the players on the servers so it's the players fault. Okay.

 

Now tell me whose fault it is that Bioware ignores the players on class balance, separating queues, lowering the gear grind, raising comm caps (or eliminating them altogether) for wz comms, beta tester feedback, PTS feedback, raising leveling speed on alts, etc. etc.

 

Seems to me you biodrones just selectively choose to blame everyone besides Bioware as often as you can.

[Enochx]

i already said I wasn't blaming anyone. cause and effect. there's plenty of other threads to go rant in. Why do it here as well?

[Stalkobot]

So Bioware listened to the players on the servers so it's the players fault. Okay.

 

Now tell me whose fault it is that Bioware ignores the players on class balance, separating queues, lowering the gear grind, raising comm caps (or eliminating them altogether) for wz comms, beta tester feedback, PTS feedback, raising leveling speed on alts, etc. etc.

 

Seems to me you biodrones just selectively choose to blame everyone besides Bioware as often as you can.

 

Actually BW didnt listen to anyone, they just did what Bioware do and made a single player game with cinematics and voice over with the smallest of cues to multiplayer functionality and called it a MMO. They should have released this for the xbox, it would have been a runaway success but as it stands it has no right to be called a MMO as the multiplayer interactions are minimal and far from massive.

[Kthx]

Seems to me you biodrones just selectively choose to blame everyone besides Bioware as often as you can.

 

So did players not scream for more servers in the beginning, when there were queues?

[Jackobite]

5 Months in and we still got a ton of subscribers paying to hate /p

 

@op No I hated that stupid drip feed launch, Its the last time im getting sucked into all the early access pre order nonsense.

[Saregon]

Remember when?

 

...at least that's what the topic title reminded me of...

Edited May 16, 2012 by Saregon

[Nyteblades]

So did players not scream for more servers in the beginning, when there were queues?

 

Many of us didnt i held in there even with huge ques. Stayed with the same server from early access till now. And it still died out. Its now a waste land.

[Ashlian]

I agree as well.. Thank you for using the term "extreme" as you described the casuals that are loving this game too.

 

Yes, because by all means you speak for everyone who can't be described as "extreme casuals." Having played EQ1 from launch, nearly the epitome of the anti-casual game, and EQ2 at the "casual raider" level, I am perfectly happy to say, with over 14 years of MMO experience, that I, who play something like 8 hours a day given that I'm now disabled and have nothing but time, love this game. Do I like the short sightedness that caused them to spread the population over way, way too many servers? Of course not. But please don't tar everyone who likes the game with the same brush. The reasons you probably liked other games are likely some of the reasons I didn't touch them with a ten foot pole (WoW, Diablo and Guild Wars, I'm looking at you).

 

And frankly, I wouldn't play EQ1 again for love or money. I don't need the stress of a job when I'm playing a game. For those that like challenge to that extreme, I am surprised you ever subbed to this game at all.....seriously, when did they ever advertise it as being for anyone but the people who enjoyed relatively leisurely, story driven, non-sandbox type games? And amazingly.....that describes a lot of people who aren't "extreme" casuals. Also people who are willing to give a brand new MMO up until the first paid expac to prove itself. Rather like the time those other successful MMO's of the past had....I can't think of one that launched without a raft of bugs and a dearth of major features later added in. But of course.....all anyone ever discusses is the product after it's been out for years. I would also rate this as about the smoothest MMO launch I've seen. If people have overinflated expectations (barring the server populations, that's entirely on BW to fix that mistake), then they need a little memory jog to remind them exactly how crazy bad some of these games were initially.

 

If I hear paid beta one more time I think I'll puke. EQ2 launched with an abysmally bad combat system and some stellarly incompetent decisions regarding crafting and gameplay that weren't fixed for well past six months and it lasted for what, six or seven years before it's descent to F2P? It's funny how all these games of the past managed to survive the ennui of the hardcore, because I guarantee anyone racing to endgame in SWTOR and bored brainless by everything ingame can have found little to recommend virtually any other non-pvp centric game at launch. PVP-centric, well, you're talking apples and oranges and you can't truly compare them at all. I'd love to know what perfect games (compared at LAUNCH) people think SWTOR can't compare to. Other than server pop, which I freely and unreservedly, as the OP stated, believe they screwed up on. Other than that, it compares very favorably with the content available at launch for endgame with pretty much any major MMO on record. Not to say I don't have a long list of things I'd like improved.....just I'm apparently as happy as the OP to wait on them.

[LeonBraun]

They didn't open up all those servers until people started complaining about que times. The public demanded more servers and the public got them. of course hindsight is 20/20. It sucks, I know, but the best descision I made was about a month or two ago I left my two high level characters and started over on a highly populated server. I did my homework first, I monitored my new server for all times that I am usually on. and I promise you dude, it was the best thing I ever did. I hardly ever have trouble finding groups for heroics, FP's or anything. pvp que up within a couple of mins. its great. best thing I ever did. Just do it. Don't wait for mergers. Because what if you wait for mergers and they run into a major bug and push the mergers back even more? if you re-roll NOW you won't be sorry.

 

They needed a few more then they launched with... they never needed 150 servers.

[Wolfeisberg]

So did players not scream for more servers in the beginning, when there were queues?

 

You are assuming that Bioware would not have opened up more servers if no customer said anything. Their own data was what was screaming at them to open up more servers. You know, the data that showed 2 million people, lots with extra time to play because of holiday break, wanted to play pretty much as the same time , and was creating massive queues, upwards of 2+ hours. I'm sure Bioware saw that and didn't feel it was right to make people wait in 2+ hour queues for several weeks when people go back to work and school after the holiday break.

[rbkrbk]

So did players not scream for more servers in the beginning, when there were queues?

 

Seriously, can you not read? Your argument has been addressed in at least 3 posts before yours.

[Kubernetic]

Indeed, the early access and staggered infusion into the game was a great plan. People didn't like it, but they liked that the servers stayed up and running.

 

The one mistake was (perhaps) listening to the QQ on the forums about queue times. I wonder what would have happened if BW had just said, "Tough, wait in the queues" and not created the new server numbers.

 

But... bygones... transfers will be here soon and those who are stranded on low-population servers, don't want to re-roll on a higher pop server, and are actually serious about the game will have some salvation.

[Encima]

I am enjoying the game, but definitely it would help to take care of underpopulated servers and future-proof it by adding cross-server warzones.

[Bloodstealer]

Why would you assume I have no lvl 50's? Why would you assume I only play once or twice a week? You assumptions are wrong....you probably shouldn't assume anything again.

 

As for the servers thing you said, I am just telling you how it happened. The forums were flooded with "we need more servers. these ques are rediculous" and lo and behold more servers were added. I am not blaming anyone, simply stating facts. It's relativity. Server ques lead to more servers lead to sparsely populated servers in the future.

 

Don't get mad at me because I am reciting history.

 

And why were the forums flooded with cries for more.. Gees what would you be doing when you have just spent a wad of cash.. some people one heck of alot of cash on that silly Collectors Edition (how many regret that now though).. they wanna log in and play....

Who decided on setting server caps so low... who decided to add a multitude of servers all at once instead of raising server caps (which they did after anyway)... hmmm yeah its all the customers fault, nothing to do with the management of the servers, and alien concept that emerged, that actually launch and athe days that followed things might get busy around here.....

On the flip side even busy servers from launch are now so sparsily populated but still they refuse to acknowldeg the real issues that there are simply too many servers and its has been having a large impact on sub retention.

 

Personally I have my own little theory on why they wanted to thin it out so much and continue to do so.. you only have to look at the game performance in heavily crowded fleets, in 8v8 WZ's and the Illum disaster... why then wouldn't they seek to merge and close servers as the demand is simply not there...

Lets be honest are many players going to transfer from one dead server to another dead server... no the few servers that do reach heavy are just going to see an influx of movers (whether it be a free transfer or paid) and the queue times are gunna peak again... and so the record replays itself....in the meantime those that get left behind for whatever reason will simply upsticks and move onto another game, loosing more subs.

Then the Fatman's etc that are peaked will start to see perfomance spiking and the forums will be transformed again... ooh wait no, the forums attitude will be just the same as it is now I guess.

 

The only thing I can see them doing by way of further damage limitation is to block off certain servers from having any kind of transfer free or paid, or maybe further mitrroring will be implemented, so you still end up with that empty feeling...then again I haven't seen much evidence of logic so far from this crew...

Either way the longer they delay trying to sort this mess out, the more subs get leaked... soon even the busy servers will begin to thin out due to the highly repetive grind and boredom factor

 

And pleaaasse none of that "its coming early summer", that is nothing but a carrot phrase...and could still mean its months away still.. not the 21st of June as one poster tried to argue yesterday

 

Anyhow, think ima gunna go log in... only 30 days sub left... may as well go and congregate with the other ghosts on the fleet

[Nyla]

Bioware did what was needed for the launch but failed to handle the next part, the predictable loss of population.

 

I'm still amazed by thoses so called MMO veterans that think themselves as the core audience of MMOs but who failed to change of servers after the first month when we started to see population loss.

 

Again, yes I blame Bioware for not being ready at that time for transfers/merges but as they didn't gave any hint of such systems after the first month, why thoses people stayed on their servers ?

[Stovokor]

Bioware basically did not have contingency plan.

 

1. Even if you listen to QQ, as a MMO developer Bioware would have known that these games tend to spike at launch and then usually stabilize. Players on the forums were also mentioning exactly this. How could they be oblivious or not have contingency for this happening

 

2. The SWTOR servers can't handle many users or concurrent user. This is a flaw that compounded the problem ... just compare max population on these servers to shards from other MMO's. Why are the ques even forming with these population numbers.

 

3. They overreacted with the opening up of too many new servers. Staggered additions would have sufficed or managing the expectations and explaining the implications to the player-base. No liaison / management made that communication. Much of Bioware early moves were reactionary not only in server space but also in regards to Class QQ

 

4. Legacy - this piece of fluff basically complicated matter for merging servers. Again declining numbers did not happen all of a sudden and they had no clue while coming out with legacy ?

 

 

I still believe in this game and comebacks but Bioware needs to prioritize now and move way faster then current speed in dealing with population issues. And don't waste anymore resources on LEGACY ... until the game population is stable and has core content like Ranked Warzones / Open PvP. Still time to reinvent many of the game systems ( as seen from other publishers ) and make it happen. Down the road, If SWTOR has a compelling gameplay experience, adding an inducement like 1 month free playtime for reactiving subs could compel many players to come back to an improved game.

Edited May 16, 2012 by Stovokor

[NasherUK]

This was THE smoothest launch ever.

 

Compare it to Diablo 3's launch. Servers down, errors on login, most people didn't even get to play and a lot probably won't for weeks

Edited May 16, 2012 by NasherUK

[chaosdefined]

This was THE smoothest launch ever.

 

Compare it to Diablo 3's launch. Servers down, errors on login, most people didn't even get to play and a lot probably won't for weeks

 

Diablo 3 isn't an MMO. Mind you this is barely one itself.

 

Perhaps BW should look into hiring people who have worked on successful MMO's and multiplayer games...as opposed to bringing on teams from MMO's that failed to last more than a year on a subscription model.

[mothear]

The issue is that there is technology out there that can bring all those players together but BW is too busying picking their nose and working on head gear bugs.

 

Oh you mean like that used in other games that lead to threads like this;

 

http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/forum/topic/2986509135

[ACE-GIRL]

Mark my words! SWTOR is dead once Super Pi Pi Brothers online goes live!

[GalacticKegger]

Why would you assume I have no lvl 50's? Why would you assume I only play once or twice a week? You assumptions are wrong....you probably shouldn't assume anything again.

 

As for the servers thing you said, I am just telling you how it happened. The forums were flooded with "we need more servers. these ques are rediculous" and lo and behold more servers were added. I am not blaming anyone, simply stating facts. It's relativity. Server ques lead to more servers lead to sparsely populated servers in the future.

 

Don't get mad at me because I am reciting history.

+10: this ... this ... and more this! Instead of patiently waiting out the 3+ weeks it took BW to fix those queue issues, the cranky mob got their wish. This is a classic example of "be careful what you wish for."

 

The perception that Bioware isn't listening is unfounded. I think they learned their lesson from this, and finally grew a disdain for kissing the collective glutials of onery grandstanders. Good for them. They are paying attention and quietly fixing things, not that ranters can see this past their own petulance.