Why non-stop alt leveling will fail.

[Darkulous]

I'd rather level an alt than spam fleet for groups. Once the LFD hits, I'll be spending a lot more time with my end game toons.

[YeknomStun]

..... Edited April 25, 2012 by YeknomStun

[Quintan]

Simply by your statement i can see that you are not a mmo old school. The journey in all mmos is one of the best things about them, even in wow but people mostly ignore it these days simply to do raiding thus the way bliz are giving out 80's like candy to enforce that feeling amongst there hardcore subscribers.

 

And to state that no serious guild would take a player that loves story and lore is so wrong its beyond discussing. Endgame is a part of the game, not the whole game just a part of it. But do enjoy D3 toodle pip.

 

Whatever you say lol... You took my words out of context btw and you're quote merits no other response.

 

again, you're assuming that this game was made for the hardcore mmo guilds/gamers.

 

that's like playing hello kitty online and expecting end game raids(or whatever else they have there) is what everyone is interested in.

 

this is a theme park mmo, always has, always will.

 

im sorry that you confused this game to be something that it isn't(assumptions suck, but there was plenty of info given out before release to show you this wasn't going to be that kind of game).

 

i do hope you enjoy diablo 3. i played the beta this weekend and ill tell you that it is NOT fun lol. maybe if you want to play it on a console, since the whole game's design/mechanics where changed to fit a controller pad and is not very keyboard/mouse friendly.

 

i just hope you dont start assuming too much. . .like you did with this game.

 

I agree with you SWTOR isn't for HardCore players but I didn't assume anything about this game it's just not a complete MMO by a long shot.

While you are not as clueless as some here I have to say that i disagree about Diablo 3. That game is simple yet so amazingly fun and entertaining!, The "story" is way more fun than anything in SWTOR.

Edited April 22, 2012 by Quintan

[Vlaxitov]

why not?

 

just because YOU play an MMO to join raids and such doesn't mean everyone has to.

 

Right, and just because chess is a 2 player game doesen't mean you can't play it solo too but thats not what I'm saying.

 

When you subscribe to a mmo, you're trading off what single player games do better to "join raids and such."

 

Thats why not.

 

You say theres too many closed minded people on the forums because why? Oh yeah because they don't agree with you and thats what you call "open minded" of course.

Edited April 22, 2012 by Vlaxitov

[notebene]

[Opinion]

 

For me it's about the journey. I've never understood the rush to end game, and the recent trend to flatten leveling curves.

 

When people talk about 'old school' all the time, I cringe a bit. I don't like corpse runs, xp loss and de-leveling on death, overly hard play that requires big groups to get anything done. I don't miss 'any' of that.

 

I do miss the leveling process, however. Quests really helped with that by the time WoW got their hands on it. DAoC had 'some' of that every level. There were 3 or 4 you could do, maybe get you 25% through, then back to grinding. I always thought then that a game should 'constantly' have quests like that.

 

(not that I also don't have a place in my heart for a sand box, but that is another thread)

 

What then happened is they started flattening the curves, to the point where we have something like Rift now, which was just crazy. I wanted to do 'all' the quests, because that's what I like to do, and between that and rifts and such, everything was grey. I maxed out and had several zones to go.

 

There's a little of that here, thankfully it's a bit slower, but I think it could be slower still. I think the first 15 are fine, but it really needs to get steep from there.

 

[again, opinion] I think the 'end game is the beginning' came out of two things:

 

1. Gamers that have been around awhile, and many of them playing WoW for 'years', got used to just being at cap, and getting lots of new things to do. Now many of them just expect to start up a new game, get to the end, and have the same amount of stuff to do, otherwise why not just do that other thing?

 

2. The newer generation of players trying out MMOs are coming from consoles, and that's 'awesome'! Welcome! I don't want PC gaming to die, and for that to happen, we need to get your excited to try it out and stay! Having said that, you are used to plopping down with Call of Duty et al and 'bam', you are awesome (other than physically 'skilling' up to learn the game mechanics and get better at it as you play). Those games are like getting a maxed out character on e-bay for an MMO and off you go. So they look at us old foggies, and wonder why we want to play a game where our CoD character comes in naked, and we really don't get to 'start playing' for 5 months.

 

I have no answers. Just some opinions there, and where I stand relative to what I like. Carry on folks.

[Darkulous]

All that new content they just released was for leveling because that's all this game is about, right? Everyone plays their own way, and there is plenty of content to allow that.

 

I agree with you that everyone plays their own way and I'm happy with the content that BW has provided. The only issue I've had with BW thus far is the lack of features, specifically LFD. The great content that BW has given us is limited, at the moment, by several population factors. Server population specifically.

[Quintan]

Right, and just because chess is a 2 player game doesen't mean you can't play it solo too but thats not what I'm saying.

 

When you subscribe to a mmo, you're trading off what single player games do better to "join raids and such."

 

Thats why not.

 

It's just the large number of MMO new comers that play SWTOR, they just don't understand... yet...

 

It takes more than a year to really get to know the ins and outs of how Massive - Multi-Player games work.

 

That being said SWTOR is about 69% MMO, 31% instanced single player game.

[Quintan]

[Opinion]

 

For me it's about the journey. I've never understood the rush to end game, and the recent trend to flatten leveling curves.

 

When people talk about 'old school' all the time, I cringe a bit. I don't like corpse runs, xp loss and de-leveling on death, overly hard play that requires big groups to get anything done. I don't miss 'any' of that.

 

I do miss the leveling process, however. Quests really helped with that by the time WoW got their hands on it. DAoC had 'some' of that every level. There were 3 or 4 you could do, maybe get you 25% through, then back to grinding. I always thought then that a game should 'constantly' have quests like that.

 

(not that I also don't have a place in my heart for a sand box, but that is another thread)

 

What then happened is they started flattening the curves, to the point where we have something like Rift now, which was just crazy. I wanted to do 'all' the quests, because that's what I like to do, and between that and rifts and such, everything was grey. I maxed out and had several zones to go.

 

There's a little of that here, thankfully it's a bit slower, but I think it could be slower still. I think the first 15 are fine, but it really needs to get steep from there.

 

[again, opinion] I think the 'end game is the beginning' came out of two things:

 

1. Gamers that have been around awhile, and many of them playing WoW for 'years', got used to just being at cap, and getting lots of new things to do. Now many of them just expect to start up a new game, get to the end, and have the same amount of stuff to do, otherwise why not just do that other thing?

 

2. The newer generation of players trying out MMOs are coming from consoles, and that's 'awesome'! Welcome! I don't want PC gaming to die, and for that to happen, we need to get your excited to try it out and stay! Having said that, you are used to plopping down with Call of Duty et al and 'bam', you are awesome (other than physically 'skilling' up to learn the game mechanics and get better at it as you play). Those games are like getting a maxed out character on e-bay for an MMO and off you go. So they look at us old foggies, and wonder why we want to play a game where our CoD character comes in naked, and we really don't get to 'start playing' for 5 months.

 

I have no answers. Just some opinions there, and where I stand relative to what I like. Carry on folks.

 

Nice Book...

 

It's clear you have plenty of time on your hands to do lots of journeying around so get to it.

[RavenGlenn]

With that said, I have yet to meet a majority of persons more interested in leveling an alt than that of the populace that's more interested in achieving max level (quickly) and playing end game.

 

Go play City of Heroes/Villains. Congratulations. You have now met a majority of persons more interested in leveling an alt.

[Vlaxitov]

That being said SWTOR is about 69% MMO, 31% instanced single player game.

 

69% The burning crusade, 31% kotor 3?

[fallenthorn]

I have been playing the game since the weekend beta and I still do not have a level 50 character. I have multiple alts ranging from 40 -20 of different classes so i can see what their story is about.

 

Why should i care about endgame? Its there but it will not go anywhere and i can take my time to enjoy the game.

 

 

So i guess that makes me one of those that perfers the story and hanging out with friends. Oh dang...does that mean i have a life?

[Quintan]

I have been playing the game since the weekend beta and I still do not have a level 50 character. I have multiple alts ranging from 40 -20 of different classes so i can see what their story is about.

 

Why should i care about endgame? Its there but it will not go anywhere and i can take my time to enjoy the game.

 

 

So i guess that makes me one of those that perfers the story and hanging out with friends. Oh dang...does that mean i have a life?

 

I think the more important question here is "Why do you pay a monthly sub to do something you can do for free?"

[Sanxxx]

Quote: Originally Posted by Quintan

All the people in this thread that say the "journey" & the "story" is what drives them are single player gamers and obviously not experienced MMO players. No experienced MMO guild concerned with PvE progress will ever want the player that wants "story" and "journey" in their raid team that's for sure, maybe as friends or family of a raider but that's about it. End-game is supposed to be the biggest part of the game in an MMO but that's not the real problem SWTOR is facing today imo, people are just getting bored of having no one to do "anything" with since a majority(definitely more than half) of the servers are very light pop.

 

Your post reads exactly like that of the typical WOW raider.

 

Experienced MMORPG players know that it's about the journey, but perhaps you meant MMO and not MMORPG.

 

As for end game. ' is supposed to be the biggest part of the game' , who says ? Guilds can group and raid at any point along the journey. Progression happens from Level 1 and continues , it doesn't start at 50.

 

Can't disagree with your final statement we just disagree about how we got there, end result is the same as far as SWTOR goes.

[MWidowmaker]

Why play a mmo and not just stick with single player games then?

because i have friends who feel the same way I do in the MMO duh

 

take your blinders off

[DieAlteHexe]

All the people in this thread that say the "journey" & the "story" is what drives them are single player gamers and obviously not experienced MMO players. No experienced MMO guild concerned with PvE progress will ever want the player that wants "story" and "journey" in their raid team that's for sure, maybe as friends or family of a raider but that's about it. End-game is supposed to be the biggest part of the game in an MMO but that's not the real problem SWTOR is facing today imo, people are just getting bored of having no one to do "anything" with since a majority(definitely more than half) of the servers are very light pop.

 

That being said, PvE is so bad in this game that endGame doesn't really matter to me. I'll stick to pvp until D3..

 

LOL! Well, I guess you have it all sussed out, or think you do.

 

The whole "end-game" is supposed to be the biggest part is well, I won't use the word I'm thinking but it has to do with the excretion of bovines. Now, it CAN be, sure. It IS for many and often ends up resulting in discontent and stress for some. As for this "experienced MMO" business...been at these things since they cost nine bucks an hour to play online. I've done the UO gank-fodder, EQ leveling, the raiding, I've done DAoC RvR, I've played a LOT of MMOs and have plenty of "experience" but I don't deign to judge others or hide behind some "well, if you were EXPERIENCED you'd see that I am right" strawman.

 

And balderdash to the "...not on their raid team". This is patently false. Many guilds have raid teams of folks that aren't JUST gaming to raid. They enjoyed their way up to raid level(s). Precisely what many are doing here.

 

You know what I wish people would do? I wish they would have the courage to say:

 

I don't like PvE or leveling or PvP or whatever it is and not try to pass off their preferences and/or opinions as fact. Have the guts to stand up and claim your own position without trying to make it a sweeping generalisation to hide behind along with the ever popular "chuck a strawman out there".

 

Meh, I can dream.

[GreySix]

because i have friends who feel the same way I do in the MMO duh

 

take your blinders off

 

For me, only an MMO allows me to play an RPG cooperatively with my wife.

 

Show me a single player Star Wars game that will allow me to do that, and I'll dump this one like a bad habit.

[DieAlteHexe]

I think the more important question here is "Why do you pay a monthly sub to do something you can do for free?"

 

An even more important question: What business is it of yours what others do with their time or money?

[Quintan]

An even more important question: What business is it of yours what others do with their time or money?

LoL mad much?

[Vardlokkur]

I just want to say that I do not have any alts. I do however have about 20 mains across three servers.

[DieAlteHexe]

LoL mad much?

 

I'm not mad. I'm just hoisting you on your own petard.

 

Valid question remains.

[FourTwent]

I agree with you SWTOR isn't for HardCore players but I didn't assume anything about this game it's just not a complete MMO by a long shot.

While you are not as clueless as some here I have to say that i disagree about Diablo 3. That game is simple yet so amazingly fun and entertaining!, The "story" is way more fun than anything in SWTOR.

 

ill give you that. there are a lot of features missing that some would say 'makes it an mmo'. the game was pushed WAY too early. . .or took WAY too long to develop different areas of the game lol. whatever the case it is true, the game needed more features, and those features needed to be fully developed(gtn anyone?)

 

diablo never was my cup of tea. even in the d3 beta im trying to use WADS to move and tab to target lol. but i do think that changing the way the game was, in order to adapt it for consoles is a huge mistake. but i see why they did it in a way. why make the 'old version' which im sure was ready way before they decided to make a console version, and then have to change the game specifically for the console version. then having to balance(and update/upgrade) two entirely different games essentially. but come on, its blizzard you know they can afford it.

 

are you trolling by trying to compare diablo 3 story with swtor story? its like your whole post was logical and reasonable up until that point XD.

 

im sure i dont need to say it, but swtor story is leaps and bounds ahead of diablo 3 story. not even focusing that swtor has 8 stories with slight variations(light/dark). . .the story for the class's starter planets are SO much better than what was showing in the diablo 3 beta(demo)

 

 

When you subscribe to a mmo, you're trading off what single player games do better to "join raids and such."

 

Thats why not.

 

You say theres too many closed minded people on the forums because why? Oh yeah because they don't agree with you and thats what you call "open minded" of course.

 

 

why is there any trading that needs to be done? do you realize how selfish and entitled this generation of gamers is? you play a game to enjoy it, like we all do. who am i to tell you how to enjoy this game or not.

 

that's not what MMO means, or what they are. an MMO is a 'living', typically persistent, world that everyone participates in. there's a whooooooooole bunch of playstyles and aspects that goes into a big massive MMO like this.

 

- you have the crafter that makes consumables and gear for people who will buy them

- you have the hardcore raiders that figure out the best way to take down certain raids, passing down the knowledge making it easier for new players to enjoy the content

- you have the explorers that go out and find all the nice little secrets like datacrons, hunting/hatching the eggs. passing down the knowledge

 

this list goes on and on with ALL types of players. you have no right to tell someone else how they should or should not play and enjoy the game. simple as that. . .it has nothing with not 'agreeing with me'. good try kid

[DieAlteHexe]

I just want to say that I do not have any alts. I do however have about 20 mains across three servers.

 

I guess I do too. My "main" is whomever I happen to be playing currently.

[Elkesai]

In this particualr game, if you've space-barred through all the dialogue and leveled as quickly as possible, you haven't actually experienced the game.

[Vardlokkur]

All the people in this thread that say the "journey" & the "story" is what drives them are single player gamers and obviously not experienced MMO players. No experienced MMO guild concerned with PvE progress will ever want the player that wants "story" and "journey" in their raid team that's for sure, maybe as friends or family of a raider but that's about it. End-game is supposed to be the biggest part of the game in an MMO but that's not the real problem SWTOR is facing today imo, people are just getting bored of having no one to do "anything" with since a majority(definitely more than half) of the servers are very light pop.

 

That being said, PvE is so bad in this game that endGame doesn't really matter to me. I'll stick to pvp until D3..

 

Pax Imperious/Pax Dominus would strongly disagree with you.

[Ricktur]

I have heard time and time, again and again by unbiased players, that they're not concered with a story line, it's the end game that's the beginning of the game.

 

With a casual player, we'll say they have roughly 3 hours of play time per day, averaging roughly 15-20 hours per week, at an average of 3-4 levels per week.

 

these two quotes are the truth of the matter