Fexhie Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 (edited) I want to see a screenie with this information... Until then I am going to assume you are full of ****. How about a video? I am sure it will be a video of you owning a bunch of people that are NOT anywhere near an objective.... This is my experience with superstars like yourself, great you can get top damage, too bad the objective is not to do more damage to the other team, for that you want open pvp. Really? You seriously are calling him out on that? The lowest ranked player on the other team is going to get more medals than the top loser simply because thats the way the system works. It will be like this everymatch, There are a few situations where this might not be the case but for the most part it is. Being on a losing team gives junk rewards, thats a fact and I don't think anyone with any sense is disputing that. However I am of the opinion this is better than how it was, so I am fine with it. Edited April 13, 2012 by Fexhie Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TUXs Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 You honestly want to be rewarded for failing!? How about we just cry until BW just gives us the endgame armour without having to do anything but walk into the operation and say boo to the bosses till they give up the shiney's. You are the 99%, don't want to work for rewards just get everything handed to you because you wanted to play. As a note, I am not an elitest nor am I in any way a PVP God, I am a mediocre player and I'm not crying about anything. Well anything other than there are way to many servers for the amount of sub's for the game. No, you're not an elitist, you're a fool. And fine with me. Toss out the end game PvP armor for all, day 1, I'm OK with that. GEAR SHOULD NOT BE the main factor in winning/losing PvP. People want their time to be worth SOMETHING! Win or lose, they deserve something. In PvP, there is ALWAYS a winning side and ALWAYS a losing side. You reward PARTICIPATION, not just outcome. Would you be happy going to work where you received 60% less than someone else who did the exact same thing as you, but did it slightly better/faster than you? You both have co-workers you need to work with to get something done. You work the same hours, both do exactly the same thing, but his team does slightly better, so your entire team gets paid 60% less. Some days, if you and your co-workers had a really bad day, like say a co-worker went home early because they were sick, you'd be there ALL day, doing your job, but get paid NOTHING for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Defilade Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 They really need to change the win/lose reward ratio back to what it was in 1.1.5. "You shouldn't get rewarded for losing!". Yes because professional athletes don't get paid for losing games right? Not only do they still get paid, but they suffer no monetary penalty for losing. Why am I paying money for video game to get punished and typically from something entirely out of my control? If bioware is going to pull this crap please reward individual performance over team performance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
underjollyroger Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 ... People play games for fun not to be frustrated and unhappy. This is a mmo you need to appeal the game to everyone whether they suck or rock or are somewhere inbetween, as the fundamental concept to a MMO is a large PLAYER base. Its unbelievable that even the rich get richer and the poor get poorer concept applies in mmo mentality these days. ... perfectly said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spanglish Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 yea its bad, i hate it when you are put into a WZ that is losing and you get in and its over, zero everything. now thats real annoying at least give me 100 creds lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Y-n-T Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 I would like to put in my thoughts on the new War zone PVP first no matter whether you agree or dsagree be logical not abusive and rude no one cares about your thoughts if your just being rude make a point show your logic of why you believe the way you do. lol im sure ill get some feed back on that but anyway to the point : I am a handy capped player so I Don't do real good in most the warzones but I give t the best shot I can I agree with someone that said it s a catch 22 I feel bad if I don't do a good job for my team but non the less I'm going to keep on trying and keep learning tricks it may take me longer than others but well that is what it takes some players are going to be quitting warzones because there going to loose and some are not going to enter because they can't win but I say just keep trying guys there are no perfect fixes we need to live with what we got. the guys at SWTOR are doing there best, to be fair but its impossible for a real good PVPer and a bad PVPer that really trys to go by the same rules and it be fair to both its life we all can't be rich some of us has to be poor so do the poor give up and starve no we keep working so I say we don't complain just get better and at the same time the good players shouldn't belittle a bad player that is trying (leechers not included) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Krazed Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 you can argue the new pvp system is good but the majority aren't hardcore pvpers. No rewards for losing drives people away from pvp. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fexhie Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 you can argue the new pvp system is good but the majority aren't hardcore pvpers. No rewards for losing drives people away from pvp. It is not that it is good imo. It is that it is a lot better than it was previous patch when they were giving away free luxury cruises and ipods to homeless people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth-Malkaevian Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 (edited) I would like to put in my thoughts on the new War zone PVP first no matter whether you agree or dsagree be logical not abusive and rude no one cares about your thoughts if your just being rude make a point show your logic of why you believe the way you do. lol im sure ill get some feed back on that but anyway to the point : I am a handy capped player so I Don't do real good in most the warzones but I give t the best shot I can I agree with someone that said it s a catch 22 I feel bad if I don't do a good job for my team but non the less I'm going to keep on trying and keep learning tricks it may take me longer than others but well that is what it takes some players are going to be quitting warzones because there going to loose and some are not going to enter because they can't win but I say just keep trying guys there are no perfect fixes we need to live with what we got. the guys at SWTOR are doing there best, to be fair but its impossible for a real good PVPer and a bad PVPer that really trys to go by the same rules and it be fair to both its life we all can't be rich some of us has to be poor so do the poor give up and starve no we keep working so I say we don't complain just get better and at the same time the good players shouldn't belittle a bad player that is trying (leechers not included) The problem is not you, it's your team. A good team will support you, If you do the best you can it is all you can do. Do not be upset because you solo qued and got sloted with some randoms that do not understand what working as a team is. If you did your best, you did you best, and that's all there is to it really, every one get's better as they play, the more they play, and a good guild can compensate for your handicap (whatever it happens to be) who will find your strengths and use them to better the whole team. Your problem is not you, your problem is you've been stuck with some ****** teams, or Guilds. Edited April 13, 2012 by Darth-Malkaevian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grossmoff Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 I think only half the warzone comms is too harsh, maybe 20 difference would be fine. the rating and the rating based rewards are enough to motivate players to win. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CaptianFordo Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 You honestly want to be rewarded for failing!? How about we just cry until BW just gives us the endgame armour without having to do anything but walk into the operation and say boo to the bosses till they give up the shiney's. You are the 99%, don't want to work for rewards just get everything handed to you because you wanted to play. As a note, I am not an elitest nor am I in any way a PVP God, I am a mediocre player and I'm not crying about anything. Well anything other than there are way to many servers for the amount of sub's for the game. This man deserves a medal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Achromatis Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 (edited) Im not a hardcore PvPer, but I have been PvPing a lot lately because it was fun and I could still advance my gear at a decent rate even if I lost. I would usually get upwards of 7-9 medals a game and that was just focusing on being a team player. I love a good game, win or lose. Now? Not so much. Before 1.2 the losing team would still be rewarded for the effort. There were many Alderann matches won by 10-25 points, there were 6-5 Huttballs, there were 6-5 Voidstar matches. People were rewarded for a good game. If I get onto a team and we get rolled at the first doors in Voidstar what do you think people are going to do? The more casual types who would have otherwise stayed are going to quit and likely stop PvPing, everyone is going to stop playing to let the other team win just to get it over with faster. Before 1.2 we had games like that were we turned it around and ended up winning, but now thats not going to happen since YOU ARE REWARDING PEOPLE MORE FOR FAILING FASTER THAN YOU ARE FOR PLAYERS PUTTING IN MORE EFFORT. What the F*** are you doing Bioware? Edited April 13, 2012 by Achromatis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sith_Cho Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 I just want the credits back for win/lose. I don't care/mind about the changes in WZ regarding valor/comms but I do have a problem with earning no credits pvp'ing. I don't want to be forced to PvE to sustain PvP. It's terrible since BW doesn't force people to PvP to sustain PvE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PullinStuff Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 Really? You seriously are calling him out on that? The lowest ranked player on the other team is going to get more medals than the top loser simply because thats the way the system works. It will be like this everymatch, There are a few situations where this might not be the case but for the most part it is. Being on a losing team gives junk rewards, thats a fact and I don't think anyone with any sense is disputing that. However I am of the opinion this is better than how it was, so I am fine with it. I am calling him out on his performance claims, I would also like to know how he knows what the opposing tam member received.... Or am I the only person who understands why I think he is full of ****? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PullinStuff Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 I play this game to pvp. I play some pve content as well but it normally isn't very exciting in my opinion. I wouldn't mind not getting anything for losing except that it gives the winners more of an advantage towards winning the next match. If they simply gave everyone the same gear rating I would be more than willing to suck it up heh. But that is not the case. Every match my opponent wins it makes it more difficult for me to compete in the next match. If this were a sport, as they seem to be trying for, Then this should be unacceptable. After all this isn't an open world pvp game like eve online, where imbalance between factions is to be expected and even encouraged. This games pvp is more equatable to football or Baseball. Where both teams optimally have the same amount of players. One team may have more talent which will lead them to win more often, but they certainly don't get better equipment that increases their capabilities. If Michael Jordan was the best basketball player of all time but he lost every game because he was too busy dribbling circles around his opponents, would he still be a basketball player? the answer is no. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PullinStuff Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 I just want the credits back for win/lose. I don't care/mind about the changes in WZ regarding valor/comms but I do have a problem with earning no credits pvp'ing. I don't want to be forced to PvE to sustain PvP. It's terrible since BW doesn't force people to PvP to sustain PvE. This I agree with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nosphuratu Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 I am in a Guild of 1.. Me. I solo que and Never run in a pre-made. Just so you know my posts come from some random guy with a casual life and play style who pvps and solo ques for "fun". sure you are.. and even if you are, the number of casual gamers agreeing with you is a very small percentage... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Broom Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 I'm a hardcore PVPer. I win far more games than I lose, with or without my guild's premade. But I will never, ever agree that not giving the loser an incentive to keep trying is a good idea. It's actually the exact opposite: it's a PVP killer. Please people, try to understand. If you have ANYTHING of a competitive spirit, losing is NOT fun. And losing because you are undergeared is even less fun. So the most common reaction I've observed over the last 9 years, is that people just stop participating. Leaving the well-geared hardcore PVPers standing there twirling their thumbs and complaining there is no PVP to be had. Eventually, you get a situation where there are only the people in the top gear and a handful beginners who soon give up, because they don't like getting farmed. I've seen this happen in so many games, it's not even remotely funny. And honestly, what is everyone's problem? Afraid of facing people on the same footing? Afraid to find out that your 'mad skillz' might actually just be your gear? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fexhie Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 I am calling him out on his performance claims, I would also like to know how he knows what the opposing tam member received.... Or am I the only person who understands why I think he is full of ****? Pretty sure he did not say exactly what the other guy got, but he got more because he won. I am not sure what the exact amount of credits you get for losing is b/c I have not been paying attention, but I assume it is 0 because everyone keeps saying it is 0. So that guy with the crappy stats had a pretty good chance I will say something like 100 percent, to get more credits than he did. As far as coms go, you get a certain amount of coms for winning, add 1 medal to that and you probably have more than it is possible to get for losing. I think I had a match with 3 mvp and i had 52 coms for losing, that was my highest, My lowest coms for winning was 85, I think it highly likely the player in question, ie any winner in any warzone gets more rewards than any loser. This is not even open for debate man, its a fact. What people are talking about here is getting more stuff for losing, and some people like the guy in question are asking to get more stuff for losing well. No matter weither the guys stats were right or not is not the point. His point was that he had no chance of getting more coms/credits than the guy who came into the wz late and got lucky enough to join the winning side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brendicus Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 I believe this is a Mentality which has been missing from the MMO industry for decades. And personally I am Glad Bioware has implemented it. it means I can log into a match "usually" and know the people in that room are going to go to their limits to help me as a team member and do the best we can to win, instead of running off and doing whatever the hell they want and causing us to loose.. Or you know, people will start to look at the prospective rewards against the time/effort expended and just say "screw it" and go do something else, leaving you and your hardline mentality sitting in a queue. alone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brendicus Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 This man deserves a medal. Shame that medal won't give him any commendations in the new patch. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blasphemerr Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 In faction-based pvp, winning cannot be the overriding factor in gearing up, as when it is, one faction gears up quickly, wins more, gears up even faster. The losing faction will eventually lose interest in pvp as no one cares to be face-rolled 11 matches in a row. Winning should however provide better rewards, I'm just not sure those rewards should be gearing up this much faster. 40 commendations for a loss, 100 for a win is pretty rough. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rooks_THX Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 As people said, all this will do is make people leave PvP. The only people playing will be the few hardcore, and that isn't enough to justify any significant amount of resoured being invested by the devs in PvP. So PvP stagnates, gets shoved off into the corner and then the hardcore complain "there's no PvP". People wion't play just to get crushed over and over with no chance of ever gearing up. If there aren't significant rewards for simply showing up and trying, people will just stop whowing up and trying, and PvP will be dead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fexhie Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 I'm a hardcore PVPer. I win far more games than I lose, with or without my guild's premade. But I will never, ever agree that not giving the loser an incentive to keep trying is a good idea. It's actually the exact opposite: it's a PVP killer. Please people, try to understand. If you have ANYTHING of a competitive spirit, losing is NOT fun. And losing because you are undergeared is even less fun. So the most common reaction I've observed over the last 9 years, is that people just stop participating. Leaving the well-geared hardcore PVPers standing there twirling their thumbs and complaining there is no PVP to be had. Eventually, you get a situation where there are only the people in the top gear and a handful beginners who soon give up, because they don't like getting farmed. I've seen this happen in so many games, it's not even remotely funny. And honestly, what is everyone's problem? Afraid of facing people on the same footing? Afraid to find out that your 'mad skillz' might actually just be your gear? There is so much here that I disagree with but just gonna make a few comments and leave the post alone. The incentive to not losing is winning. Giving people gear does not make them better, as we have seen the past month and whatever since the 4 medal *******ary that has been going on. Plenty of people have great gear and still suck, and guess what they think they are ****** b/c of it and now they are here complaining on the forums b/c they can't get free stuff by losing all the time anymore. TG My problem with this is not from me thinking I am a ******, it is me thinking most of the population on our server is logging in from a rehab center. Rather than play something they just can't seem to understand and still get cool stuff. I would prefer for them to get nothing and eventually quit and move to games more their speed like solitaire and tic tac toe, or heaven help them, actually try to reach out of their alcohol or drug induced haze and learn to press a key or 2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beardamus Posted April 13, 2012 Share Posted April 13, 2012 (edited) I agree, the new system sucks. I was in a huttball game last night with 4 people on my team. I got 11 commendations for fighting it out. I don't like things handed to me, and I don't want to be rewarded for failing. However, this felt like I was being punished. Edited April 13, 2012 by Beardamus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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