Server population is dropping...

[FSA_shadow]

Either you're truly dedicated (which I kind of doubt) or you just want to bash the game and justify why you are here.

 

Either way, I don't really care much how you waste your life.

 

I prefer to enjoy what life has to offer me.

 

Could not agree with you more!

[Trenter]

Just to clarify something - most posting about merging servers are not saying the game is dying. Although we do question why some servers are losing more people than others. But that is another debate.

 

Genuine answer. We have the same data you do. We play the game during all hours of the day and week. If our server had 33 people, no instance, in the fleet; then it impacts us. It isn't health like James Ohlen is saying. He has data he can pull from various databases and what not that give him a picture. But if a subscriber logs in day in and day out and sees the same thing, like many here have said, then it is what it is. What you have then is a TOR person saying X and subscribers saying Y with whatever we have to support it.

 

You want screen shots? You want to re-roll on our server and see for yourself? What would help you understand those posters plight? I'll also give you a secondary option. Why give players 7 days free for returning to try a patch? Why also give away 30 days free for all who have lvl 50's? Genuine question

 

 

So I suppose you missed the part in my post where I said that it is obvious that there are low pop servers then? That's alright, I can repeat it: It's obvious there are low pop servers. I'm not blind. I can, as you say, just log on to a light server and see for myself. Really tough for those of you who are playing on a low pop server without the motivation to re-roll (which I both respect and understand). Good news is, server transfers are coming. Bioware has acknowledged the problems of people stuck on these servers. They however don't see the need to merge servers. The people with the exact numbers and metrics have decided that this isn't needed. Right?

 

This is just my guess obviously, but I actually think there's a fair bit of hyperbole tainting this topic. No disrespect to those of you who actually does have problems, but just the other day I was told I probably don't understand mmos if I thought having 20-60 people in each zone, around 100 - 110 on fleet and plenty of participants in Ops and Warzones, could be considered a healthy server population. It seems the phrase "dead server" is used on pretty much anything right now, and I personally don't think the game is even close to the train wreck some people try to make it out to be.

 

And for that last part, if they can afford to, why not?

 

We have. We are a paying subscriber as you are and want to have fun. It isn't fun when there are only a handful of people on a server whereas 4 others have 300. If you look at my involvement I've stated over and over how it is on Dragon Trail. I've given data during prime time, during morning, during afternoon, and I've compared it to Fatman. The two servers are not even close. And it can be felt in the game when you play.

 

Fatman has a healthier economy. It has tons of /general chat. You can get flashpoints done. There are plenty of healers. You can do heroic quests. You can get help if you are ganked. The list goes on and on. It isn't just Dragon Trail, it is other servers people have reported.

 

We are not debating about why people left. We are not saying the game isn't good.

 

We are saying there are too many servers and we shouldn't be forced to reroll elsewhere giving up alts, money, materials, and legacy.

 

The bloke I quoted said the game was dying. I am saying it's not but it's obvious there are low pop servers. What you are debating with me here, I don't even know.

[Incendergel]

So I suppose you missed the part in my post where I said that it is obvious that there are low pop servers then?

 

I saw it, and ignored it. Why? Because you went on saying that BioWare thinks everything is fine and we shouldn't post in this thread anymore... /boggle

 

Really tough for those of you who are playing on a low pop server without the motivation to re-roll (which I both respect and understand). Good news is, server transfers are coming. Bioware has acknowledged the problems of people stuck on these servers. They however don't see the need to merge servers. The people with the exact numbers and metrics have decided that this isn't needed. Right?

 

It probably should have happened before the 1.2 patch. They already caught enough grief over the Ilum patch, then again with Ilum and giving up on it via the guild summit, and now with more maintenance (which I honestly don't care about i.e. downtime) than planned. It seems maybe that their priorities are wrong or tainted by Mother....

 

Again - 7 days if you return, 30 for existing customers who have a lvl 50, etc. So to say they acknowledged is one thing, leaving it for 1.3x and beyond is another. 1.2 isn't going to be the savior.

 

This is just my guess obviously, but I actually think there's a fair bit of hyperbole tainting this topic. No disrespect to those of you who actually does have problems, but just the other day I was told I probably don't understand mmos if I thought having 20-60 people in each zone, around 100 - 110 on fleet and plenty of participants in Ops and Warzones, could be considered a healthy server population. It seems the phrase "dead server" is used on pretty much anything right now, and I personally don't think the game is even close to the train wreck some people try to make it out to be.

 

Again, you say train wreck - that isn't what the OP said, nor is it what people are saying about low populated servers. It is also the point you appear to be missing. When people say the server is a ghost town they are talking about the lack of people playing to support the server community. You know already what I'm going to say.

 

1. Market - there isn't anything to buy or sell

2. Flashpoints - you won't get them done

3. Heroics / side quests - you won't get them done

4. Warzones - start, let alone win, heck - start with even teams

5. Social aspect - there isn't any when there are 2 to 7 people in a zone, or 33 in a fleet

6. Faction balance

 

There are 4 critical aspects of the game that people continue to say when they talk about dead servers or ghost towns. Compare that or any number people post when they do to say Fatman whom has 188+ in a starting zone, or 300+ in the fleet. Dragon Trail 33 in the fleet, Fatman 300+ (2 instances last time I was on the other night) - that is a order of magnitude different. General chat lines go by in seconds, on Dragon Trail they go by in minutes...

 

SO you agree there are servers, lots, with lower than average populations with maybe 4 healthy in the U.S. server list. We disagree maybe on priority or if there is a problem or not. Unless you play on one of the servers I honestly don't think you would agree anyway because it doesn't impact you. I didn't even mention trying to get a group together to do things such as building the datacron with +10 stats, etc.

 

And for that last part, if they can afford to, why not?

 

Glass half full argument. Yes, if they can why not. I agree. I'm of the mind set that they are smart enough to know there is trouble in Dallas. Servers are questionable regardless of what side you are on. We know GW2 is doing some beta's this month to garner interest. And we also know D3 sent out a massive beta invite today. We can both do simple math I'm willing to bet. My money is on damage control but I also hold the right to be incorrect.

 

The bloke I quoted said the game was dying. I am saying it's not but it's obvious there are low pop servers. What you are debating with me here, I don't even know.

 

Debating your dying comment and how TOR person is saying it is all good. This thread has split now what, 2 or 3 times? It isn't all about trolling. It is about people being frustrated playing on servers with hardly anyone on. It doesn't feel like a MMO when you are in that environment. There isn't any social aspect. There isn't a market.

 

So ignore the dying part because we are talking, or most anyway, about low populated servers and the need to merge to keep our interest....

Edited April 13, 2012 by Incendergel

[Newsinz]

Let this thread die already lol.

[-Sev]

Let this thread die already lol.

 

....^

[Incendergel]

Let this thread die already lol.

 

Merge servers already... /rollseyes

[Trenter]

I saw it, and ignored it. Why? Because you went on saying that BioWare thinks everything is fine and we shouldn't post in this thread anymore... /boggle

 

Since you just went on and ignored what I wrote, I will just go ahead and ignore most of what you wrote, since it doesn't have much relevance to my orignal quote. I will only comment on two things, this is the first. I'd like you to quote the part of my post where I said we shouldn't post in this thread anymore. Don't make crap up.

 

Debating your dying comment and how TOR person is saying it is all good. This thread has split now what, 2 or 3 times? It isn't all about trolling. It is about people being frustrated playing on servers with hardly anyone on. It doesn't feel like a MMO when you are in that environment. There isn't any social aspect. There isn't a market.

 

So ignore the dying part because we are talking, or most anyway, about low populated servers and the need to merge to keep our interest....

 

And now this. I take issue with whatever I want, thanks. If you feel the thread gets derailed and off topic, you report it to a moderator. A bloke said the game was dying. I don't think it is. That's the extent of my involvement right now. Tough for the people stuck on low pop servers, but apart from my sympathies, I don't wish to get involved in that particular debate. I wanted to talk about the post I originally quoted. That's it.

[Sundragon]

All I know is that virtually every MMO sees the population drop from launch. Not all, but most. So, to say "population is falling" is pretty obvious.

 

I'm on Helm of Gaurash, a PvP server. So many people have quit it's a bit scary. I think it is because the PvP in the game isn't that great. The PvE might be okay, but the PvP is where most of these players wanted to spend their time, and it simply isn't working.

 

Open world PvP is non-existent. Ilum, when it did exist as an option, was a joke. WZs are fine but awfully repetitive. Class balance seems to have gotten worse with patch 1.2. The only addition is one new warzone that is awfully like the existing Civil War warzone.

 

I suspect the PvP players that are left will leave the game in droves when another MMO with PvP is released. The PvE players might stick around, who knows, but without a decent LFG tool, I can see them getting frustrated.

 

So many things that are common in MMOs just weren't in the game when launched, which is a travesty for a triple-A MMO release to not have these basics in the game.

[Xena_Shepard]

It seems hubris will kill the beast once more...

 

BioWare themselves said that TOR would never be a WoW-killer, and of course that's true, WoW has done too good a job of indoctrinating its audience. Personally, I'd hate to see TOR die because I really love it, and I'd never even consider thinking about touching WoW. TOR is a much better game overall, in the smaller mechanics, than WoW is. Which is why I can't grasp why BioWare won't just suck up their pride and merge servers. I'd much rather play a game with a handful of heavily populated servers than a ton of low populated servers. Any moron who understands even the tiniest bit of population development knows that you begin with a highly concentrated center and expand as needed.

 

Which isn't to say my server is lowly populated, it's light during the day, but standard in the after-work hours. I usually don't have too much of a problem finding groups for things or PvPing, but it'd be nice if the server had 5000+ people on at once. They should go with the Guild Wars model, which had a handful of heavily populated servers, usually only 1~2 per region (US, EU, Asia).

 

Ending on the note of Guild Wars, I think everybody going "HURR HURR WE GUNNA QUIT FER GW2 WHEN ET COMES OUT" should just go pound sand. From what I've heard, GW2 is just gonna be a crappy WoW-clone in and of itself. TOR is a WoW clone too, cleaning up a lot of the grindy elements (which really attracted me, like the crafting system) but at least it's Star Wars. Guild Wars 2 can't say that, it's a fantasy setting like WoW, being an even more thinly veiled clone.

[Incendergel]

Trenter, you said: "James Ohlen, one of the top dogs on TOR says they have a very healthy game right now. You are saying it's a dying game."

 

You also said: Why should I believe you? What information do you have access to that the rest of us don't? Genuine question.

 

Agreed?

 

I went on to say the information we have is based off our subscription and server we play on. No more than you. The only difference is which one of the 175 or so we play on. Those posted about mergers and priorities are probably playing on the lower populated ones than you. Most of us list the server, date, and time when we compare. While not the data the chap at TOR is using, it is valid data never the less, although a smaller sample.

 

I think even a fool (not calling you one) would agree playing on a server with 2 instances of a imperial fleet (The Fatman) vs. that of one having 33 people and no instances (Dragon Trail), looks and feels different. Yes? Not sure what else we can do because it is also a matter of opinion.

 

Post 1.2 patch. 4/13/2012

Dragon Trail @ 7:24

Republic Fleet: 51 people (NO INSTANCE)

 

The Fatman @ 7:25 (25 minute queue time, will have to get back to you...)

 

See the difference? Both are in prime time with The Fatman being East coast and falling into the after 9 PM slot on a Friday....yet it is still humming along, eh?

 

Is it just a republic vs. imperial faction imbalance because I have to ask where are all the republic players...

 

 

You also said: "I'm not saying there aren't low pop servers - obviously there are. Are a majority of the servers low pop servers? Now, this is my guess, but I'd say definately no. My server, the Progenitor, is a standard tagged server with a healthy population. A majority of the servers during prime hours are marked standard (and yeah, I know standard servers have both a min and a max but I still don't think that a majority of the standard servers are in the min range). James Ohlen says they have a healthy game. The last reports from the EA financial reports have very much hinted at a healthy game.

 

So you agree there are low populated servers. We just don't agree on the ramifications. We also don't agree playing on those same servers makes for a healthy game. Nothing I can do here to change your mind or you mine. I play on a lower or lowest populated server (where my 50 is, crafting alts, legacy, and money) who also happens to be on the Republic side... It sucks.

 

No galactic market

No flashpoints or very few

Warzones take forever, never start with equal teams, and generally fall into a loss

Hard to complete weekly PvP quests

No social feel to the game, chat just doesn't happen

No civil or faction based war

Case in point - I didn't see imperial subscriber until I was lvl 28 and on Alderaan (PvP server)

 

When I'm on Fatman it is just the opposite. /General is flowing so damn fast, everything is on the market, people doing flashpoints, and warzones start pretty quick with a reasonable win to loss ration. Granted, we play more huttball But hopefully you get the point.

 

 

You then said: "Take an objective look at your own involvement on this topic and ask yourself the following: What do I really know about this?

 

I've been pretty objective. I've stated how I see it and how it feels to me. I've said time and time again the game isn't dying but the population is dropping for which I don't know why. My main focus is on the lower populated servers, however many there are, and what it does to the people who are playing for the social and mmo aspect. MMO's are a social experiment...

 

How is that? I know I am sure I missed some stuff from you but it may not be applicable to the debate. I like the game. I don't like playing on a low populated server with very few people on. I don't want to be forced to reroll when I don't believe it is my fault. I know it is a byproduct of a popular game upon launch. I also know it is a byproduct of a game whereas people don't want to stand in line to play....but this should have been known before hand just by looking at what other MMO's did....

 

Anyway, peace out. I do hope you have a good weekend. And yes, I've beat this dead horse to death. Why? Because the patch alone isn't going to address whatever issue it is that makes the servers the way they are. If it was not the case then Dragon Trail right now would be a happening place and there are now 59 people in the fleet.

[Incendergel]

And the flogging continues

 

The Fatman 4/13/2012

Imperial Fleet @ 8:04 PM PST (11:04 EST adjusted)

143 (Second Instance)

 

Compare that to my earlier number of what, 50 something and a single instance on the republic fleet on Dragon Trail?

 

Almost Epic. And this is a patch day /rollseyes.

Edited April 14, 2012 by Incendergel

[Oldgrimm]

And now this. I take issue with whatever I want, thanks. If you feel the thread gets derailed and off topic, you report it to a moderator. A bloke said the game was dying. I don't think it is. That's the extent of my involvement right now. Tough for the people stuck on low pop servers, but apart from my sympathies, I don't wish to get involved in that particular debate. I wanted to talk about the post I originally quoted. That's it.

 

You know first of all, you should adjust your attitude, because with this lacking enunciation of yours, nobody will take you seriously.

 

Secondly, the death of a thousand papercuts was ment as an analogy to the glaring problems in this game.

This game is not dying in the classic term, but it is truly bleeding subs.

 

Here at : http://www.torstatus.net/ you can check the server population trend.

 

Yes, James Ohlen has the most accurate statistics, but torstatus will be accurate enough to get a whole picture of the situation in SWTOR.

(And no, there are not only some ghost servers)

 

Lastly I will mention one thing.

To someone like me, the 30 day free-play time is a sign of clear desperation. They wouldnt introduce this gift, if this game would do fine in terms of healthy subscription numbers.

[Nyteblades]

Im pretty sure the free game time isnt from a lack of subs. Its more an im sorry we have made so many mistakes and thanks for sticking it out.

[Nyteblades]

And they must have gotten something right as there was more people on the fleet tython and taris tonight than ive seen in over a month.

[connerthekewlkid]

for all the time you people are writing out walls of text you could be actually playing the game

or stop using /emote at the least

[LeonBraun]

And they must have gotten something right as there was more people on the fleet tython and taris tonight than ive seen in over a month.

 

Yep... Our fleet was one of the busiest I've ever seen it. And friday nights in MMO land are usually pretty dead.

 

Good move on the universal 30 days in bringing people back =)

[theskurGe]

for all the time you people are writing out walls of text you could be actually playing the game

or stop using /emote at the least

 

Except that the servers were down during a lot of this posting.

[Lord_Ravenhurst]

EU servers are REALLY terrible, nothing has improved since 1.2, hoped more people would log in - server merge, when?`

 

Please combine all servers from the same category to a single shard. Ask Funcom how to do that!

[markshim]

is anyone from bioware even listening to us about the servers being dead?

the game is getting dull with on one about this is suppose to be a MMO

[corbanite]

EU servers are REALLY terrible, nothing has improved since 1.2, hoped more people would log in - server merge, when?`

 

Please combine all servers from the same category to a single shard. Ask Funcom how to do that!

 

Well sucks to be you. My EU server which was already fine has become a lot more active.. seeing a growth of what feels like some 150% in numbers since 1.2. So maybe YOUR EU server is REALLY terrible but not all EU servers are REALLY terrible.

 

anyway off to run the new instance. cya

Edited April 14, 2012 by corbanite

[wesleybakkie]

well Uthar Wynn is also dead wanted to use my legacy and make a new republic chiss but the game is just not fun without people to play with. no heroics , no flashpoints , no pvp warzones and no players.

for the players on a dead server patch 1.2 didnt do anything cause you cant use anything from your legacy.

 

GIEF SERVER MERGE !!!!!

Edited April 14, 2012 by wesleybakkie

[Lundli]

EU servers are REALLY terrible, nothing has improved since 1.2, hoped more people would log in - server merge, when?`

 

Please combine all servers from the same category to a single shard. Ask Funcom how to do that!

 

Maybe yours is, two instances on fleet is pretty decent imho.

[Psychochilla]

the EU servers are totally emptying i only see around 20 people online on a planet at 3 pm on a SATURDAY! what happened? why is no one playing this game anymore? was it mass effect 3? or did people suddenly lose interest in the game? if that continues could you please change the heroic4 missions to heroic 2 or 2+? because i dont get them done anymore with almost no people online... and my server is one of the "fullest" on the list (red eclipse)

[sambeta]

the EU servers are totally emptying i only see around 20 people online on a planet at 3 pm on a SATURDAY! what happened? why is no one playing this game anymore? was it mass effect 3? or did people suddenly lose interest in the game? if that continues could you please change the heroic4 missions to heroic 2 or 2+? because i dont get them done anymore with almost no people online... and my server is one of the "fullest" on the list (red eclipse)

 

Yay another red eclipse player! I'm having that problem on tatootine at the moment, 45 people on this planet and not one wants to do a HC. Which sucks because these are the bonus HC I need to do.

[Psychochilla]

if they dont do something quick everyone else on the underpopulated servers will leave because there is no one to play with :/

im not paying monthly for a singleplayer

Edited April 14, 2012 by Psychochilla