Why can't BW code a queue system?

[KrackenOne]

Serioulsy, how hard is it to make a queue system that queue's even teams in WZs? I really cannot believe this... WZs on Vulkar Highway are 50% lottery now anyhow. Steamroll the other side until they get even numbers, if they ever do. One side will have up to 9 at start and the other somtimes 3.

 

This is annoying......

 

What is it that makes this difficult?

Edited April 10, 2012 by KrackenOne

[AmonSWTOR]

Serioulsy, how hard is it to make a queue system that queue's even teams in WZs? I really cannot believe this... WZs on Vulkar Highway are 50% lottery now anyhow. Steamroll the other side until they get even numbers, if they ever do. One side will have up to 9 at start and the other somtimes 3.

 

This is pathetic really.

 

Anyone have a clue to why this is so hard for them?

 

It's amazing how totaly clueless people asume that everything is completely easy doable, whatever it might be.

Given that you have no coding experience, else you wouldn't even start such a pointless topic, has it ever occoured to you that there maybe, just maybe is a chance that things like that are neither easy nor, in the grand sheme of things to do, important atm?

[KrackenOne]

It's amazing how totaly clueless people asume that everything is completely easy doable, whatever it might be.

Given that you have no coding experience, else you wouldn't even start such a pointless topic, has it ever occoured to you that there maybe, just maybe is a chance that things like that are neither easy nor, in the grand sheme of things to do, important atm?

 

Yes, hence the post. I've play many other MMO's that have queue systems, not one of them has this issue.

 

Do you have anything to add that may anwer the question? Also it's no pointless, if they come out and say "This is why we are having a hard time" perhaps one of the 1.2 million subscribers might have an idea.......

Edited April 8, 2012 by KrackenOne

[sjmc]

Serioulsy, how hard is it to make a queue system that queue's even teams in WZs? I really cannot believe this... WZs on Vulkar Highway are 50% lottery now anyhow. Steamroll the other side until they get even numbers, if they ever do. One side will have up to 9 at start and the other somtimes 3.

 

I don't know how they do it, but they probably wait until there are enough people queued up for both sides and then send invites. Maybe they send invites to 9 on each side to allow for someone to say no. What should they do if several people say no to the invite and there is nobody else waiting?

 

Hold the start of the warzone until more people sign up? You could be standing around in the entry area for 10-15 minutes -- longer if others decide they don't want to wait (which is likely)

 

Delay the invites until there are 10-12 people waiting to provide for alternates? That could significantly increase queue times.

[Zunayson]

It only starts a match when you have 16 people queueing, but they don't always join. Many imps on my server know when 16 imps dissappear, they know it's Huttball... so they don't join, even if they're included, because they'd rather play reps.

 

It's not the queueing system, it's the players, which you can't fix.

[hrelas]

Serioulsy, how hard is it to make a queue system that queue's even teams in WZs? I really cannot believe this... WZs on Vulkar Highway are 50% lottery now anyhow. Steamroll the other side until they get even numbers, if they ever do. One side will have up to 9 at start and the other somtimes 3.

 

This is pathetic really.

 

Anyone have a clue to why this is so hard for them?

 

The answer is. It's *********** ridiculously hard... to do right. Designing a proper AI and develop the heuristics of such a system is incredibly hard.

[Ozzone]

Yes, hence the post. I've play many other MMO's that have queue systems, not one of them has this issue.

 

Same here. All the posters in this thread that defend BW, KrackenOne's point is 100% valid. I can't remember the last MMO I played that had queue problems like this game. If BW can't fix this simple issue, it's no wonder they are having trouble with hard stuff.

[Zunayson]

The answer is. It's *********** ridiculously hard... to do right. Designing a proper AI and develop the heuristics of such a system is incredibly hard.

 

Making it so when 16 people hit the queue button does not seem very difficult at all. They have it right, and it's not their fault people don't join the match. There's just not as many people playing this game as there is in WoW, so you notice population and team gaps.

[sjmc]

It only starts a match when you have 16 people queueing, but they don't always join. Many imps on my server know when 16 imps dissappear, they know it's Huttball... so they don't join, even if they're included, because they'd rather play reps.

 

It's not the queueing system, it's the players, which you can't fix.

I suppose you could remove the question and just automatically add people to the game without asking them. I'm not sure that would be a popular change, though.

[soldenal]

It's not really simple, yes. But other top ranking MMOs got it right no problem.

 

Anybody still remember the WZ win didn't count fiasco and how long it took BW to fix it? It was unbelievable really. Again non of the top ranking MMO have that problem either.

 

Answer is that BW's programming team is just not up to the job coding massively multi user mechanism.

[greenleef]

omg its kracken red'scorpion here

Totaly agree with you man

Side note how u been and still making server best lol

Edited April 8, 2012 by greenleef

[stephenalandavie]

Making it so when 16 people hit the queue button does not seem very difficult at all. They have it right, and it's not their fault people don't join the match. There's just not as many people playing this game as there is in WoW, so you notice population and team gaps.

 

Theres too many servers and too much imbalance aswell. I am on the highest pop eu server and i havent faced these issues. A simple solution would be to merge the low pop servers and .

 

Something does need to be done and soon

[nakoda]

Sure, I can admit that coding a queue is hard, I cannot do it; that's why I am a player, not a dev.

 

But, queuing systems have been under development in online communities for DECADES...so why does it seem that they get successively worse in MMOs rather than better? Why are development companies so tight-wadded about allowing technology to flourish through collaboration and successive improvement instead of hording something that doesn't work in the first place and seemingly starting from scratch each time?

 

Perhaps this is what the OP is asking?

[RichardNoggin]

If servers were healthy or was more balanced faction wise then this wouldnt be an issue. If they were to offer transfers to some servers and maybe strat collapsing some of the servers might become a little more healthier for this not to be much of an issue. It would keep the community intact without having to put in cross server queues and lose the bragging rights or knowing the guys your pvping with even though your pugging.

 

If they can keep it to where queues will attempt to build a team from a certain server first and go cross server after so long of being unsuccessful.

[KennethHoover]

Because coding a complex game like SWTOR (or any another MMO) isn't as simple as wishing for a magic pony named friendship.

[LeggoMyMuoio]

The problem isn't the queue system, it's people being afk, especially pubs, resulting in uneven teams. There's absolutely no way to counter this besides increasing the pool from which you grab people from.

 

I know a lot of people are against cross-server warzones because it reduces those rivalries on one server, but if they only did cross-server with maybe 3-5 servers for each cluster, I think you'd still get to know the people you're playing with/against. We'll just have to wait and see what direction they take. I know it's frustrating sitting around for 45 minutes before the queue pops only to see you're outnumbered by 2 and have no hope of winning (or better yet, your side finally gets 8 but it's only after the other team is up 400-150 in Alderaan).

[stephenalandavie]

The problem isn't the queue system, it's people being afk, especially pubs, resulting in uneven teams. There's absolutely no way to counter this besides increasing the pool from which you grab people from.

 

I know a lot of people are against cross-server warzones because it reduces those rivalries on one server, but if they only did cross-server with maybe 3-5 servers for each cluster, I think you'd still get to know the people you're playing with/against. We'll just have to wait and see what direction they take. I know it's frustrating sitting around for 45 minutes before the queue pops only to see you're outnumbered by 2 and have no hope of winning (or better yet, your side finally gets 8 but it's only after the other team is up 400-150 in Alderaan).

 

45 minutes? I have to wait about 5 minutes tops on my server it really is quick.

[Cuppcake]

There's more to it.

 

At times, when I've been que'd for over 15 minutes w/o a pop I check the /who lists for the pit, voidstar and civil war.

 

Now, if I see say.. 6 Imperials listed in voidstar I can't help but think: "Why on earth am I not getting an invite, considering there's room for 2 more players in that match?"

 

Either the /who function is borked, or the queing system is. I'm edging towards the latter.

Edited April 8, 2012 by Cuppcake

[LeggoMyMuoio]

45 minutes? I have to wait about 5 minutes tops on my server it really is quick.

 

Depends when you play. I tend to play early mornings before work. I understand that fewer people are online, so queues will be longer, but it does happen.

[LeggoMyMuoio]

There's more to it.

 

At times, when I've been que'd for over 15 minutes w/o a pop I check the /who lists for the pit, voidstar and civil war.

 

Now, if I see say.. 6 Imperials listed in voidstar I can't help but think: "Why on earth am I not getting an invite, considering there's room for 2 more players in that match?"

 

Either the /who function is borked, or the queing system is. I'm edging towards the latter.

 

Could be a different bracket. For example, if you're lvl 41, it might be the lvl 50 bracket. Vice versa, if you're 50, it could be the 11-49 bracket. But if it's the same lvl, something's borked

[KonstantinT]

Que system already exists, and it is well designed. It works behind the scenes and it has limitations such as it can not force people to join whether they want to or not. It also can not create people out of thin air (bots).

 

I'm rather sure that removing or going around either one of these limitations would be pretty unpopular (decent bots also being ridiculously complicated).

 

Your server could have an excellent population, lots of pvpers. You could have 10 warzones going on at the same time on your server. What happens to the 11th one where 16 people qued and 5 clicked "leave que" after it popped up? There are no more pvpers queing because they are all in the other 10 warzones that are active right now. What could a que system possibly do in this case? Invitations were already sent out.

 

Only thing that made sense on forums was someone suggesting that the match doesn't start for 2 min, to see if there are any extra players to join in that time. Force field just doesn't drop. If match can't begin, then players get kicked out while receiving a small compensation of tokens/valor whatever for their time.

 

Another possible way might be to have variable amounts of people in warzones. So lets say you have 8 people vs 7, que system just can't find anyone to replace, not its fault since there isn't anyone. So what it can do is only let 7 people on each side go through the barrier. Random roll on who gets to stay inside the base with the option of either quitting or waiting for 8th person to show up on the other team. At which point he would be allowed to get through the barrier and play.

Edited April 8, 2012 by KonstantinT

[supafreak]

Wow has the same exact issues so dont act like this is new. I used to play on alterac valley and horde always started AV with half a group vs 40 allies. Most other bgs were the same way

 

Since people are just running around waiting for the queue to pop anyways they should send out invites for enough people, if people click yes they are in, if they click no send more invites BUT dont even begin to start thinking about porting people in until there are 2 full teams them all those who said yes port in and the match starts

[stephenalandavie]

Depends when you play. I tend to play early mornings before work. I understand that fewer people are online, so queues will be longer, but it does happen.

 

Well i usually even only have to wait 10 minutes for a match at around 5am. Freedon nadd tends to be really busy at all times.

[NDiggy]

One thing I've learned about BW is that they are incredibly slow about patching and they're incredibly bad at doing basic things in this game. WZ queues are just one such example of a simple thing done poorly (yes WZ queues are simple programming people!). There are many solutions and work arounds, but BW has chosen not to implement any. Rewarding bonus Valor and Commendations to the shorthanded side would be an easy fix, or simply not lowering the force field until both teams are full.

 

One big problem I've noticed is that when my team has 6 I'll holler in guild chat for someone to queue up and join us. Despite having guildies willing to queue up and help out, they're never put into the WZ. I've had guildmates in queue and been stuck in a WZ where we never had more than 6 people. One night I finished my Ilum daily (10 WZs) and never had a full team of 8 for any WZs, usually be stuck with just 7.

 

Something needs to change with how their queue's work. Its not only an issue of fairness, but obviously there is something deeper in their queue system that is simply broken.

[ttwistt]

lol, at people saying you can't force people to join the game and that's why the teams are never even. how about not starting till there is 10-12 in queue on each side so if anyone doesn't join you can fill those slots right away. wow, hard stuff to figure out, serious rocket science.

 

there is no excuse for the constant games that are 6v8 or 7v8 other then BW have no clue what they are doing.