Legacy system family tree---what is the benefit?

[TUXs]

I'm a jedi, like my father before me...and uncle Ben was a Trooper which is where I learned to throw sticky grenades...

 

And I agree with the OP...worthless addition, touted as some mind blowing concept! Sounds slightly like Ilum huh?!

[GnatB]

There's an Inigo Montoya quote that applies fairly well to the way you're using the word "aesthetic".

 

If the family tree display exists for no purpose other than to be pretty, that is precisely what it means to have an aesthetic value. Now, you can of course argue that TO YOU it isn't pretty, but that's subjective. Then, too, "aesthetic" can be used to refer to things that are more felt than thought; more emotional than rational. And so, having a place to show how our characters relate to each other has no mechanical value in game... agreed, and it should not... but it can evoke feelings in players, as well as possibly being appealing in itself.

 

In other words, the family tree is purely aesthetic. I'm frankly surprised you'd suggest otherwise.

 

You seem to be confusing "aesthetic value" with "aesthetic value from the point of view of another person who can't see my computer screen".

 

I think he was saying that it has no more aesthetic value than a flowchart I've written down on a piece of paper. In fact, if I'm a really good artist, it may even have less aesthetic value.

[Rammi]

Rewards from leveling up companions can be meaningful, even in group situations. If those were restricted by relationships between characters (e.g. only available to spouses of your "primary" legacy character), instead of going out freely to all legacy characters, that would promote exactly the kind of guild restrictions on family trees we're talking about here.

 

 

You can't police the community so why try? Just make cool systems!

 

If a guild wants to mandate something who are you to argue. Don't Join the Guild!

 

All i see is a lot of brick walls going up based on may happens which prevent more unique systems from being deployed!

 

Maybe its me but I do not worry about such things and the guilds i am in do not either.

 

Ow and one last point, its such a silly stance to take when you can't complete pieces of content in game without certain gear. Whats the difference between the different restrictions. We continue to dilute choices by making them meaningless to the point where making a choices is pointless and i can just select whatever.

 

The choices in this system are the following:

 

Do I want cool thing? Yes or No

 

ff yes, Do i have legacy level? yes or no (no means go grind, great stuff )

 

If Yes, Do i have enough cash? yes or no

 

I'm bored of playing games for simple folks. Give me tougher choices to make please. I guess I'm in the minority or at least I better be for biowares sake.

Edited March 28, 2012 by Rammi

[SootyTX]

This is asking a question...

 

Hey, does anyone know if the 'family tree' system has any impact on the way the legacy unlocks and so on work, or is it just a visualization? Is there an in-game benefit I'm missing?

 

 

All this though....

 

Someone please help me understand this.

 

From what I can tell, the family tree does bupkiss.

 

Zero. Zilch. Nada.

 

I can't imagine why they would hype a system that has literally zero in-game benefit.

 

If that is literally all it does, the family tree doesn't seem a smart use of development manhours.

 

I am talking about the family tree, which has been confirmed as useless fluff...

 

....looks a hell of a lot like complaining to me.

 

 

And finally....

 

The family tree as I currently understand it is neither practical nor aesthetic.

 

To YOU maybe. To me, its looking like a useful way to help me arrange my thoughts and develop the legacy I want as the game progresses, its a lot better looking than anything I would do on paper, won't get lost or ripped up by my cat.

 

I do wish the OP and others like him would stop projecting their personal views as fact and/or majority opinions. You don't see me starting threads about why I don't want the devs the spend any resources at all on more PvP features even though (1) I fail to see the benefit of it in any way, shape or form and (2) I suspect it takes several orders of magnitude more resources to make even minor changes to PvP systems than it did to develop this feature.

[Keta]

 

BTW why do you keep the system poping up the legacy windows in my face each time I zone? I don't want a legacy name at all. I just want a last name, a separate one.

 

If the legacy window is popping up each time you log in it indicates that you haven't chosen a legacy name for your first legacy character on the server. Pick one. It sops popping up after that. Then you can either set it as a lat name, a title type thing or not to show at all. If you don't want other characters having that legacy name select hide. Then no one will know. And then you can wait until BW changes their minds and lets you have different last names for each character. Personally I like it the way it is and will be.

[Aloro]

I think he was saying that it has no more aesthetic value than a flowchart I've written down on a piece of paper. In fact, if I'm a really good artist, it may even have less aesthetic value.

 

That's purely subjective though. It's one thing to say, "I find no aesthetic value in this" and a wholly different thing to say, "this does not involve aesthetics". The former may well be true, but the latter is not, in this case.

[Aloro]

You can't police the community so why try? Just make cool systems!

 

If a guild wants to mandate something who are you to argue. Don't Join the Guild!

 

All i see is a lot of brick walls going up based on may happens which prevent more unique systems from being deployed!

 

Maybe its me but I do not worry about such things and the guilds i am in do not either.

 

Wha... huh? What are you on about?

 

I'm not suggesting anyone be policed here. The devs, likewise, are not suggesting policing anyone here. The devs' point, which I rephrased, was that it's better to avoid any need for such policing, by not building systems that would lead to these situations.

 

If specific types of connections between characters in a family tree were necessary to obtain various legacy benefits, then some guilds would require those connections. This is obvious. The devs made a system that doesn't lead to this kind of restrictions. I sincerely don't understand what you're complaining about. There are no brick walls here; they were left out of the design.

 

Ow and one last point, its such a silly stance to take when you can't complete pieces of content in game without certain gear. Whats the difference between the different restrictions. We continue to dilute choices by making them meaningless to the point where making a choices is pointless and i can just select whatever.

 

The choices in this system are the following:

 

Do I want cool thing? Yes or No

 

ff yes, Do i have legacy level? yes or no (no means go grind, great stuff )

 

If Yes, Do i have enough cash? yes or no

 

I'm bored of playing games for simple folks. Give me tougher choices to make please. I guess I'm in the minority or at least I better be for biowares sake.

 

Did you just pick my post at random, hit "quote", then start typing a stream of consciousness? I'm not trying to be rude but I have no idea at all how what you wrote pertains to anything I've written here. This discussion isn't about gear or accessing content.

 

I'm genuinely not sure what you're even saying. You... don't like having to work for things you want? You don't think the choices are meaningful?

[kottonmouth]

a superficial ploy for their future marketing attempts. maybe role players will care, who knows.

[ZachAwesomeness]

I am actually really excited and cant wait for the legacy system i think it will be fun to be a sith trooper who inherited from his father, an evil sith warrior , the ability to force-choke enemies, or a smuggler that is strong in the force . i am really looking forward to it and am so excited to be able to make a big family tree that connects all my character together Edited March 28, 2012 by ZachAwesomeness

[ZachAwesomeness]

and by the way does anyone know when the legacy system is going to be added?

[ikinai]

I am actually really excited and cant wait for the legacy system i think it will be fun to be a sith trooper who inherited from his father, an evil sith warrior , the ability to force-choke enemies, or a smuggler that is strong in the force . i am really looking forward to it and am so excited to be able to make a big family tree that connects all my character together

 

Hmm, now I just need a way to explain to people about why my prim and proper consular is going around and kicking folks in the joybox?

[Aloro]

Hmm, now I just need a way to explain to people about why my prim and proper consular is going around and kicking folks in the joybox?

 

"Because you can"?

[Glzmo]

All characters in your legacy get all of your global legacy unlocks, regardless of the arrangement of characters in your family tree.

 

The family tree is just a fun visualization of the relationships between your characters - we don't want you to ever have to "respec" your family to get the unlocks you want, or for guilds to require you to have a certain family arrangement in order to pick up the right rewards.

William, can other players see your legacy tree when inspecting one of your characters? If they can't now, it may be a good idea to make it possible in the future. I like that the family tree is just a fun visualization and nothing else - but I want it to be visible to other players that examine my character as well. If it's just something I myself can see about my characters, it looses much of it's appeal. Edited March 28, 2012 by Glzmo

[ikinai]

"Because you can"?

 

Well it's not very jedi or ladylike

[Aloro]

Well it's not very jedi or ladylike

 

So it's ok to stick a lightsaber through someone, and smash them with boulders, but kicking them seems rude? Just teasing; I understand where you're coming from. My female Commando won't have any qualms about using this skill though.

[ikinai]

So it's ok to stick a lightsaber through someone, and smash them with boulders, but kicking them seems rude? Just teasing; I understand where you're coming from. My female Commando won't have any qualms about using this skill though.

 

Hehe, yup. And I imagine a sith warrior would have a field day with it

[bigbramble]

Why does it have to have a benefit? It's a game, you know something that is essentially pointless but a bit of fun. People quickly appear to forget that fact.... ....you know like completing a raid/operation won't get you a real girlfriend, create new life, cure any life threatening illness or bring people you have loved back from the dead and for the vast majority of people it won't make any money either. Game = pointless fun, family tree in game = pointless fun.

[Nyhm]

All characters in your legacy get all of your global legacy unlocks, regardless of the arrangement of characters in your family tree.

 

The family tree is just a fun visualization of the relationships between your characters - we don't want you to ever have to "respec" your family to get the unlocks you want, or for guilds to require you to have a certain family arrangement in order to pick up the right rewards.

 

now im confused. I thought I saw in a video somewhere explaining that for example, you have a Sith Warrior who is the brother to a Imp Agent, that Agent and all characters related to it could have force choke. But then if you had another character in the tree, and it was considered a "friend", Force choke wouldnt be related because there was no "bloodline."

 

Has this since changed?

[Deewe]

Enter a damn legacy name and forget about it.

 

Hide it under social options and none's the wiser.

 

Do not link them in the family tree.

 

There, problem solved and it's still only 8.30am.

 

The Legacy system is an arbitrary game system, which is by no means perfect but it's in the game for people who like such things. If you don't, it's very easy to ignore it and go about your business. I wouldn't expect the developers to allow players to "turn off" features if so they please because they "do not want".

So you're saying the legacy is a mandatory feature?

I thought it was optional, might have read wrong then.

 

BTW I don't want to write down a legacy name that won't fit my character even if hidden because it's still there and has no ties at all with my character ; even less if I'm going to get stuck with it. Now, how about they implement new species/classes and then you find your non changeable legacy name not fitting at all?

 

This mandatory system in its actual state is being thrown into our throats. The popup is a pain.

This would have never passed the QA in LotRo, Rift, WoW.

Another thing that would have been avoided in the above games is you could not have 2 male characters linked as spouse... (I find it kind of funny though).

 

I'm just asking for 2 very simple things

1. Do not oblige us to write down a legacy name to get rid of the popup
   
2. Allow players to have different last names for their characters
   

It's not even hard nor costly to implement.

Edited March 29, 2012 by Deewe

[Tenceriker]

now im confused. I thought I saw in a video somewhere explaining that for example, you have a Sith Warrior who is the brother to a Imp Agent, that Agent and all characters related to it could have force choke. But then if you had another character in the tree, and it was considered a "friend", Force choke wouldnt be related because there was no "bloodline."

 

Has this since changed?

 

And now the whole tree doesn't matter because guilds would require x,y, & z. That's all focus, legacy underwhelming and over-hyped.

[Rammi]

Wha... huh? What are you on about?

 

I'm not suggesting anyone be policed here. The devs, likewise, are not suggesting policing anyone here. The devs' point, which I rephrased, was that it's better to avoid any need for such policing, by not building systems that would lead to these situations.

 

If specific types of connections between characters in a family tree were necessary to obtain various legacy benefits, then some guilds would require those connections. This is obvious. The devs made a system that doesn't lead to this kind of restrictions. I sincerely don't understand what you're complaining about. There are no brick walls here; they were left out of the design.

 

 

 

Did you just pick my post at random, hit "quote", then start typing a stream of consciousness? I'm not trying to be rude but I have no idea at all how what you wrote pertains to anything I've written here. This discussion isn't about gear or accessing content.

 

I'm genuinely not sure what you're even saying. You... don't like having to work for things you want? You don't think the choices are meaningful?

 

Sorry for not being as succinct as i would have liked to be i was rushing if I'm honest. The first 2 lines were in response to your quote the rest was just my general rambling which was not clearly articulated.

 

To clearly articulate my problem with your response: I do not agree that the system would result in anyone being forced to do anything. The rewards in legacy today offer no incentive to end game content such as PVP or Raiding and even if it did it would only be if those rewards were required to complete the content that any guild would have to demand it. Just because some elitist idiots will does not IN MY opinion warrant the need to make concessions to a game system. You can agree or disagree i don't care, my personal belief is i would rather deal with the community BS but have more innovative engaging systems.

 

Which led me into my thought process of why i feel frustrated with the general direction of the game catering to people who have more time and not creating rewarding engaging experiences. The legacy system is about how much time you invest in the game and thus you get rewarded. Which rightly or wrongly i have 10/20 hours of time to play a week and so for me getting any type of reward from the legacy system is going to take a while due to how much time it takes to unlock or save up the money to gain any benefit.

 

The only way i would have found the system more worthy was if it was in general more engaging and allowed for more complex choices along the way that had an impact so that my time invested actually had some real consequence and meaning rather than the very hollow grind that i PERSONALLY feel the system represents.

 

At the end of the day this is my opinion, I am honestly happy if you like the concept and the mechanics that it represents. To me the system is a fantastic idea delivered in a basic and dull fashion.

 

Time will tell if people like it!

Edited March 29, 2012 by Rammi

[RolyartNala]

And now the whole tree doesn't matter because guilds would require x,y, & z. That's all focus, legacy underwhelming and over-hyped.

Yep. Refer to sig.

[Kestralio]

would be nice if the legacy system allows a name change for a certain amount of credits. I thought Jagermeister was a funny legacy name at the time, dunno if I want to keep it now for the legacy family tree haha

[SkuzBukit]

The way I understand it the "Family Tree" is nothing more than a graphical front-end to things not yet realised, its only purpose is to give an in-game representation of something you could draw up on paper & has as much practical benefit as that piece of paper, that may or may not become more relevant in future.

 

So it's just cosmetic window dressing for now.

[BLaCKie_MoRGaN]

Someone please help me understand this.

 

From what I can tell, the family tree does bupkiss.

 

Zero. Zilch. Nada. It appears to be a fancy UI for linking your characters together, the in-game benefit of which appears to be squat. I mean, correct me if I missed something, but it doesn't appear to be tied to any of the level/credit-based rewards for the Legacy system.

 

The family tree appears to be so useless that not even role-players benefit from it, since you can't SHOW your family tree to other role-players. What, then, is the difference in benefit to role-playing between the family tree system in 1.2 and simply writing down your characters' family connections on a piece of scratch paper and then just telling people what they are?

 

I mean, is it just me, or has anyone else noticed that the system has no practical value (even to role-players)? If I am missing what the in-game benefit of the family tree is, someone please tell me. Thanks.

 

Family Tree is good, but if you want to do something other than look at it then you would have to

 

have a smuggler be

 

1. a sith pureblood's CHILD to have the race

2. a sith sorcerer's CHILD to have the Storm ability

 

there are too many possibilities to list here, but the main thing is one. THIS ARE RESTRICTIONS ON UNLOCKABLES.

 

for which you would complain again and again.

 

 

Instead they have the Tree just for your pleasure, and give you all the unlockables.

 

 

which one do you prefer?