"Resolve is broken" challenge

[Krashnburn]

When people say "Resolve is broken" they mean it in a broader sense than just "Resolve is bugged".

 

What they mean is that Resolve in its current incarnation isn't a sufficient mechanic to counter chain-CCs in the way something like....say "Diminishing Returns" would.

 

Dee Jay is right again.

 

It doesn't matter if it is working as intended if most people still don't like it. I play games for fun, not to be annoyed by stupid amounts of CC.

[tamgros]

May I point you here:

 

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=390716

 

No videos, but as I said in that post - it is very easy to duplicate, so you may easily check every single word there:)

 

I helped figure this out:

http://taugrim.com/2012/01/04/understanding-swtors-resolve-mechanic/

 

4 months ago. Not really sure why you link me that though, it doesn't address what I was talking about.

 

I was talking about when the resolve bar starts going down. Just go to a warzoen, get stunned and see when it starts counting down... it's after the stun wears off... which is a good thing, it means less stuns in a period of time before getting capped.

Edited April 3, 2012 by tamgros

[tamgros]

have a smuggler/op sleep dart you, your resolve is down to about 25% by the time it ends

 

Video or it didn't happen. I just went into a warzone and this is working fine. Like the title of this tread says, the onus is on those who think the system is broken to prove it's broken.

[Kaarsa]

I helped figure this out:

http://taugrim.com/2012/01/04/understanding-swtors-resolve-mechanic/

 

4 months ago. Not really sure why you link me that though, it doesn't address what I was talking about.

 

I was talking about when the resolve bar starts going down. Just go to a warzoen, get stunned and see when it starts counting down... it's after the stun wears off... which is a good thing, it means less stuns in a period of time before getting capped.

 

Actually, in the article you linked, author says that resolve starts to drain immidiately after achieving immunity, which is exactly what I experienced during testing today. We just cant see white bar dropping at the beginning, because white bar is 1000 units long and is not showing any resolve above 1000.

 

Being hit with tranquilizer/sleeping dart gives you 1500 resolve, that drains to around 400 before effect ends. Yes, it is not fitting into resolve formula for mezz and I dont know why.

[Veeius]

Wow, a really big L2P example... if you cant stick to a sorc as jugg/marauder, nothing in the world will help with your pvp experience.

 

Sure, because every jugg can instantly kick out of the root the hybrid build has.

 

Well, except that they can't.

 

 

Snares are ok, but roots should have some sort of dr. Otherwise it's COMPLETELY possible to easily kill melee, over and over and over again simply by rooting them and nuking them.

 

Seriously, even wow was smart enough to have roots have dr AND roots had a chance to break on damage.

Edited April 3, 2012 by Veeius

[Midumass]

I havent seen a post of a video proving resolve is broken, but I do have one of my own on my home PC. resolve bar white at 65% or so, tank completely CC'd. This followed the exact same scenario against me a few seconds prior but I missed the FRAPs on mine. What do I win for the work of learning how to edit video to post and can someone enlighten me on the best way to post a video (where should I upload it, etc.)?

[Quesadilla]

So how do you explain the Operative/Scoundrel mez from stealth filling your resolve and then start ticking down before the mez has actually worn off? Is this working as intended?

[da_krall]

after 16 pages of discussion about resolve, diminishing returns, roots, slows, huttball and game developing no one posted a vid showing that resolve is not working as intented.

 

Therefore, it is working as intended. You may not like how it works, but it working fine.

 

Still waiting for video proof that it is otherwise.

 

 

Its working as intended (people are just dumb and dont understand the simple system) hoever how they intended it to work is badly thought out and poorly designed - the system favours the heavy armoured classes signficantly more than the lighter armoured classes, widening the gap even more..

Edited April 4, 2012 by da_krall

[Kaarsa]

I havent seen a post of a video proving resolve is broken, but I do have one of my own on my home PC. resolve bar white at 65% or so, tank completely CC'd. This followed the exact same scenario against me a few seconds prior but I missed the FRAPs on mine. What do I win for the work of learning how to edit video to post and can someone enlighten me on the best way to post a video (where should I upload it, etc.)?

 

Winner of the thread title? Virtual hug? Satisfaction from helping? Your link in my signature? I cant offer anything more I am afraid;) If you have such video I would be very happy to be able to see it - maybe just upload it to some free file exchange platform or whatever? I am not a graphic expert I am afraid.

 

So how do you explain the Operative/Scoundrel mez from stealth filling your resolve and then start ticking down before the mez has actually worn off? Is this working as intended?

 

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=390716

 

Tranquilizer/sleeping dart do not follow standard resolve formulas, probably by design or they are bugged, I dont know. You can find detailed info in linked thread.

 

Its working as intended (people are just dumb and dont understand the simple system) hoever how they intended it to work is badly thought out and poorly designed - the system favours the heavy armoured classes signficantly more than the lighter armoured classes, widening the gap even more..

 

Actually, it favours balanced and coordinated parties with healer healing CC target and tank guarding that person;)

[LenrocNewDawn]

Yea Quesadilla, the moment resolve amounts over 1000 points it will start ticking down without breaking the last CC (the one that added the value needed to go over 1000). It's up to the player to use the CC breaker CD and enjoy his immunity. It adds a layer of complexity to the game where you can first maze a person wait to see if he breaks that and then follow with a stun which he won't be able to break. The OP of this thread have done some nice testing and he added some valuable information in another thread : http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=390716 .

To Midumass: If that video shows an active player with an white resolve bar ticking getting stunned/mazed/pulled/pushed then by all means post it. Your prize will be a thank you from my part. If your video only shows a player that gets CCed into active resolve but loses a part of that because he can not break the CC that made his resolve spike, then don't bother, is how the system works.

 

Hate it / like it, that's the way it works. Some may call it badly designed, which it's arguable, and press BW for a redesign. A perfectly understandable action IMHO. But until BW will decide to rethink it, you guys should try to understand it and use it in your favor.

[Midumass]

Winner of the thread title? Virtual hug? Satisfaction from helping? Your link in my signature? I cant offer anything more I am afraid;) If you have such video I would be very happy to be able to see it - maybe just upload it to some free file exchange platform or whatever? I am not a graphic expert I am afraid.

 

 

 

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=390716

 

Tranquilizer/sleeping dart do not follow standard resolve formulas, probably by design or they are bugged, I dont know. You can find detailed info in linked thread.

 

 

 

Actually, it favours balanced and coordinated parties with healer healing CC target and tank guarding that person;)

 

Hi-five will work! i'm actually not against hte resolve thing except in this precise instance I mentioned. It should not be depleting while I am CC'd period, which to me is not an intended mechanic; rather an oversight. i'll try youtube and a link first, although I'm not entirely certain about legal rights. Plus I have to cover my tank's name cuz he said he didn't want his name to be displayed and I really don't know how to do that yet lol

[Kaarsa]

Hi-five will work! i'm actually not against hte resolve thing except in this precise instance I mentioned. It should not be depleting while I am CC'd period, which to me is not an intended mechanic; rather an oversight. i'll try youtube and a link first, although I'm not entirely certain about legal rights. Plus I have to cover my tank's name cuz he said he didn't want his name to be displayed and I really don't know how to do that yet lol

 

Lenroc has a point - if your tank was hit with CC effect and it lasted until his white resolve bar dropped to 65% than it is working fine - I made quite a lot of testing and put my results in the thread Lenroc linked. Resolve after exceeding 1000 starts to deplet immidiately. We just cant see it on white bar, because this bar is 1000 units long and CCed person has for example 1500 resolve, we will see 5 seconds delay between moment CC hit and moment when resolve bar started to shrink, but in reality, process started without any delay.

[TUXs]

This thread is about technical aspect of resolve - ie. it is directed to those who claim that they have been stunned 5 times in the row. Not to those who think that resolve is not working as they wish it to work. Your accusation for "strawman" is therefore false. You posted your opinion about what resolve should do and how it should to it, I am asking for proof that it is not doing what it is currently programmed to do (ie. stop stuns, mezzes,knockbacks and pulls when it is filled).

 

No. YOU are simply focused on the 'technical' aspect. This thread is about the Resolve being "broken". Just because it's working as programmed, doesn't mean it can't still be a broken system.

 

Lemme give you an example. Just because these road signs say what they intended, doesn't mean they're not confusing, and I'd argue, 'broken' for serving the purpose they were intended to serve.

 

I see Resolve the same way. Too many CCs simply bypass Resolve which makes it a confusing, frustrating and 'broken' system for serving the purpose many believe it's supposed to serve.

[Kaarsa]

No. YOU are simply focused on the 'technical' aspect. This thread is about the Resolve being "broken". Just because it's working as programmed, doesn't mean it can't still be a broken system.

 

Lemme give you an example. Just because these road signs say what they intended, doesn't mean they're not confusing, and I'd argue, 'broken' for serving the purpose they were intended to serve.

 

I see Resolve the same way. Too many CCs simply bypass Resolve which makes it a confusing, frustrating and 'broken' system for serving the purpose many believe it's supposed to serve.

 

Well, I started this thread. I meant it to be focused on technical aspect.

 

Why?

 

Because your post is full of opinion and beliefs. It is impossible to argue about that. My opinion is that resolve is working fine. Your - that resolve is not doing what you want it to do. I believe that most of people who think resolve is broken in its not-technical function (ie. it is not preventing being CCed enough) just charge into overhelming numbers without backup and blame their deaths to resolve and being CCed for 8 seconds. I will not convince you. You will not convince me. Why bother?

 

I started thread asking for proof for resolve being broken in its technical aspect. It is others who started to bring their opinions and beliefs here. I repeat, there are few thread going all the time about opinions and beliefs. You may start another if you wish. I specificaly asked for technical aspect. Now you accuse me of being focused on technical aspect. Of course I am, I stated it clearly in my first post after all.

[TUXs]

Because your post is full of opinion and beliefs. It is impossible to argue about that. My opinion is that resolve is working fine. Your - that resolve is not doing what you want it to do. I believe that most of people who think resolve is broken in its not-technical function (ie. it is not preventing being CCed enough) just charge into overhelming numbers without backup and blame their deaths to resolve and being CCed for 8 seconds. I will not convince you. You will not convince me. Why bother?

 

I started thread asking for proof for resolve being broken in its technical aspect. It is others who started to bring their opinions and beliefs here. I repeat, there are few thread going all the time about opinions and beliefs. You may start another if you wish. I specificaly asked for technical aspect. Now you accuse me of being focused on technical aspect. Of course I am, I stated it clearly in my first post after all.

 

I'm not trying to accuse you of anything, I'm trying to suggest that you be more open minded to what people consider "broken", that's all.

 

I fully agree, people overstate the CCs they get, probably because of how many this game has and how little some effect Resolve, but I also attribute a lot of these reports to the fact that there's no visual to differentiate a root from a snare...they all 'feel' the same.

[Kaarsa]

I'm not trying to accuse you of anything, I'm trying to suggest that you be more open minded to what people consider "broken", that's all.

 

I fully agree, people overstate the CCs they get, probably because of how many this game has and how little some effect Resolve, but I also attribute a lot of these reports to the fact that there's no visual to differentiate a root from a snare...they all 'feel' the same.

 

Well, I am fully aware that many people think resolve is broken in other than technical aspect. I argue with them for few days now when I try to write my PhD and I need to take a break;)

 

Thing is, I just consider them bad players (not all of them, but I will allow myself to use generalisation here). Discussion with them is like dispute with bad marauder that tries to convince you that opening with charge on class with knockback is always a great idea and using any other opener is dumb. It is just waste of time.

 

I started this thread, because I like resolve system and I support it, but if it is broken in technical aspect it needs fixing ASAP in my opinion. Since I read a lot of posts stating that it is broken in technical aspect and I never witnessed that, I asked those who think it is broken to find me a proof. I dont have any other purpose for this thread. I started another one, to research technical aspects os resolve. It has no other purpose too, I am not going to try and convince people that think resolve is broken in non-technical sense to my opinion. After all, this is a free internet, you can believe in anything you wish;)

[Appletaz]

Resolve is touted to be the balance to the incredible number of CCs in this game, however it is hardly that.

 

1. It applies to only a certain type of CC

2. It allows for a player to die through damage inflicted while suffering from the latest CC (which obliterated the concept of player vs. player by rendering your opponent helpless to do anything, like a Roofie)

3. It dissipates and makes u vulnerable to more CCs while you are locked in the last CC -- which is maybe of no matter, since you can easily be killed while you are full resolve and still in CC.

 

Perhaps if two things were to happen Resolve might be an effective PvP balancing tool:

 

1. CCs break with damage

2. Full resolve bar breaks the CC.

[LenrocNewDawn]

No. YOU are simply focused on the 'technical' aspect. This thread is about the Resolve being "broken". Just because it's working as programmed, doesn't mean it can't still be a broken system.

 

Lemme give you an example. Just because these road signs say what they intended, doesn't mean they're not confusing, and I'd argue, 'broken' for serving the purpose they were intended to serve.

 

I see Resolve the same way. Too many CCs simply bypass Resolve which makes it a confusing, frustrating and 'broken' system for serving the purpose many believe it's supposed to serve.

 

Belief isn't equal to knowledge. People all round the world have different beliefs. Some believe that after they die they'll go in a place that has rivers of honey and milk. Others that they will be reincarnated as a dog/monkey etc. And so on. Everybody (well, almost) knows that Earth is round contrary to what everybody believed almost four centuries ago. My point is, to others it doesn't matter what you believe only matter what you know and can prove. Sadly it seems that even that isn't enough.

 

BTW. About your signs example. You know that if they are posted at a crossroad indicating to alternative routes to get in the same place they yet may serve their propose after all? Are they a bit confusing? Yes they are. Could have BW made a more exhaustive manual in which to explain different mechanics of the game? Yes they could have. Though that doesn't mean that said mechanics are broken just because you believe and say so.

 

@Appletazz

 

1 True .

2 You know you can do that too? I mean kill a player while he's stunned.

3 False . I dare you to win the chalenge .

and

1 That's the way it is now with most CC's. They break on damage.

2 Overpowered, would act like a second CC breaker. But, what the hell, I could live with that.

Edited April 4, 2012 by LenrocNewDawn

[Appletaz]

@Appletazz

 

1 True .

2 You know you can do that too? I mean kill a player while he's stunned.

3 False . I dare you to win the chalenge .

and

1 That's the way it is now with most CC's. They break on damage.

2 Overpowered, would act like a second CC breaker. But, what the hell, I could live with that.

Re: 2 -- Well, it is rarely just one person and usually multiple people. Hardly an argument for being full resolved, rendered helpless and killed without able to take an action on your own behalf. Remember the reference I made to Roofies? It's like that.

RE: 3 -- you only say it is false because you haven't paid attention. I don't do videos, so I can't help you there. I have watched myself be strangled and my resolve bar go to almost zero before I was let out of the hold, and of course I barely am alive when that happens, so one huff and puff and im gone.

 

AND

 

1. Actually, that is NOT true. The only ones that break on damage are the class one that CCs the target for 60 seconds. All the others don't.

2. I am really puzzled why you find making your opponent helpless and unable to fight back is so appealing to you. But perhaps full resolve would make u immune to damage, might be the thing.

Edited April 4, 2012 by Appletaz

[Regurgitate]

As much as you want to think its working as intended you can get hit with like 6 knockbacks before your resolve fills up in a short amount of time because of the instant resolve decay.

Considering that most knockbacks can be talented for a stun/immobilize I shouldn't be able to be hit with 4 + knockbacks and still not have full resolve because of the instant decay on it.

 

 

 

Working as intended or not thats F U K E D when 2 of my moves fill up your resolve bar instantly

Edited April 4, 2012 by Regurgitate

[LenrocNewDawn]

@Appletaz. We can't have a serious dialogue here if you don't get your facts straight.

 

Re. RE. 2 Even w/o the CCs you'll still be dying in most 1vsN

 

Re. RE. 3 Accusing me of not paying attention is a bit meh , still .... What you describe might happen and it's working as intended when the choke is the one that fills your resolve and you don't have your CD breaker active. Minimum resolve is 12 seconds while the choke is 4 seconds long so you'll have 8 more seconds of immunity. Nobody stated otherwise.

 

and

 

1 All mazes break on damage most roots do the same. Stuns and snares persist through.

2 He can do the same to me. CCs and resolve are modifiers that add a bit of depth to the game. Some timing and attention is needed besides stroking your keys in a sequence and running around like a headless chicken. I don't understand why some of you find mindless bashing till dead appealing. BTW Diablo 3 will come out shortly so....

[Scoobings]

My real major beef with the resolve system is that you start to lose resolve while CCed. I don't think that's fair, as anyone will tell you if you eat a full cyclone that fills your resolve you'll only have like 2 seconds of CC immunity afterward (which is BS). Other than that I think the system works well.

 

Maybe this game could benefit from a few moves that on activation break certain kinds of CC (sort of like the mage blink vs stun mechanic), but in general I feel like it works well.

Edited April 4, 2012 by Scoobings

[Darth_Philar]

Re: 2 -- Well, it is rarely just one person and usually multiple people. Hardly an argument for being full resolved, rendered helpless and killed without able to take an action on your own behalf. Remember the reference I made to Roofies? It's like that.

RE: 3 -- you only say it is false because you haven't paid attention. I don't do videos, so I can't help you there. I have watched myself be strangled and my resolve bar go to almost zero before I was let out of the hold, and of course I barely am alive when that happens, so one huff and puff and im gone.

 

AND

 

1. Actually, that is NOT true. The only ones that break on damage are the class one that CCs the target for 60 seconds. All the others don't.

2. I am really puzzled why you find making your opponent helpless and unable to fight back is so appealing to you. But perhaps full resolve would make u immune to damage, might be the thing.

 

Step 1: Read about how Resolve actually works and forget about how you want it to work.

Step 2: Learn to play within the parameters of what Resolve can do.

 

Essentially, your problem is not with CC, your problem is with using your CC breaker too soon. Never use your Breaker if your resolve bar is not white. You will find Resolve to be a much more forgiving and even beneficial feature when you learn how to use it to your advantage.

[kweassa]

As much as you want to think its working as intended you can get hit with like 6 knockbacks before your resolve fills up in a short amount of time because of the instant resolve decay.

 

(1) Each pull/KB is 400 resolve. 3 consecutive pull/KBs and you are over full resolve.

 

(2) Resolve decays at 25 resolve/sec when not full. In order to get KBd 6 times, you need on average 6~8 second intervals between each knocks cast upon you, and the slightest mistake will result in full resolve.

 

(3) 8 seconds is plenty enough time to position yourself to avoid KBs.

 

(4) Take time to read up and learn the how the system works, before pretending you know enough to comment on whether the system works or not.

 

 

Considering that most knockbacks can be talented for a stun/immobilize I shouldn't be able to be hit with 4 + knockbacks and still not have full resolve because of the instant decay on it.

 

Like I said, at most you get chain-knocked twice. The third puts you on resolve.

 

You can get more knocks than that if multiple enemy players time the knocks in perfect coordination with certain time intervals, but then those time intervals are plenty enough for you to try some kind of counter action. If you can't do that, then obviously, you need to learn/practice how to.

 

 

Working as intended or not thats F U K E D when 2 of my moves fill up your resolve bar instantly

 

Again, please take time to learn how things work, before propagating garbage myths to mislead people.

[Kaarsa]

 

1. Actually, that is NOT true. The only ones that break on damage are the class one that CCs the target for 60 seconds. All the others don't.

 

 

There is not a single skill that can CC player for 60 seconds. 60 seconds is against mobs. Commenting anything else posted by you after something like this is just a waste of time.

 

Try to get your fact straight and then we can discuss.

 

 

(2) Resolve decays at 25 resolve/sec when not full. In order to get KBd 6 times, you need on average 6~8 second intervals between each knocks cast upon you, and the slightest mistake will result in full resolve.

 

Actually, it is even better. Resolve before turning white decays at 25/sec after about 6 seconds since you were hit by last CC effect. To knock you back 6 times in the row, after first 2 times, that can be done back to back, you have to wait 6 sec + 400/25 sec = 22 seconds. It is probably better to just do third knockback, give target 1600 resolve and let it dacay, then you can knock hom back again 3 times;)

 

As much as you want to think its working as intended you can get hit with like 6 knockbacks before your resolve fills up in a short amount of time because of the instant resolve decay.

Considering that most knockbacks can be talented for a stun/immobilize I shouldn't be able to be hit with 4 + knockbacks and still not have full resolve because of the instant decay on it.

 

 

 

Working as intended or not thats F U K E D when 2 of my moves fill up your resolve bar instantly

 

1. Video of someone being knocked back 6 times in short time before filling oyur resolve please. It is impossible and we all know it.

 

2. "most knockbacks has a stun/immobilize" really? Really? Force push has a knockdown, sorc and sniper aoe knockback has a root (sorc has to talent it). End of the list. Hardly "most", considering merc has 2 knockbacks, assasin has a knockback and not every sorc has root on knockback talented.

 

3. You probably read my other thread and you still spread this nonsence? Seriously? But hey, thanks for bumps:)

 

My real major beef with the resolve system is that you start to lose resolve while CCed. I don't think that's fair, as anyone will tell you if you eat a full cyclone that fills your resolve you'll only have like 2 seconds of CC immunity afterward (which is BS).

/QUOTE]

 

Actually, I am in the process of proving that this is really BS. From what I know now, it looks like you get at least 1200 resolve when it turn white, even if last CC should give you only 1000 (ie. you had 200, you were hit by 8 sec mez, you end with 1200 resolve). It will leave you with 4 seconds of CC immunity after mezz runs out.

Edited April 4, 2012 by Kaarsa