Is Revan overrated?

[Spartanik]

I think that I am with Spartanik on this one (at least partly)...

 

You have to admit that this guy got a point. It is kind of... I don't know maybe sad, to claim that certain character IS MORE POWERFUL BECAUSE CANON STATES SO - THE END, YOUR ARGUMENT IS INVALID.

 

The reality that applies to all countless Revan vs Vader, Sidious vs Vitiate (and the list goes on...) topics ever created is that it is impossible to definitely state the unquestionably most powerful characters. It all depends on the situation and the way you interpret it. "But from an artistic and dramatic standpoint, this kind of question has no “right” answer. Each character has strengths and weaknesses, and they grow and change as their stories progress. On any given day, at any given time, under any given circumstance anyone can win or lose. That’s what dramatic conflict is all about."

 

i might have been sarcastic while trying to make that point. i apoligize if i ofended someone, when you got the case presented to you in sarcastic way why not answer in the same kind. BUt is a bit weary hearing what is most powerfull and what is that in all these threads and disregard what made all this characters great the most wich certainly wasnt their power ... and people fail to see that a competition to see who has the bigger thing it doenst matter and its childish... so Revan isnt the most powerfull because canon says so your argument is invalid... why do i care, ill take revan or HK 47 every day of the week any time then anakin or C3PO or the big cliché bad guy Sidious. And people call me fanboy for that what a hell?!

I still find Vader awesome though. And it was his power that mad him awesome? very very partialy i must say, his looks his merceless ways the way he sounded for instance. It wanst his showings of power for certain, as the original triology didnt had the technology that the prequels had.

Edited March 4, 2012 by Spartanik

[Rayla_Felana]

KOTOR 1 is a masterpiece and Revan is it's protagonist, he saved the galaxy by destroying the Starforge and Malak. Even in his darkness he prepared the Republic for war while attacking he was actively toughening it for the coming of Darth Vitiate(why the hell can't anyone write the man's name right?), He was inspiring enough to lead an entire faction of Jedi to fight the Mandalorians which despite Master Vandar's views was a very much needed action. If it wasn't for Revan, Bastila Carth and the others the Sith would have conquered the galaxy 300 years before TOR.

Meetra Surik is certainly accomplished but this "she did all the hard work" does not connect with my memories of kotor 2, a rather unfinished game by the way. Kreia used her to take vengeance upon her apprentices and destroy the reminiscent Jedi Masters, then she killed Kreia and went to Imperial space to try and find the greater threat to the galaxy, the end, halfway through she helped save the Jedi from extinction

Both very accomplished but Revan's feats carried more weight, maybe if KOTOR II was finished in time some more of it would have made greater sense at the time. Either way one cannot simply say he is a wannabe. It's like saying Luke Skywalker or Obi-wan Kenobi didn't have any impact in the galaxy.

 

 

PS - HK-47 is the greatest joy in KOTOR I and II, he was worth the game alone it doesn't matter if he can blow up planets or not... In fact I was very sad to shoot him to screaps in False Emperor.

 

I completely disagree with every single point you made.

 

KotOR is the original trilogy shuffled up and with a few more lightsabers thrown into the mix.

 

Revan is Vader, a poorly written Vader.

 

And actually, Revan was Vitiate or the Jedi's puppet the entire time.

 

Meetra Surik was the sole reason the galaxy wasn't wiped out of all life.

 

But let me go more in-depth than that.

 

Meetra was the last real Jedi left, despite being officially exiled, when she returned to the galactic picture, the Jedi Order as was known in KotOR was dead, hunted to extinction, it was then that she continued her undaunted service to the Republic and the Order.

 

Everyone else had packed up their bags and given up, Revan was gone, the few Jedi that remained were either arrogant and stuck in their ways or they had fauked to understand what had happened due to in-action, complacency and apathy, in her travels she took and trained six padawans simultaneously(Yes canonically she trained Brianna, Atton, Bao-dur, Mical and Mira, and taught a redeemed Visas Marr the ways of the Jedi.), later named the Lost Jedi and she redeemed High Council member Atris, she set the pillars and the first bricks of the rebuilt Order, she is the sole reason a Jedi Order even existed past KotOR II.

 

Without Meetra restabilizing the Republic through her travels, it would have inevitably fallen, as GO-TO and Mical both revealed, the Republic was dying and Surik was the only way to stop that collapse, in three standard months, the Republic would have collapsed, and the galaxy would've been thrown into chaos and civil war.

 

But perhaps most importantly, when everyone else just hid and let the Sith steadily control the galactic picture, Surik regained her powers and quickly became strong enough to be noticed by the Sith, to the point where she was the last threat left in the galaxy, she assumed a higher rank, let's assume Jedi Master, and decided not to hide, she took the Sith head on, on Korriban and Onderon, she reunited the Jedi High Council in the Jedi Enclave and for a second time accepted Exile, but Kreia assumed the position of Darth Traya and killed them, it was at this moment that she achieved Force Enlightenment, full mastery of the Light Side of the Force, through the revelations of her life, through accepting her exile.

 

Then she went on to destroy the Sith Triumvirate, first at Telos IV, saving the galaxy from Nihilus, then at Malachor V, where her full power was on display, on Malachor V, in the Trayus Academy, in the midst of a great Dark Side Nexus, by herself she defeated about a hundred Sith Marauders, Assassins and Lords, then killed Darth Sion and then killed Darth Traya, where she stated Surik was the finest student she had ever trained.

 

Now when you think about it, all Revan did was clean up his own mess, and keep the Jedi from finding out what the true dark threat behind the Mandalorians was, he handed the Sith Emperor exactly what he wanted, a distraction, a way to weaken the republic, He failed to deliver the Star Forge to him, but he did deliver the death of the Jedi and the Republic to him, only Surik prevented all of that.

Edited March 4, 2012 by Rayla_Felana

[Darth_Eminok]

I completely disagree with every single point you made.

 

KotOR is the original trilogy shuffled up and with a few more lightsabers thrown into the mix.

 

Revan is Vader, a poorly written Vader.

 

And actually, Revan was Vitiate or the Jedi's puppet the entire time.

 

Meetra Surik was the sole reason the galaxy wasn't wiped out of all life.

 

But let me go more in-depth than that.

 

Meetra was the last real Jedi left, despite being officially exiled, when she returned to the galactic picture, the Jedi Order as was known in KotOR was dead, hunted to extinction, it was then that she continued her undaunted service to the Republic and the Order.

 

Everyone else had packed up their bags and given up, Revan was gone, the few Jedi that remained were either arrogant and stuck in their ways or they had fauked to understand what had happened due to in-action, complacency and apathy, in her travels she took and trained six padawans simultaneously(Yes canonically she trained Brianna, Atton, Bao-dur, Mical and Mira, and taught a redeemed Visas Marr the ways of the Jedi.), later named the Lost Jedi and she redeemed High Council member Atris, she set the pillars and the first bricks of the rebuilt Order, she is the sole reason a Jedi Order even existed past KotOR II.

 

Without Meetra restabilizing the Republic through her travels, it would have inevitably fallen, as GO-TO and Mical both revealed, the Republic was dying and Surik was the only way to stop that collapse, in three standard months, the Republic would have collapsed, and the galaxy would've been thrown into chaos and civil war.

 

But perhaps most importantly, when everyone else just hid and let the Sith steadily control the galactic picture, Surik regained her powers and quickly became strong enough to be noticed by the Sith, to the point where she was the last threat left in the galaxy, she assumed a higher rank, let's assume Jedi Master, and decided not to hide, she took the Sith head on, on Korriban and Onderon, she reunited the Jedi High Council in the Jedi Enclave and for a second time accepted Exile, but Kreia assumed the position of Darth Traya and killed them, it was at this moment that she achieved Force Enlightenment, full mastery of the Light Side of the Force, through the revelations of her life, through accepting her exile.

 

Then she went on to destroy the Sith Triumvirate, first at Telos IV, saving the galaxy from Nihilus, then at Malachor V, where her full power was on display, on Malachor V, in the Trayus Academy, in the midst of a great Dark Side Nexus, by herself she defeated about a hundred Sith Marauders, Assassins and Lords, then killed Darth Sion and then killed Darth Traya, where she stated Surik was the finest student she had ever trained.

 

Now when you think about it, all Revan did was clean up his own mess, and keep the Jedi from finding out what the true dark threat behind the Mandalorians was, he handed the Sith Emperor exactly what he wanted, a distraction, a way to weaken the republic, He failed to deliver the Star Forge to him, but he did deliver the death of the Jedi and the Republic to him, only Surik prevented all of that.

 

I absolutely appalud that you know how the Kotor storyline works and who did what and who made a difference,

[Wolfninjajedi]

I absolutely appalud that you know how the Kotor storyline works and who did what and who made a difference,

 

Well tbh, it all ain't that hard to figure out even if you just play the games its pretty straight forward and clean cut.

Edited March 4, 2012 by Wolfninjajedi

[Rayla_Felana]

I absolutely applaud that you know how the Kotor storyline works and who did what and who made a difference.

 

Why thank you, in all honesty it isn't that hard to understand when you have gone through the games and the Revan book, as well as read the Roleplaying game based on KotOR, etc...a big fan can figure this out quite quickly, hell wookieepedia even has it down to a T without mis-information.

Edited March 4, 2012 by Rayla_Felana

[Darth_Eminok]

Why thank you, in all honesty it isn't that hard to understand when you have gone through the games and the Revan book, as well as read the Roleplaying game based on KotOR, etc...a big fan can figure this out quite quickly, hell wookieepedia even has it down to a T without mis-information.

 

Well some people apparently don't really know it and I'm glad you cleared it up a bit.

[BrandonSM]

Incoming Revanite destroyers, we can't repel fanboyism of that magnitude!

 

Magnetize! Magnetize!

[Darth_Solrac]

I don't care what any hater says frankly.

 

ANYONE that can lead en entire group of Jedi/disciples to war under his banner & save the Republic, become the Dark Lord of the Sith & nearly conquer & the Republic, redeem himself & kill the new Dark Lord, etc. does deserve said honorable mention....at least....cmon....

[BrandonSM]

I don't care what any hater says frankly.

 

ANYONE that can lead en entire group of Jedi/disciples to war under his banner & save the Republic, become the Dark Lord of the Sith & nearly conquer & the Republic, redeem himself & kill the new Dark Lord, etc. does deserve said honorable mention....at least....cmon....

 

The only combat achievements was killing Mandalore the Ultimate and Malak.

 

And killing Malak wasn't that big of a deal, he sparred with him thousands of times and always defeated him. Malak tried to kill him by destroying his ship, a cheap way to kill. Malak was not impressive.

 

 

Mandalore the Ultimate really means nothing... Vader fought to a draw with the greatest BH and Mandalore ever.

 

 

If he gets an honorable mention for NEARLY conquering the Republic, then Vader gets an extremely honorable mention.

 

 

Sidious invaded the known galaxy politically.

 

Vader did it physically. He invaded dozens of worlds including some of the toughest armies of the Republic, Kashyyk is a prime example. He went into the temple killed around 10 masters and slaughtered numerous nameless Knights and Padawans. Possibly hundreds.

 

 

Vader's time was the time of the Golden Age of the Jedi. The Jedi Order at its best, and he slaughtered a huge deal with his legion of STORMTROOPERS. Revan had an mass army of JEDI behind him.

 

 

He didn't redeem himself. The Jedi redeemed him, they had to erase his memory in order for him to change. Vader chose that decision by himself.

 

I use Vader as an example becuase thats what most used. But I can use other Examples if you'd prefer it.

Edited March 4, 2012 by BrandonSM

[Souluntar]

I don't care what anyone says. Revan is a monster. No true Jedi would ever consider complete genocide of an entire group of people. If what HK-47 is true and 97 some percent of the imperial population is subject to extermination then how many of those people are civilians? He is completely obsessed with destroying the empire beyond all reason.

 

Revan seems to be the type of guy that the ends justify the means. If he was truly a master of the force he wouldn't have given in to the dark side halfway through the fight to beat us. He is incredibly overrated. He's cool but people just worship him for no reason.

 

uhhhh Revan? monster? that can't be right. If he was a monster he would have used the star forge to conquer the galaxy, if he was a monster he would have killed the ppl who saved him, if he was a monster he would not have saved the republic from the mandalorians. Look at it this way the reason why he thought he had to do it, is because he had just been locked up for 300 years and scared half to death by the emperor while trying to resist him. He was not himself. Revan ain't overrated, because not only did he fight back the mandalorians but he mastered both Light and Dark which no other jedi had done before and there is a reason why he is called the prodigal knight. and yes i am a fan of Revan but i don't worship the guy lol Cade Skywalker and Galen Marek ftw!

[BrandonSM]

uhhhh Revan? monster? that can't be right. If he was a monster he would have used the star forge to conquer the galaxy, if he was a monster he would have killed the ppl who saved him, if he was a monster he would not have saved the republic from the mandalorians. Look at it this way the reason why he thought he had to do it, is because he had just been locked up for 300 years and scared half to death by the emperor while trying to resist him. He was not himself. Revan ain't overrated, because not only did he fight back the mandalorians but he mastered both Light and Dark which no other jedi had done before and there is a reason why he is called the prodigal knight. and yes i am a fan of Revan but i don't worship the guy lol Cade Skywalker and Galen Marek ftw!

 

Are you being sarcastic I can't tell?

 

 

He did use the star forge to try to conquer the galaxy.

Scared half to death? He seemed pretty confident and sure of himself in the Flashpoint.

Luke, Katarn, and many other Jedi have Dakr and Light Abilities. Give me 3 Dark Abilities that he used, if your going to use the Force Lightning with Nyriss thats worng. It states in the Novel he DELFECTED the lightning, absorbed it and delfected it. It was not his lightning.

Edited March 4, 2012 by BrandonSM

[Spartanik]

Why thank you, in all honesty it isn't that hard to understand when you have gone through the games and the Revan book, as well as read the Roleplaying game based on KotOR, etc...a big fan can figure this out quite quickly, hell wookieepedia even has it down to a T without mis-information.

 

what you said is all true.. but i fail to see how is revan not a great character at all.

Pretty much like vader. Who didnt even clean up his mess, he in the end just trow the Emperor into the reactor core. my point is you are making it so that people shouldnt like revan at all and should like the exile instead because what she prevented and because what she did, its only valid if you like the exile as character. What you fail to realize that all that is irrelevant people will like a character taht is the center of a good story kotor 2 didnt had a good story or was unfinished . Revan is like vader a trágic hero. with all his power and being an legend ,and a great general he still falls to the dark side, he still is not perfect he is still so much familiar with all humanity and its faults. In the end that is what makes revan great as character as well vader. The redemption. the exile dint had any of that. imo the exile (canon) was the perfect jedi, the perfect good hero, she did everything as it was expected of a good jedi, she just let krei teach her just because there is so manny plot holes in kotor 2. there is no suprise there. As much i like kotor 2 and the exile the game was unfinished and it sucked because of it. You can say had a much more darker atmosphere yes it did , it was good about that, but in the end no épic feeling no sense of acomplishment. This as a game, as a character what Bioware did to Revan pales in comparison what they did to the exile. Just a loyal servent, the good general that Revan had, that still helps him after her death.

In the end you can say that revan need her alot, but you can also say that with out revan surik was nothing as well.

 

He didn't redeem himself. The Jedi redeemed him, they had to erase his memory in order for him to change. Vader chose that decision by himself.

 

I use Vader as an example becuase thats what most used. But I can use other Examples if you'd prefer it.

well It is diferent Revan was brainwashed by the emperor trough his power, revan and malak a like, just like the elite personal guard of the emperor were. he coulndt turn to the light just like that. vader chose to join Sidious on his will too wich make him a bigger monster btw. And on the redemption part... comom you cant be that blunt... you didnt think that his son luke hadnt nothing to do with his redemption at all? He didnt do it alone you know. Revan didnt do it alone as well so. In the end he folow his nature wich it was and always had been the light side.

Edited March 4, 2012 by Spartanik

[Aximand]

uhhhh Revan? monster? that can't be right. If he was a monster he would have used the star forge to conquer the galaxy, if he was a monster he would have killed the ppl who saved him, if he was a monster he would not have saved the republic from the mandalorians. Look at it this way the reason why he thought he had to do it, is because he had just been locked up for 300 years and scared half to death by the emperor while trying to resist him. He was not himself. Revan ain't overrated, because not only did he fight back the mandalorians but he mastered both Light and Dark which no other jedi had done before and there is a reason why he is called the prodigal knight. and yes i am a fan of Revan but i don't worship the guy lol Cade Skywalker and Galen Marek ftw!

 

I am so tired of people citing that as a reason why "Revan is awesum!". The Unifying Force (as that was called) has been completely retconned. You either use the Light Side, or the Dark Side, there is no in between.

 

What was it that Luke Skywalker said? "There's either the Light Side, or the Dark side. There's no in between, Ben." (Paraphrased).

[_Zorth_]

Of course Revan is overrated. He only cleaned up his own mess..

I'm even going to say that Meetra Surik did greater accomplishments than Revan.

 

Only reason people love him so much is because he was an empty vessel for them to crawl into. He has no emotions, goals, morals.. except for the ones we give him. I enjoyed KoToR like everyone else, But I don't get attached to empty characters.

 

EDIT:

 

BW realised that Revan had no great accomplishments so they tried to give him something cool.. Balance of the force. Well, That doesn't exist. There is only the force and the dark side. You can't control both of them at the same time, Revan never was at peace. He was planning to commit genocide on 97% of the entire Imperial population and was crazy.

 

Edited March 4, 2012 by _Zorth_

[face_hindu]

What the hell is a Revan?

[Lightmaguz]

stuff

 

kotor 2's jedi purge never made much sense and was always a poorly written excuse to rebuild the storyline from scratch with a new character. The fact that Bastila and all the other companions from kotor I were alive and doing abso- *********** -lutely nothing about it alone made no sense at all. See what I did there? Same argument, different point of view. I also completely disagree to every point you've made. the "force enlightenment" ******** alone reeked of "let's make our character special!" as stated beforehand it is very clear during the game that he toughened up and prepared the Reps for the next war in a period of peace, his military actions were above simple destruction.

Besides, all the "saving the jedi" stuff Surik did was merely being manipulated by Kreia like I said before. Bastila could easily train a few new apprentices and rebuild the Jedi order, which considering the noetikon storyline from the Jedi Consular and the fact the current Grand Master is her distant grand-daughter is likely true in part.

[XjediXrf]

Troll...

[ninjashadowdark]

Haters. You gotta love 'em.

 

Yep i agree not every one likes the main character in tor . LOL........ Oh wait this guy in the form let me start a Revan, depate XD

[BrandonSM]

what you said is all true.. but i fail to see how is revan not a great character at all.

Pretty much like vader. Who didnt even clean up his mess, he in the end just trow the Emperor into the reactor core. my point is you are making it so that people shouldnt like revan at all and should like the exile instead because what she prevented and because what she did, its only valid if you like the exile as character. What you fail to realize that all that is irrelevant people will like a character taht is the center of a good story kotor 2 didnt had a good story or was unfinished . Revan is like vader a trágic hero. with all his power and being an legend ,and a great general he still falls to the dark side, he still is not perfect he is still so much familiar with all humanity and its faults. In the end that is what makes revan great as character as well vader. The redemption. the exile dint had any of that. imo the exile (canon) was the perfect jedi, the perfect good hero, she did everything as it was expected of a good jedi, she just let krei teach her just because there is so manny plot holes in kotor 2. there is no suprise there. As much i like kotor 2 and the exile the game was unfinished and it sucked because of it. You can say had a much more darker atmosphere yes it did , it was good about that, but in the end no épic feeling no sense of acomplishment. This as a game, as a character what Bioware did to Revan pales in comparison what they did to the exile. Just a loyal servent, the good general that Revan had, that still helps him after her death.

In the end you can say that revan need her alot, but you can also say that with out revan surik was nothing as well.

 

 

well It is diferent Revan was brainwashed by the emperor trough his power, revan and malak a like, just like the elite personal guard of the emperor were. he coulndt turn to the light just like that. vader chose to join Sidious on his will too wich make him a bigger monster btw. And on the redemption part... comom you cant be that blunt... you didnt think that his son luke hadnt nothing to do with his redemption at all? He didnt do it alone you know. Revan didnt do it alone as well so. In the end he folow his nature wich it was and always had been the light side.

 

Do you see what your doing? Your making an arguement for your opponent, I'm not sure if Raayla will use it but I sure will.

 

 

You've already used many examples of how Vader and Revan are alike. And thats the problem, Revan is literally an exact copy of Vader if you look at their stories. Thats why I don't lke him.

[Aximand]

Yep i agree not every one likes the main character in tor . LOL........ Oh wait this guy in the form let me start a Revan, depate XD

 

Revan is hardly the main character in TOR. Sure he's a middle of the field player, but he's nowhere near as important as people like Malgus, Vitate, Satele and the others. I'd go as far to say he isn't even as important as the player character. ****, his cult on Dromund Kaas doesn't even live past level twenty.

Edited March 4, 2012 by Aximand

[Aitix]

Yeah, Revan is pretty overrated. Edited March 4, 2012 by Aitix

[Jurakan]

He was so uber he could have a wife and babies with the councils approval while other jedi rolled over in envy because he was so strong they wanted to keep him on their side. He also reshaped and galaxy as he saw fit which is more than I can say for half of your favorite characters who play their role and die without having acomplished anything whatsoever. He also held back the invasion of the emperor for 300 years and survived captivity. Since all of the sith impire gets flattened in the long run, and given the fact that the emperor (Vitiate) is killed by a crappy jedi, I have a feeling he had a lot to do with the destruction of the empire. Edited March 4, 2012 by Jurakan

[Aximand]

He was so uber he could have a wife and babies with the councils approval because he was so strong they wanted to keep him on their side. He also reshaped and galaxy as he saw fit which is more than I can say for half of your favorite characters who play their role and die without having acomplished anything whatsoever. He also held back the invasion of the emperor for 300 years and survived captivity. Since all of the sith impire gets flattened in the long run, and given the fact that the emperor (Vitiate) is killed by a crappy jedi, I have a feeling he had a lot to do with the destruction of the empire.

 

You have absolutely no idea what you're talking about, do you?

[Jurakan]

I read all of the old republic novels, and beat kotor 1 and 2 and are battlemaster here. I am sure I know a lot more than you do!

[Jumpwings]

All I know is that i enjoyed playing "as Revan" many times (once dark, many lightside) in KOTOR I.....and i enjoyed played "the EXILE' many times in KOTOR II (even though I hated the nerfed ending and didn't even appreciate Kreia killing all the Jedi masters i had collected with such great difficulty and danger)..........I got to roleplay some interesting characters in a "StarWars" setting.......over and over again...I followed this debate and some of it was over my head, and i still don't understand all the acrimony....One of the things I like about SWOTOR is that they have some interesting Revan-related stuff (storyline plots, quests, etc).

Now, I have taken none of my characters past 30 , rep or imp, so I don't exactly know what the references are to "fighting Revan in some mission in the mid 30s's" is all about, and I don't care.....I just like the Revan stuff they put into this game, solely because I spent so many enjoyable hours playing him in a game.

Until i read this debate it never occurred to me he would be compared favorably or unfavorably to some other various "StarWars" characters.....It is ALL fiction!

I had, I admit, always considered Revan as pretty darn powerful BEFORE I roleplayed him; and I felt powerful playing as him.....My knowledge of post 30 game content is nil and my StarWars canonical knowledge is minimal, but......I LIKE REVAN, so back off (please?)