WutsInAName Posted March 1, 2012 Share Posted March 1, 2012 Bottom line is it is more competitive. Get rid of the Exp stat, its just stupid anyway. No Im not a scrub, yes I have full Champ, and yes I still think resilance err expertise needs to go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Agemnon Posted March 1, 2012 Share Posted March 1, 2012 I think resil in WoW was a bad idea. Get rid of resil/expertise so we can make room for crit and haste instead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BDutch Posted March 1, 2012 Share Posted March 1, 2012 You could probably save some time rehashing this by necro'ing one of the 1000 page threads with a similar title/subject. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jokerxdragon Posted March 1, 2012 Share Posted March 1, 2012 Congratulations, you are op number 1000 on the subject! You win nothing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WutsInAName Posted March 1, 2012 Author Share Posted March 1, 2012 You could probably save some time rehashing this by necro'ing one of the 1000 page threads with a similar title/subject. I was going to but then I remebered necro's were that other game. I did try to forcewalk one, no success. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AMKSED Posted March 1, 2012 Share Posted March 1, 2012 Bad player still crying about expertise 3 months later? Blasphemy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WutsInAName Posted March 1, 2012 Author Share Posted March 1, 2012 PS> Also, why can't blizz sue the crap out of em for such a blatant straight up copy? Im not a legal guru but would like to hear ones take on this. All those mobile companies are sueing eachother for less it seems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ironcleaver Posted March 1, 2012 Share Posted March 1, 2012 It's kind of like how PvP was in Warhammer - level 1 though 12 was the best PvP in the game becasue there was almost no CC at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redmarx Posted March 1, 2012 Share Posted March 1, 2012 (edited) 2 things: - Expertise is not really a major problem. Everyone has just over 10%. So it evens out. If you don't have enough expertise, that's your problem really, it's easy to get. - If you remove expertise, then Rakata gear will be better than PVP gear for PVP (yes, it sort of already is). If you mean Rakata and PVP gear should have the same stats, then people will gear up for PVE via PVP, or vice versa. The whole idea of expertise is to keep the 2 paths separate. Edited March 1, 2012 by Redmarx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ironcleaver Posted March 1, 2012 Share Posted March 1, 2012 PS> Also, why can't blizz sue the crap out of em for such a blatant straight up copy? Im not a legal guru but would like to hear ones take on this. All those mobile companies are sueing eachother for less it seems. Becasue blizz brought very little to the genre that was original, so if they sued, they would be sued heavily in return and for a lot more instances. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bewl Posted March 1, 2012 Share Posted March 1, 2012 2 things: - Expertise is not really a major problem. Everyone has just over 10%. So it evens out. If you don't have enough expertise, that's your problem really, it's easy to get. - If you remove expertise, then Rakata gear will be better than PVP gear for PVP (yes, it sort of already is). If you mean Rakata and PVP gear should have the same stats, then people will gear up for PVE via PVP, or vice versa. The whole idea of expertise is to keep the 2 paths separate. This --^ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pekish Posted March 1, 2012 Share Posted March 1, 2012 (edited) pvp is ALWAYS in any game i played more fun 10-49 or whatever the cap is rather then the cap itself because while people is levelling they dont have time to min/max gear Hardcore ruin the fun it's already been proven they change the game in a job not only for themselves but for everybody they meet in game. Edited March 1, 2012 by Pekish Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mordredz Posted March 1, 2012 Share Posted March 1, 2012 Bottom line is it is more competitive. Get rid of the Exp stat, its just stupid anyway. No Im not a scrub, yes I have full Champ, and yes I still think resilance err expertise needs to go. ya fun for a 40+ with all there skills/abilities not so much for the others, oh and another thread of the same cries... boring... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redmarx Posted March 1, 2012 Share Posted March 1, 2012 (edited) pvp is ALWAYS in any game i played more fun 10-49 or whatever the cap is rather then the cap itself because while people is levelling they dont have time to min/max gear Hardcore ruin the fun it's already been proven they change the game in a job not only for themselves but for everybody they meet in game. The sad truth is this. PVP is "fun" 1-49 because the people playing that bracket don't really care about the outcome, aren't proficient with their class, are bad at PVP and/or just queueing between quests. The standards are very low. At 50, you meet people who are actively PVPing as their endgame activity. So standards are suddenly higher, premades are thrown in the mix, and most people suddenly realise they're not as good as they thought they were. Edited March 1, 2012 by Redmarx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OdamanPrime Posted March 1, 2012 Share Posted March 1, 2012 (edited) Agreed, having a pvp stat is a lazy way to make pvp gear (which is bad to begin with, there are other ways to reward you for pvping that are actually more gratifying than a new piece of armor that looks like crap) better than pve gear for pvp. Overall though gear is going to be an issue until these idiots realize that hard stat caps are better than slightly bumping up stats every so often sometimes breaking their system that they supposedly work so hard to balance. Edited March 1, 2012 by OdamanPrime Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WutsInAName Posted March 1, 2012 Author Share Posted March 1, 2012 (edited) 2 things: - Expertise is not really a major problem. Everyone has just over 10%. So it evens out. If you don't have enough expertise, that's your problem really, it's easy to get. - If you remove expertise, then Rakata gear will be better than PVP gear for PVP (yes, it sort of already is). If you mean Rakata and PVP gear should have the same stats, then people will gear up for PVE via PVP, or vice versa. The whole idea of expertise is to keep the 2 paths separate. I see what your saying but 2 paths to the same gear(or stats) is fine. In fact right now, I am trying to gear an alt and having a heck of a time gearing PVE. No one runs HM's anymore on my server and it IS populated. There is literally no incentive for anyone who has been through EV even 2 times. Infact all the CAN gain really is a hefty repair bill. (I dont run HM on my main either for this reason as the risk far outweighs potential reward, which is bubcus) As it stands right now for new 50's PVP IS THE ONLY VIABLE GEAR PATH for gearing up. Edited March 1, 2012 by WutsInAName Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kai-Eurah-Tird Posted March 1, 2012 Share Posted March 1, 2012 10-49 bracket is fun if you're a headless chicken stumbling about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conchobar Posted March 1, 2012 Share Posted March 1, 2012 2 things: - Expertise is not really a major problem. Everyone has just over 10%. So it evens out. If you don't have enough expertise, that's your problem really, it's easy to get. - If you remove expertise, then Rakata gear will be better than PVP gear for PVP (yes, it sort of already is). If you mean Rakata and PVP gear should have the same stats, then people will gear up for PVE via PVP, or vice versa. The whole idea of expertise is to keep the 2 paths separate. My question to this would be simply... why? Best PvP game ever made (DaoC) did not have PvP gear like this game or WoW. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rapto Posted March 1, 2012 Share Posted March 1, 2012 Exp keeps the two different sets for their intended purposes. Working as intended. The problem I have is, in my case (DPS operative) I need to PvE for BiS PvP gear (2p rakata/BiS enhancements/PvE gun) and I need to PvP for BiS PvE gear (BM OH is better then rakata OH) This is where the imbalance comes into play. Fortunately I enjoy both aspects of gameplay, but for some who don't enjoy punching mobs this is a glaring issue when it comes down to competitiveness and Gabe's dream of this game becoming a e-sport. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kai-Eurah-Tird Posted March 1, 2012 Share Posted March 1, 2012 Say expertise gear is gone tomorrow and you as a fresh 50 come into a WZ, and you join a WZ, what would happen? You'd still get faceroll by guys in Rakata gear. Then instead of crying post about expertise, we'd have whining psot about "Why do I have to PVE raid to be good at PVP?" Vice versa, if expertise were remove from PVP gear, and PVP gear is exactly the same as T3 Rakata, we'd have QQ post about "Why bother raiding when PVP gear is just as good?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AncientForce Posted March 1, 2012 Share Posted March 1, 2012 Yeah that bracket is really fun for higher level players with all their abilities. Not so much for the lower levels that get rolled in 2-3 hits without any way to counter because they haven't unlocked the abilities yet. How is this different from geared players killing lower geared players in the 50's bracket? At least in that bracket everyone has all their abilities. It's these same fresh 50's who are used to being the big fish in that bracket who come here and whine about actually going against people their own level who have all their abilities that make these posts. Getting pvp gear is so trivial now that if you fail to get it, it's your own laziness and poor planning. Seriously...suck it up. Do you really expect to dominate when you solo queue? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jebi Posted March 1, 2012 Share Posted March 1, 2012 (edited) The sad truth is this. PVP is "fun" 1-49 because the people playing that bracket don't really care about the outcome, aren't proficient with their class, are bad at PVP and/or just queueing between quests. The standards are very low. At 50, you meet people who are actively PVPing as their endgame activity. So standards are suddenly higher, premades are thrown in the mix, and most people suddenly realise they're not as good as they thought they were. Also, re level 50 PVP: PVP is now about who has the better gear. People care too much about the outcome (gear grinds ftw), and rage quit constantly. Beating pugs with a pre-made is neither challenging or fun. Good as they thought they were? lol The real sad truth is that competitive PVP doesn't exist in TOR - not at level 10, not at level 50. Edited March 1, 2012 by Jebi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kaarsa Posted March 1, 2012 Share Posted March 1, 2012 The sad truth is this. PVP is "fun" 1-49 because the people playing that bracket don't really care about the outcome, aren't proficient with their class, are bad at PVP and/or just queueing between quests. The standards are very low. At 50, you meet people who are actively PVPing as their endgame activity. So standards are suddenly higher, premades are thrown in the mix, and most people suddenly realise they're not as good as they thought they were. Exactly this. In 10-49 bracket, 90% of players you will meet are just plain bad or are lev 12 when you are lev 49 or both. You feel as a god. Then you hit lev 50 and start to pvp against people who 1. Are much more experienced in pvp, and even bad players are on average better than bad players in 10-49 bracket. 2. Care about their gear. They tend to wear whatever is best equip they can get. And you are in lev 35 green gear, because it was enough in pve (which is so easy 10-49), and enough in 10-49 pvp (most players were just bad). Additionaly you just wasted all your credits on tier 3 speeder and on leveling abilities you never use in game (like stances you are not specced for) and you cant buy some reasonable gear from GTN. Instead of adapt, get better gear and learn to pvp you whine in pvp forum. Great job, it will make you a better pvper in SW TOR for sure... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WutsInAName Posted March 1, 2012 Author Share Posted March 1, 2012 (edited) I have 0 problems competeing at 50 I often but not always top the charts in CW and VS. I have 1 toon who is an A+ ball carrier, can run through mutiple battlemasters and laugh at thier dmg while scoring consitantly. I have 1 toon who plays A+ defence in huttball, i regularly do saves and people generally have a tough time getting the ball past me unless they are cooridinated with others. When I say its less compettitive I mean just that, every single game I have played at 50 was won by a large margin whether I was on winning team or not, the margin was just dominated. in 1-49 I had MANY matches that were right down to the wire. How many matches can you say were close at 50? I would guess not many if at all. Its like in sports, its no fun to watch the Lakers constantly win against the Wash clippers. No one buys tickets to those games. However a Lakers vs Bulls game sells out instantly. Same concept. No fun to watch or play a game of domination. Edited March 1, 2012 by WutsInAName Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StealthStalker Posted March 1, 2012 Share Posted March 1, 2012 (edited) Say expertise gear is gone tomorrow and you as a fresh 50 come into a WZ, and you join a WZ, what would happen? You'd still get faceroll by guys in Rakata gear. Then instead of crying post about expertise, we'd have whining psot about "Why do I have to PVE raid to be good at PVP?" Vice versa, if expertise were remove from PVP gear, and PVP gear is exactly the same as T3 Rakata, we'd have QQ post about "Why bother raiding when PVP gear is just as good?" No, you wouldn't get facerolled by people in rakata gear because the PvP gear would then have equivalent stats to make up for the loss of expertise. Expertise would then be moved to PvE gear, so you can't acquire PvP gear and then "faceroll" through PvE content, you'd still need to progress and acquire the new PvE stat. Removing Expertise doesn't mean removing the system completely. It means moving it somewhere else to accomplish the same goal: Make PvP more "even" regardless of where your gear comes from, require Progression in PvE. Try this thread: http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=275614 Such a system would mean more people can easily PvP due to no disparity in gear caused by Expertise alone. It still requires progression for PvE, since you still have to get "PvE Expertise" from previous content. It also helps combat gear-inflation, because the PvE stat is the main factor for PvE, not pure stats. Edited March 1, 2012 by StealthStalker Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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