Why do we have Cover?

[scootshoot]

Players back in the early WOW days playing Paladin made themselves work the Seal system as well, does not mean it did not need a change.

 

Took Blizzard 5 years to revamp the Paladins, we'll see how long it takes Bioware.

[Gassygunslinger]

While, yes, a gunslinger's best abilities require cover, the benefits of cover (particularly natural cover) hardly make it a "crutch". Even in PvP. Portable Cover gives you +20% Defense Chance (nothing to scoff at), and Natural Cover gives full immunity to non-AOE damage, as long as you're not currently popping up to shoot. Also gives full interruption immunity (for as long as you want it, not for as long as an ability lasts), immunity to force leaps (no one else can play Defense on Huttball like a smuggler, because everyone else is risking a force leap for an enemy gain), and with Hunker Down a long lasting CC immunity. The hell with mobility. You don't need it. In PVE, you can tank ranged enemies almost as well as real tanks. Once you lose the notion that ranged classes need to kite, you'll realize how much of an asset Cover can be.

[Game-Hermit]

i mean all we do is aim and pull a trigger, id assume people can do this while moving, i mean they do it in real life aswell.

 

Know what they call those people? Nothing, they're dead. The IRL tactic of choice is to camp behind cover and spray and pray.

[Mazneruk]

Jedi/Sith can't use their force leap abilities on someone that is in cover.

[Dylancholy]

I *********** love cover.

Taking it away would weaken the gunslinger class so much.

And

Nearly all of the important moves (speed shot, aimed shot) are channeled or have a casting time anyway.

So removing cover would just make the gunslinger slightly *******r.

[Ugugg]

for pvp, if you are in cover, ppl can not leap, grapple you. So when you're at the edge of huttball make sure you are in cover every time. This is a pvp thing only though.

 

Even as melee the sab charge still hits like a truck. You can press f, skill and even though it hasn't animated, it still pops.

[DarthLightSide]

The problem isn't just that cover exists, but that so many important abilities (at least, as a Gunslinger) cannot be used except from cover. If it was just a defensive bonus, maybe an energy regen increase (like Foxhole gives), with a few non-key abilities limited to cover, it would not feel nearly so restrictive.

 

Taking cover from gunfire is totally reasonable, thematically. Being unable to shoot effectively except from cover is a bit sillier.

 

+1 on that. Cover should give defense bonus and energy regen etc....but limiting many very useful weapon powers and utility powers to cover only is.....a huge handicap compared to other classes. Especially our KB. Wow, what a useless KB it is compared to others who can do it on the move and at any given second. Our is....Cover, wait a second for an already bugged power to work, then hopefully get our KB off before we're cc'd....or already dead due to our super low surviveability.

Edited March 2, 2012 by DarthLightSide

[ikinai]

shift+f

[Amien]

It's actually quite hard to fire ANYTHING on the move. THe Gunslinger and Sniper are all about making trick shots or difficult shots. You don't see people running around trying to do professional trick shots ;P

[Gassygunslinger]

+1 on that. Cover should give defense bonus and energy regen etc....but limiting many very useful weapon powers and utility powers to cover only is.....a huge handicap compared to other classes. Especially our KB. Wow, what a useless KB it is compared to others who can do it on the move and at any given second. Our is....Cover, wait a second for an already bugged power to work, then hopefully get our KB off before we're cc'd....or already dead due to our super low surviveability.

 

Okay, I don't want to be rude, but I believe we need a fact check here.

 

First off, our KB (Killing Blow), AKA Quickdraw does not require cover. You can shoot it on the run, at a range of 35m. And, correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe there is an epic set that increases its range by 5m. Not sure if it increases it to a total of 40m (see if they can outrun THAT), but regardless, it's NOT something to scoff at.

 

Second, almost every one of our Cover Only attacks are channeled, with the exception of Sabotage Charge. Meaning, they wouldn't be able to be used on the run ANYWAYS. It's actually pretty common for a class to have plenty of channeled attacks. Trooper has Mortar Volley, Full Auto, Pulse Canon, Charged Bolts, Hail of Bolts, Grav Round, Plasma Grenade and Concussive Round. None of which can be used on the run. Sound familiar? The difference between those attacks, and the Smuggler’s cover only attacks, is that you have to press middle mouse button (for portable cover) a split second before getting off your shot. Oh, and also that by being in cover, the Smuggler’s attacks cannot be interrupted at all, unlike Mister Trooper. And don’t forget, that applies to Scoundrel healers in cover. You can’t interrupt those heals in the middle of a PvP match.

 

Third, Gunslingers have a pretty good short term survivability. To be clear, they won’t make it for the long haul, but with a combination of Dodge, Scrambling Field, Distraction and Defense Screen, they can last long enough to dish out some great damage.

 

Lastly, if you find yourself getting slashed to death at melee range, where our cover doesn’t help, just remember the Gunslinger’s cardinal rule; You don’t have to out-tank them. You just have to out-DPS them.

[JoyProtocol]

I for one really love cover, and miss it greatly when I go to play any other class.

 

It is a bit more of a hurdle in surprise, open-scenario PvP, but otherwise I'm all for it. It feels cool, and it adds a lot of tactical capacity. I have tanked many a ranged mob to the surprise of my group.

 

I would like to see it affect tech and force abilities, and to have fewer things break it. But I really like it.

 

Also,

Lastly, if you find yourself getting slashed to death at melee range, where our cover doesn’t help, just remember the Gunslinger’s cardinal rule; You don’t have to out-tank them. You just have to out-DPS them.

 

Amen. Tempted to sig that.

Edited March 2, 2012 by JoyProtocol

[Rahiel]

First off, our KB (Killing Blow),

I think DarthLightSide meant "KB" to mean "Knockback", as in Pulse Detonator, which can indeed only be used from cover. And it's not channeled, either.

[kalonthar]

I don't mind cover (though I do find my Scoundrel more liberating than my Gunslinger), I just think it seems more like an ability Troopers should have, I'm not sure why. Probably because I see the Smuggler more as a "run and gun" type and a Trooper as an "in the trenches" type.

[Tempsticks]

So ok i got a lvl 50 operative and a lvl 50 sniper.

 

My question is this - why do we have cover?

 

i mean all we do is aim and pull a trigger, id assume people can do this while moving, i mean they do it in real life aswell.

 

Whereas a sorcerer/sage has to concentrate and use special hand symbols to pull off their stuff yet they seem to be able to do this while running at Mach 2.

 

what gives

 

 

Edit: Not even merc/troopers have cover and they also run around shooting things so what gives?

 

I can jump to mercs and sorcs. I can't jump to snipers, if I run all the way up to the top platform in huttball to hit them they can ambush or cover pulse me off and continue dpsing. Not saying it's OP but it's a huge advantage imo over other classes that sit and dps. Use crouch when you need to be mobile, it's much faster than take cover imo.

[RobNightfall]

Dulark, you need to realize and accept the truth: there is NO game mechanics based reason for cover to exist. None, nadda, zip, zero, zilch. They thought it was a cool idea so they added it, end of story. Stop sniping every reply you receive to your thread, take a few deep breaths, and try to be zen about it.

Also, if you don't like cover, I recommend a dirty fighting spec for your gunslinger. Cover is then useful, but not necessary, as most of the abilities don't require it. It's the most run and gun spec for gunslingers that is available.

[sumfizz]

.... thats like a restaurant saying "hey those people liked the dressing on their salad, lets put some into the souffle.

 

 

my point is that i dont see there being any in game reason for it, its just an added crutch to a class that doesent need it, if you could use Snipe or Explosive Droid(charged blast/demo charge) they would be alot better to use..

 

also the bug with roots making us unable to take cover is bloody annoying.

 

I lol'd at the restaurant analogy.

 

The cover mechanic wouldn't be so bad if it activated when you hit a skill that required it and it was instant. as it is now, you have to first activate the mechanic then wait for it to happen then fire off whatever skill you want to use. It's a drag and I quit playing my smuggler because of it.

[-Fal-]

Explosive probe, or whatever the smug version is called.

[Nexdine]

I don't mind cover (though I do find my Scoundrel more liberating than my Gunslinger), I just think it seems more like an ability Troopers should have, I'm not sure why. Probably because I see the Smuggler more as a "run and gun" type and a Trooper as an "in the trenches" type.

 

If you look at it from a real-world point of view, any class firing any kind of gun should have cover. Only a totally insane moron goes into any kind of gunfight without staying in cover, and usually only once... The only classes in the game that shouldn't have cover would be the Jedi and Sith, and they should have outrageously good lightsaber deflection skills instead, if we're going to discuss who should and should not have cover.

 

There's a reason there are foxholes and trenches in warfare, and that is to keep the troops from looking like swiss cheese from being riddled with enemy bullets.

 

Now as far as the game goes, cover for smugglers make sense. They don't wear massive quantities of armor, so they have to find a way to work around that by ducking behind something you can't shoot through.

Edited March 4, 2012 by Nexdine

[kalonthar]

You calling my Scoundrel an insane moron!?

 

Well, the problem with looking at things in a real world way, is that Smugglers aren't really living up to their name in-game, so why should they live up to the smart ones who stay in cover when fighting? Now to be serious... Yeah, it does make sense gameplay wise, but I'm still stuck in Kotor mode where we made up for our lack of armour with Scoundrels Luck.

 

Wait, now that I think about it, of course Smugglers need to use cover, we don't have any room to carry a shield like almost everyone else.

Edited March 3, 2012 by kalonthar

[Tempsticks]

Dulark, you need to realize and accept the truth: there is NO game mechanics based reason for cover to exist. None, nadda, zip, zero, zilch. They thought it was a cool idea so they added it, end of story. Stop sniping every reply you receive to your thread, take a few deep breaths, and try to be zen about it.

Also, if you don't like cover, I recommend a dirty fighting spec for your gunslinger. Cover is then useful, but not necessary, as most of the abilities don't require it. It's the most run and gun spec for gunslingers that is available.

 

If while you didnt need cover to channel your abilities (which btw require you to standstill anyway,) they were able to be interrupted, and if you could be charged to, I think you'd cry on the forums for cover to be re-implemented pretty quick. Most of the abilities that require cover have cast times. Arsenal mercs are a joke against decent players. Why? You can interrupt all of their **** and tear them apart. Same thing for force lightning spammers. Cover makes it much, much easier for snipers to get away with turreting, I don't understand how people can't see that tbh. The way you're trying to argue is like a child throwing a tantrum btw. No one's going to take you seriously with posts like that.

[soulself]

I really do not like the cover mechanics at all but i do like the story for the IA and smuggler so i find my self going to builds that do not rely on the cover ability at all.

[BardaTheHobo]

At first I did not like cover but I like it now. Most of our damage comes from casts so we would have to be stationary . If I am having to be stationary i would rather be behind cover with the defensive perks rather than bending over (bh*).

[LordXalas]

At first I did not like cover but I like it now. Most of our damage comes from casts so we would have to be stationary . If I am having to be stationary i would rather be behind cover with the defensive perks rather than bending over (bh*).

 

i know exactly what you mean, mate. Playing my merc i feel so squishy for staying out of the open casting tracer missle.