Bobiefatt Posted February 23, 2012 Share Posted February 23, 2012 I'm asking politely. This is the #1 biggest issue with SWTOR right now... Can we get a word on why it is taking so long for this to be implemented when it is so crucial to everything in the game... Dunno really, but m8 ... My casual guild has cleared everything there is atm. Yes, we diden't need a combat log for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forsbacka Posted February 23, 2012 Share Posted February 23, 2012 Dunno really, but m8 ... My casual guild has cleared everything there is atm. Yes, we diden't need a combat log for it. Thats why there aint a single hard boss fight in this game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chewpaco Posted February 23, 2012 Share Posted February 23, 2012 (edited) Obviously you havent done any serious raiding. Also how much mana healer has at end doesnt really say anything meaningfull. Sure it says something. It says I was able to conserve mana by using my most cost effective spells, because there was never any real pressure for me to get flustered and go with the highest cost skills to help my group survive. I was able to conserve, while others are being booted. Get it yet? See the irony yet? See the forced PvP action that develops in what is supposed to be a PvE experience? Edited February 23, 2012 by Chewpaco Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthOvertone Posted February 23, 2012 Share Posted February 23, 2012 I've wanted a Combat Log since launch, and given BW's track record on breaking things they try to fix, it is absolutely necessary to have in game at this point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taroen Posted February 23, 2012 Share Posted February 23, 2012 You truly beleive that those 4 healers are all being stretched to the very limit of their abilities just to keep everyone alive? This is where you are so wrong. How many raid encounters have I finished in the past with 50% of my mana left as a healer, and a DPS was booted for having the lowest parse? A TON, and it's wrong. Raid leader could have asked for healers to contribute a little on the dps side. But raid leaders that min/max like nazi's don't run raids this way anymore, because they think they know it all - You know nothing. So now you're making two seperate replies to one of my posts in attempt to deflect the fact that you STILL have been unable to answer that question..? Which healer was the low one, and how did you determine that..? Which dps players were underperforming, and why..? How did you determine that..? The very fact that you think asking a healer to dps more is a solution conclusively proves that you're clueless when it comes to raid composition and strategy. Sounds like you've been raiding with all the wrong people. It's likely because the other 15 people you COULD raid with (in a real guild) don't really think that wiping because of your "fun" build is really all that fun for them. That gets you stuck with people who don't know how to interpret data in context, and kick people for poor dps on the turn of a dime, rather than attempting to help them improve. Trying to bar people from using data, just because you play with people that don't use the data right, is total nonsense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XOrionX Posted February 23, 2012 Share Posted February 23, 2012 (edited) Thats why there aint a single hard boss fight in this game. Honestly, I feel like Soa is a pretty challenging boss. Granted, once you figure out all the mechanics of the fight it gets easier with each run. But still, transitioning from nornal mode to hard mode was a shock. Literally. Lastly... Aint? >.< Edited February 23, 2012 by XOrionX Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taroen Posted February 23, 2012 Share Posted February 23, 2012 So, you going to answer my questions or not? It's clear you're dodging them. Isn't it crystal clear, though..? He doesn't have an answer... Just the scars from some meanie booting him from a raid because he wasn't doing his part. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muskaan Posted February 23, 2012 Share Posted February 23, 2012 Honestly, I feel like Soa is a pretty challenging boss. Granted, once you figure out all the mechanics of the fight it gets easier with each run. But still, transitioning from nornal mode to hard mode was a shock. Literally. Lastly... Aint? >.< The challenging part of SOA is defeating it with all the bugs. Mechanics wise it's a snoozefest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XOrionX Posted February 23, 2012 Share Posted February 23, 2012 (edited) The challenging part of SOA is defeating it with all the bugs. Mechanics wise it's a snoozefest. I think the jury is still out on which of those are actually intended and which are real bugs. *EDIT- I know there are quite a few legitimate Soa bugs, just not sure which of htose "bugs" are actual boss mechanics. Edited February 23, 2012 by XOrionX Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forsbacka Posted February 23, 2012 Share Posted February 23, 2012 Sure it says something. It says I was able to conserve mana by using my most cost effective spells, because there was never any real pressure for me to get flustered and go with the highest cost skills to help my group survive. I was able to conserve, while others are being booted. Get it yet? Many fights didnt stretch healers to limits on mana conserve, there was other things that made a good healer. Since in any serous raiding guild situational awarness and CCs wasnt an issue, DPS was only thing that was measured on DPS classes, if boss didnt die before enrage, they got replaced, bad ones that is. Hleaer perfmance was measured also but how much mana you had to spare wasnt one of the metrics. Now, could you please answer the question on a thng you mentioned earlier, if ou have 2 tanks, 4 healers and 10 dps, boss doesnt die before enrage timer by some margin, how you start to choose which of the dps aint up to his game? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taroen Posted February 23, 2012 Share Posted February 23, 2012 I think the jury is still out on which of those are actually intended and which are real bugs. Try Jarg and Sorno on Nightmare 16-man when one of them gets to 35% and Jarg starts one-shotting random people... lol The 8-man nightmare version was pretty easy, though... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forsbacka Posted February 23, 2012 Share Posted February 23, 2012 Honestly, I feel like Soa is a pretty challenging boss. Granted, once you figure out all the mechanics of the fight it gets easier with each run. But still, transitioning from nornal mode to hard mode was a shock. Literally. Lastly... Aint? >.< Even nightmare mode on it is easier than most cata bosses on heroic. Only thing why some might find some bosses a challenge is cause every raid group has people in em that shouldnt even be doing nightmare modes but no one cant single em out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chewpaco Posted February 23, 2012 Share Posted February 23, 2012 So now you're making two seperate replies to one of my posts in attempt to deflect the fact that you STILL have been unable to answer that question..? Which healer was the low one, and how did you determine that..? Which dps players were underperforming, and why..? How did you determine that..? The very fact that you think asking a healer to dps more is a solution conclusively proves that you're clueless when it comes to raid composition and strategy. Sounds like you've been raiding with all the wrong people. It's likely because the other 15 people you COULD raid with (in a real guild) don't really think that wiping because of your "fun" build is really all that fun for them. That gets you stuck with people who don't know how to interpret data in context, and kick people for poor dps on the turn of a dime, rather than attempting to help them improve. Trying to bar people from using data, just because you play with people that don't use the data right, is total nonsense. I've been raiding since you were a twinkle in your Daddy's eye. My point is it does not matter who the underperming DPS member is in the raid. What matters is that you succeed or fail. If you are failing to get enough DPS, ask a healer or Tank to contribute. If you heals are falling short, ask a DPS specced player to help on healing for a short period of time. The fact that YOU BELEIVE there is only one way to skin a cat in these raid scenarios is what is ammusing, because it is all you have evern known. So i suppose that is why you defend it so hard. But the fact remains, guilds have taken down cutting edge content long before combat parses were commonplace, and they will continue to do so in the future. Just because your skill set doesn't allow you the ability to succeed in this fashion, there is no reason to give you a tool to belittle others with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forsbacka Posted February 23, 2012 Share Posted February 23, 2012 (edited) I've been raiding since you were a twinkle in your Daddy's eye. My point is it does not matter who the underperming DPS member is in the raid. What matters is that you succeed or fail. If you are failing to get enough DPS, ask a healer or Tank to contribute. If you heals are falling short, ask a DPS specced player to help on healing for a short period of time. The fact that YOU BELEIVE there is only one way to skin a cat in these raid scenarios is what is ammusing, because it is all you have evern known. So i suppose that is why you defend it so hard. But the fact remains, guilds have taken down cutting edge content long before combat parses were commonplace, and they will continue to do so in the future. Just because your skill set doesn't allow you the ability to succeed in this fashion, there is no reason to give you a tool to belittle others with. Ok, so tell us whats your experience in serious raiding and in which game/s? No one here believes you. Your advices/solutions clearly show that. Edited February 23, 2012 by Forsbacka Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Muskaan Posted February 23, 2012 Share Posted February 23, 2012 I've been raiding since you were a twinkle in your Daddy's eye. My point is it does not matter who the underperming DPS member is in the raid. What matters is that you succeed or fail. If you are failing to get enough DPS, ask a healer or Tank to contribute. If you heals are falling short, ask a DPS specced player to help on healing for a short period of time. The fact that YOU BELEIVE there is only one way to skin a cat in these raid scenarios is what is ammusing, because it is all you have evern known. So i suppose that is why you defend it so hard. But the fact remains, guilds have taken down cutting edge content long before combat parses were commonplace, and they will continue to do so in the future. Just because your skill set doesn't allow you the ability to succeed in this fashion, there is no reason to give you a tool to belittle others with. If you don't mind me asking, what is your raiding experience like in present and past MMOs? No offense intended. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chewpaco Posted February 23, 2012 Share Posted February 23, 2012 Many fights didnt stretch healers to limits on mana conserve, there was other things that made a good healer. Since in any serous raiding guild situational awarness and CCs wasnt an issue, DPS was only thing that was measured on DPS classes, if boss didnt die before enrage, they got replaced, bad ones that is. Hleaer perfmance was measured also but how much mana you had to spare wasnt one of the metrics. Now, could you please answer the question on a thng you mentioned earlier, if ou have 2 tanks, 4 healers and 10 dps, boss doesnt die before enrage timer by some margin, how you start to choose which of the dps aint up to his game? My very job as a Healer in EVERY situation - always, without a shadow of a doubt, is to keep everyone alive while doing my best to conserve my resources. In fact, that is the very definition of the most effective healers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XOrionX Posted February 23, 2012 Share Posted February 23, 2012 I've been raiding since you were a twinkle in your Daddy's eye. So you are assuming we are 12-14 year olds? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JediElf Posted February 23, 2012 Share Posted February 23, 2012 I've been raiding since you were a twinkle in your Daddy's eye. My point is it does not matter who the underperming DPS member is in the raid. What matters is that you succeed or fail. If you are failing to get enough DPS, ask a healer or Tank to contribute. If you heals are falling short, ask a DPS specced player to help on healing for a short period of time. The fact that YOU BELEIVE there is only one way to skin a cat in these raid scenarios is what is ammusing, because it is all you have evern known. So i suppose that is why you defend it so hard. But the fact remains, guilds have taken down cutting edge content long before combat parses were commonplace, and they will continue to do so in the future. Just because your skill set doesn't allow you the ability to succeed in this fashion, there is no reason to give you a tool to belittle others with. You sir, and the kind of raider that I respect. It would be an honor to be in a guild that you run, or in a raid that you host. You carry yourself ,in a manner, that I wish more gamers had. You are what makes raiding a truly epic experience for all, and I'm so glad to see someone like you here in this game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forsbacka Posted February 23, 2012 Share Posted February 23, 2012 (edited) My very job as a Healer in EVERY situation - always, without a shadow of a doubt, is to keep everyone alive while doing my best to conserve my resources. In fact, that is the very definition of the most effective healers. I was saying that it wasnt an challenge in many fights to have mana left at end of the fight, 5% or 50% left after boss dies doesnt make any difference. I played all 4 healer classes since wow launch to half cata more or less hardcore so dont try to teach me with your nonsense. Now tell us answer to the question beeing asked, if boss aint dying and you keep wiping due enrage timer by lets say 5% margin, how do you determine the reason and who aint doing enough dps? and please dont say hlealers should do more dps again. Edited February 23, 2012 by Forsbacka Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taroen Posted February 23, 2012 Share Posted February 23, 2012 I've been raiding since you were a twinkle in your Daddy's eye. Don't even try it. All of your posts here make it clear that you don't have a clue. And this quote proves it beyond all doubt... If you are failing to get enough DPS, ask a healer or Tank to contribute. The very fact that you would say something like that proves to every raider in this thread that you have no idea what you're talking about. You have 4 healers for a reason. Because that's how many you need to keep your raid alive. If you didn't need that many, you wouldn't take that many, in the first place. The tanks have other jobs, and any decent tank is always going to contribute as much as he can to dps, unless it's a stop-dps situation. The fact is, you have no way of knowing which one of your dps isn't performing up to par. It could be the guy with weak gear, but it definitely could also be a guy in good gear that is either slacking, or doesn't understand his own class very well... But you have yet to provide one single word as to how you would identify which people are underperforming, and instead you've offered up very laughable "solutions". 'nuff said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forsbacka Posted February 23, 2012 Share Posted February 23, 2012 (edited) So you are assuming we are 12-14 year olds? Im 37 so dont know which games he was hardcore raiding almost 40 years ago. Edited February 23, 2012 by Forsbacka Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chewpaco Posted February 23, 2012 Share Posted February 23, 2012 Ok, so tell us whats your experience in serious raiding and in which game/s? No one here believes you. Your advices/solutions clearly show that. End game content in EQ 1 on the Legends server (which you payed double for so you could have a server wide community raid schedule) in the top guild Township Rebellion, all the way through the Gates of Discord expansion. World of Warcraft - I came and went from, but particpated at different times in my life from Vanilla through the Lich King - missed alot of BC raiding because of RL stuff going on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
XOrionX Posted February 23, 2012 Share Posted February 23, 2012 Im 37 so dont know which games he was hardcore raiding almost 40 years ago. My point exactly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loendar Posted February 23, 2012 Share Posted February 23, 2012 I've been raiding since you were a twinkle in your Daddy's eye. My point is it does not matter who the underperming DPS member is in the raid. What matters is that you succeed or fail. If you are failing to get enough DPS, ask a healer or Tank to contribute. If you heals are falling short, ask a DPS specced player to help on healing for a short period of time. The fact that YOU BELEIVE there is only one way to skin a cat in these raid scenarios is what is ammusing, because it is all you have evern known. So i suppose that is why you defend it so hard. But the fact remains, guilds have taken down cutting edge content long before combat parses were commonplace, and they will continue to do so in the future. Just because your skill set doesn't allow you the ability to succeed in this fashion, there is no reason to give you a tool to belittle others with. Though I pretty much reflect Chewpaco's feelings on this subject I have to say that nothing raises my hackles faster than when someone does the 'you are clearly a child' response. It makes everything else said come off in a bad light, imho. Just my two cents in an effort to eliminate the 'I'm older than you so automatically know more' scourge of the Interwebs. Oh, and I'm 43 years old - I'm well past my twinkle days. ;p Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Menisong Posted February 23, 2012 Share Posted February 23, 2012 World of Warcraft - I came and went from, but particpated at different times in my life from Vanilla through the Lich King - missed alot of BC raiding because of RL stuff going on. I think he wanted to know what serious raiding you did and in which games. Not just the fact that you pllayed WoW. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts