People who ninja for their companions

[Eludajae]

There are so many quest rewards for your companions that taking an item out of a players hands who needs the item, is just plan rude.

[Setanian]

Eh, we had real ninjalooters in EQ. People who stole loot that other people... that other RAIDS did.

 

There was a shaman who ninja'd stuff of off vindi and then off of someone's 10th coldain ring war. She name changed, but that was back when SoE tracked name changes and so it's not like she was able to escape her rep. Edit: That was during SoL or early PoP, so the stuff she stole was still relevant.

 

she was still in a guild when I stopped playing. I still saw her in pug groups in some of the zones I was in.

 

There was a druid who was well known for training. He had spent ages training people, especially in RM (hill giants). he was in a guild years later

 

really, some people vastly overestimate how much rep matters. even when you've got your name on the server PoMS list (piece of Monkey X list)

 

I'd forgotten about those lists.. Tho after I started raiding I kinda feel away from the casual side of things.

[Vydor_HC]

Im not using the term literally but in a figurative sense.

 

As one that breaks looting rules?

[Darne]

and people that think companions arent great solo, mine is geared out in rakata, columi and a tionese piece and he's even a healer and soloed 2 strongs without losing health was insane.

 

How often do you use your companion at lvl 50? Never is the answer to that question. All companions do is promote solo play - which is fine I guess, we don't always want to play in groups. But don't take something away from another player to give to your companion which you may or may not use considering we each get 6 of them...

 

People with that thought process should go back to single player games. That mentality ruins any kind of social/community aspect this game already struggles to have.

 

Last question. Would you rather have a sick AI companion healer you can have while doing green missions, or a sick healer guildmate who can heal you properly through the tough FPs? Take your pick. If you answered companion, I'd honestly consider going back to single player RPGs. You roll need on everything in Skyrim.

[Vydor_HC]

There are so many quest rewards for your companions that taking an item out of a players hands who needs the item, is just plan rude.

 

No one is taking things out of anyone's hands..you cannot steal or pickpocket in the game. Everyone has an equal shot at getting the item with the RNG.

[Vydor_HC]

How often do you use your companion at lvl 50? Never is the answer to that question. All companions do is promote solo play - which is fine I guess, we don't always want to play in groups. But don't take something away from another player to give to your companion which you may or may not use considering we each get 6 of them...

 

People with that thought process should go back to single player games. That mentality ruins any kind of social/community aspect this game already struggles to have.

 

Last question. Would you rather have a sick AI companion healer you can have while doing green missions, or a sick healer guildmate who can heal you properly through the tough FPs? Take your pick. If you answered companion, I'd honestly consider going back to single player RPGs. You roll need on everything in Skyrim.

 

I use my companion every day, to help me get my dailies done. Having them geared out is the best way to maximize my time so I can spend as little amount of time doing dailies as it takes.

[Rabenschwinge]

Anyhow... I see only two possible solutions for this dilemma, since it is one hand true that player characters should come before companions, on the other hand you're responsible for equiping your companions and the desire to equip you favourite companion makes for a valid demand, a "need":

 

a) Loot droops are restricted to the player class they are, as is, most useful too. Each companion belongs only to its own class, which means that they can never use an item meant for a particular player class, even if their abilities resemble that class.

 

An example, since I noticed in general chat that isn't always quite clear: The Jedi Knight companion "Kira Carsen" is obviously a shadow ("Now you see me... now you don't"), but her class is "Kira Carsen" and she cannot use items meant for shadows or consulars. She could not possibly use a double blade light saber that requires class shadow or assassin.

 

This solution had a disadvantage though: It also means a jedi-sentinel can't use a full-mod chest piece meant for a smuggler anymore. As it is now, you could simply replace the mods that give cunning bonus with mods that give a strength bonus, and you have an item perfectly suited for a sentinel. If it is restricted to smugglers that would effectively limit the existing clothing options.

 

b) As I have read being mentioned before, an additional button that enables you to vote that you need the item for a companion rather than yourself. So you had all in all up to five options. "Self", "Companion", "Sell", "Disassemble" and "Pass".

Edited February 22, 2012 by Rabenschwinge

[MisterData]

that is why i dont discuss anytime loot drops i click need if i want it and that's that, we dont have time in a flashpoint or operation to discuss each and every loot drop

 

 

and people that think companions arent great solo, mine is geared out in rakata, columi and a tionese piece and he's even a healer and soloed 2 strongs without losing health was insane.

 

some of the top geared companion vids on youtube are crazy sick what you can gear your companions up to do. companions get seriously insane in top gear.

 

there's no way in heck im gonna listen to some holier than thou 'political correct' wannabe shout morals and ethics at me, it's my popup and it dont come with a EULA or TOS, so I roll need for me and companions.

 

course my guild all do the same, but we've kicked idiots from pickup groups out of the group when they start trying to preach about loot rules. Id much rather hope for good random's than listen to some autistic rant about loot rules that do not exist except in his own head.

 

It's a social parasite thing to do. Sounds like a great guild.

[Vydor_HC]

Anyhow... I see only two possible solutions for this dilemma, since it is one hand true that companions should come before, on the other hand you're responsible for equiping your characters and the desire to equip you favourite companion makes for a valid demand, a "need":

 

a) Loot droops are restricted to the player class they are, as is, most useful too. Each companion belongs only to its own class, which means that they can never use an item meant for a particular player class, even if their abilities resemble that class.

 

An example, since I noticed in general chat that isn't always quite clear: The Jedi Knight companion "Kira Carsen" is obviously a shadow ("Now you see me... now you don't"), but her class is "Kira" and she cannot use items meant for shadows or consulars. She could not possibly use a double blade light saber that requires class shadow or assassin.

 

This solution had a disadvantage though: It also means a jedi-sentinel can't use a full-mod chest piece meant for a smuggler anymore. As it is now, you could simply replace the mods that give cunning bonus with mods that give a strength bonus, and you have an item perfectly suited for a sentinel. If it is restricted to smugglers that would effectively limit the existing clothing options.

 

b) As I have read being mentioned before, an additional button that enables you to vote that you need the item for a companion rather than yourself. So you had all in all up to five options. "Self", "Companion", "Sell", "Disassemble" and "Pass".

 

Or c) let the players handle it themselves, which requires no changes to the game. Only requires people to talk to each other, which is what they should be doing anyways.

[Zunayson]

Why does it matter?

 

Well, to me (Dunno about you, but you and others, I encourage you to share your opinion on this), the fact that a player is more useful to the group means he did more to drop the boss, and therefore "deserves" more loot. So can I go in and ninja the roll if I did nothing to help the boss? Okay, probably not. Want me to contribute? Okay, I used one move. Can I have free purple endgame rolls now? See the picture yet? If you don't contribute, people feel you don't have a right. You must draw the line between actually contributing and just doing 1 damage. What line? 3k damage? 4k? Why not just whoever is the most contributing?

 

Additionally,

 

Some encounters I cannot do without my companion, so they are vital to me.

 

To the group. I highly doubt a companion is more vital to you than a real player. Companions are like strongs whereas you are like a champion or elite. We are totally dropping all PvE solo encounters, because there is no loot competition going solo. And of course it's your choice to play hand-me-down with your companion. Although there is also the fact that later you will PvE solo with your companion. And yes, that helps you, but I still feel it helps the agent more. And as there is no combat log / damage, healing, protection meters, there is no way to measure the contributions each player made to the group. So, we will have to assume that if the roles you were playing were the same, that you contributed the same [red](Why do roles matter? The same reason people generally MVP the healer in Warzones. They feel the healing matters more to the whole group than the damage. Yes, the valor helps everyone, but those who let the healer have the extra valor voted because they thought (s)he contributed more). [/red]. That being said, you attack more in PvE than your companion (And your damage and healing matters more), so his numbers take precedence as a whole (Obviously not to you, then just need it all, credits help, don't they?) than your companions IMO.

Edited February 22, 2012 by Zunayson

[Darne]

I use my companion every day, to help me get my dailies done. Having them geared out is the best way to maximize my time so I can spend as little amount of time doing dailies as it takes.

 

What dailies are you talking about? The Ilum missions/heroics? ****.

 

Or are you running HM FPs with your companion? If that's the case, also ****.

[Vydor_HC]

What dailies are you talking about? The Ilum missions/heroics? ****.

 

Or are you running HM FPs with your companion? If that's the case, also ****.

 

My commendation dailies. I want to spend as little time as it takes doing them. My companion helps me do it faster.

[Rabenschwinge]

Or c) let the players handle it themselves, which requires no changes to the game. Only requires people to talk to each other, which is what they should be doing anyways.

 

You don't honestly believe that the fighting will ever and as long as the system remains as it is?

[ferroz]

There are so many quest rewards for your companions that taking an item out of a players hands who needs the item, is just plan rude.

It's not possible to take an item out of someone else's hands.

 

And there are plenty of non-companion quest rewards... so your argument is just as valid written the other way (that you shouldn't roll against someone who wants it for their companion)

[Vydor_HC]

You don't honestly believe that the fighting will ever and as long as the system remains as it is?

 

I do not believe the can do anything programmatic to remove the issue. It's between the players and their opinions, let the deal with it instead of attempting to code in the logic for personal preference.

[souloferdrick]

Well, to me (Dunno about you, but you and others, I encourage you to share your opinion on this), the fact that a player is more useful to the group means he did more to drop the boss, and therefore "deserves" more loot. So can I go in and ninja the roll if I did nothing to help the boss? Okay, probably not. Want me to contribute? Okay, I used one move. Can I have free purple endgame rolls now? See the picture yet? If you don't contribute, people feel you don't have a right. You must draw the line between actually contributing and just doing 1 damage. What line? 3k damage? 4k? Why not just whoever is the most contributing?

 

That's getting off topic but even those who do more damage on, say, a boss fight, still depended on the rest of the group to get there. If people were able to solo HM bosses we wouldn't be having a discussion on dispersing loot to a group.

[Setanian]

Well, to me (Dunno about you, but you and others, I encourage you to share your opinion on this), the fact that a player is more useful to the group means he did more to drop the boss, and therefore "deserves" more loot. So can I go in and ninja the roll if I did nothing to help the boss? Okay, probably not. Want me to contribute? Okay, I used one move. Can I have free purple endgame rolls now? See the picture yet? If you don't contribute, people feel you don't have a right. You must draw the line between actually contributing and just doing 1 damage. What line? 3k damage? 4k? Why not just whoever is the most contributing?

 

Additionally,

 

 

 

To the group. I highly doubt a companion is more vital to you than a real player. Companions are like strongs whereas you are like a champion or elite.

 

But at the end of the boss fight, all 4 of the player characters are standing and each get to roll on the loot. Each players has a choice. That is perfectly fair. If you won, you win.

 

What some people want is a scenario, whereby loot drops, and because it matches their class, it should be their by right. There is no thought about the other 3 players characters at that point, as far the 1 players is concerned, the loot is theirs before anyone even rolls on it.

 

If that is the way it's meant to be, why bother with rolls at all. Why not let everyone pick which loot is theirs by their own rules of right and split the rest between the players that got nothing.

 

How often have you seen someone roll need on gear apparently meant for no-one else but them, and then follow that with greed rolls. I've seen it many times.

[Darne]

My commendation dailies. I want to spend as little time as it takes doing them. My companion helps me do it faster.

 

What do you do with those commendations? Buy mods for your companions? Not trying to be mean, but help me understand here because I don't get your logic. Are you talking about lvl 50?

 

Also, are you 100% ok if someone rolls need on rakata item and they win it for their companion over you getting it? I don't even....

[souloferdrick]

You don't honestly believe that the fighting will ever and as long as the system remains as it is?

 

Show me one example of a developer addition to a game that suddenly matured its entire subscriber base into adulthood and rationality and then we can talk.

Edited February 22, 2012 by souloferdrick

[KungpowSalmon]

No matter which way people try to spin it, need rolling for a companion without asking if your group minds is a grade A dirtbag thing to do and the people that do it know it as well. Please spare us the "my companion is a part of my character" or "the game lets me do it" excuses. You are all greedy and selfish.

 

Some of you probably don't care what people think of you but keep in mind that regardless of the fact that this is an MMO and your anonymity will remain intact, the way you treat others in game in essence mirrors your real life personality and the way you treat and respect your peers.

 

Say what you will to claim otherwise, but people who are generally respectful, kind and generous in the real world apply their philosophy wherever they go and in whatever they are doing. Even in games where nobody knows who they are.

[ferroz]

How often do you use your companion at lvl 50?

Every day that I play. More often that I don't use them.

 

Tharan lets me solo the daily heroic 2's (although the one on illum is really kind of painful).

 

Last question. Would you rather have a sick AI companion healer you can have while doing green missions, or a sick healer guildmate who can heal you properly through the tough FPs?

I've got both; having one doesn't preclude having the other.

 

Take your pick. If you answered companion, I'd honestly consider going back to single player RPGs. You roll need on everything in Skyrim.

the last single palyer RPG I played was.... hmmm... Probably Ultima VII: Serpent isle.

 

I like MMO's ... but there's nothing wrong with liking to solo.

Edited February 22, 2012 by ferroz

[Galbatorrix]

Please, show me where he said that's the way they intended it?

 

Fact is he said no such thing. You're trying to bend his words to fit your argument. And failing.

 

 

I said "intend". So again, you can argue your "But, but, but they may have just recently changed their mind!" way of thinking all you want. The fact is, the lead systems designer now intends that the loot system work the way our sides currently plays (ie, only being able to need on your primary class items).

 

If he did not intend it to work this way in the future, he would have said "working as intended", instead of "I'll work on fixing it".

 

So, people with your stance (which is pointless as you already admitted to cancelling) are not currently looting the way Bioware wants the loot system to work. So, keep exploiting the broken system while you still can.

[universeman]

Oh, so you're fine with people rolling need on loot that they want for their companions. Good to know.

 

I realize we have our differences in how this system works...but, if people don't play this game showing some respect to those who they are playing with, then they will not get any respect in return. And since you seem to be on the same page as me here, I will explain further: If you are going to use that NEED button to NEED something that someone else might not realize you are going to click NEED for, then you may be crossing that line of respect unless you say something up front.

 

I will interject here before continuing: Timing has a lot to do with things as well. A lot of times, people think an item should be distributed with equal opportunity, so someone clicks greed, then everyone clicks greed. But, someone at the end of the queue has the last opportunity to click need. Why should that player have the advantage? This is why the system needs to be fixed. If you think all players should just click NEED unless they don't care about the item (because that's the only other way I see it boiling down to), then the NBG system shouldn't even exist.

 

With that said, NEED is there for a reason, and if for any reason you might be using NEED in a way to get equipment that the other players are not considering, then the onus is on you to speak up. And, to me, using NEED for a companion falls under that. That's how I see it. I think that's how most people see it, and that is why it is causing problems.

 

I think the only questionable statement here (so you don't pick this apart with your own interpretation) is "other players are not considering". What do I mean by that? Well, that can be different for each player. But, I think the majority of people don't use NEED for their companions (without speaking up first). I have only seen this happen 1 time in TOR where an agent clicked NEED after everyone else and took the item over a sniper who also clicked NEED (and it was a +cunning item). What caught me as strange is that nobody questioned the roll, yet the agent immediately proclaimed "I need it for my companion." See, to me...that is sneaky (and, in my eyes, disrespectful) and I don't approve.

[Irusan]

 

Regardless of this, I don't like the game, not for loot stuff, but for many other reasons, including the general community.

 

/end of waffle

 

You don't like the game. You don't like the community. Yet here you are, hour after hour, on the forums telling us how we should play it. One could almost think you are just here to argue for the sake of arguing.

 

It is my sincere hope that I am a big part of the community that you don't like. Trust me, that is a two-way street.

[ferroz]

No matter which way people try to spin it, need rolling for a companion without asking if your group minds is a grade A dirtbag thing to do and the people that do it know it as well.

No, I don't see why you think this is true. I've asked several people but they can't seem to come up with a reason other than "I said so, ok!"

 

Say what you will to claim otherwise, but people who are generally respectful, kind and generous in the real world apply their philosophy wherever they go and in whatever they are doing.

I'm respectful, kind and generous in the real world. That's why I apply my philosophy in game and don't worry about why someone rolls need.