Patch 1.1.3 Surge nerf

[D_Rock_]

Classes and Combat

 

 

General

 

Surge rating has been re-balanced. It now reaches diminishing returns the same way as other damage ratings, and its per point damage contribution has been reduced by approximately 10%.

 

 

 

 

 

What do you guys think? Will it hurt sents dps badly?

[LordBladewind]

Undoubtedly, yes. Lower burst damage (bad for Ataru/focus) and lower dot ticks (bad for watchman).

 

How bad it hurts depending on how much gear you have. But due to the lack of available lv56/58 (rank 24/25) power based enhancement, the crit/surge variant is till your best friend until accuracy become relevant.

[darthtoph]

Two nerfs in a row? What the f......

[-Balrok-]

[...] until accuracy become relevant.

 

Are there some hard facts? How much do we really need? With Battlemaster Gear and Sentinel Head i am at 98% base accuracy. With the original mods, a bit confused it's only at 100% with full Battlemaster (not skilled the 3% - which seems to lack efficiency).

 

I wanted to change all mods to crit/surge but nobody can help so far.

[ShiroRX]

Everyone stacks surge super high, so its a nerf to all damage.

[slowantics]

man ***? this is retarded.

my mods are mainly surge rating. with this buff should we go crit chance?

and this will really mess up combat specs, so lame

[Ravrohan]

I actually don't worry as much when its a universal nerf. I'll wait to see what the scores look like before I get worked up over anything, and may just stack more power.

[FobManX]

It's a universal nerf, so I'm not sweating it.

[FarizAA]

It's a universal nerf, so I'm not sweating it.

 

Using zen for 100% crit on dots is an important part of watchman class mechanics, and it will be affected by this change. We were just rebalanced for stronger crits last patch, and right after this part of it is taken away. It is a nerf for watchman for sure, and I do not see much logic in this.

Edited February 10, 2012 by FarizAA

[AdamLKvist]

Using zen for 100% crit on dots is an important part of watchman class mechanics, and it will be affected by this change. We were just rebalanced for stronger crits last patch, and right after this part of it is taken away. It is a nerf for watchman for sure, and I do not see much logic in this.

 

And other classes that have free/activate to crit abilities dont? This kind of "victim attitude" is getting old. Watchman is in a great place right now PvP wise and this surge nerf wont hurt this class more than it will hurt others. ZZzz

[FarizAA]

Can you read? It was two patches in a row, first moved our dots damage more toward crits, second made crits less powerful. For watchman sentinel it is a nerf, if you do not understand this I am sorry, can't help much. Edited February 10, 2012 by FarizAA

[AdamLKvist]

Can you read? It was two patches in a row, first moved our dots damage more toward crits, second made crits less powerful. For watchman sentinel it is a nerf, if you do not understand this I am sorry, can't help much.

 

Rookie

[LiveandDieinLA]

Can you read? It was two patches in a row, first moved our dots damage more toward crits, second made crits less powerful. For watchman sentinel it is a nerf, if you do not understand this I am sorry, can't help much.

 

The didn't move your dot damage anywhere, they fixed a glitch which was giving you 30% more damage to all burns when it was supposed to only effect crits to begin with.

[FarizAA]

The didn't move your dot damage anywhere, they fixed a glitch which was giving you 30% more damage to all burns when it was supposed to only effect crits to begin with.

 

Sigh. Call if a fix, or call it a gods blessing, or call it a curse -- it was in fact moving of damage from general dot damage toward crit dot damage. I am not discussing if we are OP or UP, I am not discussing if it was a fix or not, I am saying that total result of this two patches is a sentinel watchman nerf.

Edited February 10, 2012 by FarizAA

[Soarlozer]

And other classes that have free/activate to crit abilities dont? This kind of "victim attitude" is getting old. Watchman is in a great place right now PvP wise and this surge nerf wont hurt this class more than it will hurt others. ZZzz

 

This. I'd think sentinel would breed the players that would rather adapt then cry about every single "nerf".

[FarizAA]

This. I'd think sentinel would breed the players that would rather adapt then cry about every single "nerf".

 

-) I give up, my last post in this thread. Where you see me crying about anything, or saying I will quit, or change class or something like this? I just stated a fact, that cumulative result of those 2 patches is nerf for watchman. If you have really something to prove this statement is wrong, please let me know.

[Soarlozer]

It is a nerf for watchman for sure, and I do not see much logic in this.

 

Subtle hints of QQ

 

1) Implying it is specifically a watchman nerf => "It is a nerf for watchman for sure"

2) Implying watchman has it hard => "do not see much logic in this"

 

It is a nerf to EVERYONE that over stacked on surge not to watchman.

[Leonalis]

Two nerfs in a row? What the f......

 

 

Only this is a Nerf.

[firesprite_ea]

Do not cry before it is out.

here is a post with some good explanation IMO

////

 

Hello, all.

 

I posted this in another thread but felt it might deserve its own subject.

 

The patch notes say:

 

Citation:

Surge rating has been re-balanced. It now reaches diminishing returns the same way as other damage ratings, and its per point damage contribution has been reduced by approximately 10%.

Surge already suffered from diminishing returns. In fact it suffered from WORSE diminishing returns than other combat stats.

 

Proof: http://sithwarrior.com/forums/Thread-SWTOR-formula-list

 

Now, the patch notes say "It now reaches diminishing returns the same way as other damage ratings." This means to me that the diminishing returns effect on Surge might be being reduced so it diminishes at the same rate as other combat stats.

 

To counterbalance that, it sounds like they're reducing the overall effectiveness of Surge by 10%.

 

 

My guess is that the old formula

 

50 + 50 * ( 1 - ( 1 - ( 0.01 / 0.5 ) )^( ( SurgeRating / max(Level,20) ) / 0.1 ) )

 

is going to be changed to:

 

50 + ( 50 * ( 1 - ( 1 - ( 0.01 / 0.3 ) )^( ( SurgeRating / max(Level,20) ) / 0.1 ) ) ) * 0.9 )

 

This would cause Surge to diminish at the same rate as other combat formulas, but would be 90% as effective as before. The underlined portion above is what would change the diminishing returns and the * 0.9 at the end reflects the 10% reduction in effect.

 

If that's what changed, here's what the before & after surge results will be for various levels:

 

 

Surge / old multiplier% / new multipler%

100 66.62 72.16

200 77.71 83.40

300 85.12 89.11

400 90.07 92.01

500 93.37 93.48

600 95.57 94.23

 

 

So if that's what changes, it'll be a net buff to Surge at almost all values, only turning to a very slight nerf at 500+ surge.

 

 

Of course, I have no idea if those numbers are accurate, but I think it's a bit early to scream that the sky is falling.

////

[Leonalis]

So we have the cap faster with this change? I think thats ok because on the Rakata Gear there is no surge an with a small change we have ~120 an thats ok:confused:

[Rhinzual]

Can you read? It was two patches in a row, first moved our dots damage more toward crits, second made crits less powerful. For watchman sentinel it is a nerf, if you do not understand this I am sorry, can't help much.

 

Reminds me of when Regeneration's two passive powers along with Fitness' health/stamina regens were doubled in power back in City of Heroes... right before Enhancement Diversification which effectively made 6-slotting them useless.

 

So really it was buffing them up purely to keep the upcoming nerf from being a total-spec-destroyer. They'll get hit hard by it, but not quite as hard, and that's what the devs want people to see and think, that we should all be thankful how we got buffed prior to being nerfed and goddammit now I'm pissed off again.

[darthtoph]

Only this is a Nerf.

 

Wrong. The so-called "damage increase" last week was a in fact a damage decrease. The statement in the 1.1.2 patch notes about it being a damage increase was a flat out lie. Please, learn your facts.

Edited February 10, 2012 by darthtoph

[Jdaddy]

Wrong. The so-called "damage increase" last week was a in fact a damage decrease. The statement in the 1.1.2 patch notes about it being a damage increase was a flat out lie. Please, learn your facts.

 

I havent really felt a difference in my ability to kill people with watchmen or my damage totals at the end of warzones. Though i never payed attention to my actual numbers my dots with ticking for because i was more concerned with stopping heals or stopping caps so i cant say for sure if it was a damage lost but i cant tell their was a damage lost or increase since the patch....it just feels the same to me.

[Vodrin]

man ***? this is retarded.

my mods are mainly surge rating. with this buff should we go crit chance?

and this will really mess up combat specs, so lame

 

It depends where the point of diminishing returns begins. People have to remember that this sort of system has been in place since launch for every secondary stat except surge. This is essentially a bug fix that brings the stat in line with the rest. How big a deal it is remains to be seen.

 

My suspicion is that you will not even notice the effect unless you are aggressively stacking surge.

[Talorra]

And this is hitting everyone who puts surge on their gear. Not just us, so stop yourselves with the crying about Sentinel nerfs.

 

Everyone who uses the stat gets hit. We'll all be on the same playing field we are now, just at a lower surge level.

 

I'll point out too, the fix for searing saber and plasma blades was just that - a fix. The game launched with the tooltip saying one thing (correctly) and the effect in game doing something entirely different. It's not like devs looked at Watchman and said "too much DPS, cut them off at the knees." We, the sentinel and marauder community, brought the issue to them and asked for it to be fixed. Not a nerf. Bioware could have done us a favor by not trying to sugar coat it with a promised "overall DPS increase" but what's done is done.

 

 

I don't know about you all, but I saved all of my level 56 and 58 mods when I swapped surge stuff in. If this doesn't pan out to my liking I'll try a different setup.