bring balance to marauders!

[Herblaw]

tbh i dont get you

 

originally it was 8000 but changed to 9000 later.... people it either 1 way or another always be complainers

[darth_billy]

originally it was 8000 but changed to 9000 later.... people it either 1 way or another always be complainers

 

probably you are wright. Mara generally is fine and the fact that he is hard to play is what makes him so intriguing, all he needs is some small tweaks, cause when a wz is ovepopulated by ranged players things can become very frustrating

[BrotherJohn]

1. Really people need to stop with the oh your a noon if you want the class easy to play. Just speaks to you not having a real clue.

 

2. If we don't know you current class state you will die quickly even one on one but often enough you should win all the time with proper skill use. Of course skill lag plays a major role in the win but you should have no problem.

 

3. There is no doubt the class is lacking vs ranged that can kick or chain stun. This is really were the class needs help. I'd your kicked charge just needs to be auto available. Your kicked even if just used charge neeto be available immediately. Simple.as that. As for stuns and really this is for any clas:Ds if a player stuns you they should not be allowed to stun you again for 60 seconds.

 

4. No buffs to class but they need to get off their butts and fix The daamn ui graphics engine lag issue with regards to skill. A properly geared Mara with a proper team and I stress team cause its what wins AZ hand down will own anything.

[DrekorSilverfang]

the medals which our class can posiibly claim on its own power(no heal and guard) are easy for everyone to get even for healers(except 300k dmg)

 

the 75k is helariously easy to get i think that it should be raised to 150k dmg and the minimun kills for 1 medal should 20-25 and single hit medal should be at least 3000

or 200k this way healers will focus to their cobat role cause from my excperience they are the weak link of pvp on this aspect

or

there should be medals for 40+ kills and 3-5+ solo kills gennerally there should dps-oriented medals that are not easy to get as things stand right now only 300k dmg is a real challenge

Here's the thing... as a DPS I get those medals while DPS'ing. I don't have to go out of my way to get those medals.

 

As a healer I have to stop healing people and start DPS'ing. So any healer who does that basically sacrifices their teammates to gain medals. Have you ever had a pocket healer? Has he ever just randomly stopped healing you when you are dieing to gain medals? How would that make you feel?

 

DPS are fine with medals. I do agree they could be a little more DPS focused and likely tanks could use their medals brought up so really only "tank" spec players actively "tanking" the whole match can get them reliably... but healers are the ones that need medal help not DPS or Tanks.

[krimpatulbb]

enternal swtor marauder dilema, but the issue is actually simple

 

mara can do serious damage in pvp or can be decent class to play only if he outgear oponents

if you have equal or worse gear then your opponent, you die because class is broken

too many things are broken to talk about that here, and i'm not dev to worry about it

 

thats it

[akatokuro]

As a 50 Carnage Marauder since Beta, I thought I'd throw in my two cents on our PvP scene.

 

Problem with most marauders saying "lol n00b L2P kthxbai" is that they're all playing the flavor spec of the month, Anni. Anni got a nice fix and so now they're in line with the other classes when played moderately well and up. A lower geared Anni spec can beat the other two specs soundly in a one versus one situation (I know this, as I've unfortunately been on the receiving end of an Anni-Mara on numerous occasions). While I'm glad that people are having fun playing this flavor of Marauders that doesn't mean I want to or should have to fully enjoy this class, so no I won't roll this spec and "L2P". Kthxbai.

 

Rage puts up good damage numbers but they really don't have much to show for it (If I do a 2.3-3.5k crit with Smash on 6 people, that'll inflate my numbers come scoreboard time). You have to be a crowd chaser with this spec to put up the good numbers, otherwise you're doomed to be constantly setting up and failing to deliver the goods. On a one vs one fight against carnage or Anni, they're dead in the water.

 

Carnage was my first spec, and much like Revan, once I learned all that there was to being a Marauder and their different specs, I went back to my first. Against most other classes, especially healers, they can be annoying to fight. A good player will stick on a single target, be it a nuker dps or healer or tank, and make them ineffective in the battleground if they can't outright kill them.

 

I think that's the misconception with this class though, if you don't put up big numbers you can't be "good". If all I'm looking for is putting up good numbers, I can put 300k into the scoreboard and lose the warzone. And that does me jack if I can't win, as those dailies and weeklies don't look for the "best DPS evar" or "Most solo kills" or anything like that, its wins. And that's something the Marauder can help deliver.

 

I can't tell you how often its been due to my ability to use our speed boost berserk ability or the rightly timed root or timed Undying Rage or making a well known healer/dpser ineffective in a battleground that has won a warzone, but if I looked at the scoreboard I'd look mediocre.

 

TL, DR version:

 

In my experience, Marauders are a great class to play but have some issues. I think they'll balance them accordingly but the problem is that there's no one right answer to doing so. For the L2Pers, while I agree with you in principle I don't agree with your answers to those who need more practice. Also, for all my fellow Marauders, stop looking at the scoreboard unless its because you won. It'll save you much needed grief.

 

Peace out!

 

-Darth Tyri Tilmorne, Lord Praven server.

[darth_billy]

Here's the thing... as a DPS I get those medals while DPS'ing. I don't have to go out of my way to get those medals.

 

As a healer I have to stop healing people and start DPS'ing. So any healer who does that basically sacrifices their teammates to gain medals. Have you ever had a pocket healer? Has he ever just randomly stopped healing you when you are dieing to gain medals? How would that make you feel?

 

DPS are fine with medals. I do agree they could be a little more DPS focused and likely tanks could use their medals brought up so really only "tank" spec players actively "tanking" the whole match can get them reliably... but healers are the ones that need medal help not DPS or Tanks.

 

i have to admit that you are wright, if dmg medals become harder to gain healers will try even more to do dmg than focusing on their job.

[tjstix]

They should give us the same force choke stun that they give juggs.

 

Just saying.

[tadro]

enternal swtor marauder dilema, but the issue is actually simple

 

mara can do serious damage in pvp or can be decent class to play only if he outgear oponents

if you have equal or worse gear then your opponent, you die because class is broken

too many things are broken to talk about that here, and i'm not dev to worry about it

 

thats it

 

if you can't kill one equally geared opponent as a mara I don't know what to say to you...

[Caribroo]

And, for the record, we were not advertised as "the apex damage dealer." Nowhere, ever, was it stated Marauders were going to do the most damage. In fact, BioWare stated many times they made all damage across all classes/specs more/less equal in order to push the "bring the player not the class" ideal.

 

Wielding two sabers and unmatched aggression, Sith trained as Marauders

slice through enemy ranks, dealing death with merciless efficiency. Able to intuit

precisely how to attack in order to maximize every strike, their adversaries

become victims in the blink of an eye. Whether annihilating a squad of

Republic troops or cutting down a single Jedi, the Marauder sees and

exploits every weakness to exact the greatest toll. Never

hesitating, never faltering, there is no swifter bringer

of pain and damage in the galaxy.

 

Most likely where his notion of that came from.

Edited February 20, 2012 by Caribroo

[darth_billy]

They should give us the same force choke stun that they give juggs.

 

Just saying.

 

actually the should fix the FC stun cause sometimes its not working

[darth_billy]

if you can't kill one equally geared opponent as a mara I don't know what to say to you...

 

1v1 is our speciality and you should be able to beat anyone 1v1, the problem is that actually there is no 1v1 on pvp 9.9/10 times there will be interference, you should capable of anticipating those situations

[darth_billy]

Wielding two sabers and unmatched aggression, Sith trained as Marauders

slice through enemy ranks, dealing death with merciless efficiency. Able to intuit

precisely how to attack in order to maximize every strike, their adversaries

become victims in the blink of an eye. Whether annihilating a squad of

Republic troops or cutting down a single Jedi, the Marauder sees and

exploits every weakness to exact the greatest toll. Never

hesitating, never faltering, there is no swifter bringer

of pain and damage in the galaxy.

 

Most likely where his notion of that came from.

 

it had smth to do with that but there was also some other things like the character progression vids etc

[darth_billy]

As a 50 Carnage Marauder since Beta, I thought I'd throw in my two cents on our PvP scene.

 

Problem with most marauders saying "lol n00b L2P kthxbai" is that they're all playing the flavor spec of the month, Anni. Anni got a nice fix and so now they're in line with the other classes when played moderately well and up. A lower geared Anni spec can beat the other two specs soundly in a one versus one situation (I know this, as I've unfortunately been on the receiving end of an Anni-Mara on numerous occasions). While I'm glad that people are having fun playing this flavor of Marauders that doesn't mean I want to or should have to fully enjoy this class, so no I won't roll this spec and "L2P". Kthxbai.

 

Rage puts up good damage numbers but they really don't have much to show for it (If I do a 2.3-3.5k crit with Smash on 6 people, that'll inflate my numbers come scoreboard time). You have to be a crowd chaser with this spec to put up the good numbers, otherwise you're doomed to be constantly setting up and failing to deliver the goods. On a one vs one fight against carnage or Anni, they're dead in the water.

 

Carnage was my first spec, and much like Revan, once I learned all that there was to being a Marauder and their different specs, I went back to my first. Against most other classes, especially healers, they can be annoying to fight. A good player will stick on a single target, be it a nuker dps or healer or tank, and make them ineffective in the battleground if they can't outright kill them.

 

I think that's the misconception with this class though, if you don't put up big numbers you can't be "good". If all I'm looking for is putting up good numbers, I can put 300k into the scoreboard and lose the warzone. And that does me jack if I can't win, as those dailies and weeklies don't look for the "best DPS evar" or "Most solo kills" or anything like that, its wins. And that's something the Marauder can help deliver.

 

I can't tell you how often its been due to my ability to use our speed boost berserk ability or the rightly timed root or timed Undying Rage or making a well known healer/dpser ineffective in a battleground that has won a warzone, but if I looked at the scoreboard I'd look mediocre.

 

TL, DR version:

 

In my experience, Marauders are a great class to play but have some issues. I think they'll balance them accordingly but the problem is that there's no one right answer to doing so. For the L2Pers, while I agree with you in principle I don't agree with your answers to those who need more practice. Also, for all my fellow Marauders, stop looking at the scoreboard unless its because you won. It'll save you much needed grief.

 

Peace out!

 

-Darth Tyri Tilmorne, Lord Praven server.

 

mate i agrre that wins are more important since they give more valor etc , but your numbers portrait how good you are.

[Crawelc]

mate i agrre that wins are more important since they give more valor etc , but your numbers portrait how good you are.

 

So if, for example, im dpsing, see someone about to hit the ball carrier, charge and choke them, then slow. Instead of just continuing to kill the target I was on. Then only get 100k at the end, because I helped my team. Im bad?

[darth_billy]

So if, for example, im dpsing, see someone about to hit the ball carrier, charge and choke them, then slow. Instead of just continuing to kill the target I was on. Then only get 100k at the end, because I helped my team. Im bad?

 

thats not what i am saying and i am completely againts farming(when objectives are not captured) ,but the truth is you cant top the charts if you dont do so.

Edited February 20, 2012 by darth_billy

[Ultratron]

:sy_spacestation:marauders and ofc sentinels are supposed(promoted as...) to be the apex damage dealers since they are pure dps , medium armored with no stuns, no cc, no skills that cant utilize the environment like force push or pull(into the acid pool form example).

The reality is different than its "supposed" to be , the vast majority from decent up to well skilled mara goes mid table in wz and those who are below this level ,they hit rock bottom.

probably many of you will argue that you have seen marauders dominate , killing someone in the blink of an eye blah blah, I dont care ,that doesnt changes the fact that an mara of random skill level has worst output than an equally skilled ranged player.

Indeed there are mara who top damage/kill chart on a wz but they are exceptionaly skilled. my point is tha a decent mara player is significantly worst comparing to a NOOB ranged player who facerolls etc and this is unarguably unfair. If you disagree with this you lie even to yourself.

 

MY explanation for this is that all non meelee classes have min 1-2 stuns + knockbacks +slow down skills+significantly lasting immoblize skills +30m range dps +burst(since they dont have to gather rage before they begin their rotations).

 

:sy_darkside:if for example you knowback , imobbilize ... actually if you do anything of the aformentioned other than stun to a ranged dps player you dont disrupt at all his dps sequence/rotation because you are still in range, simple as that.

 

:sy_darkside:if you do the same thing to a heavy armored meelee player there is chance that his armor and def buff will help him to get back in range without any devastating hp loss but still you disrupt his dps sequnce while you keep dealing damage on him for significant time since he has to walk his way back to his target and often he will be slowed down too.

 

:sy_darkside:if you have a MARAUDER on the same scenario you are doing all ther afformentioned + during the proceedure to get back in range he sustains damage witch could be proved enough to lose the fight since his def buffs are few , they have big cooldowns or dont last long(scratch out loack of p.) and more importantly his distance closer(force charge) probably is still on coolsdown and even if it comes out of colldown (15secs cd ) he will probaly be slowed down and beaten enough to lose, not to mention that the longer the 1v1 fight last the easier it gets to be futher involved in a 1v2(+) situation .

 

in my point of view this is the definition of being underated(slightly but...). In order to restore balance among the classes my suggession is to dramaticly decrease the cool down of force charge .

:sy_target:also devs should take under some serious cosideration how complicated the battle machanics of a mara are(for example all decent and more than decent buff require 30 stacks which pvpwise are not easy to maintain(except cloack of pain ) Thats not such such a majro isue but it's a fact.

 

i thing my syggestions are reasonable at least the one about the cd of force charge is, providing that ranged classes have a significant variety of stuns knowbacks etc on the other hand force charge is our 1 and ONLY distance closer(on meelee clashes) and escpecialy on mara is the only skill with 10m<range=30m

every comment/opinion is welcomed but i am really looking forward fro the comments of fellow marauders.

 

P.S.to make things clear, according to my criteria, i rank my self as a decent player nothing less nothing more and my experience from playing other classes showed me that mara has slighly more drawbacks tha he should and he is undoubtly the harder class to play with.

 

 

addittions to the original post

suggestions other than mine made in this post

:sy_target:someone suggested of having an actual stealth instead of our current so called stealth. I honestly find it even better than my suggestion since stealth was promoted as one of our key features and obviously it is nothing special but if it was a go to move it could make a real difference on pvp and it feels so marauder

 

clarifications and additional points from the discussion so far

:sy_spacestation:Many consider this post whining from someone who gets beaten all the time which is not true, i am not gonna claim that i am a big dog cause it is not true also. My main complaint is that dut to the very hight ranged/meelee ratio (at least on my server) pvping for meelee classes sometimes is frustrating and anoying for the reasons explained before. We dont need a buff only some tweaks.

 

playing a demanding class it is more than ok for the most of us, actually it is intriguing. The problem revolves around the result/effort ratio which for mara is sgnificantly lower comparing to other classes

 

 

 

YES! BRING BALANCE TO THE MOST STABLE AND BALANCED CLASS IN THE GAME!

 

MARAUDERS DEMAND JUSTICE!

Edited February 20, 2012 by Ultratron

[darth_billy]

YES! BRING BALANCE TO THE MOST STABLE AND BALANCED CLASS IN THE GAME!

 

MARAUDERS DEMAND JUSTICE!

 

so you imply that the others are unsteble and unbalanced ,thanks for coming

[akatokuro]

mate i agrre that wins are more important since they give more valor etc , but your numbers portrait how good you are.

 

I was throwing some very specific example numbers, I can give you a better idea of where I am if you prefer. I'm not a top tier marauder by any stretch of the imagination, but I'm not a n00b either. I will say I'm probably upper mid-tier on my normal days and lower-top tier on my good days. I'm wearing a 60/40 split of Centurion/Champion gear (my valor rank is 44) and as I stated earlier I'm a Carnage spec Marauder.

[darth_billy]

I was throwing some very specific example numbers, I can give you a better idea of where I am if you prefer. I'm not a top tier marauder by any stretch of the imagination, but I'm not a n00b either. I will say I'm probably upper mid-tier on my normal days and lower-top tier on my good days. I'm wearing a 60/40 split of Centurion/Champion gear (my valor rank is 44) and as I stated earlier I'm a Carnage spec Marauder.

 

same here but i am half champion half rakata also i am anni (because ataru form is bugged i like carnage a lot)

Edited February 21, 2012 by darth_billy

[Evixy]

If anything, Marauders and Sentinels need a knockback/pull immunity. Like for 8-10 seconds after using Force Charge, you are immune to knockbacks and pulling effects. By limiting it there is still a window were Snipers for example can knock you back.

 

As it is right now, if you charge a Sorcerer/Sage/Assassin/Shadow/Merc/Commando/Sniper/Gunslinger (not that you EVER should charge any of them if you can get to them in a fairly short time), they'll just knock you back first thing they do and you are useless for about 20-30 seconds (mainly thinking of Huttball here since that is all I get when i queue).

 

Right now Marauders and Sentinels are the most useless classes in Huttball. Even Operatives/Scoundrels are more usefull since they can stealth to the enemy teams goal and you just pass the ball to them. We just have no utility. We can't knock anyone down and we can't pull anyone down from the walkways either. We can't jump to friendly players like Juggernauts/Guardians and we most definitely can't pull friendly players like Sorcs and Sages do. While Undying Rage is fairly usefull when running the ball, we are still more squishy than a Juggernaut/Guardian. We can Charge to enemy players while carrying the ball, but so can Juggernauts/Guardians and Powertechs/Vanguards. Assassins/Shadows will just use their OP 150% movement increase that drops all movement impairing effects.

 

So really, the idea of "Bring the player, not the class" does NOT apply to PvP in Star Wars: The Old Republic.

[Excidium]

Marauders need more gap closers. That's all.

[Evixy]

Marauders need more gap closers. That's all.

 

I would suggest you take a look at Rage/Focus spec in that case. The only reason you'd want more gapclosers is due to knockbacks. But having 2x Force Charge is just silly.

Edited February 26, 2012 by Evixy