Commando healers, really Bioware?

[savionen]

Depends on the spec. Madness assassins have solid internal. Death Field and Creeping Terror both put out a significant amount. Especially Death Field.

 

Death Field doesn't hit that hard, and has a 15sec cooldown.

Creeping Terror has a 9sec cooldown too, and is a moderate damage DoT.

 

Spec'ing deep into Madness also means you're doing Lightning Charge instead of Surging Charge, which is energy damage instead of internal. So that's still 2 non-physical attacks, instead of 1. I imagine Madness would have a harder time against Commandos too, because it pretty much has no burst.

 

Something like a Pyrotech Vanguard just spams elemental attacks 24/7.

[Evuke]

it's kinda obvious but if you're doing white damage against a geared, heal specced commando/bh you will never take them down, they have too much armor/defenses.

 

you need to be doing magic damage, 3 sorcs will take one down no problem.

 

other classes just look for another target with medium/light armor.

Edited February 5, 2012 by Evuke

[Manigma]

if you're doing white damage against a heal specced commando/bh you will never take them down, they have too much armor/defenses.

 

you need to be doing magic damage, 3 sorcs will take one down no problem.

Lol my guildie is War Hero Sorcerer i'm nearly BM as op. it took both of us foccusing one of these buggers to kill it, even then he wasn't moving just using multiple heals and that ridiculous armour shield. He wasn't being guarded or healed by anyone else before you ask.

Edited February 5, 2012 by Manigma

[Evuke]

Lol my guildie is War Hero Sorcerer i'm nearly BM as op. it took both of us foccusing one of these buggers to kill it, even then he wasn't moving just using multiple heals and that ridiculous armour shield. He wasn't being guarded or healed by anyone else before you ask.

 

ops are probably the weakest class in the game since they were nerfed (or snipers still), so you were moot. So it was really 1 vs 1, you need more than 1 sorc to killa bh, bring 3 next time.

[Manigma]

ops are probably the weakest class in the game since they were nerfed (or snipers still), so you were moot. So it was really 1 vs 1, you need more than 1 sorc to killa bh, bring 3 next time.

We don't have 3 high level sorcerors in my guild, guess we're screwed right?

[Solemnone]

When you're crying for a nerf to healers, then you're just nitpicking; especially when the worst thing they're doing is keeping themselves alive. Nerf the elevator long before you nerf a healer.

[Redmarx]

it's kinda obvious but if you're doing white damage against a geared, heal specced commando/bh you will never take them down, they have too much armor/defenses.

 

you need to be doing magic damage, 3 sorcs will take one down no problem.

 

other classes just look for another target with medium/light armor.

 

 

Again, magic damage does not bypass armor

 

SORC DAMAGE IS MITIGATED BY ARMOR AS IF IT WAS MELEE DAMAGE

 

I don't understand how people do not know this

[Manigma]

When you're crying for a nerf to healers, then you're just nitpicking; especially when the worst thing they're doing is keeping themselves alive. Nerf the elevator long before you nerf a healer.

It's a case of one AC healer being much better than the other ones, so yes it should be brought more in line.

[cokn]

While they are probably the toughest class to fight, I can usually kill them 1v1 on my Assassin. The main problem is that in a WZ, they can usually hold me up long enough for help to arrive.

 

I usually start with a Reckless Surging Charge and cycle interupts (usually Low Slash first as it doesn't fill resolve, has a quick CD and stuns them, followed by Disrupt and finally Electrocute). That gives me three interrupts with a lot of damage in between. There is also Overload but that hits resolve usually too hard and knocks them away.

 

I have seen both good and bad Commando Healers, some I can take out quickly, others which hold me up long enough to get help but I don't see them as unkillable.

[Ryotknife]

you realize that heavy armor means nothing in pvp when most damage goes right through it? sorcs probably have better passive mitigation in pvp than commandoes as they have -10% elemental/internal damage taken, which is what the vast majority of pvp damage is.

 

i have a pvp spec that can use tank or dps stance. with tank stance i have 48% physical damage mitigation, without i have 17%. being in tank stance makes no noticeable difference in my survivability than being in my dps stance. only reason for me to use tank stance is for s snare or for guard.

[ripamorame]

from my experience i do find marauders very good anti healer classes annihilation for one with dots a interrupt a stun/dot and a 20% heal reduction.

[Shanst]

blah blah blah

 

How hard is it to type interrupt? I mean, reading the word rupt, makes my brain want to rupt...ure. Nah mean.

[Iridor]

The OP states that he is speaking about PvP not PvE.

 

In PvP they are a problem.

 

I'm aware of the OP's statement. My point is that because they're gimped support heals in PvE, their cds could reasonably be nerfed slightly in exchange for providing them with more PvE utility. The problem is that people probably wouldn't like a Commando healer with Hots and better AoE heals.

[Crowleyz]

Again, magic damage does not bypass armor

 

SORC DAMAGE IS MITIGATED BY ARMOR AS IF IT WAS MELEE DAMAGE

 

I don't understand how people do not know this

 

It's incredible really. If people just bothered to mouse over the armor and actually check their own skills a lot of frustration could be avoided. Only internal damage bypasses everything, most spells are kinetic which means they at mitigated by armor.

[BambulaGTS]

I can probably kill commando healer with my sniper, but after shield is down, he will not cleanse my dots and he will not run to his teammates.

 

This combination of circumstances requires a really dumb frog dog commando healer

[Gwal]

Gear up newbie.

 

Gear is what makes pro's.

[Batslav]

Dont know why but mercs are easier to be killed i know they are mirror classes but either most mercs are not that good or the mirror reflection is bad

 

anyway Healers having CCs to defend them is fine but having better defensive CDs than tank doesnt look fair

 

adding school lock to interrupts might solve the problem

[Gwal]

anyway Healers having CCs to defend them is fine but having better defensive CDs than tank doesnt look fair

 

25% damage reduction and immunity to pushback (not knock back) and interrupt for 12 seconds every 2 minutes does not compare to tank cool downs.

 

Just use stuns and knockbacks and the Merc/Commando wont be able to do anything but two weak heals one of which is a heal on damage precast the other a very weak instant cast with a 15 second cool down.

 

2 options are here for you.

 

1). Learn to play what you are having trouble killing.

 

2). Get better gear then kill anything of any class with worse gear than you.(no learning required and this actually trumps option 1)

[CaptainInsano]

At the end of the day, killing guarded healers is way too hard vs the skill required to set up guard. It's basically an "I win" move that gives Commandos in particular insane mitigation and you can't even interrupt them. If you interrupt one heal, they can simply cast another if their aura mastery is on CD. A guarded Commando can tank entire teams of DPS if the tank is using taunts. It's just stupid and there isn't a counter.

 

2 things need to change for PvP to actually be competitive: 1.) Big cooldown on Guard. 2.) Interrupts lock out spell schools, not just 1 ability. In WoW for example, healers don't even have the benefit of tanks providing them with 50%+ mitigation and this is how interrupts work. It's very puzzling why BW felt the need to stack the deck in the healers' favor so much.

Edited February 6, 2012 by CaptainInsano

[Adzzy]

The thing that disturbs me the most about this video is the huge dmg output in his healspec. *faceplam* at 9:20 he deals nearly 8k dmg burstdmg to an enemy player in what? 1,4 seconds? heck my highest crits when healspecced is around 2k.. and i run around in 600+ expertise champ gear.

 

Yes his enemys are terrible and he has a pocket tank with him, but his armor absorbs quite an amount of burstdmg on him. Healers rarely die due to dps, they die because of burst, and he nearly never takes any hits above 2k dmg. If i think about it he takes about half as much dmg from any ability i recognized in this video than i would take...

 

I'm shoked. I knew commandos played right were strong but THIS strong?

 

it's because this video is pre patch and a lot of the opponents are pretty low level.

[Niconogood]

What is the point of this? Are you just trying to mock people? Hitting them for 90, 100 and then my biggest attacks CRIT for 500. In the meanwhile they are able to heal about 5-10 times that.

You saying your biggest hit only crit for 750? If not he was guarded, which means you shouldnt be able to take him out.

 

The damage reduction on reactive shield is only 25%. And you have to remember thats our ONLY defensive CD, lasting for a meager 10sec and on horrid 2m timer. It can also be specced to make you interruptable for these 10 meager sec. We dont have force speed, we dont have vanish and the likes. Our ONLY option is to stand there and take the beating. If this meant we would just randomly die to the first ungeared, clueless scrub coming by I dont think there would be many medics out there...

 

Outside of the reactive shield, my life as a commando healer (in BM gear and 18,5k hp), is basically stun, interrupt, stun, interrupt, dead. I get to pop my instaheal and my warzone medpac but thats about it against any 2 players having the faintest idea about what theyre doing.

 

Bads will be bads however. Against clueless, ungeared players I seem to be able to tank 3-4 guys sometimes, for at least 30 sec or so, until i of course run out of ammo, which happens in about 4-5 casts under pressure.

Edited February 6, 2012 by Niconogood

[-sasori]

While they are probably the toughest class to fight, I can usually kill them 1v1 on my Assassin. The main problem is that in a WZ, they can usually hold me up long enough for help to arrive.

 

I usually start with a Reckless Surging Charge and cycle interupts (usually Low Slash first as it doesn't fill resolve, has a quick CD and stuns them, followed by Disrupt and finally Electrocute). That gives me three interrupts with a lot of damage in between. There is also Overload but that hits resolve usually too hard and knocks them away.

 

I have seen both good and bad Commando Healers, some I can take out quickly, others which hold me up long enough to get help but I don't see them as unkillable.

 

Which further proves the contrary, that commando heals need a buff. When the best you can do is to prolong your life while still being a free kill for DDs, there is something broken.

 

But in the case of Marauders i expect a heavy nerf with consumable anyway. Currently their ability to stealth and oocombat heal is ridiculous. Better heals than any commando healer could provide and it's not even interruptable.

Edited February 6, 2012 by -sasori

[Gwal]

i of course run out of ammo, which happens in about 4-5 casts under pressure.

 

Either you're spamming medical probe and nothing else or you specced really, immensly badly.

 

Or you're just lying.

[zeroburrito]

The problem for an Assassin is that their interrupt is on a 12sec (10 sec cooldown). Assuming you interrupt a bigger heal that's a lot of time they can still be casting heals.

 

Assassins are also one of the few worst classes against high armor targets. Assassins only have 2 skills that are not fully reduced by armor, and one is a proc.

 

Side-note: A Commando has as much or more armor than an Assassin tank.

 

Edit: Genesis_Shadow, I tear through sages, but can't touch mercenaries. There's no way to do enough damage to outheal them when your attacks are being reduced 40-55%.

 

560 expertise and 29% mitigation. that's all an assassin tank has?

[CrimsonFire]

Heals are OP period. Being able to outheal someone's damage (and for lest cost) is bad design that leads to boring gameplay. In open world it has less impact but with Warzones where time is the key factor it's just imbalanced.

 

Timed doors are, not only extremely boring and frustrating but also a bandaid for not people surviving longer than intended.