BrianDavion Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 Reven was proably the most powerful jedi of his age problem is this isn't Reven's age anymore. and I don't see any reason why certin individuals being more powerful (includeing the characters played by the PCs) is any great injustice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthMoord Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 Reven was proably the most powerful jedi of his age problem is this isn't Reven's age anymore. and I don't see any reason why certin individuals being more powerful (includeing the characters played by the PCs) is any great injustice. I thought about that argument, but dismissed it. By making it you're conceding that Revan is more powerful than quite a number of Sith who frankly have vastly greater showings of power than he does. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Venturi Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 THE FOLLOWING REPLY CONTAINS SEVERAL SPOILERS None of it was retconned this was Lucasarts plan from the beginning about the true sith being out in the unknown regions and about Revan having found them before and going back out there to find them. This was author Drew Karpyshn's idea in fact. They also did not trivialize the Exile, she went with Revan to fight the Emperor, she was killed by Lord Scourge as they were facing off with him and now her Force Ghost has been keeping Revan alive for 300 years as he fought the Emperors mind probing. Thats not trivializing thats giving her a heroic purpose. Also I do not believe Revan is fully dead or that we've heard the last of him from Foundry. His health wasn't all the way down when he disappeared for one thing. And he even mentioned being able to rebuild HK-47. We'll see him again I am sure of it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wolfninjajedi Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 THE FOLLOWING REPLY CONTAINS SEVERAL SPOILERS None of it was retconned this was Lucasarts plan from the beginning about the true sith being out in the unknown regions and about Revan having found them before and going back out there to find them. This was author Drew Karpyshn's idea in fact. They also did not trivialize the Exile, she went with Revan to fight the Emperor, she was killed by Lord Scourge as they were facing off with him and now her Force Ghost has been keeping Revan alive for 300 years as he fought the Emperors mind probing. Thats not trivializing thats giving her a heroic purpose. Also I do not believe Revan is fully dead or that we've heard the last of him from Foundry. His health wasn't all the way down when he disappeared for one thing. And he even mentioned being able to rebuild HK-47. We'll see him again I am sure of it. You missed the part where he evaporated in an explosion of light, not saying he couldn't be alive but characters that disappear in a flash of light usually isn't good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Venturi Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 There was a difference to his flash of light then others. As it had a purple hue, most of the ones that mark death usually have a blue-ish hue to them. I am thinking he has figured out a way to take himself apart in the Force and rebuld himself elsewhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthThuzad Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 (edited) A) Revan was drained of energy over 300 years. B) These aren't just four noodies. They're more like the champions of the Empire. Not just a run of the mill warrior, inquisitor, etc. Does this Revanism know no end? Darth Revan is old news. All hail Darth Nox! Fixed Edited January 23, 2012 by DarthThuzad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoadtoArkham Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 Drain or not, we've been waiting since KoToR to see Revan again. It's a shame they brought him back just to get rid of him as quickly as possible. He was a very interesting character, with a unique perspective of the Force. I hate what they did with the Exile. Where'd the ****** General chick go who took down Sion, Nihlus, and Traya? She's jealous of Bastilla? She retains unflinching faith in the Light Side after KoToR II? Did she learn nothing from Kreia? And poor T3 and HK... I have said this before and I'll say it again, they blew their load too early. All these years of build up, fleshing out the heroes and villains of the Old Republic, only to kill them all off in the release of a game that's supposed to last? And don't get me started on Vitae...totally belittles Nihlus, Palpatine, and all other great Sith, canon-wise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthMoord Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 Fixed You got a funny way of spelling 'The Emperor's Wrath'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthFanatic Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 (edited) Drain or not, we've been waiting since KoToR to see Revan again. It's a shame they brought him back just to get rid of him as quickly as possible. He was a very interesting character, with a unique perspective of the Force. I hate what they did with the Exile. Where'd the ****** General chick go who took down Sion, Nihlus, and Traya? She's jealous of Bastilla? She retains unflinching faith in the Light Side after KoToR II? Did she learn nothing from Kreia? And poor T3 and HK... I have said this before and I'll say it again, they blew their load too early. All these years of build up, fleshing out the heroes and villains of the Old Republic, only to kill them all off in the release of a game that's supposed to last? And don't get me started on Vitae...totally belittles Nihlus, Palpatine, and all other great Sith, canon-wise. Vitiate has nothing on Palpatine. Vitiate is still powerful but Palpatine did crazy stuff in EU. I don't think we've see the last of Revan. No one in any fictional setting, especially Sci-fi/Fantasy, should be considered dead unless there is a body and even sometimes that doesn't guarantee death. Edited January 23, 2012 by DarthFanatic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthMoord Posted January 23, 2012 Share Posted January 23, 2012 And don't get me started on Vitae...totally belittles Nihlus, Palpatine, and all other great Sith, canon-wise. Except he doesn't. Palpatine is miles above any other Sith except Caedus. He summons planet-killing, fleet disintegrating wormholes that can transport people he chooses acrossed the Galaxy. He's got Galaxy-wide Battle Meditation. By Dark Empire he and Luke are engaged in a duel that occurs at speed that boggles even a Jedi's ability to perceive. Not to mention mindwiping all of Coruscant at once to forget about the Lusankya. Oh and Palpatine can do what Nihilus does, only he can actually control it. As for Nihilus I honestly couldn't care about him being outperformed by a fifteen-hundred year old body jumping malevolent being, it says a lot about Nihilus that it takes that much effort to top him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DesAnvos Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 Or he was never as strong as his fans wanted him to be as their personal Mary Sue. Lets look at the endings of KOTOR before they retconed it, Dark Lord Reborn: Republic and Jedi are all but dead, Starforge is reaching new hieghts of infinate fleet, disidants can be thrown in those pods to keep Revan healthy and strong, and he has a companion who has a force power capable of turning the tide of battle. All in all Revan is nearly unstopable and Sith Empire isn't a threat. Revan Redemed: Republic and Jedi order are saved and have a new guardian to lead the republic and jedi into rebuilding and strengthening themselves before the sith arrive. Not quite as great as an infinate fleet but the Republic would have been far stronger and unified and jedi now have a path to using both sides of the force. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Koronii Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 They've also trivialized Exile as well, and Darth Nihilus. It's like a hit job on KOTOR 2. How can they trivialize Darth Nihilus? He's dead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthMoord Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 (edited) Lets look at the endings of KOTOR before they retconed it, Except they didn't. Dark Lord Reborn: Republic and Jedi are all but dead, Starforge is reaching new hieghts of infinate fleet, disidants can be thrown in those pods to keep Revan healthy and strong, and he has a companion who has a force power capable of turning the tide of battle. All in all Revan is nearly unstopable and Sith Empire isn't a threat. First of all Revan understood that the Starforge drains the user and it was only a temporary use. Second we only ever see Force Users in those pods so it's not an infinite source. Third Battle Meditation was rare during the Jedi Civil War, not in later times. There's nothing here to suggest that the fight with the Reformed Sith Empire is going to be at all easy. Jedi can't use 'both sides of the force'. This can't be laid out any more simply, 'Once you start down the dark path, forever will it dominate your destiny'. Revan didn't master the Dark Side and the Light Side simultaneously, it was always one or the other. Revan Redemed: Republic and Jedi order are saved and have a new guardian to lead the republic and jedi into rebuilding and strengthening themselves before the sith arrive. Not quite as great as an infinate fleet but the Republic would have been far stronger and unified and jedi now have a path to using both sides of the force. That's not how the Force works. You can't use 'both sides of the force'. This is quite explicit in RotJ when Yoda says it and it's further laid out by Luke in the Dark Nest Trilogy that there is a dark side and if you use it you WILL fall. How can they trivialize Darth Nihilus? He's dead. Apparently a Sith Lord stronger than Nihilus somehow makes Nihilus lesser. Edited January 24, 2012 by DarthMoord Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Koronii Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 Apparently a Sith Lord stronger than Nihilus somehow makes Nihilus lesser. The weirdest thing about that is that Darth Nihilus is described as weak by both Kreia and the Jedi Exile if she has a high enough wisdom score. The force hunger gave him power, but it came at a terrible cost. He was already dying when you fought him on Telos. And he would have died, even if he killed you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wargonglok Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 you could play republic and save him radical I know, but just think about it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forgon Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 Fanboyism at its strongest. As a Revan fan, I cannot stress how much I believe he was fine. What was retconned from KotOR II exactly because, frankly, I believe you are not only misusing the term but also assuming your perception of the characters is reality. Kreia, Revan, HK, among others sounded find imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rabios Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 The fact that revan was in the game bothered me .Hk i understand but revan ***. make it a cl 50 quest and dont have us kill him . in essence im betraying myself lol if you play kotar you are reven etc . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Koronii Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 Personally I'd have preferred Revan to have died when he attacked the Emperor in the book. He doesn't to my mind add enough to the game to justify this rather bizarre cameo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RoadtoArkham Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 Fanboyism at its strongest. Having an opinion does not a fanboy make. Frankly, I'm disgusted at how often the "fanboy" charge is leveled at people on these forums, simply for expressing an opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liberate Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 (edited) Maybe it's because our current characters are BA? Edited January 24, 2012 by Liberate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Talkative Posted January 24, 2012 Share Posted January 24, 2012 It's a (poor) storytelling technique to allow players to benchmark the awesome of their characters. "Man you remember how we took out REVAN at level 30? We're level 50 now, bro." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DarthMoord Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 Having an opinion does not a fanboy make. Frankly, I'm disgusted at how often the "fanboy" charge is leveled at people on these forums, simply for expressing an opinion. There's a difference between expressing an opinion and arguing that a character is awesomely powerful despite no examples to go by. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Erstok Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 Revan was retconned purely because after a 100 years or so Revan realized that people can go above level 20(kotor 1 level limit). HK-47 is the only TRUE hero of the kotor series, meatbags. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrandMasterOdin Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 1. A lot of Revan's hype was due to his charisma. Whenever he puts on that mask, you are not facing a Jedi or a Sith, but an idea. A symbol of unity in the Mandalorian Wars, a symbol of terror in . A lot of things about him has been exaggerated, since he is like, a symbol, a legend. I'd loved the book and the game because it puts him into a more human twist to him rather than legend. 2. You killed Revan, and he's now one with the force? Really? Did his cloak, armor, and mask got left behind after the purple flash of light just like Obi-Wan's robes did when he was struck down or ... http://starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Fold_space 3. I wouldn't even pretend to know what Revan is capable of at his prime, or at the foundry. I don't know which is potential, exaggeration, and capability because things are pretty blurred, and that's alright. So, I'll just enjoy the game take things at face value but still with a grain of salt, and worry less. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
blahmanmeh Posted January 25, 2012 Share Posted January 25, 2012 DarthMoord just shut it no one cares about your arguing points as so many others have said its based off of opinion. and at some point someone said he was "one of the strongest JEDI of his time" not sith as you keep saying but jedi. And when he's fighting the emperor he's doing so as a JEDI so stop comparing him to sith that's his former self not how he is now. And as for you saying Caedus is so pro. not so much is hack job sister cuts his arm off and he continued to fight even at the expense of his injuries and he dies. well now sounds like a great death for a sith lord i mean it took Vader throwing the emperor down a nearly bottomless pit but he loses an arm and then has the stupidity to continue the attack with one arm and unhealed wounds instead of being smart as he has proven himself to be in the past very strong indeed. so in conclusion no one cares its a matter of opinion you may have some facts but not all of them. revan could be capable of so much more then he is now only the creator of revan has an idea of where he will end up. death is immanent in his future but his story has been a good one and many people enjoy it. and if you dont believe revan to be strong then his symbolism that has held followers for centuries and produced darth bane. im seeing that yes he was powerful but in a way the other sith never were and that was that he had charisma and he was an intellectual beyond his years and that my good sir is a strength far greater then raw power in its own. so checkmate and all that other malarky and just cut the crap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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