Why make excuses For MMO's at launch?

[davidpop]

MMOs are allowed to launch with bugs etc because the games tend to be far larger than single player games. If they waited until the game was bug free the game would never launch.

 

True, but even single player games releases with bugs these days, because they know they can patch later.

[navarh]

i'm software-developer

not games but ERP, not big company, nothing specisal we do our work on local market in our country

 

and if i, for some unknown reason, go to company that alreay running some erp-system and offer them buy mine, that has nothing special, have some flavs and miss alot of bonus-features and guess what? they don't buy it

and even if i'm try to feed them with "evolving & incoming patches" in best-case scenario they answer "ok, come again when u evolve enough to make good offer to us" but likely they just lol at me, they don't need something someday "soon" if they can work with same things right now and here

 

 

i saw some post's like "wow players want wow in space blahblahblah" ok, but i don't "want" it i alredy have it (= u can deny as much as u can but it will atay like this

 

 

oh i missed post where was debate about hardware and sowtware failures, so i add my info, and fo mmo it is very-likely (for old-ones like 2004 wow it's very likely)

"server" was planned to maintain like 30 active-connections (in "" cuz that was simple desktop computer), and then bam we recieve call that program-software work tooo sloooooowww we scratch head and then begun to extract more info from them

and guess what? active conection is not 30 but 100+ part of them via vpn from remote places with horrid, absolute garbage connection

sadstory cheap "server" wasn't able to handle that, and connection that have like a 30-40% packet-loss is not our problem either

Edited January 22, 2012 by navarh

[infestedchris]

If they wanted to cleanse every bug from a MMO the game would never come out. They have to beat out competition. A company has to produce results you numb nuts. You think Bioware is just going to sit idle while they feed a 3 year old project? Then they say, "You know what president of Bioware, I think the game should be perfect and awesome and have 0 bugs at launch. Can we have another year or two doing this?" YEAH RIGHT!!

 

They would close the project so fast. You think money just grows on trees? You think investors are just going to sit and feed something they feel is showing no results? You guys need to stop playing video games for a while and go outside. Go pay bills, go get a job, go do things that involve life.

 

They need to turn a profit. They get a sum amount of money. They use that money. If they need more time they have to host another meeting with investors and all kinds of crap to get more money. The process is all business. And until you understand that, these MMO's will just have to due with what they got.

[calibrik]

Well what i keep reading in these threads is mostly people making excuses for MMO's at launch, In my understanding MMO means Massivly Multiplayer Online. Soo why do people make excuses for MMO's at launch?

 

When we buy an MMO game, we do not buy it for constant bugs and things not working as they should. People make too many excuses for these companies and developers of these games.

 

Does not matter what excuses are going to be said in this thread. I bought this game for fun and it should not matter if i buy this game at launch, or 6 months after launch i should get the same experiance there is no excuse for that.

 

What is the point of BETA for soo long if launch is not going to be perfect (or atleast close)

 

People giving theses companies the excuse of ''ALL MMO'S ARE THE SAME AT LAUNCH'' is not the answer. Giving them this excuse lets them bring out MMO's before they are actually ready giving profit from a game that is still in BETA stages.

 

SWTOR BETA TESTING

 

I have read muliple threads about BW not fixing bugs that were reported in BETA and the bugs are still in game, I blame mostly the '' ALL MMO'S ARE THE SAME AT LAUNCH EXCUSES'' without these the companies and developers would work harder to get the MMO up to scratch before launch.

 

Ok soo i know i am going to get people hating my opinions and soo on but who agrees with me and why ????????

 

Thanks for your time and patiance this was bigger than i thought i would have been

 

may the force be with u all

 

why? because they are MASSIVE

Edited January 22, 2012 by calibrik

[Ellvaan]

Greetings everyone!

 

We recently removed several posts from this thread for not being in compliance with our Rules of Conduct.

 

While we do welcome all feedback, both positive and negative, we ask that your feedback be constructive. For better understanding on helpful feedback, please refer to this thread by Allison Berryman. We encourage you to please be constructive and civil in your posts. If rude and insulting behavior continues, we will be closing this thread.

 

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Edited January 22, 2012 by Ellvaan

[Runeshard]

Like look here everyone made my point ''its a new game'' every single time, it is people like you that make the companies think it is ok to launch in these states. And without people like you they would take notice and actually get the game to the gameplay (6 months after launch ususally bring) at launch.

You didn't read the linked aritcle did you, or if you did it seems you didn't understand it.

 

Far too many people, like yourself I dare say, are completely unreasonable, demanding perfection from the first day and losing their minds when these unrealistic expectations aren't met.

[quantumsheep]

Far too many people, like yourself I dare say, are completely unreasonable, demanding perfection from the first day and losing their minds when these unrealistic expectations aren't met.

 

This entertaining and interesting talk might go some way to explaining that:

 

http://www.strategies.ca/en/2011/06/the-unexpected-impact-of-choice-on-customer-satisfaction/

 

The whole thing is fascinating and I'd encourage people to watch it all, but he deals with unrealistic customer expectations, and possible causes at around 12:16

 

QS

[Runeshard]

This entertaining and interesting talk might go some way to explaining that:

 

http://www.strategies.ca/en/2011/06/the-unexpected-impact-of-choice-on-customer-satisfaction/

 

The whole thing is fascinating and I'd encourage people to watch it all, but he deals with unrealistic customer expectations, and possible causes at around 12:16

 

QS

 

That was good, thanks for the link

[Jinzouningen]

While travelling in the Second and Third worlds I noticed power outages were a fairly common occurrence. I wondered why my hosts/friends/coworkers did not seem in the least upset or complain about it. They were conditioned to expect it, and more importantly, accept it.

 

Now you have a bunch of First worlders buying a hyped MMO game. they are conditioned to expect major components to be present and work correctly. When they don't, they complain. A few biodrone fanbois try to shout them down saying "when I lived in Albania we had power outages all the time!"

 

That isn't going to work on the average modern First world game consumer any more than daily power outages would. Don't blame the consumer; modern society has created them and companies are generally astute enough to deal with them. Hence the crux of the problem in ToR.

 

Mediocre CS and limited info from devs has irritated Mr and Mrs average game consumer. When they call the power company saying "my power is out" they don't want to be put on hold for days/weeks, they want timely feedback and gentle reassurance. Biodrones screaming "live by candlelight!" is not going to satisfy them. If BW was the only game in town maybe, but competition in the marketplace is too tough these days and I fear those subs/dollars/gaming hours will be going somewhere else.

 

Never have the chance to make a second first impression, at least until the day you F2P I guess.

 

hahah this is great and nails it XD

 

Its like the walked 3 miles one way in the snow to school stories. We own a few cars gandpa i think we'll use those now. but if they break down we're still not walking 3 miles in the snow to school

[Fiachsidhe]

I said CONSTANTLY. Most time Windows XP, or 7 would not crash unless you have a hardware issue, or another application causing interference.

 

Most people dont know how to configure their computer and just assume it is an OS issue.

 

So actually it is a good example..If windows 7, or xp, or even vista crashed constantly it would be hard for you to make this post.

 

You know nothing of Windows. I mean nothing.

 

All Windows have had rocky starts. Windows ME was like having a virus, Windows Vista crashed constantly and like XP, had mad compatibility issues. Every Windows program has required eventual service packs, to become fully functional.

 

How many service packs are required to run Windows 7, at it's most effective now?

Edited January 22, 2012 by Fiachsidhe

[captainmerkin]

simply put, every game out there, every job role, every restaurant, every pub , bar and club, politician, president and person on the planet makes mistakes and has a learning curve for everything single thing they do new or old..

 

A game is no different, its build by people, run by people, developed by people. It has a learning curve, showing those in control how it works with a real live player base is essential to fixing and developing the game.

 

If the game had all of these bugs that have been found in 6 months - a years time, I would be mildly concerned, but this is one of the best launches I have ever seen and the game is very, very complete from my experience and deserves a great deal of leeway in its launch phase and coming months for achieving so much.

[RamataKahn]

One word to the OP's question:

 

Fanbois.

[Jebazel]

I thought that's what Beta's were for.. but what do I know.

 

I do know Electronic Accountants insisted on early release for the Christmas market...

 

 

 

[Fiachsidhe]

Actually no where in that post did I compare a person at the start of life to someone at the end of life. In fact I was pretty straight in comparing education and success in general.

 

So by my logic each generation should build on the success of the previous, your grandparents high school dropouts, parents graduate HS, you college, your kids masters/phd, or just in general learn more and have better life.

 

Except that people are individuals, and each individual needs time to grow, and reach that potential. You can't just take all the previous experience, and do everything at once.

 

I get what you're saying, but your analogy was horribly flawed. You want Bioware to look at previous games, and learn from them. The thing you fail to realize is that their time, and resources, are limited.

 

They needed to lay down the groundwork, for the game they wished to produce. That took a lot of time, and resources. Now they can add to it, and get all the little nuances in, that other games can make time time for, due to having little else to worry about.

 

Other mmorpgs don't have elaborate systems in place for cinematics, choices and story, the way this game does. Thus, they can focus on all those little things.

 

When your main game, consists of moving from zone to zone, grinding for text-based quests that have zero variables, you can include all sorts of crap at your leisure. People who understand this basic, and simple premise, can wait for the inevitable improvements.

 

Others sit around and complain, expecting this level of story telling, companions, space combat, AND everything else, in the same development timeframe. It's ignorant and naive.

Edited January 22, 2012 by Fiachsidhe

[laserfloyd]

Well what i keep reading in these threads is mostly people making excuses for MMO's at launch, In my understanding MMO means Massivly Multiplayer Online. Soo why do people make excuses for MMO's at launch?

 

When we buy an MMO game, we do not buy it for constant bugs and things not working as they should. People make too many excuses for these companies and developers of these games.

 

Does not matter what excuses are going to be said in this thread. I bought this game for fun and it should not matter if i buy this game at launch, or 6 months after launch i should get the same experiance there is no excuse for that.

 

What is the point of BETA for soo long if launch is not going to be perfect (or atleast close)

 

People giving theses companies the excuse of ''ALL MMO'S ARE THE SAME AT LAUNCH'' is not the answer. Giving them this excuse lets them bring out MMO's before they are actually ready giving profit from a game that is still in BETA stages.

 

SWTOR BETA TESTING

 

I have read muliple threads about BW not fixing bugs that were reported in BETA and the bugs are still in game, I blame mostly the '' ALL MMO'S ARE THE SAME AT LAUNCH EXCUSES'' without these the companies and developers would work harder to get the MMO up to scratch before launch.

 

Ok soo i know i am going to get people hating my opinions and soo on but who agrees with me and why ????????

 

Thanks for your time and patiance this was bigger than i thought i would have been

 

may the force be with u all

 

 

But they are all the same at launch. That's just how it works out. You go from thousands to millions of players and things break. :/

[Zhiroc]

Another point to make: Welcome to the wonderful world of software.

 

Let's take a look at an extremely important and popular product: Firefox.

 

If you do a search for those bugs with status between NEW and REOPENED, and severity normal and higher, there are over 6000 bugs.

 

If you narrow down the search to just the ones marked major and higher, there are still almost 600 bugs.

 

And I would argue that FF is a fundamentally simpler design than an MMO server and client.

 

Software has bugs. Version 1 always has more. It's just how it is.

[Tic-]

Nature of the beast. Simple as that.

 

I was there opening day for UO, and a lot of opening days since. Its the way it is, and the way it shall stay. I've seen this post in every MMO since DAoC. If you don't care for it, don't purchase them for 6 months or so.

[Pink_Saber]

Well what i keep reading in these threads is mostly people making excuses for MMO's at launch, In my understanding MMO means Massivly Multiplayer Online. Soo why do people make excuses for MMO's at launch?

 

It's not an "excuse" to say MMOs have bugs at at launch. It's the absolute truth, not just for MMOs, but for any large software project.

[Tiam]

Most people are sheep. They have become used to getting an incomplete product, paying full price for it and living with it.

 

In their world it is the norm, and attack people norm is seen as an attack on themselves.

 

Apparently fanbois are fans of mediocrity. Thank goodness the majority have a brain and won't pay for an incomplete mmo these days.

[Charlzki]

Well what i keep reading in these threads is mostly people making excuses for MMO's at launch, In my understanding MMO means Massivly Multiplayer Online. Soo why do people make excuses for MMO's at launch?

 

When we buy an MMO game, we do not buy it for constant bugs and things not working as they should. People make too many excuses for these companies and developers of these games.

 

Does not matter what excuses are going to be said in this thread. I bought this game for fun and it should not matter if i buy this game at launch, or 6 months after launch i should get the same experiance there is no excuse for that.

 

What is the point of BETA for soo long if launch is not going to be perfect (or atleast close)

 

People giving theses companies the excuse of ''ALL MMO'S ARE THE SAME AT LAUNCH'' is not the answer. Giving them this excuse lets them bring out MMO's before they are actually ready giving profit from a game that is still in BETA stages.

 

SWTOR BETA TESTING

 

I have read muliple threads about BW not fixing bugs that were reported in BETA and the bugs are still in game, I blame mostly the '' ALL MMO'S ARE THE SAME AT LAUNCH EXCUSES'' without these the companies and developers would work harder to get the MMO up to scratch before launch.

 

Ok soo i know i am going to get people hating my opinions and soo on but who agrees with me and why ????????

 

Thanks for your time and patiance this was bigger than i thought i would have been

 

may the force be with u all

 

 

Seriously every MMO is the same, I know it can be frustrating for people like you (complainers). If you cant stand the bugs of MMOs (all of them really are like that at launch) then just buy it 2-3 months after release (you might even pay less than at launch if you wait). At launch the game should come with 2+ months of free game time tho !

[Derbefrier]

@ OP i think its been very well explained why people have come to expect lots of bugs in an MMO launch. being a fanboy or a "sheep" as some one else put it has nothing to do with it. This is just how MMOs are Its what long time MMO players have come to expect. now this game is faaar from unplayable and my experience has been a pretty smooth one. if your unwilling to accept this point of view thats fine but this point of view comes from experience with other MMos not fanboyism or anything like that. Our experience tells us to expect problems during a launch of an MMO and because of that we are generally more accepting of problems (that doesn't mean we dont expect to see them fixed, of course we do). and when these players try to convey that to some who writes a long winded QQ i am cancelling my sub post its often done to help quell their fears in hopes to get them to stick it out.

 

for first time MMO players i expect this can seem quite disappointing, and maybe you guys have a point. maybe we should expect more from a release in 2011 but that's entirely up to the individual to make that choice. but maybe knowing why that choice is made can help you better understand why some people are a lot more patient when it comes to bug fixing,

[Torquist]

It's called "reality". Some people have a hard time coming to terms with that one.

 

Next is called "reasonable expectations". This one is even more difficult to grasp.

 

And the final one which I personally use to evaluate a new MMO that I have bought "How do the developers respond within the first 3 months"

 

From the culmination of those 3, I then make my judgement. In amongst all the rabid QQing, I do actually appreciate all the constructive negative posts calling for fixes and improvements. I'm just glad it's not my job to have to sift through the rubbish.

[Vastalee]

Hello all,

 

While we do encourage feedback of all types (positive and negative) we do ask that it promote constructive discussion on the forums. We have the following thread where you can share your suggestions on improving the game with others in the community:

 

The Suggestion Compilation Thread - Regularly updated!

 

We're going to go ahead and close this thread.