Sith Emperor vs Darth Sidious

[Aurbere]

Vitiate supporters is a very liquid term.In terms of real support ,i don't like Vitiate at all.At all.And have mixed feelings toward Sidious.

Now... claiming Vitiate is more powerful is just stating the obvious.Vitiate supporters is too strong a term to be used for these people.

Sidious supporters are not actually Sidious supporters imo.They are old SW concepts and old fixed views supporters on SW things vs the concepts brought by the Bioware part of the SW franchise.Same goes for Revan.

For these people SW will always be about the movies and the Skywalker story.The other stories are just an add on.For me Vader and movies story is just one of many and far from the best one.Imo that's the point of the matter.

 

Answer me this: Do you support Vitiate being more powerful than Sidious?

[Kaedusz]

I'd encourage you to read this thread, and I'd encourage you read all of it

 

I have read it .It's a profane method of comparing,created to give Palpatine an artificial edge in advance.Using this method one can make nearly every sith or jedi appear stronger or equal to any other,depending on predetermined already created opinion.

 

For example ''Sith Emperor: shows little to no skill in lightsaber combat.''

The Son showed little to no skill in lightsaber combat either.The Father too ,the Daughter too.

Same goes for Force powers.The Son's display of Force powers is actually lower and much much fewer in number than Palpatine's.

Nearly all mentioned things regarding Palpatine are useless or moot in this way.

 

 

Also you have missed a few things about Vitiate.

 

PS:The first paragraph (''In the old days...'') says much about the motivation to support Sidious and reinforces a point i made earlier.

[Beniboybling]

I have read it .It's a profane method of comparing,created to give Palpatine an artificial edge in advance.Using this method one can make nearly every sith or jedi appear stronger or equal to any other,depending on predetermined already created opinion.

 

For example ''Sith Emperor: shows little to no skill in lightsaber combat.''

The Son showed little to no skill in lightsaber combat either.The Father too ,the Daughter too.

Same goes for Force powers.The Son's display of Force powers is actually lower and much much fewer in number than Palpatine's.

Nearly all mentioned things regarding Palpatine are useless in this way.

 

 

Also you have missed a few things about Vitiate.

No offense, but that argument is pathetic. Its laughable. All it shows it your complete and utter inability to provide some reasoning for your argument, instead you resort to cop-out strategies and evasive techniques.

 

A lot of time and effort has been put in by those supporting Sidious. and not just now but for a long time. The least you could do is show some respect and put the same amount of effort to support your own argument.

 

Really this is just rude.

 

And don't feel the need to respond, I think you've proven quite clearly that your opinion isn't worth my time.

[Kaedusz]

No offense, but that argument is pathetic. Its laughable. All it shows it your complete and utter inability to provide some reasoning for your argument, instead you resort to cop-out strategies and evasive techniques.

 

A lot of time and effort has been put in by those supporting Sidious. and not just now but for a long time. The least you could do is show some respect and put the same amount of effort to support your own argument.

 

Really this is just rude.

 

And don't feel the need to respond, I think you've proven quite clearly that your opinion isn't worth my time.

So... i pointed out the inconsistency of your attempt of a ''great showdown'' and you become insulted and defensive.

Nice...

It again proves that Sidious' support has little to do with actually supporting Sidious for most powerful sith.It's an ego massage and adherence to old concept that doesn't like changes.Hence the ''PS: '' in my previous post.

[Beniboybling]

So... i pointed out the inconsistency of your attempt of a ''great showdown'' and you become insulted and defensive.

Nice...

It again proves that Sidious' support has little to do with actually supporting Sidious for most powerful sith.It's an ego massage and adherence to old concept that doesn't like changes.Hence the ''PS: '' in my previous post.

So no attempt to elaborate on your point or present any argument of your own? Just more whining?

 

What exactly does your argument consist of? Or is it all insults and brazen opinion?

 

P.S. Your 'inconsistency' doesn't exist. I've carefully made sure to only make direct comparison between abilities that the Sith Emperor and Sidious share.

[Aurbere]

For example ''Sith Emperor: shows little to no skill in lightsaber combat.''

The Son showed little to no skill in lightsaber combat either.The Father too ,the Daughter too.

Same goes for Force powers.The Son's display of Force powers is actually lower and much much fewer in number than Palpatine's.

Nearly all mentioned things regarding Palpatine are useless or moot in this way.

 

If you have issues with my work in the project (the BattleZone format should have made that obvious) please direct them to me.

 

But as to your concern. You are right The Ones do not have any lightsaber skill. If you had taken that quote in the context that it was posted, you would know that it was a comparison between Sidious and Vitiate's lightsaber skills.

 

Also, great lightsaber skills are not indicative of great power in the Force. Master Fay is an incredibly powerful Jedi Master, yet she has no lightsaber skill of note.

 

Also, it is canon that The Ones are the most powerful beings in the galaxy, so that other argument is null.

[Kaedusz]

So no attempt to elaborate on your point or present any argument of your own? Just more whining?

 

What exactly does your argument consist of? Or is it all insults and brazen opinion?

I wouldn't classify my last few posts as whining.

Regarding elaboration of my ''support'' of Vitiate,its been done a million times to death by many people,including in a lengthy description of Vitiate by some guy in a thread i am too lazy to search for.

At this point i said what i had to say.I am not discussing SW lore just for the sake of discussing it,for fun,at this time.

[Kaedusz]

Also, it is canon that The Ones are the most powerful beings in the galaxy, so that other argument is null.[/color]

They are most powerful by virtue of being what they are,first.By virtue of Canon-second,third,fourth .. etc. So it was not null in our context.

[Aurbere]

They are most powerful by virtue of being what they are,first.By virtue of Canon-second,third,fourth .. etc. So it was not null in our context.

 

I'm not sure I understand. Are you attempting to say that Sidious isn't the most powerful Sith Lord because of The Ones?

[Beniboybling]

I wouldn't classify my last few posts as whining.

Regarding elaboration of my ''support'' of Vitiate,its been done a million times to death by many people,including in a lengthy description of Vitiate by some guy in a thread i am too lazy to search for.

At this point i said what i had to say.I am not discussing SW lore just for the sake of discussing it,for fun,at this time.

The primary thrust of your argument is that we are outdated old fogies with over inflated egos. Essentially your complaining, and your complaints are feeble as you don't even know who we are. That is the definition of whining I'm afraid. Obviously you don't have any credible argument to back up your opinions, so stop whining, and stop putting forward your opinion as if its a blatant fact, without putting in any effort to back it up. Because that is insulting.

[Kaedusz]

I'm not sure I understand. Are you attempting to say that Sidious isn't the most powerful Sith Lord because of The Ones?

Nope,they are more powerful than him because of what they are.And you know that without the need to see them do every single thing Sidious did and improve on it.

I mentioned them because this comparison can be translanted into the Vitiate vs Sidious discussion.It's another way of looking at it.

[Aurbere]

Nope,they are more powerful than him because of what they are.And you know that without the need to see them do every single thing Sidious did and improve on it.

I mentioned them because this comparison can be translanted into the Vitiate vs Sidious discussion.It's another way of looking at it.

 

/facepalm

 

You're grasping at straws now.

[Kaedusz]

edit : I just took notice of this ^

You're grasping at straws now.[/color]

Claiming that the whole method of comparison you people manufacture as ineffective in our context,is nowhere near the vicinity of grasping at straws.

 

 

The primary thrust of your argument is that we are outdated old fogies with over inflated egos. Essentially your complaining

 

Complaining and whining by definition implies that i express dissatisfaction or grief ; or i am effected in some negative way by the object of the complaint.

These things doesn't exist here. I am perfectly fine with your position,after all we are all SW fans ,however i find it worthy of replying to.I find it interesting.

 

So you see,basically ,you are found guilty of complaining because not every1 agrees with your pov.

[Beniboybling]

Complaining and whining by definition implies that i express dissatisfaction or grief ; or i am effected in some negative way by the object of the complaint.

These things doesn't exist here. I am perfectly fine with your position,after all we are all SW fans ,however i find it worthy of replying to.I find it interesting.

 

So you see,basically ,you are found guilty of complaining because not every1 agrees with your pov.

What you are doing is stating you are right without providing any evidence. Simple as.

[Kaedusz]

What you are doing is stating you are right without providing any evidence. Simple as.

technically i did,because the point of my last several posts was that Sidious' support is not as much about Sidious' support as something else.

[Beniboybling]

technically i did,because this was the point of my last several posts was that Sidious' support is not as much about Sidious' support as something else.

Yes yes I mean aside from the whining. Which for the record is not credible argument, it doesn't matter what somebody's motives are (which is baseless theory and you do not know any of us in person) as long as their arguments are valid. Especially given the fact that your are baselessely ascribing good and bad to your own fabricated ideals.

[Aurbere]

technically i did,because the point of my last several posts was that Sidious' support is not as much about Sidious' support as something else.

 

Yes, yes, we support Sidious because we are obsessive fanboys of the movies. We are so infatuated with the characters. So much so that we don't want any other character to even be considered a threat to them.

[Kaedusz]

Yes yes I mean aside from the whining. .

And we are back to square 1 and further reinforcement of my point.Page 48 ,7th post,the PS part + the one before the last.I rest my case.

And ofc let's not forget that according to the definition i was nowhere near close to whining,you however were close.

[khayyinx]

Then you didn't truly understand it.

 

Please, enlighten me..

 

Sidious supporters are not actually Sidious supporters imo.They are old SW concepts and old fixed views supporters on SW things vs the concepts brought by the Bioware part of the SW franchise.Same goes for Revan.

For these people SW will always be about the movies and the Skywalker story.The other stories are just an add on.For me Vader and movies story is just one of many and far from the best one.Imo that's the point of the matter.[/Quote]

 

You couldn't be more right about this!!

 

Beniboybling, there's a lot of evidence including in this thread! All you have to do is see posts of people defending vitiate, excpecially SW_Legend who gave a lot of plausible arguments.

 

Now, I could agree that vitiate may lose a fight against sidious, mainly due to his lack of lightsaber skills, but it's definetely not a stomp. You want a stomp? Make sidious fight against ep.1 obi-wan, maybe...

 

Also, more powerfull doesn't means who would win in a fight. I think movie sidious would have a lot of trouble in a real sith empire...

[Aurbere]

Please, enlighten me..

 

It's right there. His overconfidence was his weakness.

 

But, I mean, it's not like the Sith Emperor didn't have an embarrassing death. It's not like he walked right into some pathetic Jedi's lightsaber, or something as stupid as that...

[khayyinx]

It's right there. His overconfidence was his weakness.

 

But, I mean, it's not like the Sith Emperor didn't have an embarrassing death. It's not like he walked right into some pathetic Jedi's lightsaber, or something as stupid as that...

 

So, all someone have to do is grab him and throw him? I think vitiate could do that...

 

And it's still not explained why he didn't fly or used the force to survive the fall, if he's so powerfull

[Beniboybling]

And we are back to square 1 and further reinforcement of my point.Page 48 ,7th post,the PS part + the one before the last.I rest my case.

And ofc let's not forget that according to the definition i was nowhere near close to whining,you however were close.

You don't have a case, never did and likely never will.

[Beniboybling]

You couldn't be more right about this!!

 

Beniboybling, there's a lot of evidence including in this thread! All you have to do is see posts of people defending vitiate, excpecially SW_Legend who gave a lot of plausible arguments.

 

Now, I could agree that vitiate may lose a fight against sidious, mainly due to his lack of lightsaber skills, but it's definetely not a stomp. You want a stomp? Make sidious fight against ep.1 obi-wan, maybe...

 

Also, more powerfull doesn't means who would win in a fight. I think movie sidious would have a lot of trouble in a real sith empire...

Really, I thought better that you wouldn't agree with him. But clearly I was wrong. If all the Vitiate-supporters can do is resort to such petty attacks then we've already won this debate. The least you could do is actually consider respond to the arguments put forward, here and elsewhere. But it seems your not even capable of that, the only thing Legend would be, is ashamed of your inability to defend his arguments. Which for the record I have made sure to counter.

 

Formulating opinions on the personalities people you know very little about and haven't even met and then forcing these opinions on them strikes of ignorance and arrogance. And I'd like to make it abundantly clear, though I shouldn't have to, that it couldn't be further from the truth. I myself am a massive fan of the Old Republic era, in fact its my favourite era and couldn't really care for the post-ROTJ.

 

And you know what else? The Sith Emperor is one of my favourite characters from that era. Yet despite this I'm still capable of formulating a logical opinion contrary to my personal preferences. Which for the record shouldn't matter.

 

Who cares if people dislike the Sith Emperor and prefer other era's? What gives you the right to lecture them about how that isn't OK? So whatever your response may be, try to factor in some respect for other people's opinions. Or at the very least some acknowledgement, because you've failed to respond to post #471 where I address your concerns.

 

Simply put, your sullying our impression of you. Both of you. What we see is individuals clinging to their opinions against overwhelming evidence that points to the contrary, and its frustrating, because you don't even has the courtesy to make the slightest effort to propose a solid counter-argument, and promote constructive debate. Please, please try to understand our position here. Rather than supporting this nonsense, it will get you nowhere.

 

P.S. The distinction between movie Sidious and post-ROTJ Sidious is a slim one. The majority of Sidious' most impressive abilities are prior to the post-ROTJ. Please take a look at this thread for more information.

[Beniboybling]

edit : I just took notice of this ^

 

Claiming that the whole method of comparison you people manufacture as ineffective in our context,is nowhere near the vicinity of grasping at straws.

It kinda is, especially given the fact you failed to elaborate.

 

You basically just said "its flawed!"

 

That's not really an argument.

 

I mean do have a better method?

[Kaedusz]

You don't have a case, never did and likely never will.

It' pretty clear what's what.Your butthurt again.

It kinda is, especially given the fact you failed to elaborate.

The main reason ''why'' was given,and then an example was given.Other people pointed it out also.

* * *

The second point of my involvement is also proven all over the place.For example,might i remind you that you said the following ''Guys, guys please. We have no need to engage with the rabble.'' in a recently necroed thread to guys that were saying negative things about Sidious or other characters of the era.Oh,yes clearly there isn't a case. (sarcasm)