so you want a participation trophy? Has to be a troll. What is the world coming to. "I lost 10 games in a row i demand my reward". But honestly id be ok with the daily being play 10 matches(to keep people playing) But if OP thinks the daily should be play in 3 warzone matches and get a bag for the best gear in the game... That is pretty lol. Sorry but to get the best stuff in the game the fastest participation alone should not be enough. Neither should RNG but that is another thread. the intent on the daily is to get you to play and reward you for winning. It is not there so in 15-20 min you can get a free reward.

You are missing the point again and addressing a different group of qqers. People in champ gear are not crying about BM geared players... People in trash gear are complaining about BMs mostly in champ gear and assuming they are full BM.. not saying the undergeared QQers are right just saying your assessment of the argument is wrong.

isn't some of your issues with OPVP the appeal of it? Constantly looking behind you ever few seconds running into someone. I agree in a popular MMO Opvp is tough on people because it usually turns into a zerg esp if zerging yields the best rewards. I and i assume many pvpers enjoy it when pvp can just happen or just going into the world looking for someone to fight compared to a warzone where at least for me the pvp feels the same. Its rare to have a good pvp fight in a warzone esp the ToR zones due tothe design. Warzones are basically a tab target fest and non stop ability spam. Compared to the open world you are always mindful of your health, cooldowns etc. Opvp only works if it is the main form of pvp in the game it never works if it is just something that is there with better rewards elsewhere(examples wow and rift). No third faction is killer for Opvp but there are work arounds when you design the pvp areas. If ToR mimicked some OG Daoc instead of trying to recreated wintergrasp it could work better than what they have now.

i assume it took you all day to write this crying post and thus missed the dev post earlier saying they are making it so you get a TON more tokens per bag. Also btw i demand they put level 50s in their own bracket they are just dominating the 10-49s so bad its unfair!

yeah its annoying that both pve'ers and pvpers are such babies about gear. I loved it back before there was pvp only gear in games. Both imo should be viable. In a quest to make it so you dont have to pve to pvp they have made PVE gear worthless in pvp(not the first game to do this either) Imo make pve gear have a passive +5percent more dmg in pve. make pvp gear +5percent more dmg vs players keep the stats close so if you are full pve you are only about 5percent behind pvpers and vice versa. Then tweak balance by normal stat changes to the sets.

No one knows yet. People are just overreacting. All we know is there will not be as much of a gear differential between a newish 50 and a geared 50. So either they will change expertise or they will make an entry level pvp set. Since this was all said in a crafting thread i assume there will be mods with expertise at the very least and i wouldn't be surprised if expertise is reworked some. Also it sounds like these changes are not coming anytime soon.

sadly when will people realize that when you try to hardcore pvp a pve game it is not a full time game. not sure how this is a surprise to people still. Its like every MMO that is pvp focus'd always says the same crap. "We will have and support pvp" "there will be a ton for a pvper to do" etc. Then the pvpers eat it up and seem to read into it that yeah they will add all the pvp i could ever dream of into the game. WRONG. it never happens. Wow got close and the arena pvp bandaid kept all the pvp epeens happy at the expense of ever having to add anything that could grow the pvp base. Rift just did a bad job of what wow did, Tor is doing an even worse job. Sadly the reality is this. If you want to pvp in a pve game the best you will ever get is a rated arena type setting with 3ish instanced battlegrounds. If you want any pvp besides that, open world pvp, RVR, keep sieges then you will need to actually play a less popular pvp focus'd mmo. All that said ToR's pvp content is probably the worst i have ever seen in a game that offers pvp so i am a bit surprised.

I dont understand all the QQ full BM will still stomp a new 50 just not as much as now. Imo it needed to happen the differential was too high heck even after 2 weeks of the game being out it was bad it was just hidden because we were all queuing together and we could blame levels. And im sorry but i never have played a game where after a month i could basically be so geared i would just destroy everyone on gear alone like it is in tor. Even games like rift where you could power up the ranks the R6 pvp gear was actually not much better than 5 man T2 expert dungeon gear(they did not make pvp gear raid worthy until raids were getting cleared but i guess since raiding in ToR is a joke compared to other games they have to make it all available) Its a pity that the bads will benefit from this but for the quality of the game i think the gear differential is too big too early and needed to be changed.. Imagine how much worse it will get with the next tiers of gear..

That isn't the answer at all. This is kinda the bed BW made without drastically changing the gear system there really is no way to bracket stuff anymore. There just are not enough players to segregate the population anymore. Sadly the problems this game has in pvp is not a minor patch its something that would take 1.2 and 1.3 to put a dent in since we are talking massive changing in the direction of gear/inflation/grinding. The current vision/model for pvp BW has committed to is what we have and tbh i can't see it changing. The only two bandaids i see are making the grind to R60+ faster and easier for a side that can't win warzones or do ilum and/or modify expertise so it doesn't quad dip its effectiveness in pvp(basically making it a take less dmg stat only or do more dmg stat only) At the end of the day one of the biggest mistakes apart from the gear issue is the choice in warzones is pretty awful for someone undergeared to have to play. Huttball is fun if you have a team but pretty bad/painful when you are getting rolled. Voidstar(the fact this is the best they could do for A v D is pretty embarrassing) is the worst since you are forced to just run in and die over and over. Civil war is probably the best since you can D a turret while the higher geared players pad stats.. but that is about it.

a lot of good points in this thread actually.. Made me realize that unlike other games that have come out in the last 2-3 years that borrow from wow along with other games. ToR is seemingly more and more is just pulling directly from wow but doing a bad job of it There is little to nothing of their own vision and it is beyond me how they didn't take the good from other smaller games and include it. The token grind fest is basically this entire game. There is almost nothing in this game that isn't playing for badges. Heck it isn't even a real grind either its just that is the entire game. Do a ton of trivial pve or pvp to get stuff to use to do the exact same trivial pvp and pve.

alts in the 10-49 bracket is fun mainly because gear doesn't matter as much. You can still feel some affect from stuff you have on, bought, found. But it doesn't feel OP it feels about right. I wish ToR was more like that. I dont want to abolish gear progression i just wish we didn't have such insane stat inflation and gear basically being more important than spec/playstyle/skill. Right now gear trumps all i would like to have gear matter just not as much as it currently does.

i agree that pvp in this game is totally broke. I do not, though, agree with the more and more people posting saying that this wow clone is not enough like wow...

that is almost as lame as a smash highlight reel. No one gives a crap if you run around in the best gear beating on newbs with a pocket healer. A good pvp video is you outplaying people not this crap. I guess gone are the days of pvp videos of people taking 2on1s+ not using a cheese spec on low geared players with all cooldowns and temp buffs up. Novice stuff here.

they are awesome 1on1 but being pure melee with almost no escapes makes them just balanced/ok in group fights. Imo if this game didn't have the awful delay with animations to when dmg hits.. guards and juggs would be even better and there would be many tears.

Until a new game comes out that breaks the mold and is successful we will keep getting high budget badge farmer games. People can cry on the forums all they want the decision makers will always go the safe(wow) route. They will never realize that Wow was popular for reasons besides the things they are copying. I am positive that is Wow went the RVR Daoc route every game since then would have the same model. I find it funny how people link wow's success to their pvp system which is totally not the case that game was huge for a a bunch of reasons and would have been just as popular if they went a different route for pvp. Sadly the only games that venture away from the Wow Rift now Tor way of playing are the asian mmos but they rarely work out in the states/europe due to western gamers not wanting the same leveling experience as our eastern friends. The sad fact is there is no point to pvp in these games. Wow through a bandaid on it by making things ranked but that only gets the epeen kiddies happy and is still is not always pvp and gets old.

being able to modify your crit dmg multiplier is an interesting idea and from a player standpoint its a stat to get excited about.. that said there is a reason almost NO MMO allows a stat like this to exist. It is just too hard to balance and once it gets inflated then its pretty damn powerful.

Sorc's are fine. I believe the main issue is that there are soo many sorcs that a team of sorcs esp in a premade really make them seem op but 1on1 2on2 they are fine. which brings me to the second issue is sorcs by design just can basically do everything which really makes a team of them even more powerful than lets say a lot of another class since there really is no downside to having a lot of sorcs.

what are you talking about? MMOs have never been about premade "stock" even characters fighting in PVP... Its always been about YOUR character you built vs other players characters... And wth does "fair" mean? Everyone has the same/similar opportunity to get all the gear. The problem is not with it not being fair.. The problem is BW's itemization just makes a huge gear gap really early. Also i never understood why people always want PVE gear forbidden from PVP. Imo PVE gear shouldn't dominate PVP but everyone crying to make it so PVE gear is awful for PVP just so the "cool pvp only i refuse to pve cuz you can't force me to play the entire game" dont cry. Imo crap would be easier if they just made the crap similar and top end PVP gear gets a 3-5percent advantage over top PVE gear. Its funny because as far as i know PVE gear has not dominated PVP since like pre arena wow... But yet Top end PVP gear with a pvp stat has completely gear gapped the crap out of PVP since then.

the big issue that snares/slows cant be on resolve as we know it is because there is SOOOO much slow spam that people will always be on full resolve and real stuns will never land. I think that is the general reasoning behind BW's leaving slows/roots off resolve. the problem is it just makes roots/slows stupidly spammed and overused. As i said earlier only thing i can see is having at least two tables of DR for cc just like every other game. Imo if you give all the CC to everyone then well this is what you get. A giant mess. WTB the old idea of CC not giving to every single class/spec. Imo CC should be spec'd into and a roll. not something from tanks to healers to have all of.

Nah DAOC was a bridge game(rules and style wise) between EQ and Wow. It wasn't a hardcore PK game. But it was a pre pvp=instanced battlegrounds genre. I do agree that the fad for MMO's now is to just have you grind to get gear and once you get that gear you have nothing really else to do until the next grind is released. I think that is why RVR was soo popular because besides the rewards/RPs etc. The fun was just going out into the world and not knowing what you would get. I think many of us are tired to PvP warzone grind to get BM, get gear then basically the only thing to do with that gear is to grind the same instanced battlegrounds we already played the crap out of to get that gear. Its sad how wow basically made it so end game pvp is the exact same as the pvp instance grind. Its funny because yay freshish 50 i win X% of my warzones.. Geared BM.. team still wins around the same % of games. When in reality all BW needs to do is give us a very large planet that is similar to a daoc RVR frontier and just let us play. Take away the quests that force people to farm and camp and just make it objective/control based.

BW needs to just wake up and go to a DR system. DR on knockback / Stuns /Mez and another DR on slows/roots. Obviously its OP to have slows DR on stuns DR but it is just as stupid to have slows not on any type of DR.

haha agreed Voidstar is the worst warzone/bg/front i have ever seen in my life. They took a normal concept attacker vs defender and managed to make it the biggest pos ever. Its a sad day when the best warzone is a base/resource capture map. Imo this is one of the bigger not talked about issues with ToR PVP. They have no awesome warzone. Most games have at least one map that is basically pure awesome pvp. I guess it was supposed to be huttball but its no CTF and its no hold the piece. There are only 3 warzones and tbh one is complete crap, one(huttball) is ok but it gets old, annoying and non pvp much of the time. Plus its the only map where its up to the other team to "beat" you so you can be stuck in 15 min long matches just being farmed(All the other maps end fast if you are vs a premade). And Alderaan which imo has some of the best pvp in it but is still a flawed map. There needs to be an iconic pvp warzone that people WANT to play and grind in. As it is now as far as i can tell no one is really that excited about the maps thus making the grind much worse.

the thing is. DAOC was rvr with no real battlegrounds like we have today. Imo having gear be gear is more than fine in openworld pvp/RVR. But when you get into a warzone/competitive pvp everything is min/maxed and under a microscope and people will demand a gearset for that.

I hate expertise in this game but i can tell you that having PVP gear just being health heavy does NOT work. Vanilla WoW tried it and we all pvped in raid gear while loling at the GMs. Its an ok thought on paper but unless someone in pvp gear has 2x the health of a raid geared player players still will go for more dmg. PVP gear should either have extra mitigation or extra dmg. Not a stat that basically buffs everything in pvp and def not a stat/gear that in first wave of pvp gear outclasses anything else completely. I do not know why BW decided to go off the deepend with PVP gear rather than just making pvp gear the best gear for pvp while not make everything else not viable.

Yeah i agree. How can there not be a combat log....?? In pvp or anywhere its nice to know what happened to you. Just shows how not serious they are on making a good MMO when they do not even give us this simple.