Too many "Abilities"?

[Dianoia]

You shouldn't have more than six or seven core rotational abilities. I think Jugg/Guardian tanks, ATM, have the most core abilities that are regularly used.

 

The rest will be situational.

 

Part of the skill cap cieling for PvP is in knowing your situational abilities and using them effectively. If you find yourself primarily PVE'ing, just remove the ones you don't need/use off your bar. If you need help finding your rotation, ask on your AC forums, or do it the old fashioned way with math. :-)

[Kunra]

Cal-I in CS and 2k in WoW pre WoTLK... this is nothing.

 

 

inb4 haters

 

Huh? 12345

[Kheld]

Having lots of abilities to use is a GOOD thing.

 

Not having macros to chain them to 1 keypress is also a GOOD thing.

 

Hate to say it but, L2P!

[FerrusPA]

Skill bloat is certainly a problem. I played both a Mage and a Warrior in WoW and never felt like I had too few bars. Here however I do. True, not everything is needed but it's hard to distinguish what is since there are no clear PvP abilities.

[Andryah]

You shouldn't have more than six or seven core rotational abilities. I think Jugg/Guardian tanks, ATM, have the most core abilities that are regularly used.

 

The rest will be situational.

 

Part of the skill cap cieling for PvP is in knowing your situational abilities and using them effectively. If you find yourself primarily PVE'ing, just remove the ones you don't need/use off your bar. If you need help finding your rotation, ask on your AC forums, or do it the old fashioned way with math. :-)

 

/signed

 

I don't know why this is so difficult for so many to work through and understand.

[FerrusPA]

Having lots of abilities to use is a GOOD thing.

 

Yes. Lots of abilities that vary very little or are highly situational.

[Invitcted]

You shouldn't have more than six or seven core rotational abilities. I think Jugg/Guardian tanks, ATM, have the most core abilities that are regularly used.

 

The rest will be situational.

This, clearly some people just don't understand that the game still gives you abilities for your 'core' class even once you choose your AC.

 

As a sin I learn/have force lightning but there is no viable reason ever as an assassin to use force lightning ergo it isn't on my bar. Same with the merc and shoulder bash, just because you have it doesn't mean you're supposed to use it.

 

Also if you are specced for pve/don't pvp or vice versa you don't need solely pvp abilities on your bars.

[Norsmeang]

Definitely way too many. I have more key binds on my warrior than I do on my rogue and at least 3-4 that I can't key bind because I have nothing left.

[Guaritorr]

As a 43 Sith Jugg, I've got 20+ abilities that I use regularly and another 4-5 that I want bound for quick access (cooldowns). It's a lot to manage, especially with the meh UI options, but I do like the increase in complexity. I just wish they'd release some more UI options so I could play with it to make it a tad neater.

[Seismax]

/signed

 

I don't know why this is so difficult for so many to work through and understand.

 

Cause it's not really true. It stops being "situational" when the abilities are simply being used every minute instead of every 10 seconds.

[Dire-Wolf]

At level 25 my sith marauder only has a bar and a half of abilities. I guess other classes have a lot more? I sort of feel like I'm missing out now.

[Salmissra]

Cal-I in CS and 2k in WoW pre WoTLK... this is nothing.

 

 

inb4 haters

 

2k nothing. I call BS on this. I was gladiator in BC and I had half the abilities bound there that I do now. They were far more effective, differentiated, and spec-specific.

Edited January 1, 2012 by Salmissra

[virtualmatrix]

Yeah I've got some all over the place, I'm a bounty hunter. I had no choice but to invest in a speed pad with more keys but I pick the ones that I really need and the ones that inflict most damage, the rest I'll macro through the keyboard (Microsoft X6). Some of the abilities I kind of laugh at but in the end I just ignore them unless I find a need to use them.

[Patmage]

If they ever get a macro system in I hope it is like Rifts (1 ability, but if condition fails it goes to the next.) It would definitely cut down on some of the tedium. On the smuggler for instance, I would make a macro that would be something like

/cast "back blast"

/cast "blaster whip"

/cast "Quick Shot"

 

That way if i was behind it would back blast, if blaster whip was off cooldown it would do that, and finally quick shot would be the fall back. That right there would condense 3 keys into 1. This would allow me to move up some of the defensive abilities to easier keybinds. The problem I'm having is I have so many abilities I use in every fight that my "oh crap" abilities don't have any good binds and yet they are the ones that when you need them, you need them now.

 

Also as others have said, why aren't abilities like flechette rounds just baked into the 2 abilities that use them. It feels so clunky. Also I hope there are some proc'ing relics. Who has room for another 2 hotkeys for those? A stealth bar would also help. Or at least combine the cover and stealth bar, as scoundrels don't use cover.

 

EDIT: Just counted the number of hotkeys I'm using on nearly all elite mobs, 19. I'm all for having a good arsenal.. but that's getting a little crazy. I wish i could micro manage my companions abilities, but I just don't have enough hands for that.

Edited January 1, 2012 by Patmage

[FerrusPA]

Just fyi: "Complexity" doesn't always come down to "More abilities". Less abilities with more utility also make combat more complex.

[Salmissra]

Just fyi: "Complexity" doesn't always come down to "More abilities". Less abilities with more utility also make combat more complex.

 

Well stated

[KithPine]

The problem is some skills are hold overs from your pre-ac days, Double Strike on sages, some skills are not used by some trees, a gunnery commando should take charge shot off their bar grav bolt does everything it does and more, other skills are only PvE solo, the companion skills. Some things are situational and rarely used, the 60 minute buffs are hit once every 40 minuets or so, sprint is only turned on/off in rare situations. Yes there are a lot of skills but not all the skills are used by every tree, or every AC. The issue is the feeling you have to have them all hot-keyed or on your bars. I don't see having extra skills a bane, since they feed the ACs or trees differently, I think the player just needs to learn what to use. The reason we felt we didn't have too many skills in WoW was we had as many bars as we wanted to mod in and they made some skills obviously rendered obsolete by improved versions with similar names.

[SageGaspar]

Some things are situational and rarely used, the 60 minute buffs are hit once every 40 minuets or so, sprint is only turned on/off in rare situations. Yes there are a lot of skills but not all the skills are used by every tree, or every AC. The issue is the feeling you have to have them all hot-keyed or on your bars.

 

Well I mean as a guardian/juggernaut, here are the normal combat skills that I use all the time:

 

Default rage builder

Improved rage builder (on a CD)

Default rage spender

Force Scream

AE

Frontal AE

Riposte

Leap

Guardian Leap

Taunt

AE taunt

Ravage

Stun

Force Choke

Interrupt

Force Push

Saber Throw

High damage single target attack (depends on spec)

Attack that does more damage to immobilized non-elites

Attack that does more damage to stunned non-elites

 

 

Doesn't include the three emergency cooldowns (four while soloing), stimpacks, dispatch, AE snare, AE mezz, instant rage builder, etc.

 

It's a LOT of buttons. I'm very familiar with these kinds of games and I don't mind it so much, but I can see where it gets overwhelming. You can get away with removing the default rage spender and the two attacks on enemies with status effects, but it still negatively impacts your performance.

 

Mostly for me I just absolutely need a third and even fourth hotbar at the bottom of the screen. That would fix most of my issues.

Edited January 1, 2012 by SageGaspar

[Guaritorr]

If they ever get a macro system in I hope it is like Rifts (1 ability, but if condition fails it goes to the next.) It would definitely cut down on some of the tedium. On the smuggler for instance, I would make a macro that would be something like

/cast "back blast"

/cast "blaster whip"

/cast "Quick Shot"

 

That way if i was behind it would back blast, if blaster whip was off cooldown it would do that, and finally quick shot would be the fall back. That right there would condense 3 keys into 1. This would allow me to move up some of the defensive abilities to easier keybinds. The problem I'm having is I have so many abilities I use in every fight that my "oh crap" abilities don't have any good binds and yet they are the ones that when you need them, you need them now.

 

Honestly, If they put something like that in the game, It'd turn my 20+ button Jugg into a 1 button class nearly exactly like Rift's warriors.

[Lord_Jedite]

there is a special keyboard that is specially designed for swtor

 

maybe it will help you out abit

 

i dont know if i am getting it or not because i use the 0 number pad and not the space bar for my jump, and the keyboard doesnt have a button near the arrow keys

 

here is the keyboard anyway

 

http://ebgames.com.au/pc-154552-Razer-Star-Wars-The-Old-Republic-Keyboard-PC

 

Razor is also releasing a mouse, headset and yes even a mousepad :/

[ApesAmongUs]

I play City of Heroes, and on most high level characters I have 1-10, alt+1-10, and ctrl+1-10 for my commonly used abilities and 3 other hotbars for my less used abilities that I can hit with a mouse click instead of needing a a hotkey. For some characters I have additional commands bound to my numberpad keys (individual pet command and target each groupmate+buff/heal). For some of my characters getting into endgame content, I have had to move to a 7th ability bar to hold situational abilities.

 

This game doesn't need fewer abilities. It needs the ability to change the UI and keybindings to make it easier to use.

[Midnight_Malice]

I have over 100 spells and about 20-30 job abilities in FFXI. The 40 or so you get in this is very easy to manage, and is in its infancy. If you aren't sure how complex MMO's progress it's like this release > get feedback > tweak. I'm sure if your responses weren't all WoW did this, so thats what SWTOR should do, I'm sure they would be more willing to listen. If they just did what WoW did that you all like, you would complain that this is just WoW with lightsabers.

 

Customizable UI would help us manage our abilites = good feedback

 

WoW had customizable UI WHY DONTZ YOU GUYS DO EEETT = Bad Feedback

 

And BTW, if they made the 1 touch macros you guys want PvP would be stupidly unplayable not relying on any skill whatsoever, and coming down to whoever pressed 1 faster.

Edited January 5, 2012 by Midnight_Malice

[Kunitsukami]

More abilities the better, as long as some abilities are effective as others in different situations, or even the same situations depending on preference. This would mean that people can play differently from each other... it's good.

[sjcooper]

You don't have to have all your abilities on your bars. Just saying.

 

I actually can't see why this could possibly be an issue for people, it is so minute. Yes, there are redundant abilities for certain classes, but how does that cause quality of life or gameplay problems? I actually quite like being able to spot an Arsenal Merc just because of the tracer missile animation, for example (and I would assume a lot of people playing Arsenal like their spec to have a unique aesthetic, though I could be wrong). Beyond this, I have in fact used the majority of my abilities throughout my class questing. Less so at 50, granted, but it doesn't pain me to send some abilities packing from my bars.

[C-Bee]

It's not like you absolutely HAVE TO use them all. Having abilities to choose from means more variable styles (until someone finds that cookie cutter way of doing things) and that is a good thing.