xxSHOONYxx Posted May 8, 2023 Share Posted May 8, 2023 On 5/4/2023 at 3:46 AM, Gelilk said: I wonder whether the devs would comment on this post or will they systematically ignore it as well...@JackieKo There is an obvious demand for answers from the playerbase and you can't just let it go away by ignoring it or deleting it to create a "positive bubble". Systematically ignore it is... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anchor_leg Posted May 9, 2023 Share Posted May 9, 2023 8 hours ago, xxSHOONYxx said: Systematically ignore it is... Pretty ridiculous but expected given the state things are at right now. Rather insulting to the community Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ardrossan Posted May 9, 2023 Share Posted May 9, 2023 (edited) 2 hours ago, anchor_leg said: Pretty ridiculous but expected given the state things are at right now. Rather insulting to the community The 'community' meaning like maybe a dozen players? Who have expressed their annoyance by writing a couple threads they had to stick into off-topic and suggestions otherwise they would have been deleted already? You might not like what Jac said but tbh I think he's right. You can either express feedback with your wallet...or you can do performative gestures like this, make demands that get ignored, then you have the 'satisfaction' of knowing that yes your prediction that they would utterly ignore you was correct. And if the community really cared it would have been in General Discussion, with hundreds of views and dozens of posts. Weird that no one seems interested, huh? Let's put a pin in that for now. One reason bioware hasn't responded might be found in the "people are not happy" thread: only a fraction of players do NiM raiding, BW has now realized this (not for the first time) and is shifting resources away. Oh I shouldn't be so dismissive. We're all in this together, right? After all... On 5/4/2023 at 11:37 AM, xxSHOONYxx said: It's way beyond of what people like or don't like. You might not care about r4 nim, but they might promise and announce something you like, and when you ask about it years after when it never come on you are met with timeout bans and silence. This is far beyond an issue of "hard core players" and should be an issue of the entire player base, because the next promise they break and then silence will be something you like Absolutely, we're all players, anyone who posts here has paid, so we should have some kind of solidarity and stand up for each other when we're giving feedback. We're not just "story players" or "RP players" or "PVPers", we're SWTOR players and what bioware does affects us all! ...So it's a real shame that the hardcore raider/ranked pvp segment of the playerbase has literally never reciprocated. Never. I've been reading this forum for a decade. I'm not singling any of you out, but the attitude expressed by the raider community is crystal clear disdain for people who want more focus on story or want the kind of "play how you want" gearing in 6.0. "Just play hammer station a dozen times", right? The overall impression is that y'all think that you're so much better at playing the game than the rest of us and therefore deserve special treatment. And now that you aren't getting it anymore, we get these comments like "bioware has stopped listening" and the rest of us are like "...bro what are you talking about, this is the way it's always been." So yeah your pitch about "next time it'll happen to you" well, we don't need to wait for next time, it's happened to us already, often. Where were you? Where was the raider community? Not helping, that's for sure. Despite your claims, whether R4 gets nightmare mode is not remotely of interest to 'the entire playerbase', it's just you, and the devs know it, and the non-raider community knows it, and that might be why you got the response you got. Edited May 9, 2023 by Ardrossan 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xxSHOONYxx Posted May 9, 2023 Share Posted May 9, 2023 8 hours ago, Ardrossan said: The 'community' meaning like maybe a dozen players? Who have expressed their annoyance by writing a couple threads they had to stick into off-topic and suggestions otherwise they would have been deleted already? I know several hundreds of people that still do nim ops, i know only 2-3 that use the forums because forums add nothing to the game. On the other hand a post on reddit was made and it had 300 comments. 8 hours ago, Ardrossan said: You can either express feedback with your wallet Many people did already, i know of 12 raid teams that ended the same day 7.3 stream happened because most/all of the members unsubed. 8 hours ago, Ardrossan said: One reason bioware hasn't responded might be found in the "people are not happy" thread: only a fraction of players do NiM raiding, BW has now realized this (not for the first time) and is shifting resources away. This has nothing to do with who plays what and the number of people. Most games now focus on casual players not because less people play endgame or want challenging content (look at all the dark soul style game and how popular they are), but because casuals are the most likely to buy off the GTN, because casuals are used to and want things that are easy and when they find a roadblock they pull up the credit card to avoid it. While hardcore not only don't mind roadblocks, they want things to be challenging and can get those things through the game. Casuals are being milked and they are ok with it. Even cartel market items are on the live streams for god's sake. They already did a story focused expansion and a half, and look at how the numbers plummeted from 3.0 to 5.0. 8 hours ago, Ardrossan said: play how you want" gearing in 6.0. 6.0 gearing was awful and full of rng. 7.1 gearing was a bit better but it's not good either and im 99% sure 7.0 gear was made in a rush when, for everyone's surprise... Bioware promised the world and underdelivered by having an expansion that the only good thing was loudouts and two classes with maybe 2 hours of "content", and they needed players to stay busy by doing boring stuff as if re gearing through old content is actual "content", until they were able to release r4 and daily areas. Give me 2.0 gearing any time of the day, 2.0 was peak swtor to me. 8 hours ago, Ardrossan said: The overall impression is that y'all think that you're so much better at playing the game than the rest of us and therefore deserve special treatment. And now that you aren't getting it anymore, we get these comments like "bioware has stopped listening" and the rest of us are like "...bro what are you talking about, this is the way it's always been." When did endgame receive any kind of special treatment or as if they were listening to us??? I'm puzzled by this comment. Endgame is literally what they spend the least time with and the reason most people left the game already, most people left the game even at launch because the game had no endgame. And every time raid community tries to make an event and goes on twitch dwarfing good ol swtorista viewer numbers, they ask to devs for help and all they receive is silence. There is in fact a race on star forge that will happen soon and the number of people that signed up is so low compared to previos races, people are already voting with their wallet after what the devs did in 7.3. 9 hours ago, Ardrossan said: So yeah your pitch about "next time it'll happen to you" well, we don't need to wait for next time, it's happened to us already, often. Where were you? Where was the raider community? Not helping, that's for sure. Despite your claims, whether R4 gets nightmare mode is not remotely of interest to 'the entire playerbase', it's just you, and the devs know it, and the non-raider community knows it, and that might be why you got the response you got. Same point as above, what's left of the raiding community simply does not use this forum, it has nothing to add to their experience. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dev Post JackieKo Posted May 9, 2023 Dev Post Share Posted May 9, 2023 Hi everyone, Wanted to address the conversations surrounding the moderation of the chat during the livestream. There were some accounts that were timed out and other accounts that were banned. We took some time to go through the conversations that were popping up and connected with all the teams that were supporting the stream in a post mortem. In short, several accounts were actioned against due to an over abundance of spam and/or posting messages that were not encouraging healthy discussion in the chat. As there was a lot of spam that was being generated in chat, it is possible that some accounts were caught up in the timing out/banning actions that did not warrant said action. Of course, the time outs have already expired, however, the team will be going through the chat history and lifting bans on accounts that were only spamming. Note that we will not lift the ban on some accounts due to the nature of what was posted. Please understand that chat mods will delete spam comments, especially if they are being posted multiple times or copied and pasted over a short period of time. I appreciate those who messaged me constructive feedback about the stream, so we can take steps to make the next one even better. That said, quite a bit of the spam and brigading that happened was questions about Ops content, which we have answered here. 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anchor_leg Posted May 9, 2023 Share Posted May 9, 2023 16 hours ago, Ardrossan said: The 'community' meaning like maybe a dozen players? Who have expressed their annoyance by writing a couple threads they had to stick into off-topic and suggestions otherwise they would have been deleted already? You might not like what Jac said but tbh I think he's right. You can either express feedback with your wallet...or you can do performative gestures like this, make demands that get ignored, then you have the 'satisfaction' of knowing that yes your prediction that they would utterly ignore you was correct. And if the community really cared it would have been in General Discussion, with hundreds of views and dozens of posts. Weird that no one seems interested, huh? Let's put a pin in that for now. One reason bioware hasn't responded might be found in the "people are not happy" thread: only a fraction of players do NiM raiding, BW has now realized this (not for the first time) and is shifting resources away. Oh I shouldn't be so dismissive. We're all in this together, right? After all... Dozen of players is so far off you have to be delusional. Go on fleet, people are searching for people for ops. There's a massive community for it and if you're assuming the forum posts didn't have hundreds of responses, that's silly. The fact of the matter there's actually a lot of responses from different forum posts as well as a lot on reddit complaining about it that had over 600+ up votes so I would say there's a larger community than you think about it. So yeah lets not put a pin in it and if you think we're in this together, than you'd have a different tone to it. PVP was hit, raiding is now hit, what's next? What is there new and exciting for different groups of people to look forward to? The quality and communication hasn't been there and if your niche hasn't been hit, well maybe soon it will...but we're in this together...right...? Maybe aim to tone it like we are because if pieces of the game does fall apart, it will impact everyone 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RussellRichter Posted May 9, 2023 Share Posted May 9, 2023 It's always strange to to me see the "metrics" argument being made. Sure the amount of people who do higher level raiding is small, but that's because the content cycle has been insanely slow and during some periods it was non existent. The game had a lot of raiders before 4.0 and a huge amount left due to no new raids for several years. Bioware focused entirely on solo story during this time. Of course the raiding metrics will be bad when there are no new operations. It is extremely important for an mmo to have aspirational content, but with the removal of ranked pvp and the lack of new operations, there is absolutely none. Even having aspirations for cosmetics is out of the picture due to 90% + of it being cartel market exclusively. The game needs to have something for people to work towards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RussellRichter Posted May 9, 2023 Share Posted May 9, 2023 5 minutes ago, Ardrossan said: I'm sure any day now you'll get an official response about what happened at the twitch stream. they did respond? in this thread Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nee-Elder Posted May 9, 2023 Share Posted May 9, 2023 42 minutes ago, RussellRichter said: they did respond? in this thread Yes, today, here--> https://forums.swtor.com/topic/929191-game-update-73-livestream-recap/?do=findComment&comment=9757488 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RussellRichter Posted May 10, 2023 Share Posted May 10, 2023 17 minutes ago, Nee-Elder said: Yes, today, here--> https://forums.swtor.com/topic/929191-game-update-73-livestream-recap/?do=findComment&comment=9757488 I know lol, I was telling the other guy 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YodaUnrea Posted June 5, 2023 Share Posted June 5, 2023 Well honestly it is also a known method to well... dig their own grave. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts