The New Expansion Blows...and Here's Why

[DarthOvertone]

I can't play the way I want. It's that simple.

 

I resubbed last week. Already cancelled my sub. Game is total and complete garbage as far as I'm concerned.

 

The story lasted like two days and was meh beyond belief. I could write a more interesting story on toilet paper while on the commode. I did get some okay gear drops from the story, but now the story's over so...

 

All I do, all I've ever really done, is PvP and craft in between PvP pops. The gear drops in PvP are beyond terrible and are clearly bugged. Still dropping T1 green trash when I've already got some gold and purple items. In a game with gear progression, where gear matters at endgame, I'm done with that.

 

Sorry, but I have zero interest, actually less than zero, in running 100 Hammer Station FPs to get my gear. I mean, I ran Hammer Station the first time something like 7+ years ago. Why in the world would I want to run it now? Please tell me. God bless the PvEers who will grind anything and everything monotonous until there's no water left in the rock...the only ones keeping this game alive.

 

There is also no crafting alternative which did exist in the past. Like I said, I used to craft in between PvP pops. I could use crafting to give Alts a cushion of sorts. Now I have no idea what I need to craft, how to get materials, how to get schematics, or even what's available for me to craft. That segment of the game has been turned into a complete disaster, and unnecessarily so. Even the proposed changes coming in what...a month?...don't look like they will help much.

 

Wanted to come back to the game. Wanted to love this game from the start...but you guys kept, and keep, blowing it at every turn.

 

Good luck

[DarkTergon]

Before anyone else asks, can I has your stuff

 

On a more serious note, the gear drops, and crafting is being looked at, and hopefully made better. Can't do much about the story though, when it's done, it's done :/ Have you tried the dailies, on onderann and meksha?

[Ylliarus]

Your frustration is understandable and you raise valid concerns over elements of the game that have been getting much criticism since they were introduced into the game. I may not have experienced these elements the same way you did, because - barring crafting which is plain bad - I have found myself to quite enjoy the new gearing system. But of course, opinions differ.

 

What I would like to suggest before you leave the game for good again: wait until the new changes are pushed through. The dev team is not deaf, they have already stated that they have seen the criticism expressed towards gearing, crafting and such and will address them over the coming weeks and months. Especially since you say that you wanted to love this game again, maybe it might be worth it to remain patient and wait until the changes arrive? Because maybe you'll find the game much more enjoyable again once they have applied those changes to crafting and gearing, it would be a pity if you missed out on it!

Edited November 14, 2019 by Ylliarus

[XxHazenxX]

The dev team is not deaf

 

While I agree with everything else you posted, I'm not so sure about this one. If the dev team wasn't deaf, none of these changes the OP mentioned would have even made it onto the live servers. EAWare had players screaming in their ears for the entirety of 6.0 being on the PTS, and they did nothing. History, both long ago and recent, shows that they are very, very deaf.

[Ylliarus]

While I agree with everything else you posted, I'm not so sure about this one. If the dev team wasn't deaf, none of these changes the OP mentioned would have even made it onto the live servers. EAWare had players screaming in their ears for the entirety of 6.0 being on the PTS, and they did nothing. History, both long ago and recent, shows that they are very, very deaf.

 

Okay, you do have a point there. Let's say, they can choose not to be deaf, although too often they do seem to ignore player feedback, like with the crafting changes on PTS. I think that is a glaring mistake on part of the devs that they went through with their crafting changes despite the feedback they got from players.

[Benirons]

Well spoken OP, u say it like it is, i like that.

 

We need more outspoken un-sugercoated posts like this to wake BW the **** up.

 

Every now and then i run a few regs to dick around, and 99% of the gear i get is purple.... while im full 306. That is absolute nonsense.

 

Im being pissed off by lil things coming in this patch like u can no longer sell set pieces back, yet there is no mention of a substantial increase of the frags cap. Asinine.

 

They changed some set bonuses too that people already bought/grinded for for the effect they were giving then. Now they r useless trash.

 

They r still sticking to this lvl lock ********, and no mention of it getting changed any time soon. Im going to submit a ticket to get the 5 pieces of right price set refunded to me, or else im going to unsub. I do not appreciate making my time worthlessly spent on stuff that is now turned into garbage.

[omaan]

Your frustration is understandable and you raise valid concerns over elements of the game that have been getting much criticism since they were introduced into the game. I may not have experienced these elements the same way you did, because - barring crafting which is plain bad - I have found myself to quite enjoy the new gearing system. But of course, opinions differ.

 

What I would like to suggest before you leave the game for good again: wait until the new changes are pushed through. The dev team is not deaf, they have already stated that they have seen the criticism expressed towards gearing, crafting and such and will address them over the coming weeks and months. Especially since you say that you wanted to love this game again, maybe it might be worth it to remain patient and wait until the changes arrive? Because maybe you'll find the game much more enjoyable again once they have applied those changes to crafting and gearing, it would be a pity if you missed out on it!

 

Dont give him false hope. Iam a pvp player who wrote many threads about pvp problems including gearing. Devs didn't say they will rethink gearing in pvp they just said about crafting only.

 

If OP is a ranked player there is nothing keeping here. Ranked will have serious problems in this patch:

1. because of removing mats and ossus blue crystals from ranked quests ranked community declined considerably. I always see same faces in sr and tr is completely dead. Pops are much less frequent

2. class balance in 6.0. is much worse than in 5.0. Opers and sins dominating fights, outperforming other classes Drastically. Because of these solo ranked is full of sins and opers which makes ranked less interesting

[ZionHalcyon]

All I do, all I've ever really done, is PvP and craft in between PvP pops

 

Well, that explains why it blows for you.

 

I don't PVP and the game is just fine - better than ever.

 

 

We can agree crafting is broken, and gearing in PvP is too slow. But the expansion doesn't blow - at least not for many of us. I do think though PvP does need to be looked at.

[Lhancelot]

While I agree with everything else you posted, I'm not so sure about this one. If the dev team wasn't deaf, none of these changes the OP mentioned would have even made it onto the live servers. EAWare had players screaming in their ears for the entirety of 6.0 being on the PTS, and they did nothing. History, both long ago and recent, shows that they are very, very deaf.

 

Are they deaf? The devs? Or are they not relayed concerns and requests, comments from the players via community management here? I have a hard time pinning lack of changes on the devs shoulders without any evidence of that.

 

I mean we can cherry pick an example which very well could indicate they are deaf and not listening to the player base, but that same example can also be explained by pointing out perhaps what is being written by the players never makes it to said devs.

 

I tend to lean this way more, because we can see how weeks can pass and we not get any sort of acknowledgement of gamebreaking issues people report from BW which isn't the devs fault, it's community management failing to communicate.

[Lhancelot]

All I do, all I've ever really done, is PvP and craft in between PvP pops. The gear drops in PvP are beyond terrible and are clearly bugged. Still dropping T1 green trash when I've already got some gold and purple items. In a game with gear progression, where gear matters at endgame, I'm done with that.

 

I am in this boat, too. My ingame activities revolve around PVP, crafting, GTN buying/selling, and making outfits for my toons. I love Space Barbie! The crafting abomination really irks me, too.

 

I said it before, I never seen where an established MMO with a successful crafting system in operation effectively guts the crafting system and alters it so much that it becomes completely broken.

 

Crafting right now serves no purpose but to sink credits and mats with zero reward for the sacrifice of these bits. But Keith knows that, and at least he did mention that they are aware of it.

 

I can't say they won't fix crafting, they will but I wonder if crafting will ever be as simple and fun as it was before. I do feel crafting was simplistic before 6.0, but at least it was lucrative and you could do it easily, which made it fun in some ways.

Edited November 14, 2019 by Lhancelot

[UltraFlashStar]

The game is true in the fact that you CAN play the way you want and get gear (dissembling lesser gear from PvP and using the fragments, daily chests and weekly chests, rewards from conquest by PvPing). Doesn’t mean it’s as fast as doing other content (daily OPs, MM FPs).

 

I loved this expansion because I’m a hybrid player (PvE, PvP, and GSF) so playing anything I want while getting gear was great.

 

The only problem I have right now is with Armormech requiring both Slicing and Scavenging to craft (and the horrible conversion rates for Jawa Junk from Slicing).

[Lhancelot]

The game is true in the fact that you CAN play the way you want and get gear (dissembling lesser gear from PvP and using the fragments, daily chests and weekly chests, rewards from conquest by PvPing). Doesn’t mean it’s as fast as doing other content (daily OPs, MM FPs).

 

What they don't add is, you can play your way, but prepare to be punished with lack of gears/loots if it doesn't involve conquest and/or PVE activities.

[Ylliarus]

Are they deaf? The devs? Or are they not relayed concerns and requests, comments from the players via community management here? I have a hard time pinning lack of changes on the devs shoulders without any evidence of that.

 

I mean we can cherry pick an example which very well could indicate they are deaf and not listening to the player base, but that same example can also be explained by pointing out perhaps what is being written by the players never makes it to said devs.

 

I tend to lean this way more, because we can see how weeks can pass and we not get any sort of acknowledgement of gamebreaking issues people report from BW which isn't the devs fault, it's community management failing to communicate.

 

There is an interesting element here, because there is something that I noticed regarding communication: I barely see any interaction between players and devs over these forums, but completely the opposite is true on Twitter. In the past, for example, I have frequently asked Charles Boyd various lore questions people had sent me in, about the game and setting. He has been incredibly engaging and informative, sometimes replying even within mere minutes of my tweet. In general, I see the interactions between the devs like Eric Musco and players to be much higher on Twitter than on these forums.

 

A possible explanation for this? Perhaps Twitter allows them to see more messages, more quickly. Or it gives a sense they can be more direct with their players. Or, and I am inclined to believe this the most, the tone of the tweets and interactions between devs and players is much and much more respectable over Twitter than over these forums. There's always friendly banter going on and respectful, meaningful communication over Twitter, I have yet to see a negative interaction between players and devs there. Of course, the reason for more player-developer interaction happening over Twitter could be that the devs are just more active on that medium, I can't say for sure. But there is a remarkable difference in tones, when I compare these forums and Twitter.

Edited November 14, 2019 by Ylliarus

[ZionHalcyon]

There is an interesting element here, because there is something that I noticed regarding communication: I barely see any interaction between players and devs over these forums, but completely the opposite is true on Twitter. In the past, for example, I have frequently asked Charles Boyd various lore questions people had sent me in, about the game. He has been incredibly engaging and informative, sometimes replying even within mere minutes of my tweet. In general, I see the interactions between the devs like Eric Musco and others, to be much higher on Twitter than on these forums.

 

A possible explanation for this? Perhaps Twitter allows them to see more messages, more quickly. Or it gives a sense they can be more direct with their players. Or, and I am inclined to believe this the most, the tone of the tweets and interactions between devs and players is much and much more respectable over Twitter than over these forums. There's always friendly banter going on and respectful, meaningful communication. Of course, the reason for more player-developer interaction happening over Twitter could be that the devs are just more active on that medium, I can't say for sure. But there is a remarkable difference in tones, when I compare these forums and Twitter.

 

I've said that before, but the grumps have always insisted that they have the right to scream at the developers like 3 year olds AND be taken seriously. They just can't see how one might inhibit the other...

[Ylliarus]

I've said that before, but the grumps have always insisted that they have the right to scream at the developers like 3 year olds AND be taken seriously. They just can't see how one might inhibit the other...

 

It may be why I am much more positive in my attitude towards the devs, because I can show all the tweets I sent with questions ranging from whether Zash will return, to the idea of having class titles be made available to instant level 60/70 characters as well, and almost all received a great answer. I was always respective and polite in my tweets and questions and 90% of my tweets got meaningful and lengthy answers. Not too long ago for example, I asked Charles Boyd about whether we could see marriage scenes between our companions and our characters and it prompted an amazing and very friendly conversation between Charles Boyd and various players about what we would like to see regarding it and what not. It really shows that being kind, polite and respective gets so much more done than anger or frustration. The Tweets on Twitter are there for everyone to see and don't lie.

Edited November 14, 2019 by Ylliarus

[Nemmar]

Well, it is true, the ilvl grind is not play as you want. But after you get to 306 it is.

 

So, you can just go run hammer stations or solo flashpoints and get your ilvl up. If you are not willing to invest 2 days to do that, then sorry, off you go.

I do agree that the ilvl grind is the worst part of it, but the game is fun. You are feeling frustrated cause you are not willing to do what's necessary to overcome the hurdle and get to the point you want to be in.

 

My main activies are warzones and dailies, so i understand and i think gear from pvp blows. It always get's converted for me. But, i did put in the work at the start to overcome the hurdle so now i'm in a place where it isn't a big deal. I can just get tech fragments from it.

 

Does the xpac blow cause of it? No, not at all. It's something you don't think about anymore after you overcome it. But, yes, i would like to see it changed to be faster, cause there really is no point in it except an artificial barrier for the real gearing.

Edited November 14, 2019 by Nemmar

[DarthOvertone]

What I would like to suggest before you leave the game for good again: wait until the new changes are pushed through. The dev team is not deaf, they have already stated that they have seen the criticism expressed towards gearing, crafting and such and will address them over the coming weeks and months. Especially since you say that you wanted to love this game again, maybe it might be worth it to remain patient and wait until the changes arrive?

 

My brother...I really like your attitude. It fires me up. But I don't have the time to wait. You make a strong case. However, I'm just going to let my sub expire. I was subbed to this game for 6+ years from launch. I'm still seeing the same stupidity and poor implementation after all this time. I will check out the next patch. If it really makes a difference for my play style, I'll give it a whirl. If not, I'm done.

[DarthOvertone]

I tend to lean this way more, because we can see how weeks can pass and we not get any sort of acknowledgement of gamebreaking issues people report from BW which isn't the devs fault, it's community management failing to communicate.

 

I remember you my man. We've gone head to head in PvP and I know you've been in the game mix for a long time. You understand as much as anyone the problems with this game. I just have no patience for it anymore.

 

I don't blame Musco and the community communication side so much. I think they're just running on a skeleton crew, have deadlines to meet, and can't get the fixes out in time. This has been the case for pretty much the past 5 years or so. I'm just done putting up with it. There are other, frankly much better, games to play, and I don't have much available game time anymore.

 

I truly do wish the rest of you the best though. Always loved the SWTOR community.

 

Sorry for the double post, but I'm responding from my phone and this website is as mobile-unfriendly as it gets. lol

[DreadtechSavant]

Why are players on about running Hammer Station all the time? That's was test server only, all FP's give gear now. If you choose to just run Hammer Station because it's quicker then that's still on you. Also don't remember you complaining when groups/PvP'ers got better gear, I believe it was a case of well join a group was your answer.

 

I'm not saying PvP should not give gear it should but on the same quota as doing any other activity not more not less, so agree it should be looked at if you're saying you are not getting gear in the same rasio. However at present my highest rated geared character is only on 271 overall with 276 being the highest itemed gear peace.. So are you really getting it that much slower?

Edited November 15, 2019 by DreadtechSavant

[Ylliarus]

My brother...I really like your attitude. It fires me up. But I don't have the time to wait. You make a strong case. However, I'm just going to let my sub expire. I was subbed to this game for 6+ years from launch. I'm still seeing the same stupidity and poor implementation after all this time. I will check out the next patch. If it really makes a difference for my play style, I'll give it a whirl. If not, I'm done.

 

That is okay and entirely understandable! I'm already glad I could rekindle the slightest flame of hope take your time and return when you feel stuff might have changed or be better! I will be hoping fiery that the game will have improved a lot by then, so that as much returning players will stay for longer!

[sharkfishman]

Why are players on about running Hammer Station all the time? That's was test server only, all FP's give gear now. If you choose to just run Hammer Station because it's quicker then that's still on you.

 

It's really not.

 

If you leave group finder on random queue, Hammer Station will pop about 75-90% of the time. This goes for Veteran Mode and Master Mode. The only way around this is to deselect Hammer Station, but then pops go down significantly.

 

The simple truth is that the devs did a poor job (at least at launch, they may change it in future updates) of balance rewards/effort for this expansion. They added valuable items to all FPs equally, instead of saying, harder content will get increased rewards to take into account the added time for completion.

 

For example, HS, Red Reaper and flashpoints designed for Brand New Players may have a 10% chance of dropping a set bonus piece at each boss, and a 50%-70% chance at final boss.

 

Next tier of flashpoints, 20% chance at each boss and 100% at final boss.

 

The hardest/most recent, i.e. Umbara, Nathema, Chiss, 30% chance at each boss, 100% for one at final boss and additional 50% chance of a second piece at final boss.

[ZionHalcyon]

It's really not.

 

If you leave group finder on random queue, Hammer Station will pop about 75-90% of the time. This goes for Veteran Mode and Master Mode. The only way around this is to deselect Hammer Station, but then pops go down significantly.

 

The simple truth is that the devs did a poor job (at least at launch, they may change it in future updates) of balance rewards/effort for this expansion. They added valuable items to all FPs equally, instead of saying, harder content will get increased rewards to take into account the added time for completion.

 

For example, HS, Red Reaper and flashpoints designed for Brand New Players may have a 10% chance of dropping a set bonus piece at each boss, and a 50%-70% chance at final boss.

 

Next tier of flashpoints, 20% chance at each boss and 100% at final boss.

 

The hardest/most recent, i.e. Umbara, Nathema, Chiss, 30% chance at each boss, 100% for one at final boss and additional 50% chance of a second piece at final boss.

 

 

Can I be honest?

 

I don't think GF is broken. I think it is pairing you with people who only have Hammer Station selected, because it is the shortest FP and the easiest to gear up off of. If you have everything selected, but the pool of people queueing in GF only have hammer station selected, guess what? You're running Hammer Station.

[sharkfishman]

Can I be honest?

 

I don't think GF is broken. I think it is pairing you with people who only have Hammer Station selected, because it is the shortest FP and the easiest to gear up off of. If you have everything selected, but the pool of people queueing in GF only have hammer station selected, guess what? You're running Hammer Station.

 

I never said it was broken. I replied to the statement of the person I was quoting.

[ShinLunaAzure]

Your frustration is understandable and you raise valid concerns over elements of the game that have been getting much criticism since they were introduced into the game. I may not have experienced these elements the same way you did, because - barring crafting which is plain bad - I have found myself to quite enjoy the new gearing system. But of course, opinions differ.

 

What I would like to suggest before you leave the game for good again: wait until the new changes are pushed through. The dev team is not deaf, they have already stated that they have seen the criticism expressed towards gearing, crafting and such and will address them over the coming weeks and months. Especially since you say that you wanted to love this game again, maybe it might be worth it to remain patient and wait until the changes arrive? Because maybe you'll find the game much more enjoyable again once they have applied those changes to crafting and gearing, it would be a pity if you missed out on it!

 

The dev team may not be deaf but some of these changes being made in the first place show they don't respect your time and want the game to become a huge credit sink and grindfest now. PLus 6.0 is generally very light on content, if we were keeping in line with say the value proposition of shadow of revan, rather than just a class skill, we should be getting a new combat proficiency skill (so an extra 3 skills) since a new one was added every 14 levels previously. Not to mention the disappointing lack of even passives .etc to actually make 75 feel significant compared to 70.

[Transcendent]

Are they deaf? The devs? Or are they not relayed concerns and requests, comments from the players via community management here? I have a hard time pinning lack of changes on the devs shoulders without any evidence of that.

 

I mean we can cherry pick an example which very well could indicate they are deaf and not listening to the player base, but that same example can also be explained by pointing out perhaps what is being written by the players never makes it to said devs.

 

I tend to lean this way more, because we can see how weeks can pass and we not get any sort of acknowledgement of gamebreaking issues people report from BW which isn't the devs fault, it's community management failing to communicate.

 

Is that a case of different priorities on the actual developer time though? Some parts of the game would possibly take precedence over other parts, or the feedback being taken isn't being relayed in the correct form possibly. Without any evidence to swing it either way it's definitely open to individual interpretation, depending on circumstances and preferences.

 

Crafting definitely isn't in a good place right now, I haven't touched PvP in 6.0 due to Tacticals / Set bonuses and actually doing other things in the game (like gearing etc). What's worse about 6.0 for me personally is the lack of clarity on certain aspects of the game introduced in 6.0, such as yet more "random" systems. We're all being conditioned to accept more RNG, not many of us are seeing that though. When is enough enough?