New Conquest System: First Impressions

[AlainaFlute]

I just can't figure out why the dev team decided to overhaul something that just didn't need to be fixed. The original UI for conquest was easy to figure out and very intuitive. This new one just isn't. The only thing that I like about this new system is having a minimum cap for planets. In theory, it would've made it so that smaller guilds could still get conquest rewards for playing the game without the stress of making top 10. That's the only thing that should've been worked into conquest. Other than that Conquest, and the objectives that went with them, did not need to be messed with. There are PLENTY of other broken things in game that really need attention. Conquest was NOT one of them.

[translucentwolf]

Just a general comment on "the patch".

 

Just started a new toon to jun through the JK Story.

On Tython - just killed 28 Flesh Raiders before any of them dropped loot!!!

 

Is this another stealth-nerf to credit gains?

 

All The Best

 

That's RNG for you. I killed 5, and got loot.

[TUXs]

There have always been one time pieces that you had to fiddle around with. Most weeks always had a single shot War Supply and a Single Shot Invasion Force, and specific FP's, and Commanders, and Guards, and bosses, and lots of those things were always one shot. However, take this list, add the daily random on each toon, and I think that will be what I am looking at for what I would like to see. and......work out the "is it a legacy thing or can all toons do it" piece.

And imo, that was also wrong. Once per Legacy is BS.

[PorsaLindahl]

And imo, that was also wrong. Once per Legacy is BS.

 

I've always felt that way as well.

[Exly]

my point is the person I was responding to said this:

 

 

 

So my response was that they did bring it up before. Did I say they explain it completely no. I just stated they did bring bring it up before.

 

You are so eager to come to the defense of the devs even when what they do is indefensible. I could understand that if you worked for them, but don't get why you don't understand that those of us that pay to play this game aren't looking for you to school us on why we are wrong when we take issue with some of the things that the devs do, and when we criticize them for doing things that make the game less enjoyable for us.

Edited March 21, 2018 by Exly

[Caferal]

Hey folks,

 

Keep the feedback coming! Seeing your thoughts on the revamp is very helpful to the team. My plan is that tomorrow I want to get the following information into this thread: a breakdown of our intention around the Conquest revamp and a list of the feedback points that all of you have raised. This will allow you to see our thoughts on Conquests and then to highlight the feedback you have stated that we are actively reviewing internally.

 

Thanks everyone!

 

What can I say?

 

I am the leader of a small guild. For months now we're gathering mats to win against larger guilds in crafting weeks.

We spend a lot of money (IRL and IG), time and energy to do that.

 

And Bioware changed the war supply schematic by adding grade 2 to 7 mats. Without warning. Without letting us enough time to spend what we have already gathered, and actually do something about this changes.

 

Two days ago I could craft 40 thousand war supplies. Now I can't even craft one

Edited March 21, 2018 by Caferal

[BallisticKaine]

Personally the revamp wasn't something the people asked for. This revamp was a waste of time from you guys. Time and money put into something that wasn't broken. You screwed over so many casual players by revamping the conquest. I use to be able to PvP for a few days and hit conquest, now I can't. It also screwed over all lower level characters. Please reverse this craptastic thing you guys so thought we wanted and needed.

[AdrianDmitruk]

There was a post about the conquest changes

 

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?p=9549316#post9549316

 

Nowhere in this post did they confess "We're going to make both PVE and PVP once per legacy per day." Which is pretty much, in a highly condensed nutshell, what completely broke everything what they were trying to tell us in that post you linked.

[translucentwolf]

What can I say?

 

I am the leader of a small guild. For months now we're gathering mats to win against larger guilds in crafting weeks.

We spend a lot of money (IRL and IG), time and energy to do that.

 

And Bioware changed the war supply schematic by adding grade 2 to 7 mats. Without warning. Without letting us enough time to spend what we have already gathered, and actually do something about this changes.

 

Two days ago I could craft 40 thousand war supplies. Now I can't even craft one

 

Keep what you've save thus far. Continue to save. When you've saved enough to craft the supplies, do so then, and win that week.

[hillerbees]

First impression is that I'm glad I have got the achievements before this landed.

 

1) Vendor not visible - I assume this is a bug

 

2) Majorly increased requirement of crafting mats is going to immediately dry up the availability of crafting materials in the game and thereby increase their cost on GTN. This is going to push up the cost of crafing normal stuff (away from Conquests entirely) that people sell to a point where its not worth selling many, many items as there is no profit in it for the crafters or the prices they have to charge, for basic items will be too high for those that need the crafted item.

 

In short its going to kill crafting and the idea that a player can obtain a useful reasonably priced crafted item.

 

3) The UI is horrible - before, you could see all the goals (or most of them) on a single screen. Now you have to scroll up and down a long list. The same as when you are sending out companions to do jobs - I hate these list interfaces.

 

The symbols need explaining.

 

4) The stonghold bonus....is this now auto adjusted for in the points you see on offer or do you get say 150% of the points on offer (like before) because if its the former - how do we know what the base points are?....looks like we are getting no bonus.

 

5) The description of the tasks needs some work - I saw that you get 1875 points for completing any one of the Gree dailies - so I did all of them thinking I'd get 5 x 1875 but I only get rewarded for one of them.

 

6) PVP participation - like a lot of people have mentioned, if like me you only win the odd few matches you are at nothing attempting to complete your target this way.

 

7) Legacy bound missions - you know what i'm gonna say..... this altaholic thinks it sucks.

 

I'd echo what others have said - do you not know your own game?....CXP and now this?....are you TRYING to drive people away? I cannot believe you spend time and resources like this without any consulation with players and have it blow up in your face.....no wonder you have not the ability to release new content - you are too busy screwing up the old stuff!!!

 

I'm a loyal player but I'm finding it hard to be positive about anything in game these days. Thats sad.

[casirabit]

Nowhere in this post did they confess "We're going to make both PVE and PVP once per legacy per day." Which is pretty much, in a highly condensed nutshell, what completely broke everything what they were trying to tell us in that post you linked.

 

Yes that I agree with. The post was not very well informative but I had hoped since they decided to do a livestream afterwards there would more details and information on the livestream, but instead they spent 30 minutes and didn't explain anything about the conquest changes even though people had questions about it.

[hillerbees]

I just can't figure out why the dev team decided to overhaul something that just didn't need to be fixed. The original UI for conquest was easy to figure out and very intuitive. This new one just isn't. The only thing that I like about this new system is having a minimum cap for planets. In theory, it would've made it so that smaller guilds could still get conquest rewards for playing the game without the stress of making top 10. That's the only thing that should've been worked into conquest. Other than that Conquest, and the objectives that went with them, did not need to be messed with. There are PLENTY of other broken things in game that really need attention. Conquest was NOT one of them.

 

Well said.

[KendraP]

Hey folks,

 

Keep the feedback coming! Seeing your thoughts on the revamp is very helpful to the team. My plan is that tomorrow I want to get the following information into this thread: a breakdown of our intention around the Conquest revamp and a list of the feedback points that all of you have raised. This will allow you to see our thoughts on Conquests and then to highlight the feedback you have stated that we are actively reviewing internally.

 

Thanks everyone!

 

Musco, first and foremost, it is good to know you're at least reading this.

 

That being said, i felt you already told us what you were intending for conquest. Was that not the purpose of this?

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=945216

 

This is not encouraging. I believe we have been overwhelmingly clear with our feedback, with many of us posting greatly detailed analyses of our concerns (again, in my case after a bit of nerd raging yesterday when I realized you basically destroyed my main reason for playing).

 

I was hoping for an acknowledgment that a mistake has been made, and you want to do something about it. I do not expect a rollback or return to the old system at this point. I do expect massive changes on the scale of galatic command, that happen much faster.

 

Next, on the patch notes as found here: http://www.swtor.com/patchnotes/3202018/game-update-5.8

Nowhere does this give any idea of the incredibly dramatic changes that were being made.

Nowhere does this mention the rather ground breaking changes to crafting.

There is literally nothing here that gave us any idea of how you were implementing your stated intentions.

 

The only conclusion i draw from this is that you did not want us to know. The logical outcome then, is that you expected the riot.

 

So my first question: if you expected a riot, why would you continue down that path AND not request detailed feedback from us BEFORE you implemented the patch? It would seem this would save a bit of headache.

 

Secondly, these are large scale changes that affect a substantial portion of the player base. Why would this not be play tested, if not for the conclusion I drew (that you didnt want us to know)?

 

If what you plan on saying tomorrow is something along the lines of "we haven't given the new system a chance," "working as intended and here's why," or "we hear you but you're wrong and here's why," your loyal fans will be deeply disappointed.

 

Now that I've addressed that, I wish to request that, going forward, you keep us in the loop. I for one (and I'm sure many others) felt totally blindsided by the scale of the changes. Honesty and openness will go a long way. Consider what those of us still here have stuck around through - we are not the faint hearted who leave for the newest shiny.

 

Thank you for posting, Musco, and please give me an encouraging surprise tomorrow, rather than more disappointment.

[Kaldron_Fell]

The good:

 

• CXP for goals, for those that still care about CXP (I don't. I really don't)
  
• Can now get guild rewards (read: encryptions) without being in the top 10. Excellent!
  
• No longer have to stuff my SH with basic chairs, that's a big improvement.
  

 

The bad:

 

• Too much stuff isn't repeatable. What is repeatable has terribly low yield, even with full SH bonus. That makes it tough for a small guild even to fill the goal for small planets
  
• I probably will only care about small (semi-achievable) worlds, but really, why even bother with the "large" ones? The difference in rewards is a joke. You can blow mats worth several millions to be rewarded with some small amount of jawa junk and a few mats you won't need anyway? Way off course there.
  

 

The ugly:

• Kill 25 champion mobs for 1250 points (with full SH bonus) -- are you kidding me? Who'd bother with that? Same with the Rampage goals. Nice that it is now repeatable, but it yields so little it is a total waste of time.
  
• RIP Crafting for conquest. The material costs for crafting war supplies is nothing short of IDIOTIC.
  
• The stuff that is repeatable on several toons vs. the stuff that is repeatable once every day over all tunes. ***. Even if Relics of the Gree missions were repeatable over all toons every day, it would still be hard to fill the goal for small planets with a smaller guild. This way? F... that.
  
• No more points for flashpoints? Have you completely lost your minds? Did someone get their head stuck in a microwave? What are you guys thinking? Do you want us to flee your game in droves? WHY????
  

 

I was thinking of unsubbing because I'm bored out of my skull with this game. Along comes the new conquest system, and at first glance I thought that hey, this might be something cool to spend time on. But the more I look at it the more I realize you've once again f'ed it up instead of improving it. Sure, reaching the goal was easy on the first toon. For one, the free 10k points for killing the two Ilum event WBs that everyone seems to get for free helped. Then the crafting of 10 invasion forces (which I wont be able to do again, considering the new ludicrious costs of war supplies) helped, as well as the op I did. But then I looked at what I could do to reach the goal and I realized.... basically, nothing. I

 

'm back at thinking of unsubbing now, after sticking with this game since 2012. Gratulations for that, Bioware. Great work.

[Lyshar]

The interface.

 

While not perfect, you used to have a conquest interface that allowed the user to view all the conquest tasks, with easily recognized, *colored* icons on sight, in a table format. That allowedthe user one glance for the whole picture. Now, you've taken out color (which had a meaning in the previous interface, attached to type of task) and put it in a must-scroll list. Don't you understand that you haven't "streamlined" anything? You have added steps, removed key indicators and made figuring out what tasks are worth what points needlessly more arduous.

 

Converting a *TABLE* to a single field scroll-heavy LIST is not an improvement. This is the kind of thing you see when people who either learned or are used to designing on one platform (say... oh, CONSOLES) think the principles are the same on a different one.

 

Roll back. Please - you didn't need to do this. Please Bioware, we are the last of your diehard fans. We understand resources have been diverted... how can you justify paying someone who doesn't understand UX for PCs to change something that wasn't broken in order to make it clunkier? There are so many things in this game that are broken. Please, please, stop "fixing" the stuff that isn't.

 

Thank you, I was starting to think I was the only one who hated it. It's just a mask to fail to hide how bad the underlying system is. They should at least make a toggle in there, like you can display files on your computer in tiles or list or a full detailed list.

 

[hirophantix]

i am horrified by what you have done in this revamp you have made the crafting of warsupplies so much harder, there are no rewards for pvp matches if you dont win, so whats the point in going into them now since if you're not great at pvp you going to loose and get no points, no rewards for doing GF FP's so whats the point now over doing old content? i have bought a bunch of character slots so i have a small army of alts to help with crafting and doing repeatable missions and you have just made them a waste of my money since every mission now appears to be legacy based so i'm very offended by this how are small guilds meant to compete with larger guilds if we cant use our alts. i work 8am to 5.30pm and as soon as i get home i log in to have fun with my guildmates, i now do not feel like logging in to play or compete in conquest because of what you have done simply because my limited playing time has now become so much harder, the only good thing this update has done is to change the conquest bonus for owning strongholds, i no longer have to have them at 100% decorated to get the max bonus for each one, which for me personally means i can now take all the rubbish out of all of them and work on making them look really good and for new players they just have to unlock them and can worry about decorating later, tbh if you continue in this vain i will have to consider my participation in this game that i have grown to love since i actually bought a pc just to play this game, my first ever mmo, and you just ruined the whole experience for me, up until this update i had a few niggles with things that you have done in the past but moved past them, this is the first time i have ever written in the forums so that should hopefully tell you just how upset i am with the new udate, thx for reading my lang complaint i truly hope you take it to heart and rework or reset everything so i can go back to enjoying my beloved game, if not then i guess i will have to look for another game to play, again thankyou for all the fun for 6 years

[MacCleoud]

And imo, that was also wrong. Once per Legacy is BS.

 

I have always felt that way as well, but we have to keep it in context a little. They broke it.....fixing this in addition would be nice, but at least get the pieces back the way they were. Points may go down, but I think we can all work with that......if there is something that is workable.

[Hal-Pa_Bajas]

I'm no longer encouraging my Guild Members to participate in Conquest. I refuse to ask my friends and Guildmates to make such a large investment of time and resources for so little reward.

 

BW really screwed the pooch on this one.

[Caferal]

Keep what you've save thus far. Continue to save. When you've saved enough to craft the supplies, do so then, and win that week.

 

I can't. In the new schematic, I need grade 2 to 7. Grade 8+9 is the "easy" part of the schematic, and it took us 3 months of intense farming.

 

If we begin gathering grade 2 to 7, it will take us at least a year, because we need double lower grade mats that we needed grade 8 + 9.

 

And there is no place like Yavin or Zakel for lower grades, that I know of...

 

I can't do that. We need Bioware to restore the schematics the way it was before 5.8 and let us at least a few months to spend those mats and playing crafting conquest, before they change the schematics again.

[PorsaLindahl]

Yes that I agree with. The post was not very well informative but I had hoped since they decided to do a livestream afterwards there would more details and information on the livestream, but instead they spent 30 minutes and didn't explain anything about the conquest changes even though people had questions about it.

 

I watched the livestream. They barely touched on conquest, and showed the UI briefly and Keith said how excited he was about the changes.

 

The only conclusion i draw from this is that you did not want us to know. The logical outcome then, is that you expected the riot.

 

They knew exactly what they were doing. They are creatures of extremes and they're notorious for this kind of thing. It's like they live in a mirror universe. If it's something that players enjoy, they'll destroy it instead of making the needed adjustments.

[Sarova]

Wow, I just got a warning for one of my previous posts. I used no foul language, like I've seen here. I didn't call anyone any names, like I've seen here. It wasn't even all that angry in tone, I was defending the 500 or so other people in this thread against the 2 people who have come on here and called the rest of us "whiners". I was told that it "wasn't constructive". I have reread my statement several times and have failed to find anything that is any more offensive than nearly ANY other post in this thread.

 

Okay, here's constructive. I have 3 things that I enjoy about SWTOR.

1. Conquest for the goals and the help it provides my guild.

2. My guild, which I enjoy, as I've become close friends with several of the members.

3. The Stories, I love the stories.

 

You've ruined conquest. You've taken much of the fun out of it and turned it into a grind that, at least for me, isn't worth the pitiful reward at the end. Unless you fix it, all I have is finishing up my stories and my guild. Though I love my guild, it won't be enough to keep me here once I'm done with the stories and then I and my sons subs will go back to World of Warcraft.

 

Sending me a warning about my comment, when it wasn't nearly as inflamatory as the one I was responding to, doesn't help improve my opinion. My DEEP love for SWTOR and the people that work on it has been sorely tested the past couple of days.

Someone must have reported you and the responding moderator didn't read your posts. There was absolutely nothing in them that the rest of us hadn't already said (and many of us, myself included were much less pleasant about it). Maybe the moderator made a mistake? I'd ask for clarification on what the warning was for. You'd think they'd be a little bit more supportive to people who belong to a close/good guild as those guilds tend to "jump ship" together.

[peter_plankskull]

Someone must have reported you and the responding moderator didn't read your posts. There was absolutely nothing in them that the rest of us hadn't already said (and many of us, myself included were much less pleasant about it). Maybe the moderator made a mistake? I'd ask for clarification on what the warning was for. You'd think they'd be a little bit more supportive to people who belong to a close/good guild as those guilds tend to "jump ship" together.

 

Moderation of the forums have always been questionable at best, they don't auto report as far as I can tell, they just have very sensitive people going through the logs, I can PM you a few examples if you like.

[Exly]

Hey folks,

 

Keep the feedback coming! Seeing your thoughts on the revamp is very helpful to the team. My plan is that tomorrow I want to get the following information into this thread: a breakdown of our intention around the Conquest revamp and a list of the feedback points that all of you have raised. This will allow you to see our thoughts on Conquests and then to highlight the feedback you have stated that we are actively reviewing internally.

 

Thanks everyone!

 

At this point, stating your intentions will just serve as confirmation that you intended to do what you did, and that is not a good thing.

 

If you want us to pay to play this game you need to make it enjoyable, what you did instead was make it more of a grind and less enjoyable with your changes. So instead of trying to convince us that you were doing this for our benefit, or whatever, maybe you could tell us how you plan to fix your mistake.

 

At this point your intentions are irrelevant to me. I want to know what action you plan to take, and how soon (meaning quickly and not soon™) you plan to fix what you broke.

Edited March 21, 2018 by Exly

[Rocketmanballs]

Is this the "Go play another game or anthem," Patch? Someone didn't tell them that anthem wasn't out yet. I'm never buying another EA product again. This just reaffirms that. You didn't consult the players/customers and you didn't put this on the test server. WHo is making these crazy choices at Bioware? I hope Lucasfilm pulls your license and soon. You just ruined the freaking game!

[Rocketmanballs]

The good:

 

• CXP for goals, for those that still care about CXP (I don't. I really don't)
  
• Can now get guild rewards (read: encryptions) without being in the top 10. Excellent!
  
• No longer have to stuff my SH with basic chairs, that's a big improvement.
  

 

[

 

The stronghold changes have lots of friends of mine pissed off. They spent time decorating their SH's. Yes, it even took time to stuff em full of meat trees. This just made all that time we took WASTED!!!!!!!!!!!!