Spoilers and why I did not like TLJ

[AlienEyeTX]

Got to disagree with you man. His dad was freaking Darth Vader, he saw some good in him even AFTER his dad cut off his hand. However, now the story depicts him as weak and scared so badly by Kylo, he was going to kill him before he had even done anything, and this is his nephew, the son of his twin sister and his best friend. Give me a break, it is completely out of his character. Meanwhile, his dad killed uncounted Jedi and other people, still Luke, even after his dad dismembered him, wanted to save Vader. Hammill said it himself, he had to think of him as Jake Skywalker.

 

The mouse character assassinated Luke Skywalker.

 

Luke wasn't going to kill Ben. He just thought about killing him and then changed his mind. Big difference!

 

He saw a quick way to end the budding darkness and in a fleeting moment realized that if he did not act, the galaxy could suffer as it did under Palpatine and Vader. He chose poorly by letting him live, but it's not as though he actually tried to kill Ben. THAT would possibly have been out of character.

 

The thing is, we don't know exactly what Luke went through from the time of the Battle of Endor up until Ben burns the academy. We don't know what happened with him and how events would have affected his personality.

 

But, I still stand by my original assessment that all of this is perfectly reasonably within character for Luke. He flirted with a dark idea, came to his senses, and then went to sulk when things turned sour. Go watch the OT again... that's totally Luke!

 

And then he came to his senses, in the end. Just like he always does. And he pulled off one of the greatest tricks we've seen on screen in Star Wars. And he went out a hero.

Edited January 23, 2018 by AlienEyeTX

[TalonVII]

Luke wasn't going to kill Ben. He just thought about killing him and then changed his mind. Big difference!

 

He saw a quick way to end the budding darkness and in a fleeting moment realized that if he did not act, the galaxy could suffer as it did under Palpatine and Vader. He chose poorly by letting him live, but it's not as though he actually tried to kill Ben. THAT would possibly have been out of character.

 

The thing is, we don't know exactly what Luke went through from the time of the Battle of Endor up until Ben burns the academy. We don't know what happened with him and how events would have affected his personality.

 

But, I still stand by my original assessment that all of this is perfectly reasonably within character for Luke. He flirted with a dark idea, came to his senses, and then went to sulk when things turned sour. Go watch the OT again... that's totally Luke!

 

And then he came to his senses, in the end. Just like he always does. And he pulled off one of the greatest tricks we've seen on screen in Star Wars. And he went out a hero.

 

Too many people put Luke Skywalker on a pedestal. Think back to ROTJ. When Luke force pulls his saber to his hand after Palpatine taunts him, who do you think Luke is swinging at? Wasn't Vader. He was swinging to take Palpatine's head off and VADER blocked him.

 

To say "oh Luke wouldn't do that". Bull****. He tried to take out the Emperor right there!

[jarjarloves]

Too many people put Luke Skywalker on a pedestal. Think back to ROTJ. When Luke force pulls his saber to his hand after Palpatine taunts him, who do you think Luke is swinging at? Wasn't Vader. He was swinging to take Palpatine's head off and VADER blocked him.

 

To say "oh Luke wouldn't do that". Bull****. He tried to take out the Emperor right there!

 

and he force choked the crap out of those Gamorian guards at Jabba's Palace.

[AlienEyeTX]

Too many people put Luke Skywalker on a pedestal. Think back to ROTJ. When Luke force pulls his saber to his hand after Palpatine taunts him, who do you think Luke is swinging at? Wasn't Vader. He was swinging to take Palpatine's head off and VADER blocked him.

 

To say "oh Luke wouldn't do that". Bull****. He tried to take out the Emperor right there!

 

Exactly! Selective memory, many people have.

[SithKoriandr]

Too many people put Luke Skywalker on a pedestal. Think back to ROTJ. When Luke force pulls his saber to his hand after Palpatine taunts him, who do you think Luke is swinging at? Wasn't Vader. He was swinging to take Palpatine's head off and VADER blocked him.

 

To say "oh Luke wouldn't do that". Bull****. He tried to take out the Emperor right there!

 

First off, the Emperor is not Ben. The Emperor is known to be pure evil. There was no, I sense darkness in you. It was, one didn't need to be able to sense the darkness to know he was.

 

The problem with the story, was Luke never went to Han and Leia. Seriously, Han died and he doesn't go see Leia? The fact that Luke died is also a problem.

 

Their idea is "Kill off all the original heroes" and it's a terrible idea. Not to mention, as they've already admitted, they have no idea what they're doing. They have no plot line thought out. This is a "You're the director, what do you want?" style story.

 

It's that type of creative writing story, where one person starts, then the next person takes over.

[NuSeC]

oh good the guy who doesn't even bother to read his own sources and just likes to troll is back...

 

Says the guy who admitted to doing the same thing.

[NuSeC]

Luke wasn't going to kill Ben. He just thought about killing him and then changed his mind. Big difference!

 

Not really, he actually lit his light saber while standing over top of him, he was going to kill him and changed his mind. He was in the act of actually doing it. It was not "just a thought."

 

He saw a quick way to end the budding darkness and in a fleeting moment realized that if he did not act, the galaxy could suffer as it did under Palpatine and Vader. He chose poorly by letting him live, but it's not as though he actually tried to kill Ben. THAT would possibly have been out of character.

He did actually go into his room with a weapon and was in the act of it when Kylo woke up. Even in the movie, Kylo sees Luke's lightsaber ignited. It was that moment that Luke changed his mind, not before.

 

 

The thing is, we don't know exactly what Luke went through from the time of the Battle of Endor up until Ben burns the academy. We don't know what happened with him and how events would have affected his personality.

Yeah, because the story was a dumpster fire. There was more screentime about saving horse dogs on a casino world then there were answers about Luke.

 

But, I still stand by my original assessment that all of this is perfectly reasonably within character for Luke. He flirted with a dark idea, came to his senses, and then went to sulk when things turned sour. Go watch the OT again... that's totally Luke!

We will disagree that it is typical Luke. I have saw the OT dozens of times over the last 40 years, no need to watch it again as I literally just watched it like a week ago.

 

And then he came to his senses, in the end. Just like he always does. And he pulled off one of the greatest tricks we've seen on screen in Star Wars. And he went out a hero.

Greatest tricks? Again, we will disagree. Force projection suicide maneuver instead of being there in person. this is the only starwars movie where lightsabers do not cross. An epic fight scene would have done wonders for this movie. Again, a "write in" Mace Windu was more BA on screen then Luke Skywalker ever got to be.

[NuSeC]

Too many people put Luke Skywalker on a pedestal. Think back to ROTJ. When Luke force pulls his saber to his hand after Palpatine taunts him, who do you think Luke is swinging at? Wasn't Vader. He was swinging to take Palpatine's head off and VADER blocked him.

 

To say "oh Luke wouldn't do that". Bull****. He tried to take out the Emperor right there!

 

And killing the emperor who had corrupted his father was a bad thing?

[jarjarloves]

Says the guy who admitted to doing the same thing.

 

and here it is again. No I admitted i missread the article. You admitted and showed you don't read the posts let alone your own sources.

 

You claimed Pearl Harbor was done by 50 or so Kamikaze pilots (when there was only 1 there as shown by your own source)

 

You said there was no trailer for The Clone Wars movie ( when you linked to a article that auto plays the trailer at the top)

 

let's not forget you claiming MOST women hate feminism when you link to two articles that say the exact opposite of that.

 

 

and that's just the beginning.

 

 

You troll we get it now just move on.

Edited January 26, 2018 by jarjarloves

[Leklor]

And killing the emperor who had corrupted his father was a bad thing?

 

Killing anyone in anger is a bad thing. As far as Star Wars goes.

Do I need to quote Yoda?

 

Also, not the point being discussed. The point being made was that even in his last major appearance before TLJ, Luke was still a man vulnerable to outbursts of emotions and instinctive actions that he took quite some time to snap out of.

As such, claiming that Luke considering killing Ben for a mere fraction of a second and igniting his lightsaber (But not even moving it an inch afterwards) is out of character is not just non-sense, it's being blinded by nostalgia and hero worship of Luke Skywalker.

And honestly, like or dislike TLJ, I can't really find a proper counter-argument to that except maybe that Luke was so changed by the duel against Vader that they expected him to change completely from A to Z.

 

Not really, he actually lit his light saber while standing over top of him, he was going to kill him and changed his mind. He was in the act of actually doing it. It was not "just a thought."

 

It was "just a thought". Luke mentions it didn't last more than a second. You clearly see that he didn't try to attack Ben at all. He considered it and that second of consideration was enough for Ben to get the wrong message.

 

He did actually go into his room with a weapon and was in the act of it when Kylo woke up. Even in the movie, Kylo sees Luke's lightsaber ignited. It was that moment that Luke changed his mind, not before.

 

Again, wrong. I've seen the movie (And therefore this scene) three times now. Luke is already regreting it before Ben turns towards him and pulls his lightsaber to his hand. You can clearly see Luke having a "By the Force what am I doing?" expression on his face. He. Wasn't. Going. To. Attack.

 

An epic fight scene would have done wonders for this movie.

 

Would have wrecked the story being told you mean.

A "in person" fight scene would have had only two endings possible:

1) Luke kills Kylo Ren and the trilogy ends at the end of the second episode, with no remaining vilain and no more story to be told. Also the "passing the torch" message is ruined.

2) Kylo Ren kills Luke, either with the barrage or in a duel, completely crushing the Resistance morale and strenghtening Kylo Ren's position as Supreme Leader.

 

Luke accomplished the unlikely with his Force Projection trick:

-He allowed the Resistance to escaped.

-He humiliated Kylo Ren in front of his men.

-He focused all of Ben's anger and hatred on him, leaving his possible redemption (Or defeat) in the hands of Rey (And before Carrie Fisher died, Leia) as he states himself that "[he] can't save him" not that he can't be saved.

A lightsaber fight wasn't necessary for the movie to work, and the Throne Room fight was fresh enough for Star Wars to scratch my fight scene needs.

Edited January 26, 2018 by Leklor

[TalonVII]

First off, the Emperor is not Ben. The Emperor is known to be pure evil. There was no, I sense darkness in you. It was, one didn't need to be able to sense the darkness to know he was.

 

The problem with the story, was Luke never went to Han and Leia. Seriously, Han died and he doesn't go see Leia? The fact that Luke died is also a problem.

 

Their idea is "Kill off all the original heroes" and it's a terrible idea. Not to mention, as they've already admitted, they have no idea what they're doing. They have no plot line thought out. This is a "You're the director, what do you want?" style story.

 

It's that type of creative writing story, where one person starts, then the next person takes over.

 

Oh because the Emperor is pure evil, it's perfectly ok to strike him down in a small fit of anger? Did you even READ the Jedi code? Jedi are not supposed to do that. Regardless of who it is. Nice try at justifying Luke committing murder.

[TalonVII]

And killing the emperor who had corrupted his father was a bad thing?

Jedi DON'T MURDER. If you're going to put Luke up on that pedestal, put him up there. Don't excuse one thing but let go another and try and rationalize away MURDER.

 

Jedi DO NOT DO THAT. What everyone keeps trying to say when he was standing over Ben contemplating MURDER. Either he does, or doesn't do it. There is no grey area here.

[AlienEyeTX]

Jedi DON'T MURDER. If you're going to put Luke up on that pedestal, put him up there. Don't excuse one thing but let go another and try and rationalize away MURDER.

 

Jedi DO NOT DO THAT. What everyone keeps trying to say when he was standing over Ben contemplating MURDER. Either he does, or doesn't do it. There is no grey area here.

 

Don't feed the troll.

[Leklor]

I also noted a clever visual trick used by Rian Johnson during the flashback scenes: The lightsabers' positioning.

 

Put it simply:

-In the version told by Kylo Ren, Luke is outright trying to murder him. His lightsaber slashes verticaly towards Ben who blocks the attacks horizontally.

-In the "real" (Assumed) version of the story, it's Ben who is holding his blade vertically while Luke is holding it horizontally.

It may seem insignificant but IMO, that's meant to represent the complete switch of the attacker/defender role in the story.

[AlienEyeTX]

I also noted a clever visual trick used by Rian Johnson during the flashback scenes: The lightsabers' positioning.

 

Put it simply:

-In the version told by Kylo Ren, Luke is outright trying to murder him. His lightsaber slashes verticaly towards Ben who blocks the attacks horizontally.

-In the "real" (Assumed) version of the story, it's Ben who is holding his blade vertically while Luke is holding it horizontally.

It may seem insignificant but IMO, that's meant to represent the complete switch of the attacker/defender role in the story.

 

Many of the truths we cling to depend greatly on our own point of view...

[NuSeC]

and here it is again. No I admitted i missread the article. You admitted and showed you don't read the posts let alone your own sources.

 

missread* that teaching tho...

A classic case of: pot calling the kettle black.

 

You want to dig up Pearl Harbor when you know the idea was controlled hyperspace missiles. Who cares that I thought they kamikaze them? I mean really. The topic/idea was controlled hyperspace missiles. I mean really. It was an analogy, that is all a bad one but none the less. Also, when I was shown wrong, I dropped it. See how that works?

You seem to be claiming it is not possible for someone else to misread something... as I admitted to doing just like you.

Also, you claim to be a physics teacher who can't spell missile.

 

Go away troll.

[NuSeC]

Killing anyone in anger is a bad thing. As far as Star Wars goes.

Do I need to quote Yoda?

 

You say he was angry. I would say trying to stop a psychopath who is in the process of murdering your friends and the one who turned your father. I would say it was more justice than anything else.

 

Also, not the point being discussed. The point being made was that even in his last major appearance before TLJ, Luke was still a man vulnerable to outbursts of emotions and instinctive actions that he took quite some time to snap out of.

As such, claiming that Luke considering killing Ben for a mere fraction of a second and igniting his lightsaber (But not even moving it an inch afterwards) is out of character is not just non-sense, it's being blinded by nostalgia and hero worship of Luke Skywalker.

And honestly, like or dislike TLJ, I can't really find a proper counter-argument to that except maybe that Luke was so changed by the duel against Vader that they expected him to change completely from A to Z.

 

The point is, that for 40 years Lucas had a different version of Luke than what Disney gave us. It is that simple. The lore and cannon that was allowed to linger and fester for 40 years is what has brought us to this. People like me grew up on a much different version of Luke Skywalker.

 

 

 

 

It was "just a thought". Luke mentions it didn't last more than a second. You clearly see that he didn't try to attack Ben at all. He considered it and that second of consideration was enough for Ben to get the wrong message.

You cant say it was just a thought when there was physical action in it. He went into his room and lit his saber. So no, it was not "just a thought."

 

Again, wrong. I've seen the movie (And therefore this scene) three times now. Luke is already regreting it before Ben turns towards him and pulls his lightsaber to his hand. You can clearly see Luke having a "By the Force what am I doing?" expression on his face. He. Wasn't. Going. To. Attack.

...

 

Would have wrecked the story being told you mean.

A "in person" fight scene would have had only two endings possible:

1) Luke kills Kylo Ren and the trilogy ends at the end of the second episode, with no remaining vilain and no more story to be told. Also the "passing the torch" message is ruined.

2) Kylo Ren kills Luke, either with the barrage or in a duel, completely crushing the Resistance morale and strenghtening Kylo Ren's position as Supreme Leader.

These are your false options, in a story, such a proven by this movie, anything is possible. Up until now, Jedi/Sith did not just fly in outerspace, nor project themselves as a hologram across the galaxy nor did hyperspace missiles become a thing. Or force ghosts able to impact actual matter or use lighting bolts. Point is, this movie is proof they can put anything in a story. You attempting to pose outcomes as if the story itself did not already change cannon and lore.

Luke accomplished the unlikely with his Force Projection trick:

-He allowed the Resistance to escaped.

-He humiliated Kylo Ren in front of his men.

-He focused all of Ben's anger and hatred on him, leaving his possible redemption (Or defeat) in the hands of Rey (And before Carrie Fisher died, Leia) as he states himself that "[he] can't save him" not that he can't be saved.

A lightsaber fight wasn't necessary for the movie to work, and the Throne Room fight was fresh enough for Star Wars to scratch my fight scene needs.

 

How did he humiliate Kylo exactly? I mean how? Because he threw a temper tantrum? Is he not already known for temper tantrums? Allowed the resistance to escape? Super Rey was on the other side of that wall, the marketing ploy crystal dogs led the way. I mean really, all they had to do is have Mary Sue, I mean Rey show up like 30 seconds sooner and move the wall of boulders with her super force powers and there would have been no need for Luke in that scene at all. I mean seriously. So little impact to the over all story it is not even funny.

 

I'm glad it scratched "your fight scene needs".

 

 

Luke died a meaningless death. No fight scenes - nothing. A Snoke/Luke fight scene would have done wonders for this movie. Instead, no back story on Snoke and no real story on Luke other than he was living as a hermit for the past several years. This movie was disgusting.

Edited January 30, 2018 by NuSeC

[Leklor]

You say he was angry. I would say trying to stop a psychopath who is in the process of murdering your friends and the one who turned your father. I would say it was more justice than anything else.

 

Doesn't change the fact that Luke was striking out of anger. Even Palpatine is taunting him to let go of his Jedi "training" and unleash his anger to strike him down. At that moment, Luke is very much emotion driven. He lets his negative emotion take over.

Sure he "could" have killed Palpatine without any anger, out of the much vaunted idea of justice. But in ROTJ he certainly wasn't doing that.

 

The point is, that for 40 years Lucas had a different version of Luke than what Disney gave us. It is that simple. The lore and cannon that was allowed to linger and fester for 40 years is what has brought us to this. People like me grew up on a much different version of Luke Skywalker.

 

And Luke Skywalker grew in those 30 years you didn't see him.

Also, Lucas had already planned for Luke to be a bitter hermit in his version of the Sequels he ended up not making. So I'd say TLJ Luke was very much in accordance to his vision.

 

You cant say it was just a thought when there was physical action in it. He went into his room and lit his saber. So no, it was not "just a thought."

 

Well, he didn't attack, did he? So he thought about attacking but didn't do it.

You know, if you're going to criticize the film (And we both know it deserves criticism) at least try to be right about what you complain about. This isn't a matter of interpretation, it's outright STATED by Luke that it was a moment of instinct that led him to igniting his lightsaber and that he never really went forward with his split-second thought of killing Ben. It's said verbatim in the film.

 

...

 

Great point, I agree.

 

These are your false options, in a story, such a proven by this movie, anything is possible.

 

Then propose a coherent plot that keeps the movie's themes intact (Failure is the most painful but most important teacher. People are people, not legends. Stop looking for a savior and move your butt) with a Snoke vs. Luke fight scene.

 

Up until now, Jedi/Sith did not just fly in outerspace, nor project themselves as a hologram across the galaxy

 

Both were shown in Rebels before (And had been seen in the Legends EU). Also each of the OT film added previously unknown Force Powers. So there's lots of precedents of it.

 

nor did hyperspace missiles become a thing.

 

Never stated in the film that it is a new tactic, canon-wise.

 

Or force ghosts able to impact actual matter or use lighting bolts.

 

There's a difference between creating a lightning bolt (Something Yoda didn't do) and direct a lightning bolt from a pre-existing storm to a specific place. Also, Obi-Wan said "I shall become more powerful than you can possibly imagine". Pretty sure "Sitting around on Dagobah" and "Smiling at Luke during an ewok ceremony" don't count as "More powerful than you can imagine". Affecting weather locally though. That could count.

 

Point is, this movie is proof they can put anything in a story. You attempting to pose outcomes as if the story itself did not already change cannon and lore.

 

It extended canon. It did not change it. It didn't portray anything stated or shown to be impossible before as possible.

 

How did he humiliate Kylo exactly? I mean how?

 

Make him defy him to a duel, stopping the assault on the base just to show off only for the fight to have been a lure that wasted the First Order's time utterly. Making him the newly minted "Supremer Leader Ren" look like an utter tool? That's a good start for me.

 

Because he threw a temper tantrum? Is he not already known for temper tantrums?

 

Yes but he wasn't the Supreme Leader then. Also, he usually suceeded until TFA began (And even then, he captured both Poe and Rey easily. Losing them wasn't on him.). Now his first big action as Supreme Leader ended in a relative defeat, to the point that the cinematography already hints at Hux planning something (Which he was before Kylo Ren took the mantle of Supreme Leader but dropped out of fear of him.)

 

Allowed the resistance to escape? Super Rey was on the other side of that wall, the marketing ploy crystal dogs led the way.

 

But the FO would have caught up with the Resistance had Luke not intervened. They would have plowed through the door and invaded the mines. Instead they camped in their walker and watched Ren fight with air.

 

I mean really, all they had to do is have Mary Sue, I mean Rey show up like 30 seconds sooner and move the wall of boulders with her super force powers and there would have been no need for Luke in that scene at all. I mean seriously. So little impact to the over all story it is not even funny.

 

Re-igniting the spark of hope that had been snuffed out throughout the galaxy is having "little impact". Gotcha.

 

Luke died a meaningless death.

 

Apparently you missed the last scene on Canto Bight.

True, this planet sucks *** and was the worst part of the movie but the whole message behind Luke's passing is in this last scene. If you didn't get it, I'm sure someone else will explain it to you (Sub is running out, won't be able to do it.)

 

A Snoke/Luke fight scene would have done wonders for this movie.

 

I'm curious as to why! Why would it have "done wonders"? (That's not me disagreeing, I genuinely curious as to how a fight scene between an old hermit with no weapon and a limping salesman would have been good. Alright, I kind of disagree.)

 

No real story on Luke other than he was living as a hermit for the past several years.

 

Yeah, so sad we didn't hear about what lead him to his exile and... Oh wait, it was in the movie.

 

This movie was disgusting.

 

Should have used a better seasoning. I used Béchamel sauce myself, it kind of hid the imperfections.

[AlienEyeTX]

Luke died a meaningless death. No fight scenes - nothing. A Snoke/Luke fight scene would have done wonders for this movie. Instead, no back story on Snoke and no real story on Luke other than he was living as a hermit for the past several years. This movie was disgusting.

 

Yet, it was ok for Obi-Wan to have been living as a hermit, have no "real" fight scene, and die without confronting the Emperor.

 

Of course we didn't know about the emperor until later. And he had no backstory. He was just a guy who was less forgiving than Vader.

 

Sorry it wasn't your cup of tea, but it doesn't make it wrong. It also doesn't mean that the way you wanted it would be right or better. It is what it is and crying about it won't change a thing.

[jarjarloves]

missread* that teaching tho...

A classic case of: pot calling the kettle black.

 

You want to dig up Pearl Harbor when you know the idea was controlled hyperspace missiles. Who cares that I thought they kamikaze them? I mean really. The topic/idea was controlled hyperspace missiles. I mean really. It was an analogy, that is all a bad one but none the less. Also, when I was shown wrong, I dropped it. See how that works?

You seem to be claiming it is not possible for someone else to misread something... as I admitted to doing just like you.

Also, you claim to be a physics teacher who can't spell missile.

 

Go away troll.

no.. it's really not. I dug up your Pearl Harbor statement as well as your claim that women don't like feminism. Both of those you were wrong on and both of which YOU brought up.

 

The issue isn't missreading something its that YOU DON"T READ YOUR OWN SOURCES AS WELL AS OTHER PEOPLES RESPONSES.

 

Yes it was about Hyperspace missiles which of course would be useless as we firmly established.

 

yes I was an AP physics teacher who doesn't care about how you spell a word on the SWTOR forums. If you can show me where misspelling a word on a video game forum would disqualify you from teaching I would love to see it.

 

This thread is a testament of you constantly getting owned.

[jarjarloves]

You denied calling me a racist.

 

And obviously you don't know my issue with SJWs as you were proven wrong on your assumptions already. Trying to throw the racist/sexist card out before you even comprehend what I said.

 

Also... most women are not feminist anymore because it is not what it used to be and does not mean what it used to mean. So the majority of women hate women? Women are misogynistic? This is where your logic leads.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/graphics/national/feminism-project/poll/

or

https://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/04/16/feminism-poll_n_3094917.html

 

My issue is not with women or races as I think it is petty. The fact that is what you CHOOSE to focus on and put words in my mouth is not my problem but yours.

 

Feminism no longer stands for equality, equality in the sexes is not the issue. Now it is about beating down men and incited sexual bias, and the majority of women agree so again... are women misogynistic? It has evolved into something else that is why they disagree.

 

I am done with this portion of the discussion. You were wrong and jumped to the conclusion that I hated women and other races. The problem here is there is real racism, and if people just throw it around, then it becomes just another word. It means something, save that kind of accusation for when there is no other meaning.

 

Again, being anti SJW does not mean you hate women. Perhaps you should look outside your echo-chamber?

---

 

.

 

your own sources say you are wrong.

 

 

way to show your bias

Edited January 30, 2018 by jarjarloves

[TalonVII]

I must ask all the Luke fanboys out there.(dont get me wrong I love Luke Skywalker as a character). WHY was it so necessary for Luke to have this grand display of a force battle with Snoke? Why was it necessary? And furthermore, was that in keeping with who Luke was?

 

From all the films, and even in the EU books, Luke's usage of the force was more subtle than Yoda. Luke wasn't about "I am raw power(as he thumps his chest) watch me crush everything in sight with ease!" Hell even Yoda wasn't like that.

 

I personally thought Luke projecting himself clear cross the galaxy and doing so long enough to fool Kylo was way more in line with WHO LUKE WAS and how he used the force.

 

Luke never became more powerful for power's sake. All of you screaming "but he didn't use the force the way I WANTES HIM TO!!" That's your whole problem the way YOU wanted him to.

 

I have no issue with how TLJ ended with Luke. How he got to that end from ROTJ, yeah I got some beef with.

 

But I also love this angle when Luke was trying to take Palpatine's head off on the second Death Star with "oh he was just trying to stop a mad man, he was justified." No Luke would of been justified killing Palpatine in SELF DEFENSE. Not being egged on then taking a shot at a man sitting down not making a move to defend himself.

 

This regardless of the circumstances is what we call MURDER. Jedi do not MURDER.

[NuSeC]

Yet, it was ok for Obi-Wan to have been living as a hermit, have no "real" fight scene, and die without confronting the Emperor.

 

 

1) The story is not about the Kenobi family.

2) He did get an eventual fight scene in the prequels, Luke got nothing.

3) it is not just the fact he was a hermit, it was why and for how long. The reasoning behind Kenobi doing it was to watch over Luke. Luke did it because his nephew is trying to be the new Darth Vader.

Of course we didn't know about the emperor until later. And he had no backstory. He was just a guy who was less forgiving than Vader.

He didn't need a backstory at the time. there was no lore or preceding trilogy that had to be explained about some super powerful guy around the same time as the actual emperor.

I mean why does this need to be repeated? There was no lore or story prior to Palpatine... there is for Snoke. You don't just insert some super powerful guy into an existing story.

 

Sorry it wasn't your cup of tea, but it doesn't make it wrong. It also doesn't mean that the way you wanted it would be right or better. It is what it is and crying about it won't change a thing.

What was the title and topic of this thread? It is a personal review of why I and others did not like it and you want to call a review crying. Just whatever man. You have attacked me from the start. Go take some anger management classes or something.

[NuSeC]

I must ask all the Luke fanboys out there.(dont get me wrong I love Luke Skywalker as a character). WHY was it so necessary for Luke to have this grand display of a force battle with Snoke? Why was it necessary? And furthermore, was that in keeping with who Luke was?

 

From all the films, and even in the EU books, Luke's usage of the force was more subtle than Yoda. Luke wasn't about "I am raw power(as he thumps his chest) watch me crush everything in sight with ease!" Hell even Yoda wasn't like that.

 

I personally thought Luke projecting himself clear cross the galaxy and doing so long enough to fool Kylo was way more in line with WHO LUKE WAS and how he used the force.

 

Luke never became more powerful for power's sake. All of you screaming "but he didn't use the force the way I WANTES HIM TO!!" That's your whole problem the way YOU wanted him to.

 

I have no issue with how TLJ ended with Luke. How he got to that end from ROTJ, yeah I got some beef with.

 

But I also love this angle when Luke was trying to take Palpatine's head off on the second Death Star with "oh he was just trying to stop a mad man, he was justified." No Luke would of been justified killing Palpatine in SELF DEFENSE. Not being egged on then taking a shot at a man sitting down not making a move to defend himself.

 

This regardless of the circumstances is what we call MURDER. Jedi do not MURDER.

 

LOL are you saying that every person killed by a Jedi was strictly in self defense?

 

What about Windu? When Windu was going to kill Palatine and had him in a window, was that anger or was it justice?

 

Some people believe it to be out of synch with Luke, I agree. You may not agree and that is your right

[jarjarloves]

 

What about Windu? When Windu was going to kill Palatine and had him in a window, was that anger or was it justice?

D

 

OMG that was the entire POINT! Windu was wrong! He was acting out of anger.

 

in ROTJ The Emperor even taunts luke by saying "Strike me down and complete your path to the dark side" You can't get more obvious then that.

Edited January 30, 2018 by jarjarloves