I think the writers are going to kill Theron

[Typhaos]

. I have killed Scorpio and Kailyo and while I want them out of my story I did not want them out of someone else's story.

IA is very lucky. Even though KOTET/KOTFE fits Force-users the best, it's IA who gets many companions back in a meaningful way.

The thing with Kaliyo is really well done. She is one of few companions who actually DO something in reaction to PC disappearance, she is angry, she seeks revenge, she finds Zakuul on her own, she hits Zakuul.

She has TWO major story moments in KOTFE and in KOTET she still actively speaks to PC if she is romanced!

Maybe you didn't like Kaliyo and SCORPIO but both of them are nicely reintroduced and I wish my main SI could have something like that KOTFE/KOTET feel so differently, so much better on IA .

Xalek and Talos quests were good, but they were not the main companions, these were Ashara LI and Khem/Zash for me. Replacement Dashade does not count And Talos/Xalek are not part of the main story of the expansion like SCORPIO/Kaliyo.

Another lucky one is SW, especially if romancing Vette.

Maybe trooper too but I don't play one.

The rest may just cry....

Edited December 10, 2017 by Typhaos

[IoNonSoEVero]

I find it unlikely that BW doesn't realize that companions mean a lot to people -- all these changes to the companions and what you can do with them seem to be directly taken from complaints that were raised over and over again i.e. in these forums. Loads of people were unhappy that they couldn't kill companions if said companions did something their character would not approve of. Quinn is the most obvious one, but Kaliyo has a pretty sizeable hate group for just being Kaliyo. Other complaints I have seen over the years have been at least Ashara (people claimed you could let the ghost kill her in beta and many would have preferred that), Xalek (some felt that he should have been punished for breaking the rules of the Sith Academy), Skadge (...do I need to say why?) and Broonmark (people felt he's a bloodthirsty beast that has no business hanging out in a LS SW's ship). Ashara has not yet returned, but everyone else has had a kill option iirc. To me, it feels Bioware is trying to fix what many felt was an error in vanilla.

 

The problem we're seeing might be that the people who complained to have a kill option either have moved on to other games or have stopped going to forums. BW seems to be slow to implement changes in story (I think the livestream with Timothy ZAhn said that they're working on stuff far, far ahead in the future atm), and players wish to have fast reactions to their complaints, which doesn't mix well.

 

And I bet that, years from now (if this game manages to survive that long), Bioware will implement 8.0 and have spotlight moving from companion to companion -- and forums will be full of people complaining how they don't want to waste 3 chapters hanging out with Doc when they could be hanging out with Theron and Lana or something.

 

Yes - they are listening too much to the edgelords who want all these kill options, IMHO, and they're not considering how that affects everyone else (since a companion with a kill option is essentially dead for everyone).

 

IMHO it *was* a mistake not to allow players to kill or remove Quinn, Skadge or Kaliyo from your crew in the vanilla story - they could have even worked it so every class had one "kick this companion" button and could remove the companion they liked least (by firing them, not killing them...I know plenty of people who would have kicked Doc off their ships, for example).

 

But that shouldn't translate into every character being killable now, and it shouldn't mean that they vanish from everyone's stories even if they're saved. When they cater to the group that wants everyone killed for lulz they alienate another vital playerbase.

[Seireeni]

Yes - they are listening too much to the edgelords who want all these kill options, IMHO, and they're not considering how that affects everyone else (since a companion with a kill option is essentially dead for everyone).

 

IMHO it *was* a mistake not to allow players to kill or remove Quinn, Skadge or Kaliyo from your crew in the vanilla story - they could have even worked it so every class had one "kick this companion" button and could remove the companion they liked least (by firing them, not killing them...I know plenty of people who would have kicked Doc off their ships, for example).

 

But that shouldn't translate into every character being killable now, and it shouldn't mean that they vanish from everyone's stories even if they're saved. When they cater to the group that wants everyone killed for lulz they alienate another vital playerbase.

 

I agree that it was a mistake, and that adding those options now is too little too late. I can't find many reasons for my characters to kill companions they tolerated for all those years. Especially when it comes to cases like Quinn -- he doesn't give you any reason to kill him, you just kill him out of spite after all those years. I'd also like to see other characters used more in the future -- I don't know if I'm in the minority, but I'd rather have less content and have that content be better, than more content that's done as cheap as possible.

 

However, I don't agree with your decision to refer to people who wished to kill a companion or two as "edgelords". Maybe some of them were, but many of the ones I saw were annoyed that their characters were forced to act in a way that felt out of character for them. Calling them derogatory names doesn't help at all, imo it just derails the conversation.

[Eshvara]

I agree that it was a mistake, and that adding those options now is too little too late. I can't find many reasons for my characters to kill companions they tolerated for all those years. Especially when it comes to cases like Quinn -- he doesn't give you any reason to kill him, you just kill him out of spite after all those years. I'd also like to see other characters used more in the future -- I don't know if I'm in the minority, but I'd rather have less content and have that content be better, than more content that's done as cheap as possible.

 

However, I don't agree with your decision to refer to people who wished to kill a companion or two as "edgelords". Maybe some of them were, but many of the ones I saw were annoyed that their characters were forced to act in a way that felt out of character for them. Calling them derogatory names doesn't help at all, imo it just derails the conversation.

 

Killing Quinn isn't exactly out of spite though. You tolerated him for years because you had to as they took the option away. I don't think anyone who dislikes Arcann would want him forced in their story and I think because of what he has done and the issues they have with that, they'd kill him as soon as they could, even if that was years after the events.

 

I don't think it's spiteful at all for people to kill Quinn or Arcann, they did bad stuff, and if you care about those things, their death isn't undeserved.

I myself don't care however, and I wouldn't kill either of them. But I get why people do want them dead, I just don't share the same feelings.

[Seireeni]

Killing Quinn isn't exactly out of spite though. You tolerated him for years because you had to as they took the option away. I don't think anyone who dislikes Arcann would want him forced in their story and I think because of what he has done and the issues they have with that, they'd kill him as soon as they could, even if that was years after the events.

 

I don't think it's spiteful at all for people to kill Quinn or Arcann, they did bad stuff, and if you care about those things, their death isn't undeserved.

I myself don't care however, and I wouldn't kill either of them. But I get why people do want them dead, I just don't share the same feelings.

 

I didn't mean that the player would do it out of spite -- I meant that the character did. There was really no in character reasoning to why you weren't able to kill Quinn ages ago, nor is there any reason why your character would have been forced to tolerate him until that point. With other kill options, there seems to be some reason for your character to kill said companion. Quinn, however, just comes to you bearing a message.

Edited December 11, 2017 by Seireeni

[Ioue]

I think they're trying to get out of the corner they've written themselves into with KOTET and Iokath.

 

Theron, I don't know, I want to know why he hasn't told us what he's doing and why he's doing it. If the answer is something silly then I'll fully support the kill option for him.

 

That is my current impression with FEET right now. I loved the announcement when it came out as I took it as a sign the team wanted to experiment and place more effort into the game instead of terminating all the servers permanently. (As recent news with Marvel Heroes established as a valid outcome *cough*). But as I played the chapters, I felt the monthlies were very lean. Compared to episodic games out on the market, it left me in a state of meh.

 

With the traitor current storyline, I am more interested in how the writers will push the story further. Even though I do like Theron as a character, my focus has landed on how the whole traitor plot will play out. But I do hope the devs take the outcries after Umbara into account on how to ... treat Theron with respect for want of a better word. As in add more to his character development. Make his reasoning understandable and realistic in the context of Eternal Alliance.

 

Because the last thing I want is to have Theron act in a way of typical, boring quest giver cutout as I thought he was going through some character development. That's why I was interested in romancing him besides the whole look.

 

 

Troy is busy, with VA work, with his band, he has a lot on his plate so if it's a case of "Can no longer commit to", so be it but I would then hope Bioware would replace him rather than kill Theron. On the other hand, Tanno Vik's VA had passed away by the time of KOTFE and well, we all know there is no way for a Trooper to ever get Tanno back.

 

I did not know he had a band or the fact Tanno Vik's VA passed away

 

Respectfully, I would also like to point out SWTOR has a localization process that involves German & French VA. That means (very likely) those across the pond listening to other versions of Theron. And localization/translation adds a lot of months to the finishing process. Include the strict overseeing by Disney-LucasFilms, what we see and play takes a lot of months plus development time. Adding more to logistical concerns like scheduling and what not.

 

I am a fan of Theron, too, as well as Troy Baker's work. But I think it's important to acknowledge the process of the localization and those on the German and French servers. Because from the posts I've been reading, I didn't see much about localizations.

 

I don't think they actively are trying to make people hate characters unless they are villains. I can't really call Theron a villain.

 

I wouldn't call Theron a villain. Valkorion? Yes. Vitiate? Yes. Even Saresh? Yes? But Theron?? No.

[Damask_Rose]

I find it unlikely that BW doesn't realize that companions mean a lot to people

 

Oh, I think they realize how much companions mean to people, I just don't think they care. I'm sure someone over there worked out how many people they will lose over shoddy story vs. how much money they will save with it and so far cheap production is winning out over happy story players.

[Lunafox]

Oh, I think they realize how much companions mean to people, I just don't think they care. I'm sure someone over there worked out how many people they will lose over shoddy story vs. how much money they will save with it and so far cheap production is winning out over happy story players.

 

I wouldn't be surprised. They didn't give a crap about all the people who needed to be on the west coast servers, and that was a sizeable chunk, so I don't imagine we story/companion lovers are far behind.

[Seireeni]

I wouldn't be surprised. They didn't give a crap about all the people who needed to be on the west coast servers, and that was a sizeable chunk, so I don't imagine we story/companion lovers are far behind.

 

These forums have become extremely strange. A year or so ago, last time I was hanging out here, status quo was still that hardcore raiders were unsatisfied because Bioware clearly just wanted to create story content and fluff and balanced classes around pvp and didn't care about raiders, hardcore pvpers were unsatisfied because Bioware just wanted to create story content and fluff and clearly balanced classes around pve and didn't care about pvp players and, solo players were, I don't know, talking about story and lore and playing the game?

 

Now, ops/heroics/fps section and pvp section are half dead and hardcore story players are unsatisfied because Bioware clearly just wants to create pvp/ops/fp content and doesn't care about story players.

 

It's like a parallel universe.

[Asmodesu]

These forums have become extremely strange. A year or so ago, last time I was hanging out here, status quo was still that hardcore raiders were unsatisfied because Bioware clearly just wanted to create story content and fluff and balanced classes around pvp and didn't care about raiders, hardcore pvpers were unsatisfied because Bioware just wanted to create story content and fluff and clearly balanced classes around pve and didn't care about pvp players and, solo players were, I don't know, talking about story and lore and playing the game?

 

Now, ops/heroics/fps section and pvp section are half dead and hardcore story players are unsatisfied because Bioware clearly just wants to create pvp/ops/fp content and doesn't care about story players.

 

It's like a parallel universe.

 

That's what happens when Bioware does a complete 180 degree change on what they had planned. they even cut down the planned story trilogy (FEET) by over a third to cater to the raiders, and now they've just made a mess across the board. But at least the hardcore raiders got what they wanted, right? nope, they either aren't playing or got like 3 bosses.

Edited December 11, 2017 by Asmodesu

[IoNonSoEVero]

I agree that it was a mistake, and that adding those options now is too little too late. I can't find many reasons for my characters to kill companions they tolerated for all those years. Especially when it comes to cases like Quinn -- he doesn't give you any reason to kill him, you just kill him out of spite after all those years. I'd also like to see other characters used more in the future -- I don't know if I'm in the minority, but I'd rather have less content and have that content be better, than more content that's done as cheap as possible.

 

However, I don't agree with your decision to refer to people who wished to kill a companion or two as "edgelords". Maybe some of them were, but many of the ones I saw were annoyed that their characters were forced to act in a way that felt out of character for them. Calling them derogatory names doesn't help at all, imo it just derails the conversation.

 

Oh, I don t think simply wanting to kill a few companions makes one an edgelord. My SW always will kill Quinn (she feels he is kissing up again amd cannot be trusted around his Alliance...if there had been an option to put Quinn on the next ship back to Dromund Kaas with a permaban in Alliance space I would have taken it. That was not an option, and my SW was not going to have him around). I always kill Arcann and Senya. Unless you are playing an angel we have probably all knocked a character off.

 

BUT...there seems to be a contingent of players both here and in the game that seem to get off on killing everyone and will even go on about how they want to kill them and how they hope it is painful and seem to take delight in that. Those are the edgelords and it seems they want just about everyone to die...same sorts you see on Fleet beating their companions with Punish over and over again...

Edited December 11, 2017 by IoNonSoEVero

[Damask_Rose]

These forums have become extremely strange. A year or so ago, last time I was hanging out here, status quo was still that hardcore raiders were unsatisfied because Bioware clearly just wanted to create story content and fluff and balanced classes around pvp and didn't care about raiders, hardcore pvpers were unsatisfied because Bioware just wanted to create story content and fluff and clearly balanced classes around pve and didn't care about pvp players and, solo players were, I don't know, talking about story and lore and playing the game?

 

Now, ops/heroics/fps section and pvp section are half dead and hardcore story players are unsatisfied because Bioware clearly just wants to create pvp/ops/fp content and doesn't care about story players.

 

It's like a parallel universe.

 

I don't think many sane people feel like pvpers or raiders are being catered to right now. Everyone is suffering from a lack of well thought out, well executed content.

[JennyFlynn]

Quite truthfully, KOTFE/ET has been a disaster fest since its release and they should have never greenlit the project. Now I'm not talking about the story itself (which is bad enough all on its own) but the design of the expansion overall. Throughout the release, Bioware miraculously managed to screw over several, if not all, niches of the game. If it wasn't the OPs folks suffering, it was the PvPers, solo players, and story players. Hell, I think there was even an issue for crafters at some point. From "no OPs" for the longest time, to the false promises concerning companions, saying one thing but doing the opposite, ignoring various kinds of bugs some more impactful than others and the list goes on and on all the while throwing stuff in our face no one really asked for or wanted (Hi GC!). I feel the entire format of the expansion was unsuccessful and sloppy. Whoever first conceived the idea for FE/ET should never be allowed to touch an MMO again.

 

I'll admit, originally I was stoked playing through KOTFE CH 1-9 but my rose tinted glasses cracked fast and I regret having so many of my characters linger halfway into KOTFE. I hope this will go down in history as their lowest point ever and from here on out things will improve.

 

I probably sound pessimistic and bi.tchy right now but whatever, I'm only human so.

Edited December 11, 2017 by JennyFlynn

[Asmodesu]

I love Kotfe and kotet, still. The only reason all my characters haven't gone through them yet is because the story arc isn't wrapped up! The class stories all ended the same no matter what you did, with illusional variances, as did Makeb, and SoR so don't know why people rage about KotFE etc doing the same thing but meh, different strokes for different folks.

My characters didn't go through RotHC until it was released and wrapped up, which was basically at release, since it was just the one planet (if not doing ops). Same with SoR, so I thought, with Ziost "wrapping it up" but then came KotFE which for the first time directly continued that arc line. Now I'm just having to wait and see where the story goes still before my main story characters can go through KotFE. I'm impatient and excited for the day my mains can start their way through, but until then I have my "story testing toons" that experiment with every variation <3 it's just the waiting game got longer this year, then it was for 2 years prior and makes me irritated xD

[IoNonSoEVero]

I actually really love KOTFE and KOTET despite some of the plot holes/points. But IMHO it would have probably been far better if they had stuck with the original plan of three seasons instead of acuttling it and scrambling for content this year. I don't think it works for non Force users and there are many things I would add or change but I did love it and I still replay chapters and being new alts through.

 

I do also hold back characters, though. Only one of mine has done Copero and most of the rest will hold after KOTET until this story arc wraps up. I won't send them through any new content without the spoilers to avoid losing certain companions. And my agent isn't doing SoR or KOTFE at all because the story doesn't seem to fit her.

Edited December 11, 2017 by IoNonSoEVero

[aerockyul]

Isn't Shae Vizla your favourite? The way they gave her away, she may as well have been dead.

 

At least she got some chapter play, but you're right. She's just as "dead" as most of the other comps now.

Actually Ashara and Khem are my favorites. I'm not looking forward to the 3 minute Alliance Alert with a kill option for Ash and we may actually never see Khem again

[Eshvara]

At least she got some chapter play, but you're right. She's just as "dead" as most of the other comps now.

Actually Ashara and Khem are my favorites. I'm not looking forward to the 3 minute Alliance Alert with a kill option for Ash and we may actually never see Khem again

 

I like Ash too! I liked Khem'zash over Val, and I hope I can get her to return. I found it quite interesting to have your mentor becoming your companion. Nothing wrong with a little of "I'm better than you now" feeling.

Imo, Shae should have been given as a companion for her chapter, rather than a sub reward. I don't know how they're going to keep her relevant when only so many people have her. Same goes for HK! Such a waste.

 

The chapters with Koth, Lana and HK were the most fun imo.

Edited December 11, 2017 by Eshvara

[IoNonSoEVero]

At least she got some chapter play, but you're right. She's just as "dead" as most of the other comps now.

Actually Ashara and Khem are my favorites. I'm not looking forward to the 3 minute Alliance Alert with a kill option for Ash and we may actually never see Khem again

 

Depending on which character I have at my stronghold, the dashade there is labeled as Khem Val or Akghal Usar. They seem to think a dashade is a dashade. No...my SI's friendship with Khem really developed over time and that is the dashade I want back.

 

I am looking forward to Ashara, both with my SI and with my SW, who I think would enjoy meeting her too.

[Lammia]

IA is very lucky. Even though KOTET/KOTFE fits Force-users the best, it's IA who gets many companions back in a meaningful way.

The thing with Kaliyo is really well done. She is one of few companions who actually DO something in reaction to PC disappearance, she is angry, she seeks revenge, she finds Zakuul on her own, she hits Zakuul.

She has TWO major story moments in KOTFE and in KOTET she still actively speaks to PC if she is romanced!

Maybe you didn't like Kaliyo and SCORPIO but both of them are nicely reintroduced and I wish my main SI could have something like that KOTFE/KOTET feel so differently, so much better on IA .

Xalek and Talos quests were good, but they were not the main companions, these were Ashara LI and Khem/Zash for me. Replacement Dashade does not count And Talos/Xalek are not part of the main story of the expansion like SCORPIO/Kaliyo.

Another lucky one is SW, especially if romancing Vette.

Maybe trooper too but I don't play one.

The rest may just cry....

 

At the same time, SW is the most unlucky, if you romanced Quinn. And trooper is in the similar boat.

[Seireeni]

Quite truthfully, KOTFE/ET has been a disaster fest since its release and they should have never greenlit the project. Now I'm not talking about the story itself (which is bad enough all on its own) but the design of the expansion overall. Throughout the release, Bioware miraculously managed to screw over several, if not all, niches of the game. If it wasn't the OPs folks suffering, it was the PvPers, solo players, and story players. Hell, I think there was even an issue for crafters at some point. From "no OPs" for the longest time, to the false promises concerning companions, saying one thing but doing the opposite, ignoring various kinds of bugs some more impactful than others and the list goes on and on all the while throwing stuff in our face no one really asked for or wanted (Hi GC!). I feel the entire format of the expansion was unsuccessful and sloppy. Whoever first conceived the idea for FE/ET should never be allowed to touch an MMO again.

 

I'll admit, originally I was stoked playing through KOTFE CH 1-9 but my rose tinted glasses cracked fast and I regret having so many of my characters linger halfway into KOTFE. I hope this will go down in history as their lowest point ever and from here on out things will improve.

 

I probably sound pessimistic and bi.tchy right now but whatever, I'm only human so.

 

I don't think many sane people feel like pvpers or raiders are being catered to right now. Everyone is suffering from a lack of well thought out, well executed content.

 

I think you might be right -- and I'm not sure where the issue lies there. Imo Bioware seems to be trying to at least throw bones at every niche and harcore players, but it's either not enough or not good enough. Especially with the ops group, it really feels they're giving them just the bare minimum.

 

Maybe they have come to rely on the casual players. As a casual pvper, casual ops player and what I can only describe as "casual story player" (as I don't share the opinions that "us story players" and "us people who enjoy story" present despite being a story player and enjoying story), I'm personally moderately happy with how the game is doing. There's lots of room for improvement, but lots of good, too.

[Glower]

Enraged Satele will pop in out of nowhere, Marr will assist her. New mini expansion without overpowered enemies. One could wish...

[jamoup]

I don't think they will kill him. Maybe we will a get a choice to? doubt it. I always assumed SCORPIO was controlling him through his implants and we would figure it all out and welcome him back with open arms..because choice matters.

[Ralei]

Ralei,

 

What I don't understand about your comment (and other people's) is why some of you are so against choices. As I mentioned (in my first among now three brilliant posts ) is that from an RP perspective, my characters run the gamut from love interest, to former love interest (once an original companion came back), to thankful for his efforts but nothing romantic, to indifferent, to loathing because he's Republic, to loathing because my characters feel betrayed regardless of his intentions, to loathing because my character is bonkers.

 

I hardly think of myself as some 11 year-old edge lord (new term to me, but I get it). I can completely see my range of characters embracing a range of options. Not sure how my RP-ing with Theron impacts your interactions.

 

TL-DR: Options are good, particularly when they don't impact you.

 

Hugs,

 

Dasty

 

I was just imagining my fictional nephew Chad that spacebars through all the dialog texting me saying "I KILLED THERON LOLZ IT WAS AWESOME HIS EYES BULGED." and i'm just over here sniffling into my whiskey as a long time adult subscriber with real actual money thinking about my real actual money being spent to make Theron's eyes bulge for Chad to lel at instead of a story being written for me to fangirl about on the forums for the next 6 months. Cause that did happen. With Quinn. F U fictional Chad, I'm never introducing you to another game.

 

I'm trying to imagine it the other way around, like me texting him saying "Aren't you so sad you killed Theron and now you can't see that super sweet cutscene where he made your character giggle and you kissed for like 5 minutes?" He'd text back "Who Theron? Lana spelled backwards is anal LOLOLOL."

 

I'm encourage by the rumors that Prince Egghead is getting his own sweet romance scenes because that means those of us who hate the guy and killed him won't give a crap, but those who love him will be happy. Chad won't care either way, he's playing Battlefront II now.

[JennyFlynn]

I was just imagining my fictional nephew Chad that spacebars through all the dialog texting me saying "I KILLED THERON LOLZ IT WAS AWESOME HIS EYES BULGED." and i'm just over here sniffling into my whiskey as a long time adult subscriber with real actual money thinking about my real actual money being spent to make Theron's eyes bulge for Chad to lel at instead of a story being written for me to fangirl about on the forums for the next 6 months. Cause that did happen. With Quinn. F U fictional Chad, I'm never introducing you to another game.

 

I'm trying to imagine it the other way around, like me texting him saying "Aren't you so sad you killed Theron and now you can't see that super sweet cutscene where he made your character giggle and you kissed for like 5 minutes?" He'd text back "Who Theron? Lana spelled backwards is anal LOLOLOL."

 

I'm encourage by the rumors that Prince Egghead is getting his own sweet romance scenes because that means those of us who hate the guy and killed him won't give a crap, but those who love him will be happy. Chad won't care either way, he's playing Battlefront II now.

Hahaha! You just made my day and gave me a few good giggles with that comment, especially the bold part, well done!

 

But on a serious note--you're spot on with your fictional nephew.

[Eshvara]

Seems like money well spent for Chad.