IGN review of KOTFE

[FerkWork]

Yup

/5char

[MeNaCe-NZ]

Yep that review more or less sums up exactly what KoTFE is and what SWToR has become.

 

6.5 ... ouch ... that's on top of the usual EA bribery towards IGN. Must be why it was held back so long so it didn't hurt initial sales so much.

 

Basically a really big fail of an expansions yet they are persevering with this design choice.

 

RIP SWToR.

[KrazieFox]

It's always the same ... the tiny minority on the forums trying to dictate to the silent majority quietly playing the game ...

 

why do these people equate MMM = Group?

 

Massive Multiplayer Online ... where in that does it say "Forced Grouping"?

 

Early mmo's did force players to group - even single 'trash mobs' needed a group to take down ... back in those days you could not even leave town without a group - solo players were torn asunder ... back in the early days of mmo's where 250,000 players was HUGE! Back then mmo players had to invest hours upon hours - it was actually beneficial if you did not have a job, so you could devote your every waking hour on it ... sometimes you would have to wait several hours in town to form a group ... 'Prime Time' was really the only time you could properly play, though ... otherwise there was not enough people to form groups with ... the main issue was when people started leaving ... could no longer devote 12+ hours aday to the game ... "damned casuals" ...

 

... and so the mmo genre nearly became extinct - it was a tiny fringe market - only those who could devote most of their lives played mmo's ...

 

Then World of Warcraft hit and ... most of those old relics complained it was not a real mmo, because people could play without a group!? 0_0

What heresay is this!

 

The reason World of Warcraft was so big is that they capitalised on the fact that most mmo players are solo players ... players could play whenever they wanted - no more having to wait in town for hours upon hours (and sometimes days) waiting to form a group in order to leave town - players could now leave the safety of the town on their own ... and the genre blossomed ...

 

The reason WoW became so big and stayed at the top, is simple. They realise that the majority playerbase for mmo's is - The Solo Player.

 

Some people believe the 'Solo Player' is the bane of the mmo genre ... the most successful games, however, are the ones that recognise this and are not swayed by the tiny (10% - 15%) minority that yell and shout on the forums. The largest chunk of that 10% - 15% are the pvp players ... they have to keep up with what is happening in the game in order to stay competitive. Meanwhile the 'silent' majority are quietly playing and enjoying the game.

 

Until, that is, some of the Dev's start to believe that their majority is in the forums and make game changes based on this belief. Only to be amazed when, after giving their audience what they wanted, there is a mass exodus away ...

That's what happened when 4.0.2 hit ... the dev's heard the forumites screaming 'Nerf Companions' ... they believed the tiny minority was their majority and made changes based on this - only to see their numbers sharply decline - which was a huge contrast to their increased numbers following 4.0 ... and it is why they had to change things back.

 

So, lets try to remember - MMO's mass audience is the Solo Player ... players who may only have an hour to spare each day and wants to feel like they can achieve something within that hour ...

 

As opposed to the old, dead, mmo where unless you had 12+ hours aday to commit, don't bother.

 

Massive Multiplayer Online means there are other players in the same space as yourself - you CAN group, if you so desire, or you can progress on your own - or you can log in, play for a bit, go afk without other people shouting at you ... World of Warcraft is so big because it understands this.

 

BioWare are known for their story games - "Dragonage", "Mass Effect" - there was so much hope for swtor when it was first announced ... until the forumites came along and shouted loud enough the dev's made changes to their original concept and ... out came a generic mmo - many, disappointed, left. The game quickly declined to the point where severe server mergers happened. This time last year it even looked like there would only be 4 servers remaining - 2x US, 2x EU (1 normal, 1 pvp) ... right now, swtor is enjoying a resurgence ... thanks to KotFE ...

 

I've never put much stock in IGN anyway - they tend to hate most of the games I love. So, if they hate it, chances are it's a good game. You just get sour revievers, usually part of the tiny minority.

 

I think swtor is doing well, right now - and some people don't like it.

 

Most of the people here shouting for 'old school' mmo have never had to experience the nightmare they used to be - often there was no point logging in at all because there simply was not enough players online ... and there was very little you could do without a group.

 

So, in summary, IGN's 'bad' review is a good thing - it means the game is good - and IGN is as sour as it has always been

[peter_plankskull]

This ^^

 

I mostly disagree with this review , Love the story and their renewed focus on it,, love the fact that it can be soloed at story level difficulty..among other things ... personally i give it a 7.5/10

 

There's a difference between solo story level, and giving your companion alone to kill any of the bosses throughout the game. MAYBE they wont be able to solo Arcann, but you sure as hell wont die with that kolto station.

[LordArtemis]

I have a different view, though I recognize some of the criticisms this article has for the title.

 

I think the current system could have been spot on for it's target audience, casual players and future casuals, but falls short because of OTHER game changes.

 

Now, most of the changes, IMO, are good on paper. Universal companions, level sync to make old content relevant and offer decent rewards, etc. But really, IMO, this covers up the real problem with this game that avails itself after playing for a while....

 

...combat tends to be boring, and not because it is too easy....because it is far too gamey, glitchy and downright comical at times. And that is entirely the fault of the "balance" team.

 

What they have done is taken almost everything that was awesome about the game ability wise and turned it on it's ear, in a bad way IMO. Most of the animations no longer work right, and the ones that do create some strange situations....like an NPC reacting to a force push you havent done yet, or NPCs falling over from an explosion that has not yet occurred. It makes it look like a lagfest frankly, and I have to wonder what person thought this kind of change was a good idea.

 

Abilities that, by their very nature should be overpowered (but perhaps have long cooldowns) instead are laughably weak, sometimes weaker than quick attacks with far less theatrics.

 

Abilities that take a LONG time to fire, only to seemingly tickle the enemy, while others that hit immediately and appear to hit with a substantial push, causing a player to leave the drama behind and stick to one or two strong abilities with lackluster effects.

 

Ok, so this is rambling on a bit, better to list specifics....

 

1) Abilities and animations that are a hot mess.

2) Far too many static NPCs in the world.

3) FAR too many bugs, old cheap work still in place, holes in the environment, etc to count.

4) Game features that fall FAR short of expectations (I am looking at you Strongholds/GSF).

 

That doesn't mean there isn't plenty to love, but that is the strange nature of this game....plenty to love, plenty to hate, throw it together into a general feeling of malaise.

 

The game used to somewhat hit the target with story but combat was epic. Now it nails story but combat is a mess. This game seems to have a problem finding a sense of itself, and I don't expect that problem is going to end any time soon.

 

Changes I would make immediately.

 

1) Revert almost ALL of the bad changes made for the sake of balance, including the frankly idiotic change to animation triggers and effects.

2) Remove most of the static NPCs from the environment, replace them with roaming/patrolling NPCs.

3) Add far more explosive elements to the environment.

4) Add one more level to level sync.

5) Add a mechanic to downlevel a player 3 or 4 levels with toggle.

6) Restore all removed dailies from Illum and Makeb.

7) Add a NIGHTMARE MODE to KotFE with higher rewards, DOWNLEVELING a player by 3 levels throughout the content.

 

Changes I would make over time....

 

1) Add a PVE element to GSF, even if just a tutorial, and turn hangars into "strongholds".

2) Make the NarShadaa nighttime event a game feature.

3) Add a way to earn CC in game on a regular basis by participating in underutilized forms of play, like raiding, pvp, etc.

4) Redesign personal starships to make them something we can customize without breaking mission triggers, even if only externally.

5) Redesign Strongholds to allow more customization and hooks we can move around and lock down as we wish.

6) Add 190 mods to craftable mods.

7) Create companion craftables, both animal and droid, that players can make and sell. Would act as no dialog or story companions, if they die they disappear. Would not be able to run missions.

8) Add MANY more appearance options for companions by allowing them to be customized in appearance designer.

9) Add pazaak to the game.

 

And finally...

 

10) Make sure that a solo, tactical, regular, hard and NIGHTMARE mode exists for every single flashpoint in the game, including end game flashpoints.

 

If you read that, thanks for reading.

[BrianDavion]

"Hi I didn't try raiding at all, and oinly did the end game content in this expansion for single players. I found it kinda easy and repetive" that can be said about ANY MMO EVER.

 

 

if you're a single player your end game has always consisted of endlessly running dead easy dalies.

 

 

as others have noted, this reviewer is a WoW fanboy whose never liked SWTOR. not saying he's all wrong, but at the same time, he's not comparing SWTOR to "did it improve the game" etc. he's saying "nope WoW's still better! ohh look I got my cheque from activision"

Edited December 11, 2015 by BrianDavion

[Lord_of_Mu]

*snip*.

 

 

I did read all of that and I agree with many of your points. I would like to further add that Bioware should try to not only tell a story about the current conflict, but develop systems with in the game to give players more direct control and interaction along the way.

 

We're going to have over 50 companions by the time this story ends. We can only craft with 6, and we can only use one out with us at a time. I love the selection available, but to me that screams a need for a new feature to make the remaining companions more useful, for reasons other than story.

 

I'm the commander of this alliance. Let me command.

Edited December 11, 2015 by Lord_of_Mu

[Neglience]

This game is so easy mode. I can not see what can be argued about this.

[Jerba]

Wow, this review feels much more honest than I expected. IGN has a reputation of non-sensical scores but I can agree with this review. And you can really see that the reviewer played through a lot of the KotFE story and alliance missions, not just the chapter 3 demo they showed at the game shows. He really knew what he was talking about.

It is kind of strange that they released the review in time for Episode 7, right when SWTOR does all of their December promotions, but this could have just been coincidence and not related to a request from BioWare.

Unfortunately, I fear that if the developers see this, they take away the message that it is better to completely abandon endgame because it is bad, instead of trying to improve it. But at this point, I doubt that there is any developer left who wants to support veteran players.

[Makillda]

Bit the bullet and started a third character through the expansion. The first time, it was cool because new. The second time, different alignment, different choices, same outcome. This time, it is *********** tedious. 3-4 minutes of sneeze and kill everything (toon is in 190 ziost gear) then 15 minutes of movie time. I'll push through but this may very well be it for me.

 

I'm not paying a subscription to play a single player rpg. This is not the game I dropped a pile of cash on to get the Collector's Edition anymore. This is not the game that pulled me away from WoW anymore. It's kotor 3 that is released at a trickle and costs me 3 times what the damned box would cost if they just released it as a stand alone game by the time it is all available to play.

 

I will probably cancel my recurring sub before it pops again in January. Pretty much sucks because I really liked what the game used to be but it is but a shadow of its former self.

 

Oh, and accurate review is accurate.

[Vember]

, WAY TO EASY COMBAT

 

What MMO has difficult combat? Or what rpg of any kind, to be honest?

 

Can you point me to a game that has challenging leveling content?

 

I keep seeing this complaint in the SWTOR forums, yet I see the same exact easy faceroll combat in every other mmo I play...GW2, Tera, WoW, Wildstar, Lineage 2, EQ 2, AoC, Secret World - the list goes on.

 

What exactly are you looking for?

Edited December 11, 2015 by Vember

[SaerethDL]

What MMO has difficult combat? Or what rpg of any kind, to be honest?

 

Can you point me to a game that has challenging leveling content?

 

I keep seeing this complaint in the SWTOR forums, yet I see the same exact easy faceroll combat in every other mmo I play...GW2, Tera, WoW, Wildstar, Lineage 2, EQ 2, AoC, Secret World - the list goes on.

 

What exactly are you looking for?

 

Maybe they are looking for an MMO to break that mold?? maybe?

[Vember]

Maybe they are looking for an MMO to break that mold?? maybe?

 

Maybe, but the reason i ask is because I don't see these complaints about other MMO's, only this one - at least at this volume, lately - and it makes me wonder. SWTOR hasn't really changed in that department in the last four years, and it mirrors most other MMO's, so I really don't understand all the complaining.

Edited December 11, 2015 by Vember

[GalacticKegger]

It's always the same ... the tiny minority on the forums trying to dictate to the silent majority quietly playing the game ...

 

why do these people equate MMM = Group?

 

Massive Multiplayer Online ... where in that does it say "Forced Grouping"?

Massively Multiplayer Online ... where in that does it say "Forced Singleplayer"? Edited December 11, 2015 by GalacticKegger

[Pagy]

"Hi I didn't try raiding at all, and oinly did the end game content in this expansion for single players. I found it kinda easy and repetive" that can be said about ANY MMO EVER.

 

 

if you're a single player your end game has always consisted of endlessly running dead easy dalies.

 

 

as others have noted, this reviewer is a WoW fanboy whose never liked SWTOR. not saying he's all wrong, but at the same time, he's not comparing SWTOR to "did it improve the game" etc. he's saying "nope WoW's still better! ohh look I got my cheque from activision"

what's the point in raiding in kotfe?

 

it's all old, recycled content. *yawn*

[Sporetox]

So far, I've not had any issues beating enemies into submission in KOTFE, where in the standard game, even for the story missions, I had to get help at least a few times. So the combat feeling weak isn't just him. I think the story is keeping me in though, and that's really the point of SWTOR anyway for me.

[DarthDymond]

Maybe, but the reason i ask is because I don't see these complaints about other MMO's, only this one - at least at this volume, lately - and it makes me wonder. SWTOR hasn't really changed in that department in the last four years, and it mirrors most other MMO's, so I really don't understand all the complaining.

Sometimes it's a game of inches - difficulty is a spectrum, not a binary "difficult" vs "not difficult" switch.

 

A significant piece of modern game-design theory is the idea of Cognitive Flow, basically the idea that you keep players engaged with a game best by making sure that as their proficiency with a game increases over time, the game remains challenging enough, without getting too challenging.

 

If a game becomes too difficult too quickly (outpacing a player's increasing skill at the game) it becomes frustrating and the player is more likely to lose interest. But if it fails to provide enough of a challenge (allowing the player's skill to significantly outpace the difficulty), the gameplay becomes boring, and the player is also more likely to lose interest.

 

That's a bit of an oversimplification of the theory for the sake of discussion, and there are certainly other factors that contribute to a player's overall enjoyment / engagement / investment in a game, but Cognitive Flow is a piece of the puzzle for many - and in a genre that tends to hug the line pretty close, sometimes it is a relatively slight shift that crosses over from being in the Flow to slipping into Boredom.

Edited December 11, 2015 by DarthDymond

[Myracarrah]

What MMO has difficult combat? Or what rpg of any kind, to be honest?

 

Can you point me to a game that has challenging leveling content?

 

I keep seeing this complaint in the SWTOR forums, yet I see the same exact easy faceroll combat in every other mmo I play...GW2, Tera, WoW, Wildstar, Lineage 2, EQ 2, AoC, Secret World - the list goes on.

 

What exactly are you looking for?

 

You know.... excellent good question. How about a game where moving on the fly matters? You can cast while running and so can the mob chasing you down. Wouldn't it be nice to drop your AOE circle infront of a charging mob and have them run into it? You drop it behind them, and you ... miss. No damage.

 

How about if I hover my mouse over the mobs head while firing off a blaster, I get a damage increase? That's right, you have to face the mob to hurt it the most.

 

Basically I want a faster movement (but not faster damage) type of combat that involves me thinking on the fly to get it done. Basically if static hold still combat damage met and fell in love with twitch first person shooter and they had a terrible mutant baby hybrid.

 

So I want Assassin's Creed style combat in an MMO.

 

Then, since you made the mistake of asking, I want differing combat mission difficulties. I want SOLO. I want DUO (set for a player and a friend, or a really strong player) Then I want GROUP, GROUP - OMG are you stupid to do this HARD MODE, followed by RAIDS. Oh wait... no... I stopped raiding.... but I still want raids...even if I never see them.

 

And finally, finally I want... no I need... FACTIONS. Not like this Republic Empire thing. Nono. I want to go to Voss. I want to help the Gormak. I want to kill all the little Voss children on their pilgrimage. I want to see their weeping faces... and then I want to walk into Voss-Ka and have the guards start shouting 'Killer! Murderer!' And have waves of NPCs light up for combat and eat my face for thinking that I could get away with it.

 

So the Summary

1) Assassin's Creed style combat movement with a target circle for increased damage.

2) Many many options of difficulty for Instanced Quests.

3) Factions that matter.

[GalacticKegger]

This is Earth & Beyond all over again. The only reason this isn't being killed as quickly as E&B was is the IP. Edited December 11, 2015 by GalacticKegger

[FerkWork]

Bahahaha IGN f*cken savage m8 XDDDD!!!!!

[Vember]

You know.... excellent good question. How about a game where moving on the fly matters? You can cast while running and so can the mob chasing you down. Wouldn't it be nice to drop your AOE circle infront of a charging mob and have them run into it? You drop it behind them, and you ... miss. No damage.

 

How about if I hover my mouse over the mobs head while firing off a blaster, I get a damage increase? That's right, you have to face the mob to hurt it the most.

 

Basically I want a faster movement (but not faster damage) type of combat that involves me thinking on the fly to get it done. Basically if static hold still combat damage met and fell in love with twitch first person shooter and they had a terrible mutant baby hybrid.

 

So I want Assassin's Creed style combat in an MMO.

 

Then, since you made the mistake of asking, I want differing combat mission difficulties. I want SOLO. I want DUO (set for a player and a friend, or a really strong player) Then I want GROUP, GROUP - OMG are you stupid to do this HARD MODE, followed by RAIDS. Oh wait... no... I stopped raiding.... but I still want raids...even if I never see them.

 

And finally, finally I want... no I need... FACTIONS. Not like this Republic Empire thing. Nono. I want to go to Voss. I want to help the Gormak. I want to kill all the little Voss children on their pilgrimage. I want to see their weeping faces... and then I want to walk into Voss-Ka and have the guards start shouting 'Killer! Murderer!' And have waves of NPCs light up for combat and eat my face for thinking that I could get away with it.

 

So the Summary

1) Assassin's Creed style combat movement with a target circle for increased damage.

2) Many many options of difficulty for Instanced Quests.

3) Factions that matter.

 

Well, you can find 2 and 3 in Anarchy Online, and that's been around since 2001

 

Assassin's Creed style combat in an MMO would be pretty awesome, I will admit.

[Anishor]

And this is why ultimately I think sandbox MMOs will be the next phase of MMO development. Something in the vein of SWG that hopefully will have an actual functional ground combat system ( no Pre-CU was borked as hell and you know it) more content and sandbox systems ( ie the GCW Meta game and underworld factions) at launch and a little bit more accessibility.

 

You need player driven economies and content in a virtual world to keep player retention high to keep your hardcore players satisfied enough to continue investing in a game and a world to draw people in, and the star wars IP is one of those that do that almost automatically. Now you have a functioning game world that is kind of self perpetuating, then you can add things on top at a natural slow development pace like Raids and Story and not get a raft of crap from the players for it.

 

Here are some of the key things I believe that would help create a fantastic sandbox:

 

1. Persistent Player Housing and Cities. - Nothing builds community more imo. Instances can exist but I would use that to have apartments in npc cities, to increase the accessibility of the system.

 

2. Player Event System - in SWG this was the storyteller system, allowed players to spend in game currency to obtain things normally only GMs and Designers have access to for a temporarily time to create events, whether decorations, NPCs, costumes, ect. I would expand this with the ability to generate notifications out of game to advertise and subscribe to events.

 

3. Player Crafted best Items (requiring combat obtained components of course ) and Player Driven economy

 

4. The ability for all player types to affect the game world, whether be PvPers and PvErs, Non-Combat Social game play, or crafters. Everyone is important and everyone should be able to contribute and affect any meta level systems of the conflicts that arise.

 

5. Non-Combat, Non-Crafting Social game play systems such as dancing, bartending, music, mayors

 

6. A dynamic world of NPCs where player actions affect the state of the game world. SWG had this a little but could be much more expanded upon. EQ-Next is claiming to trying to do something like this.

 

7. The acknowledgement and design around that players interaction with other players and the game world create far more memorable stories and these are as valuable an asset to the game as finely written and developed stories and gameplay experiences crafted by the developers.

[MillionsKNives]

"Hi I didn't try raiding at all, and oinly did the end game content in this expansion for single players. I found it kinda easy and repetive" that can be said about ANY MMO EVER.

 

 

if you're a single player your end game has always consisted of endlessly running dead easy dalies.

 

 

as others have noted, this reviewer is a WoW fanboy whose never liked SWTOR. not saying he's all wrong, but at the same time, he's not comparing SWTOR to "did it improve the game" etc. he's saying "nope WoW's still better! ohh look I got my cheque from activision"

 

Are you actually trying to act like current operations end game is a positive point for the game right now?

 

What MMO has difficult combat? Or what rpg of any kind, to be honest?

 

Can you point me to a game that has challenging leveling content?

 

I keep seeing this complaint in the SWTOR forums, yet I see the same exact easy faceroll combat in every other mmo I play...GW2, Tera, WoW, Wildstar, Lineage 2, EQ 2, AoC, Secret World - the list goes on.

 

What exactly are you looking for?

 

At least some of the older content felt like it had some challenge to it. Lots of people had trouble clearing the final class story bosses their first try. The final guy on imp Ilum would murder you if you didn't interrupt him properly. The big droid fight on Makeb, and the final boss was challenging for many players.

 

The game practically plays itself now, even heroics aren't all that challenging like they used to be. Before, at level it might take a bit of trickery to get through some of them. Now you just waltz in and clear the place out without a thought.

[Myracarrah]

Well, you can find 2 and 3 in Anarchy Online, and that's been around since 2001

 

Assassin's Creed style combat in an MMO would be pretty awesome, I will admit.

 

I actually encountered 2 and 3 playing Might and Magic back in the 1990s.

 

It's not a new concept, it's just not one that gets put into MMOs often.

[aztecknight]

Looks like EA/Bioware forgot to send the check this time. IGN, and the vast majority of game reviewers, have already massively discredited themselves. If you play the game why do you need to read a review. If you don't play the game it's Free to Play, try it out and see if you like it. Taking advice from a guy who may be on the take is silly.