Darth_Victus Posted November 21, 2015 Share Posted November 21, 2015 Warning, some spoilers will be mentioned! So what's up with all the "soft Sith" we are getting now? Lana seems to have gone soft, (and maybe a bit disloyal for those who romanced her) but she covers it well with her intelligence. And don't get me started on Darth Marr. He shows up as a Force Ghost to talk to Satale!? As I understand in lore, only Jedi or those attuned to the light side of the Force can become a Force Ghost. And then later on, we come across another former Sith Acolyte hiding on Nar Shaddaa who is more concerned about protecting the people of Nar Shaddaa. Just makes me miss Jaesa all the more. I want my blood thirsty wife back. Also, don't take this post to seriously. This was done in fun and in good spirit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Codedrago Posted November 21, 2015 Share Posted November 21, 2015 And don't get me started on Darth Marr. He shows up as a Force Ghost to talk to Satale!? As I understand in lore, only Jedi or those attuned to the light side of the Force can become a Force Ghost. ...HAVE YOU PLAYED THE GAME!? There's Sith Force Ghosts all over the bloody place Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hadoken Posted November 21, 2015 Share Posted November 21, 2015 Someone clearly didn't visit Yavin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrutchCricket Posted November 21, 2015 Share Posted November 21, 2015 Lana's a pretty clear outlier as far as Sith go. I'm still waiting for the other foot to drop. Marr I have no idea what they were thinking. Yes Sith ghosts exist. But they don't hang with Jedi. However in general, you're either going to get "rawr i kil u dead and torture your puppies" or nice, normal non-Sith people. A little subtlety is required to really get the nuance of Sith down. This game mostly lacks it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
QuevvenXiltyn Posted November 21, 2015 Share Posted November 21, 2015 Warning, some spoilers will be mentioned! So what's up with all the "soft Sith" we are getting now? Lana seems to have gone soft, (and maybe a bit disloyal for those who romanced her) but she covers it well with her intelligence. And don't get me started on Darth Marr. He shows up as a Force Ghost to talk to Satale!? As I understand in lore, only Jedi or those attuned to the light side of the Force can become a Force Ghost. And then later on, we come across another former Sith Acolyte hiding on Nar Shaddaa who is more concerned about protecting the people of Nar Shaddaa. Just makes me miss Jaesa all the more. I want my blood thirsty wife back. Also, don't take this post to seriously. This was done in fun and in good spirit. On Lana, I'm not sure she's gone soft, per se. She just needs this alliance to defeat Zakuul. I think she will sacrifice nearly anyone to defeat Zakuul. And after Zakuul falls... well... Besides, she always seemed to be one of the more pragmatic (LS) Sith. On Marr... Well, if he was light side aligned, he could become a standard Force Spirit (like Obi-Wan and Master Dinn). If he was dark side... Force Ghosts have been around for a long time. The SI story involves a few. And then there is the original KotOR. Where, if you play Revan just right you can redeem a long dead Sith Lord's Ghost. As for the acolyte on Nar Shaddaa, she was a slave/captive who because of Force sensitivity was sent to Korriban... in time for the Zakuul attack. In fact, if I read her bio correctly, she might have struck her Overseer down in order to flee. She has no interest in being Sith, or even trained. You can bet (depending on your character's outlook) that if she survives until the fall of Zakuul, you may well want her to finish training/be trained as a Jedi/be killed for slaying her Overseer. The Jedi would see an untrained Force user (especially one trained in Sith ways) as very dangerous to leave alone. And the Sith... well, she must finish her training. Or die in the attempt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
QuevvenXiltyn Posted November 21, 2015 Share Posted November 21, 2015 Lana's a pretty clear outlier as far as Sith go. I'm still waiting for the other foot to drop. Marr I have no idea what they were thinking. Yes Sith ghosts exist. But they don't hang with Jedi. However in general, you're either going to get "rawr i kil u dead and torture your puppies" or nice, normal non-Sith people. A little subtlety is required to really get the nuance of Sith down. This game mostly lacks it. They will hang with Jedi if a) the situation demands it (Zakuul and the Emperor being rather big situations) and/or b) they are trying to corrupt/tempt said Jedi. Of course, in the case of Marr, it is arguable that he might have been one of the most Light Sided of all the Sith in the Empire. So it is also possible he went full Obi-Wan Force Spirit. And it is not like the "Empress" Darth Acina or any other Sith (with the possible exception of Lana and your character) who would listen to him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
freeoftime Posted November 21, 2015 Share Posted November 21, 2015 As for your spoiler, you might wanna play the SI story, cause that's nothing new tbh. And tbh I quote enjoy having actually pragmatic and smart Sith around, the code says "Peace is a lie, there is only passion" not "Peace is a lie, be a complete freaking idiot". (There is a special place in my heart reserved for seething hatred of certain DS choices in the SI story...) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth_Victus Posted November 21, 2015 Author Share Posted November 21, 2015 As stated, this thread was started in fun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CrutchCricket Posted November 21, 2015 Share Posted November 21, 2015 They will hang with Jedi if a) the situation demands it (Zakuul and the Emperor being rather big situations) and/or b) they are trying to corrupt/tempt said Jedi. Of course, in the case of Marr, it is arguable that he might have been one of the most Light Sided of all the Sith in the Empire. So it is also possible he went full Obi-Wan Force Spirit. And it is not like the "Empress" Darth Acina or any other Sith (with the possible exception of Lana and your character) who would listen to him. Yeah, no. Those conditions are at cross purposes. And b) is a little against character. I'm not the biggest fan of Marr but the suggestion that he is lightside is pretty funny. You can tell that, just by looking at him:p But let's get this out of the way first: dark side is not baby-eating, puppy kicking, kill everyone you can all the time. Conversely, a character who does not do the above100% of the time is not light side. Darth Marr is pragmatic enough to form truces and temporary alliances. That doesn't mean he wouldn't flay every single Republic character he finds if he could without it being a detriment to the Empire. Now the problem with ghostMarr appearing by Satele is that the way the scene is presented he does appear more like a Jedi ghost than a Sith one. And that's flat out wrong. And on an unrelated note, I know it will never happen but if my SI meets ghostMarr... well, it's lunchtime. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rodyn Posted November 21, 2015 Share Posted November 21, 2015 (edited) They will hang with Jedi if a) the situation demands it (Zakuul and the Emperor being rather big situations) and/or b) they are trying to corrupt/tempt said Jedi. Of course, in the case of Marr, it is arguable that he might have been one of the most Light Sided of all the Sith in the Empire. So it is also possible he went full Obi-Wan Force Spirit. And it is not like the "Empress" Darth Acina or any other Sith (with the possible exception of Lana and your character) who would listen to him. Marr's hardly "light sided," he's coldly logical. Just because he's not bathing in blood and eating babies doesn't mean he isn't on the dark side, he's just incredibly pragmatic and believes in a strong, unified Sith Empire (which is a "Lawful Evil" government, if you want to use the DnD/Pathfinder alignment chart). Edited November 21, 2015 by Rodyn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
E-Zekiel Posted November 21, 2015 Share Posted November 21, 2015 Lana was never a hardline sith. In fact, replaying through SOR, I recently rediscovered the line, when accused of not being a typical sith, she says "I like to believe I am my own woman." Anyway, if you're wondering why they're "soft"? Because if you continue being a blatant psychopath with no regard for anybody else, you and the entire Sith Empire and the Republic are going to be wiped out. Period. *YOU* will be gone, or possessed by a force being much more powerful than you. That's why. There are two reasons to be good: 1. It's the right thing to do. 2. Self preservation. Try to figure out your sith's motivation Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Psychopyro Posted November 21, 2015 Share Posted November 21, 2015 1. It's the right thing to do. 2. Self preservation. Try to figure out your sith's motivation Yea I always found that the Jedi always saw this as more black and white. Where as the sith was not necessarily about cruelty. It's the old saying, one man's butcher is another man's hero. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Djiini Posted November 21, 2015 Share Posted November 21, 2015 I mean, not being a walking psychopath who murders everything that moves or looks at you funny isn't really goin soft. That mindset is WHY the Empire loses so often. Marr and Lana are pragmatic. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Audoucet Posted November 21, 2015 Share Posted November 21, 2015 Warning, some spoilers will be mentioned! So what's up with all the "soft Sith" we are getting now? Lana seems to have gone soft, (and maybe a bit disloyal for those who romanced her) but she covers it well with her intelligence. And don't get me started on Darth Marr. He shows up as a Force Ghost to talk to Satale!? As I understand in lore, only Jedi or those attuned to the light side of the Force can become a Force Ghost. And then later on, we come across another former Sith Acolyte hiding on Nar Shaddaa who is more concerned about protecting the people of Nar Shaddaa. Just makes me miss Jaesa all the more. I want my blood thirsty wife back. Also, don't take this post to seriously. This was done in fun and in good spirit. Bioware always loved dark good guys. They want the coolness of the Dark Side but without any of the consequences and inconveniences. Revan, Valkorion, Lana, Marr, and so be it if it makes the Jedi look like irrelevant bigots. Sadly, It seems to please a lot of players who want to play a dark dictator with evil powers, but without being actually evil. Me, I will use the first occasion to kill Lana, and to relieve myself on Marr-y Sue's dead body. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Audoucet Posted November 21, 2015 Share Posted November 21, 2015 Marr's hardly "light sided," he's coldly logical. Coldly logical is the definition of the Light Side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
branmakmuffin Posted November 21, 2015 Share Posted November 21, 2015 Someone clearly didn't visit Yavin. Or play the Inquisitor story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kahiel Posted November 22, 2015 Share Posted November 22, 2015 (edited) It's my understanding that Lucas changed his mind regarding Dark Side Force Ghosts. Origonally there were DS force ghosts in the Old Republic games as well as the books. Lucas changed his mind during the Clone Wars series and limited it to only the LS Jedi being able to do so. There was a planned scene in TCW that would have had the force ghost of Revan but Lucas cut the idea in favor of the DS limit. Mar was always weak. That is why we must rescue the Empire. Since Jassa has moved on, consider turning Vaylin from her brother and making her your new snuggle muffin. Edited November 22, 2015 by Kahiel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth_Victus Posted November 22, 2015 Author Share Posted November 22, 2015 (edited) Or play the Inquisitor story. Actually I have done both. As I said at the end of the initial post, this thread is not to be taken seriously and I am just having fun by creating a thread not discussing the companion nerf or upcoming buff. Not threatening to unsub for blah blah reason. Just pure fun and getting people to talk about something else entirely. Which I have succeeded in doing. Edited November 22, 2015 by Darth_Victus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darth_Victus Posted November 22, 2015 Author Share Posted November 22, 2015 It's my understanding that Lucas changed his mind regarding Dark Side Force Ghosts. Origonally there were DS force ghosts in the Old Republic games as well as the books. Lucas changed his mind during the Clone Wars series and limited it to only the LS Jedi being able to do so. There was a planned scene in TCW that would have had the force ghost of Revan but Lucas cut the idea in favor of the DS limit. Mar was always weak. That is why we must rescue the Empire. Since Jassa has moved on, consider turning Vaylin from her brother and making her your new snuggle muffin. Vaylin wants me, she just doesn't know it yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmwfte Posted November 22, 2015 Share Posted November 22, 2015 (edited) Beniko = Kenobi Edited November 22, 2015 by tmwfte Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Audoucet Posted November 22, 2015 Share Posted November 22, 2015 Just pure fun and getting people to talk about something else entirely. http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=853794 Knock yourself out ! XD Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StarkHelsing Posted November 22, 2015 Share Posted November 22, 2015 Beniko = Kenobi Mind = Blown. I didn't notice Beniko was an anagram for Kenobi till you wrote it out, damn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
E-Zekiel Posted November 22, 2015 Share Posted November 22, 2015 Mind = Blown. I didn't notice Beniko was an anagram for Kenobi till you wrote it out, damn. Same Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zarobien Posted November 22, 2015 Share Posted November 22, 2015 (edited) Lana seems to have gone soft, (and maybe a bit disloyal for those who romanced her) but she covers it well with her intelligence. I have no previous experience of her but based on the story I played so far. I'd count her as light side sith or dark side jedi; She does lack the insane torture scale but she doesnt hesitate to kill for revenge, sport, etc. Satele Shan doesnt seem to be bothered about the amount of murder and mayhem my jedi guardian inflicts on the most mundane tasks... Mayby she has a dark side too? And don't get me started on Darth Marr. He shows up as a Force Ghost to talk to Satale!? As I understand in lore, only Jedi or those attuned to the light side of the Force can become a Force Ghost. This is a jedi lie... Sith Inquisitor binds more Sith ghosts than Jedi ones, Sith Inquisitor ancester frequently visits him/her as force ghost, Darth Vader becomes force ghost, Emperor valkyrion becomes force ghost... And then later on, we come across another former Sith Acolyte hiding on Nar Shaddaa who is more concerned about protecting the people of Nar Shaddaa. Makes absolytely no sence if his/her masters powerbase isnt in Nar Shaddaa. I suggest zapping him/her a bit. Edited November 22, 2015 by Zarobien Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmwfte Posted November 22, 2015 Share Posted November 22, 2015 Emperor valkyrion becomes force ghost... I don't think we actually know what Valkorion is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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