Who finds combat in SWTOR fun?

[YankeeDelta]

I've noticed that many of the arguments in favor of the 4.2 companion nerf center around the idea that players who enjoyed the 4.0 companions should Learn 2 Play because they are missing out on the CHALLENGE of the game.

 

After giving it some thought, I believe the core issue since launch has been that combat in SWTOR is simply not very much FUN. And challenge without fun simply becomes WORK for most people.

 

I believe the developers realize this, too, because most of the changes they have tried out over the years have been different ways of allowing you to skip as much of the combat as possible.

 

Personally, I found the combat in the Batman Arkham series to be more fun with 8 buttons than I have ever found SWTOR with the 30 or so buttons they want me to have mapped. Which is why I believe so many players were enjoying the 4.0 companions, because for the first time since launch I was able to stop focusing on the 30 cooldowns on my button bars and simply enjoy the flow of the combat itself. I saw combat animations that I had triggered a million times in fights but never actually SEEN.

 

And that... that was FUN for me. If I could have that fun and the challenge then I would take both in a heartbeat, but given a choice between the two I think I prefer fun with little challenge to challenge with little fun.

[LordArtemis]

It was fun at one time. Not so much now...but perhaps not for the reasons folks might think.

 

I think the balance crusade removed most of the fun from combat. The negative changes, IMO....

 

1) Animation and effect changes

2) Moving triggers to the beginning of the animation instead of the end.

3) Nerfing the animations and durations for AoE attacks, like OS and FS, instead of simply adjusting cooldowns/damage

 

I think these three things alone ruined one of the few things the original dev team did right....engaging, exciting animations that made combat exciting and fun.

[Ghisallo]

I actually find it fun BUT it depends on the class. Jedi Knight Guardian and Operative? Yes. Commando healing yes? Commando dps? Not so much (I find the rotation boring.)

[oneupkev]

yeah

 

if it wasn't fun, i don't think i'd be playing the game since it's a combat based game

[Neglience]

That something is no longer fun is only a dummy argument from those, who want OP companions back. They think this is the best argument possible to achive this goal.

 

It was pretty much the same for the slot machines. Much of the whine was about that it is no longer fun to use the machine. But what exactly is entertaining on pressing the mouse button over and over again and getting rewarded for it instantly ?

 

The real argument is, that those peoples want everything as fast as possible and with the least effort as possible. Those players are not casual players, they are entitleists.

Edited November 20, 2015 by Neglience

[Senkoau]

Personally I don't find it fun I find it confusing. Most games I've played have either had half a dozen buttons (mouse, games console controller, wasd/jump/use) or a bar of abilities. Here I've got 4+ bars of abilities that just leave me rather lost on what I should actually be doing. Do I force stasis, force freeze, force push, force kick, awe? All interrupts/immobilizers but when do I use each is awe better than force freeze for affecting mobs? does it have a bigger range, affect tougher mobs?

 

I've just (at the advice of someone ingame) shifted from one toolbar to have the 6 spread around my screen but I'm still no clearer on what to use where.

[TarKoFett]

I've noticed that many of the arguments in favor of the 4.2 companion nerf center around the idea that players who enjoyed the 4.0 companions should Learn 2 Play because they are missing out on the CHALLENGE of the game.

 

After giving it some thought, I believe the core issue since launch has been that combat in SWTOR is simply not very much FUN. And challenge without fun simply becomes WORK for most people.

 

I believe the developers realize this, too, because most of the changes they have tried out over the years have been different ways of allowing you to skip as much of the combat as possible.

 

Personally, I found the combat in the Batman Arkham series to be more fun with 8 buttons than I have ever found SWTOR with the 30 or so buttons they want me to have mapped. Which is why I believe so many players were enjoying the 4.0 companions, because for the first time since launch I was able to stop focusing on the 30 cooldowns on my button bars and simply enjoy the flow of the combat itself. I saw combat animations that I had triggered a million times in fights but never actually SEEN.

 

And that... that was FUN for me. If I could have that fun and the challenge then I would take both in a heartbeat, but given a choice between the two I think I prefer fun with little challenge to challenge with little fun.

 

Exactly, you my friend got it right, with 4.0 i was no more forced to wait for a def cd or buff or stun or whatever i just could hack trough the other wise boring old content which all the sudden became endgame content.

Some say it was brain off run through, i say it was exactly Brain off, a brain i have to use every day all day for rl, and if i come back home and im not in the mood of doing brain on chalenge mode ready content i want to do brain off but FUN old stuff that hase become endgame why ever.

 

It was so fun not to care if a dcd is up or if a stunn is rdy aso aso. Justz jump in hack your way through the dull content and have at least fun not taking care about rotations max dps which one to stun aso. Oh and being able to do it with an npc was the best part of it. My game my timeing my pace and MY day/weekly. I still dont understand how it matters that someone could godmode through anything solo? who cares why do u care, how dose it hurt you and your elitist if someone just enjoys the game as a game.

 

To be honest it is more brainless to follow a certain path and a certain rotation over and over again, instead of jumping in having fun and not care so much about all of that elite stuff.

[Kulyok]

Honestly, I play for the story, hence I always choose stealth characters when appropriate (though I love Sniper, she has to fight too much), and skip all the fights I possibly can. When I fight, I view it as a chore, and I regret there're so many obligatory fights in KOTFE.

 

Mara used to be real fun, because I loved force jumps. Now that the ability to force jump from any point has been taken away (there's a minimum distance again), no fun anymore.

 

Besides, I love nuking people. In DAO, I loved the combo "blizzard+thunderstorm". In SWTOR, the only advanced class that has reliable AoEs is Arsenal Merc. Well, and the Orbital Strike from HM, but that's it.

 

So, no, I don't consider combat fun. I much prefer storymode on ME3, when I turn on that electric blue assault rifle and just fry everyone and skip to the next scene with Garrus, Liara or the Illusive Man.

[DomiSotto]

Heh, I have over 40 buttons mapped on each character, since I need to include targeting options as well as the rotational, situational, defensives and support abilities. It's a nightmare for every character. But despite promising to condense the abilities, BioWARE instead added another one.

[ZanyaCross]

It's fun for me because I tend to jump around between classes a lot. If I'm going to jump into an FP I might even do a little solo to refamilierize myself with that particular character first. Gotta stay sharp.

[TarKoFett]

That something is no longer fun is only a dummy argument from those, who want OP companions back. They think this is the best argument possible to achive this goal.

 

It was pretty much the same for the slot machines. Much of the whine was about that it is no longer fun to use the machine. But what exactly is entertaining on pressing the mouse button over and over again and getting rewarded for it instantly ?

 

The real argument is, that those peoples want everything as fast as possible and with the least effort as possible. Those players are not casual players, they are entitleists.

 

Can u explain me what the problem is if some can rush through the solo content because it is easy now and MOST others finally have fun doing that content?

 

Why do u care so much about what someone dose solo, can u explain me that? Why did they not just give u harder content or a hc server where you elitist could be on your own and all the rest of us who want to have JUST FUN which is the most important aspect of a game cane go back to pre 4.0.2

 

Playing Games is all about fun, if customers give feedback that something boring and painful before became fun all the sudden, you should care more about your customers thatn gosh darn nubers teling you this and that.

 

SWTOR failed more than once but this time it is final for me, ill uninstal as soon as the left days of my 60 days sub goes off. Thats it EA/BW/Disney GG

Edited November 20, 2015 by TarKoFett

[nagada]

I find it pretty standard, though the increased mobility in some of the classes over the past few years and the companion nerf have increased my fun.

 

NB - I said my fun and not the fun. I'm just talking for myself, not trying to make a statement on nerfing or OP or what have you.

[Chaloss]

I consider combat necessary evil to achieve my goal and wish to do as little as I can always. Did not enjoy it before Makeb (before 2013 in other words), on Makeb, after 4.0 or after 4.0.2 just in case someone makes another stupid assumption. Also not really fan of having to relearn after system complete overhaul, especially as it seems to be different annoyance rather than better.

[ZanyaCross]

Can u explain me what the problem is if some can rush through the solo content because it is easy now and MOST finaly have fun doing that?

 

Because it's bulls***. I ran through Nar Shadaa in one hour last night and was still 3 levels over sync.

 

The solo content in this game is blazingly fast now, and there is no way I will ever believe the people arguing this in good faith were here for 2.X when it would take, if you were lucky, a day to a week to grind through a single planet. And given how much content there is now beyond the class stories? That's a good thing!

 

This game, even in the state it's in now, practically spoils you with how fast it moves up until the alliance building at the end. And you know, that last bit is a perfectly legit complaint to Bioware, especially since we don't know what if any effect that's going to have on the story, but throwing out blanket statements I've seen how the game in general is a tedious grind? That's just flat out ignorant.

 

More importantly, it affects my game personally, because then when players who never had to learn to play their characters jump into FPs, they either get destroyed so badly they never want to try it again, or I end up having to spend however much time trying coach and help them.

Edited November 20, 2015 by ZanyaCross

[Neglience]

Can u explain me what the problem is if some can rush through the solo content because it is easy now and MOST others finally have fun doing that content?

 

Why do u care so much about what someone dose solo, can u explain me that? Why did they not just give u harder content or a hc server where you elitist could be on your own and all the rest of us who want to have JUST FUN which is the most important aspect of a game cane go back to pre 4.0.2

 

Playing Games is all about fun, if customers give feedback that something boring and painful before became fun all the sudden, you should care more about your customers thatn gosh darn nubers teling you this and that.

 

SWTOR failed more than once but this time it is final for me, ill uninstal as soon as the left days of my 60 days sub goes off. Thats it EA/BW/Disney GG

 

I would suggest a huge amount of players crying loud now, were here berfore KOTFE release and probably are long time subscribers. The fights during that time were more less what we have now and i did not see the mass complains that fighting is boring/tedious whatever at that time.

 

Now, after one month of godmode, out of a sudden, fighting at a level before KOTFE release becomes boring and tedious and is a reason to unsub, actually made the game unplayable for some ?

 

To say, the "endgame" that game with KOTFE is boring is another point. I agree on that.

Edited November 20, 2015 by Neglience

[LordArtemis]

Actually there have been plenty of complaints about combat and the lack of fun for quite some time....especially with respect to the changes to AoE abilities.

[Copd_Onasi]

After giving it some thought, I believe the core issue since launch has been that combat in SWTOR is simply not very much FUN. And challenge without fun simply becomes WORK for most people.

 

I believe the developers realize this, too, because most of the changes they have tried out over the years have been different ways of allowing you to skip as much of the combat as possible

 

Players who wanted to (re)play the class stories were forced to kill X amount of NPCs in order to do so. And then again and again and again. It got extremely boring after a while. Hence the changes.

 

Personally, I found the combat in the Batman Arkham series to be more fun with 8 buttons than I have ever found SWTOR with the 30 or so buttons they want me to have mapped. Which is why I believe so many players were enjoying the 4.0 companions, because for the first time since launch I was able to stop focusing on the 30 cooldowns on my button bars and simply enjoy the flow of the combat itself. I saw combat animations that I had triggered a million times in fights but never actually SEEN.

 

No, you do not need to bind 30 abilities. You mostly just need your rotational and defensive abilities, and will be able to get through most of the content.

 

Combat is fine and is a strong point of this game; please leave it out of these pointless arguing.

[PatT]

I actually find it fun BUT it depends on the class. Jedi Knight Guardian and Operative? Yes. Commando healing yes? Commando dps? Not so much (I find the rotation boring.)

 

What he says.

[YankeeDelta]

I would suggest a huge amount of players crying loud now, were here berfore KOTFE release and probably are long time subscribers. The fights during that time were more less what we have now and i did not see the mass complains that fighting is boring/tedious whatever at that time.

 

Now, after one month of godmode, out of a sudden, fighting at a level before KOTFE release becomes boring and tedious and is a reason to unsub, actually made the game unplayable for some ?

 

To say, the "endgame" that game with KOTFE is boring is another point. I agree on that.

 

The complaints have been around since release, they simply weren't happening all at once. Players would complain, then leave the game and not look back.

[denavin]

I liked the OP companions. It allowd me to be a bad A*s. I did not have to grind and gring and grind. I'm not intrested in a stupid amount of challenge in the general popluation mobs including Heroic. Challenge is for HM Flashpoints and Ops. Let me go around and Kick Butt I'm a fricking Jedi for crying out loud. If you want extreme amounts of challenge then stick to Hard Mod Flashpoints and Ops. Leave the general population mobs easy. If you think that is a waste of your time... then DON't do them. But do not screw up my fun.

 

Many people liked the OP companions. Just look at the flame storm of the last 2 days in the fourms. There are more threads for un nerf the companions over 2000 comments in 2 days more then anything else. Let me easliy do the Heroic 2s solo if I want if you don't like that to bad. You will get over it or you can just leave I don't really care.

 

I play these games to have fun. Not to increase my stress level.

 

Since the nerf the fun is gone and the stress is at max level.

 

GIVE ME BACK MY OVER POWERED COMPANIONS!

 

To heII with the elitests that want every thing hard and frustrating. I don't have max gear or max companions or play tanks or healers. I like DPS classes and they are squshy and die easily, I need all the heals I can get. Dieing a half a dozen times per mob is NOT FUN.

 

Don't tell me learn to play. I play the way I want not the way YOU want. I don't tell you how far you should stick your head up your A*s. So don't tell me what to do either..

[mrsrachelm]

Nope, nor fun any longer. Companions are weaker now than prior to 4,0. And yes, I know how to play the game and my classes. No, I'm not a newb. Yes, I know all about CC, etc etc. Alliance system forces me to revisit old planet heroics ad nausea to grind alliance and companion levels. Making that even MORE tedious does not "fun" make for me personally. Edited November 20, 2015 by mrsrachelm

[YankeeDelta]

No, you do not need to bind 30 abilities. You mostly just need your rotational and defensive abilities, and will be able to get through most of the content.

 

Combat is fine and is a strong point of this game; please leave it out of these pointless arguing.

 

I include abilities like jump, cover, stealth, medpacks, targeting, and so on. Anything I need bound to a button.

 

Why, how many abilities do you have bound to buttons? Less than 20?

 

If the targeting alone were improved it would not only free up several buttons, it would also alleviate some of my aggravation with the combat system.

[maidelken]

Some of the classes, yes, others no.

 

I remember my warrior being painful as I died too much in melee in medium armour. But my consular was a blast and I'm really starting to enjoy my heavily armoured guardian.

[Hebruixe]

Some classes are more fun than others. Personally I find the lightning/telekinetics sorc/sage to be a lot of fun...as well as the marksman/sharpshooter sniper/slinger and vengeance/? juggernaut/guardian. I don't think combat in SWTOR is inherently unfun, but some classes just aren't enjoyable for me, such as the sentinel and (dps) operative.

[Draqsko]

If you are playing SWTOR for combat, you are playing the wrong MMO. There's lots of better ones out there with far more engaging combat than SWTOR has. If you really want combat to be the strong point of your game, you'd be playing Tera, Blade and Soul, Vindictus, Onigiri, Neverwinter, DCUO, those are games whose strong point and even major selling point is combat.

 

Story is the strong point and selling point of this game, not combat. Combat is ok, for a GCD type combat, because they do animation syncing so that it actually looks like your character is involved in fighting another person, instead of you and a mob standing there beating on each other's hp bar without any reaction except your own animations. Sure that's good enough for some people, because different strokes for different folks, so don't think I am demeaning someone who prefers this game's combat over others. But if you think that combat is a strong point for this game, you are sadly mistaken. It's never been in any top 10 list for combat, however it is always number 1 for story.