dapixelassassin Posted September 19, 2015 Share Posted September 19, 2015 (edited) Just more proof that Bioware / devs show preference to the imperial side and have no clue what mirror classes mean, for example...5 imp stuns on one class VS. 3 rep stuns on supposed mirror class. Get a clue I dont know *** these people are thinking, but maybe they should hire people that actually play SWTOR and dont show prefferential treatment to on faction over the other. Edited September 19, 2015 by dapixelassassin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FrozenGoalie Posted September 19, 2015 Share Posted September 19, 2015 Hey BW, mind explaining to me how the transpose thing works? Like, how does my BH do that? Seems like he must have some pretty fancy new tech, probably pretty bulky if it can do something like that. I'm impressed it's something he can carry something like that around with him in a fight. You sure he's not Force sensitive? Like maybe this should be a sin tank thing?... Also: jet charge. You are aware that, last xpac, you specifically put it at level 10 for tanks so that you can feel more like a tank as soon as you decide to be one, right? So... now what? What did you replace it with at level 10 so that you acutally feel like a tank? So far you've only said other abilities get delayed a level but you didn't say what's learned at 10 or when the new ability is learned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maraxuss Posted September 19, 2015 Share Posted September 19, 2015 These changes are beyond absurd. Firstly I was in the camp that ONLY tanks should ever have jet charge to the target, but you take the COOL tank skill and give it to the other AC's, and what do you give back, some kind of half baked transphased ability, that will never even go on my hotbar, so basically nothing in return, GG. Why would I ever use that ability, in PvE what are you going to put another player in front of the boss? in PvP which I mostly do...I'm not going to put another player, especially the healer in the midst of 4 other attackers. On Top of that it has a cast time..lolwut. Though in the case of Jet charge, even if it is your future design philosophy that all ac's get the charge, why in the world would you make it level 61, something that warriors get at level 2? No one in their right mind is going to roll BH tank now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dwillyjpox Posted September 19, 2015 Share Posted September 19, 2015 Jet charge at 61? I'm guessing their metrics show... Oh wait the trusty metrics Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Exly Posted September 19, 2015 Share Posted September 19, 2015 Soooooo, my PT tank - who has had Jet Charge since level 30 - will forgot how to charge, lose the ability, and have to level up to relearn it come expansion time? I don't understand... It makes about the same amount of sense as the fact that they wanted to give us a skill point at level 65, and that's why they are taking away the level 11 skill point. It makes me wonder if on days where they get to work late, if they then feel the need to leave early to make up for it? I ask because it seems to me that this is they type of logic that they are employing with some of the decisions that they have made lately. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VitorFox Posted September 20, 2015 Share Posted September 20, 2015 Whether you prefer bullets, missiles, or just plain fire, Bounty Hunters and Troopers have something for you! Read More Bullets? But that's not how... We use... Its not... I... Are, are you guys even aware of what universe we are in? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jherad Posted September 20, 2015 Share Posted September 20, 2015 The only reason I can think of for gimping one of the weakest PvP classes in the game like this was that some Merc touched a dev in the no-no during a livestream. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LucasEighty Posted September 20, 2015 Share Posted September 20, 2015 Nerfing hold the line for mandos & giving vanguards storm is a bad idea Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raansu Posted September 20, 2015 Share Posted September 20, 2015 Just more proof that Bioware / devs show preference to the imperial side and have no clue what mirror classes mean, for example...5 imp stuns on one class VS. 3 rep stuns on supposed mirror class. Get a clue I dont know *** these people are thinking, but maybe they should hire people that actually play SWTOR and dont show prefferential treatment to on faction over the other. The hell are you talking about? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PennyAnn Posted September 20, 2015 Share Posted September 20, 2015 Aren't you the same people who plan on having some of the content effectively down-level you? So as a tank you lose your gap closer? Maybe we can use the stupid new translocate power to switch places with a DPS who got their gap closer at level 10 like we used to.... Going to tank anything (like flashpoints??) as you are leveling up? Not as a VG/PT you aren't. There is a long list of reasons why these changes are bad and make no sense. Please play your own game, Bioware. But most importantly, PLEASE RETHINK THIS. You will not see a single powertech or vanguard tank in the game before level 61 otherwise. Not in PvE, not in PvP, not anywhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aries_cz Posted September 20, 2015 Share Posted September 20, 2015 Bullets? But that's not how... We use... Its not... I... Are, are you guys even aware of what universe we are in? Projectile weapons exist in SW universe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrintoSFJ Posted September 20, 2015 Share Posted September 20, 2015 (edited) I think at this point devs are out of ideas, they are not lazy, they are just out of ideas, they have no idea how to add more abilities for a class according to it's lore while keeping the number of abilities to a minimum. thus all the class will now get some type of mobility skill and some skills are being pushed back. I hate to be in their shoes right now but i would not have touched something that is already working, that is just asking for more trouble. What are they going to do when they will have to raise level cap again? Edited September 20, 2015 by BrintoSFJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xX-Archangel-Xx Posted September 20, 2015 Share Posted September 20, 2015 (edited) Aren't you the same people who plan on having some of the content effectively down-level you? So as a tank you lose your gap closer? Maybe we can use the stupid new translocate power to switch places with a DPS who got their gap closer at level 10 like we used to.... Going to tank anything (like flashpoints??) as you are leveling up? Not as a VG/PT you aren't. There is a long list of reasons why these changes are bad and make no sense. Please play your own game, Bioware. But most importantly, PLEASE RETHINK THIS. You will not see a single powertech or vanguard tank in the game before level 61 otherwise. Not in PvE, not in PvP, not anywhere. They want do it, but problem is game drops fps and for them is unplayable Edited September 20, 2015 by xX-Archangel-Xx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frenesi Posted September 20, 2015 Share Posted September 20, 2015 I think at this point devs are out of ideas, they are not lazy, they are just out of ideas, they have no idea how to add more abilities for a class according to it's lore while keeping the number of abilities to a minimum. thus all the class will now get some type of mobility skill and some skills are being pushed back. I hate to be in their shoes right now but i would not have touched something that is already working, that is just asking for more trouble. What are they going to do when they will have to raise level cap again? If they don't have ideas, they shouldn't be doing level increase at all. Really, of all things people will complain, NOT geting 5 levels more to grind is probably the last one. PVE is centerd on gear progression, PVP is centered on gear progression, storymodes doesn't even care. Or, if you can't provide new skills, provide new utilities! You have the great sistem for experimenting invented already, just expand it! You gave more utilities - you already are half way there! Just toss in 1 or more extra points, and -SURPRISE!- you just expanded class with minimal effort in it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlrikFassbauer Posted September 20, 2015 Share Posted September 20, 2015 Bullets? But that's not how... We use... Its not... I... Are, are you guys even aware of what universe we are in? "Bullet" rhymes with "Bounty [Hunter]". It is in fact an Alliteration. You don't seem to be well educated in rhyming. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dwillyjpox Posted September 20, 2015 Share Posted September 20, 2015 I think at this point devs are out of ideas, they are not lazy, they are just out of ideas, they have no idea how to add more abilities for a class according to it's lore while keeping the number of abilities to a minimum. thus all the class will now get some type of mobility skill and some skills are being pushed back. I hate to be in their shoes right now but i would not have touched something that is already working, that is just asking for more trouble. What are they going to do when they will have to raise level cap again? Out of idea's but not lazy...good one. How about we settle for less than abysmal effort? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UberSamoyed Posted September 20, 2015 Share Posted September 20, 2015 (edited) So I guess for tank's end game content, it's Sins or bust from this point on. With the worst int damage rating and defensive cooldowns in the game, PT tanks HO's was the big equalizer. If the timing no longer pans out for bosses like M&B and Revan, then that big advantage is toast. I always felt that the big HO cheese for Rav/ToS was payback for the lack of viability in previous operations relative to the other tank classes. Sure...I understand that there are far too many PT tanks in the game. The Starparse numbers reflect the big discrepancy. Yet, aren't the numbers really only a reflection of the number of people only running Rav/ToS? With the emphasis of running all operations for gear back in place, I suspect PT tanks are in a very unenviable position. I really don't perceive equality here. In fact, it looks like the old trick of nerfing a class to lessen the ratios. We saw it with Operatives. We saw it with Sorcs. Sorcs survived it because they could fall back on some other abilities. Yet, the Operative dps class is still dead. Does this nerf drop PT tanks to third? That is the question I'm asking myself. Sure, you can run any class, in any spec, effectively. But that's not the point. You are not going to bring the worst tank for clearing end game content into your raid group...and it goes without saying that clearing end game content may not be a big priority to the Devs right now. As I see it (and at this very preliminary point), the ratios are set for a big change again. Juggs, the least rolled tank spec right now, got a nice mobility boost. I guess their numbers will go up some. I expected that. PT's may well become the ugly red-haired stepsister of the bunch. Or, perhaps...the point was to match Jugg numbers to PT numbers. Did they? Good question. And then we have Sins. The magical tank just got a little more magical. And, I can't see a reason not to run him exclusively when 4.0 drops. I absolutely understand the reasoning behind all of this. Still, I believe lowering the desirability of being a PT down to Jugg levels may not be the best way to go. It would have been wiser to raise up the Jugg's desirability to the levels of current PT's and Sins. You know...true parity. And, what if lowering it down drops PT's below Juggs? Yikes. Regardless, I truly believed PT's and Sins were on equal footing in the recent past. IMHO, the only reason why PT's were so numerous was because mastering a Sin tank was harder for the general population. I kinda hoped the Dev's understood this. Oh well. Adapt and overcome. It looks like Sins or bust. Maybe...just maybe...that was the goal. Edited September 20, 2015 by UberSamoyed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrintoSFJ Posted September 20, 2015 Share Posted September 20, 2015 They want do it, but problem is game drops fps and for them is unplayable HAHAHAHA.... If they don't have ideas, they shouldn't be doing level increase at all. Really, of all things people will complain, NOT geting 5 levels more to grind is probably the last one. PVE is centerd on gear progression, PVP is centered on gear progression, storymodes doesn't even care. Or, if you can't provide new skills, provide new utilities! You have the great sistem for experimenting invented already, just expand it! You gave more utilities - you already are half way there! Just toss in 1 or more extra points, and -SURPRISE!- you just expanded class with minimal effort in it That could absolutely work, new skill and utility points without raising level cap. And they could have done it through an alternate progression system and they could even call it "outlander level". But i think they are just totally out of idea as to how they could do it without totally unbalancing the classes. Out of idea's but not lazy...good one. How about we settle for less than abysmal effort? That is why i said i would not touch things that are already working. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hoppinswtor Posted September 20, 2015 Share Posted September 20, 2015 (edited) "Mercs get a disengage!" - every other class gets a gap closer "Mercs need a longer cooldown on hydraulic overrides to compensate!" This is technically a nerf. The disengage is neither a buff nor a nerf because every other class is getting something similar, and a longer cooldown on a very important kiting ability is thus a nerf. Bioware has once again buffed sorcs and left their red headed stepchild in the dust when it comes to pvp. Not that it matters much, but it would be nice to see mercs a little overpowered in PVP for once. Edited September 20, 2015 by Hoppinswtor Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
idnewton Posted September 20, 2015 Share Posted September 20, 2015 (edited) "Mercs get a disengage!" - every other class gets a gap closer "Mercs need a longer cooldown on hydraulic overrides to compensate!" This is technically a nerf. The disengage is neither a buff nor a nerf because every other class is getting something similar, and a longer cooldown on a very important kiting ability is thus a nerf. Bioware has once again buffed sorcs and left their red headed stepchild in the dust when it comes to pvp. Not that it matters much, but it would be nice to see mercs a little overpowered in PVP for once. Now, hold on a second here. Merc is ranged, right? They shouldn't want a gap closer. I'd prefer disengage to a gap closer any day. Do I like the longer cooldown on Hydraulic Overrides? Mmmm no. Of course not. But I don't see the problem with giving mercs Disengage vs a gap closer. You know what I wish they would do? I wish, in addition to Disengage, they would give mercs Knockback Blast (the yellow-icon ability that a lot of droids have). It'd fit with the Mercenary/Commando vibe and it'd be nice for keeping enemy players away. Edited September 20, 2015 by idnewton Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cox_The_Beast Posted September 20, 2015 Share Posted September 20, 2015 (edited) Now, hold on a second here. Merc is ranged, right? They shouldn't want a gap closer. I'd prefer disengage to a gap closer any day. Do I like the longer cooldown on Hydraulic Overrides? Mmmm no. Of course not. But I don't see the problem with giving mercs Disengage vs a gap closer. You know what I wish they would do? I wish, in addition to Disengage, they would give mercs Knockback Blast (the yellow-icon ability that a lot of droids have). It'd fit with the Mercenary/Commando vibe and it'd be nice for keeping enemy players away. I think the problem he was underlining is how the fact that, now that everyone else is going to have one more gap closer, the disengage becomes less useful than it should have been in the first place. And htat the increased CD on HtL/HO makes it harder to escape, if needs be. Edited September 20, 2015 by Cox_The_Beast Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frenesi Posted September 20, 2015 Share Posted September 20, 2015 I think the problem he was underlining is how the fact that, now that everyone else is going to have one more gap closer, the disengage becomes less useful than it should have been in the first place. And htat the increased CD on HtL/HO makes it harder to escape, if needs be. Well, to be fair, it's only 20 seconds CD. Everything else ranges from 45 seconds to 3 minutes my *** ***** ************** Sorry, got distracted. Problem is, merc will not survive that 20 seconds interval. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Transcendent Posted September 20, 2015 Share Posted September 20, 2015 Well, to be fair, it's only 20 seconds CD. Everything else ranges from 45 seconds to 3 minutes my *** ***** ************** Sorry, got distracted. Problem is, merc will not survive that 20 seconds interval. Plus the fact you have to waste a utility point to make it useful, oh and if you're rooted or hindered, you're not disengaging from anything (especially with the increase of the HO/HtL CD by 50%). So essentially, you're worse off than you were previously, with an ability that is 2 expansions late. Pretty good deal right there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BadHoneyBadger Posted September 20, 2015 Share Posted September 20, 2015 Rereading the article, you are correct. New question. How is that ability remotely useful when solo? What use is it during the story when it is just you and a companion? Sounds worthless unless grouped. I have a question with this as well from a tanking standpoint because this is also going to change a passive ( I think it is passive) from our skill tree as well. When running FPs or even trash pulls in ops flame sweep is a way to tag all mobs before your AoE taunt. This brings me to FLAME SURGE you get at level 40, is this getting replaced with something viable since it works off of Jet Charge? Translocate is something I just don't get either, I am suppose to tank by running away? This skill really does more harm than good. Use it at the wrong time suddenly a healer or rDps is getting AoE or conal damage. I would seriously rethink this ability and when you offer Jet Charge. Solution is leaving it in the PT Tank skill tree and just making it trainable by others at 61. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cyrusramsey Posted September 21, 2015 Share Posted September 21, 2015 (edited) I assume translocate is meant to be used by tanks who are not already where they are supposed to be. This makes it highly situational.. except maybe if you pug with maras a lot, then it might actually compensate for your lack of a charge... To me it sounds like a welcome ability, if only as an extra tool to assist people in getting datacrons, but putting the charge at lvl61 for tanks is just really bad. I'm afraid that the train of thought is that tanking abilities won't be needed anymore while leveling, now that SM FPs are turned into Tacticals. Making the charge a lvl10 ability was the one class change in 3.0 that I was very happy with. Edited September 21, 2015 by cyrusramsey Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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