Raphael_diSanto Posted February 15, 2015 Share Posted February 15, 2015 (edited) Sounds like a simple spatial calculation to me.... As a digital cartography and spatial programmer in RL, this is stuff I do every day. It's not rocket science. The game's refusal to grab the guy RIGHT NEXT TO ME who's shooting me in the face, and insisting that the mob way over there ---------------> is the 'nearest' one is - and has been since launch - one of the biggest annoyances in TOR. Edited February 15, 2015 by Raphael_diSanto Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZoeyWash Posted February 16, 2015 Share Posted February 16, 2015 (edited) Soon Working As Intended "bah, bah, ooteenee" (Rough translation = 'is not bug, is feature') Edited February 16, 2015 by ZoeyWash Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max_Killjoy Posted February 16, 2015 Share Posted February 16, 2015 They sure can pump out the vapid shinies, however. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kheldryn Posted February 16, 2015 Share Posted February 16, 2015 Yes, BW can pump out Cartel items left and right, fix targeting?, Way too much to ask for. Might as well ask for a free Hypercrate, not likely to get either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calypsissmexy Posted February 16, 2015 Share Posted February 16, 2015 They use non Euclidean geometry to calculate the "nearest" enemy. Do you see Dagon complaining? Nope. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OddballEasyEight Posted February 16, 2015 Share Posted February 16, 2015 I think it's "nearest enemy in line of sight" so if there's an enemy right outside your LOS shooting at you, it still won't target that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AshlaBoga Posted February 16, 2015 Share Posted February 16, 2015 (edited) They use non Euclidean geometry to calculate the "nearest" enemy. Do you see Dagon complaining? Nope. I saw Cthulu at Austin recently, she/he/it was getting a snack at Starbucks, hope the Barrista tasted good. Edited February 16, 2015 by AshlaBoga Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calypsissmexy Posted February 16, 2015 Share Posted February 16, 2015 I think it's "nearest enemy in line of sight" so if there's an enemy right outside your LOS shooting at you, it still won't target that. Which is stunningly frustrating if you aren't ranged. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calypsissmexy Posted February 16, 2015 Share Posted February 16, 2015 I saw Cthulu at Austin recently, she/he/it was getting a snack at Starbucks, hope the Barrista tasted good. If Cthulhu is on the dev team I will give it a pass in hopes that he eats the people who keep designing bugged armors. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlaricSevGirl Posted February 16, 2015 Share Posted February 16, 2015 Hmm...you want them to fix this when they can't fix cape clipping and persist in adding them to armor pieces? Never going to happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OddballEasyEight Posted February 16, 2015 Share Posted February 16, 2015 Which is stunningly frustrating if you aren't ranged. I know... not saying it's good... just saying that's how it is. (I think) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlrikFassbauer Posted February 16, 2015 Share Posted February 16, 2015 Yesterday I noticed with my Sage that he doesn't alw<ys pick the nearest enemy - only the nearest he can see ! Since he isn't able to actually see enemies standing in hios back - like we RL humans do - he thus cannot target them as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
calypsissmexy Posted February 16, 2015 Share Posted February 16, 2015 Yesterday I noticed with my Sage that he doesn't alw<ys pick the nearest enemy - only the nearest he can see ! Since he isn't able to actually see enemies standing in hios back - like we RL humans do - he thus cannot target them as well. If they want it to work like that they needed to make it a first person game. They also need to completely remove the ability to target enemies outside your line of sight. As it works now it just trolls melee. "Oh, you must want to target that guy 30 feet away and not this dread assassin wailing on you 2 feet to your left." Yes, thank you crappy auto-target. Now I can spam my melee attack a few times before I realize my target is that guy way off on the horizon and junk my dps. "You are welcome...******e." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vhaegrant Posted February 16, 2015 Share Posted February 16, 2015 (edited) Sounds like a simple spatial calculation to me.... As a digital cartography and spatial programmer in RL, this is stuff I do every day. It's not rocket science. The game's refusal to grab the guy RIGHT NEXT TO ME who's shooting me in the face, and insisting that the mob way over there ---------------> is the 'nearest' one is - and has been since launch - one of the biggest annoyances in TOR. I don't know, have you tried turning your character to face the prospective target and then click? 10 melee based characters and I've yet to have any targeting issues, about the only thing I make sure is targeting within screen is turned off in the preferences (but I think that's default setting anyway) Target nearest enemy doesn't tend to be set by default either, you have to go into key bindings and set it. Edited February 16, 2015 by Vhaegrant Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZoeyWash Posted February 17, 2015 Share Posted February 17, 2015 Yesterday I noticed with my Sage that he doesn't alw<ys pick the nearest enemy - only the nearest he can see ! Since he isn't able to actually see enemies standing in hios back - like we RL humans do - he thus cannot target them as well. This is an interesting hypothesis, but I don't think it's correct. I have witnessed, particularly with classes that are Ranged and Melee (like Cons/Inqs) that the game will sometimes ignore the "red name' right in front of you nose (directly in your LoS) and select an enemy further away. From my own (albeit not exactly 'exhaustive') research, I think the game assigns a "number" to enemies you have aggro'd, and uses that to not only decide the "next' enemy (when you press "Tab") but also to decide who is the "nearest enemy" when you kill the current one. If no other enemies have 'aggro' on you, then I think it auto selects, not the nearest "red name" geometrically, but the next 'red name' who attacks you, and classifies that as the nearest "enemy". This will sometimes be the 'red name' standing right in front of you, but may also be the 'red name' 25 meters away.. Whatever the reasoning/programming used, it is flawed and annoying, but will BW do anything about it? ... Yeah right. In the immortal words of a certain Jawa merchant ... "Is not bug, is feature" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wiredgutter Posted February 17, 2015 Share Posted February 17, 2015 I don't know, have you tried turning your character to face the prospective target and then click? 10 melee based characters and I've yet to have any targeting issues, about the only thing I make sure is targeting within screen is turned off in the preferences (but I think that's default setting anyway) Target nearest enemy doesn't tend to be set by default either, you have to go into key bindings and set it. I assume he's taking about the setting where with no target selected an ability auto targets. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vhaegrant Posted February 17, 2015 Share Posted February 17, 2015 This is an interesting hypothesis, but I don't think it's correct. I have witnessed, particularly with classes that are Ranged and Melee (like Cons/Inqs) that the game will sometimes ignore the "red name' right in front of you nose (directly in your LoS) and select an enemy further away. From my own (albeit not exactly 'exhaustive') research, I think the game assigns a "number" to enemies you have aggro'd, and uses that to not only decide the "next' enemy (when you press "Tab") but also to decide who is the "nearest enemy" when you kill the current one. If no other enemies have 'aggro' on you, then I think it auto selects, not the nearest "red name" geometrically, but the next 'red name' who attacks you, and classifies that as the nearest "enemy". This will sometimes be the 'red name' standing right in front of you, but may also be the 'red name' 25 meters away.. Whatever the reasoning/programming used, it is flawed and annoying, but will BW do anything about it? ... Yeah right. In the immortal words of a certain Jawa merchant ... "Is not bug, is feature" I don't think it's as convoluted as that. Many players have reported from the earliest days that where you see an enemy isn't necessarily where the game knows the enemy is. It's more apparent with some abilities than others. There is a setting in preferences that allows you to place icons above the mobs that shows their place in the cycle sequence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vhaegrant Posted February 17, 2015 Share Posted February 17, 2015 (edited) I assume he's taking about the setting where with no target selected an ability auto targets. Well then, you pays your money, you takes your chance Especially if you're not willing to put in the minimal effort to turn your character. It was stated a long time ago that PvP would not have auto-targeting, so I would assume this is a PvE specific situation. The game requires very little of you as a player as it is when levelling through PvE and running dailies, keyboard turning is more than adequate to deal with PvE mobs. If you want to fine tune targeting you can preselect a focus target (maybe the gold/silver in a group) to allow quick targeting on that specific mob. But again it's rarely needed in normal play, although can be handy for tanks in making sure they allways have a quick way to get back their main target. Edited February 18, 2015 by Vhaegrant Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malastare Posted February 17, 2015 Share Posted February 17, 2015 Hmm...you want them to fix this when they can't fix cape clipping and persist in adding them to armor pieces? Never going to happen. The two aren't even remotely related. One is a user experience issue, on the order of "Do what I expect, not what is mathematically correct". The other is a very complex modeling issue that has known solutions that loads of the community does not want (drastic increases in CPU power requirements). I believe that the core of the targeting issue is a combination of LoS and the fuzzy positioning of players (the definition of "closest" varies whether you ask the server or the client... and will also vary between clients). Could it be improved? Yeah, probably. But the problem doesn't seem to have a deterministic solution. Instead, it seems that the answer which "feels correct" requires a combination of opponent position, movement (mobs moving toward me feel closer), and action (mobs attacking me feel closer). Also, the game would produce answers which feel better if it based its LoS restrictions at least partially on the player LoS, not the character LoS. These are things that could change, but it would require design and beta testing and as much as the armchair coders around here like to think that its a 5-minute fix, its not. Still: Go ahead and ask for the change. There is some good reasoning behind it. But its not the same as the cape thing, and ASG knows it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elyx Posted February 17, 2015 Share Posted February 17, 2015 Honestly, I don't think it's that bad. Go and play FFXIV for a bit, and then tell me if it's bad over here. the AI they use for targeting in this game is pretty decent compared to others. seriously, 9x out of 10 ill target the mob i wanted to in this game, or close. if i don't, then im usually close. I think they base it on field of view here (of the screen, not necessarily the character). and it often goes closest to furthest. Honestly, if you think it's bad here, you need to try a few others out there. It's not perfect, but IMO it's decent enough that it shouldn't be their top priority to fix. far more items out there to work on then the targeting system. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aerilas Posted February 17, 2015 Share Posted February 17, 2015 Sounds like a simple spatial calculation to me.... As a digital cartography and spatial programmer in RL, this is stuff I do every day. It's not rocket science. The game's refusal to grab the guy RIGHT NEXT TO ME who's shooting me in the face, and insisting that the mob way over there ---------------> is the 'nearest' one is - and has been since launch - one of the biggest annoyances in TOR. I've long learned to live with it and solved how it actually works. It targets the character closest to the middle of your screen. (If they're on a ~line, then it'll target closest to you first on that line in the middle of screen). So if you want to target something fast, turn your camera to put the wanted target in the middle of your screen. (Keyboarturning will make this annoying ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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