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BioWare, why does 'Target nearest' not actually target the nearest mob?


Raphael_diSanto

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Sounds like a simple spatial calculation to me.... As a digital cartography and spatial programmer in RL, this is stuff I do every day. It's not rocket science.

 

The game's refusal to grab the guy RIGHT NEXT TO ME who's shooting me in the face, and insisting that the mob way over there ---------------> is the 'nearest' one is - and has been since launch - one of the biggest annoyances in TOR.

Edited by Raphael_diSanto
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They use non Euclidean geometry to calculate the "nearest" enemy. Do you see Dagon complaining? Nope.

 

I saw Cthulu at Austin recently, she/he/it was getting a snack at Starbucks, hope the Barrista tasted good.

Edited by AshlaBoga
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Yesterday I noticed with my Sage that he doesn't alw<ys pick the nearest enemy - only the nearest he can see !

 

Since he isn't able to actually see enemies standing in hios back - like we RL humans do - he thus cannot target them as well.

 

If they want it to work like that they needed to make it a first person game. They also need to completely remove the ability to target enemies outside your line of sight. As it works now it just trolls melee.

 

"Oh, you must want to target that guy 30 feet away and not this dread assassin wailing on you 2 feet to your left." Yes, thank you crappy auto-target. Now I can spam my melee attack a few times before I realize my target is that guy way off on the horizon and junk my dps. "You are welcome...******e."

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Sounds like a simple spatial calculation to me.... As a digital cartography and spatial programmer in RL, this is stuff I do every day. It's not rocket science.

 

The game's refusal to grab the guy RIGHT NEXT TO ME who's shooting me in the face, and insisting that the mob way over there ---------------> is the 'nearest' one is - and has been since launch - one of the biggest annoyances in TOR.

 

I don't know, have you tried turning your character to face the prospective target and then click?

10 melee based characters and I've yet to have any targeting issues, about the only thing I make sure is targeting within screen is turned off in the preferences (but I think that's default setting anyway)

 

Target nearest enemy doesn't tend to be set by default either, you have to go into key bindings and set it.

Edited by Vhaegrant
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Yesterday I noticed with my Sage that he doesn't alw<ys pick the nearest enemy - only the nearest he can see !

 

Since he isn't able to actually see enemies standing in hios back - like we RL humans do - he thus cannot target them as well.

 

This is an interesting hypothesis, but I don't think it's correct. I have witnessed, particularly with classes that are Ranged and Melee (like Cons/Inqs) that the game will sometimes ignore the "red name' right in front of you nose (directly in your LoS) and select an enemy further away.

From my own (albeit not exactly 'exhaustive') research, I think the game assigns a "number" to enemies you have aggro'd, and uses that to not only decide the "next' enemy (when you press "Tab") but also to decide who is the "nearest enemy" when you kill the current one.

If no other enemies have 'aggro' on you, then I think it auto selects, not the nearest "red name" geometrically, but the next 'red name' who attacks you, and classifies that as the nearest "enemy".

This will sometimes be the 'red name' standing right in front of you, but may also be the 'red name' 25 meters away..

 

Whatever the reasoning/programming used, it is flawed and annoying, but will BW do anything about it? ... Yeah right.

In the immortal words of a certain Jawa merchant ... "Is not bug, is feature"

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I don't know, have you tried turning your character to face the prospective target and then click?

10 melee based characters and I've yet to have any targeting issues, about the only thing I make sure is targeting within screen is turned off in the preferences (but I think that's default setting anyway)

 

Target nearest enemy doesn't tend to be set by default either, you have to go into key bindings and set it.

 

I assume he's taking about the setting where with no target selected an ability auto targets.

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This is an interesting hypothesis, but I don't think it's correct. I have witnessed, particularly with classes that are Ranged and Melee (like Cons/Inqs) that the game will sometimes ignore the "red name' right in front of you nose (directly in your LoS) and select an enemy further away.

From my own (albeit not exactly 'exhaustive') research, I think the game assigns a "number" to enemies you have aggro'd, and uses that to not only decide the "next' enemy (when you press "Tab") but also to decide who is the "nearest enemy" when you kill the current one.

If no other enemies have 'aggro' on you, then I think it auto selects, not the nearest "red name" geometrically, but the next 'red name' who attacks you, and classifies that as the nearest "enemy".

This will sometimes be the 'red name' standing right in front of you, but may also be the 'red name' 25 meters away..

 

Whatever the reasoning/programming used, it is flawed and annoying, but will BW do anything about it? ... Yeah right.

In the immortal words of a certain Jawa merchant ... "Is not bug, is feature"

 

I don't think it's as convoluted as that. Many players have reported from the earliest days that where you see an enemy isn't necessarily where the game knows the enemy is. It's more apparent with some abilities than others.

 

There is a setting in preferences that allows you to place icons above the mobs that shows their place in the cycle sequence.

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I assume he's taking about the setting where with no target selected an ability auto targets.

 

Well then, you pays your money, you takes your chance ;) Especially if you're not willing to put in the minimal effort to turn your character.

 

It was stated a long time ago that PvP would not have auto-targeting, so I would assume this is a PvE specific situation. The game requires very little of you as a player as it is when levelling through PvE and running dailies, keyboard turning is more than adequate to deal with PvE mobs.

 

If you want to fine tune targeting you can preselect a focus target (maybe the gold/silver in a group) to allow quick targeting on that specific mob. But again it's rarely needed in normal play, although can be handy for tanks in making sure they allways have a quick way to get back their main target.

Edited by Vhaegrant
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Hmm...you want them to fix this when they can't fix cape clipping and persist in adding them to armor pieces? Never going to happen.

 

The two aren't even remotely related. One is a user experience issue, on the order of "Do what I expect, not what is mathematically correct". The other is a very complex modeling issue that has known solutions that loads of the community does not want (drastic increases in CPU power requirements).

 

I believe that the core of the targeting issue is a combination of LoS and the fuzzy positioning of players (the definition of "closest" varies whether you ask the server or the client... and will also vary between clients). Could it be improved? Yeah, probably. But the problem doesn't seem to have a deterministic solution. Instead, it seems that the answer which "feels correct" requires a combination of opponent position, movement (mobs moving toward me feel closer), and action (mobs attacking me feel closer). Also, the game would produce answers which feel better if it based its LoS restrictions at least partially on the player LoS, not the character LoS.

 

These are things that could change, but it would require design and beta testing and as much as the armchair coders around here like to think that its a 5-minute fix, its not.

 

Still: Go ahead and ask for the change. There is some good reasoning behind it. But its not the same as the cape thing, and ASG knows it.

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Honestly, I don't think it's that bad. Go and play FFXIV for a bit, and then tell me if it's bad over here. the AI they use for targeting in this game is pretty decent compared to others.

 

seriously, 9x out of 10 ill target the mob i wanted to in this game, or close. if i don't, then im usually close. I think they base it on field of view here (of the screen, not necessarily the character). and it often goes closest to furthest.

 

Honestly, if you think it's bad here, you need to try a few others out there. It's not perfect, but IMO it's decent enough that it shouldn't be their top priority to fix. far more items out there to work on then the targeting system.

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Sounds like a simple spatial calculation to me.... As a digital cartography and spatial programmer in RL, this is stuff I do every day. It's not rocket science.

 

The game's refusal to grab the guy RIGHT NEXT TO ME who's shooting me in the face, and insisting that the mob way over there ---------------> is the 'nearest' one is - and has been since launch - one of the biggest annoyances in TOR.

 

I've long learned to live with it and solved how it actually works. It targets the character closest to the middle of your screen. (If they're on a ~line, then it'll target closest to you first on that line in the middle of screen).

So if you want to target something fast, turn your camera to put the wanted target in the middle of your screen. (Keyboarturning will make this annoying ;) )

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