No more SKILL TREES is crazy

[Vashforth]

Because that sounds to me exactly like even MORE hybrid spec

 

 

 

Face it, now you can be one spec then cherry pick skills you like from A COMPLETE DIFFERENT TREE just because you like them

 

 

Why not Jedi with blaster up next then?

 

 

Or how do I like follow up to my Thermal Detonar with a force lighting

 

 

 

OF COURSE

 

 

Hybrid ****fest, here i said it

 

OP

 

 

Spacing like this

 

 

 

does not make

 

 

 

your point more valid.

[DarthTHC]

This seems very Star Wars Galaxies NGE'ish

 

Not even close.

[OddballEasyEight]

Probably, mostly ....listen to yourself

 

The truth is that you DO NOT know what they have taken and what is going away, you DO NOT know if anadvance class will still play the same, you DO NOT know if abilities you liked will be now somewhere else and you will not basically be able to keep your build, something you came to know and are proficient in using

 

Big part of this game where mechanics, now they change them. And we will be FORCED to adapt to whatever change has been made without asking or demanding it at all

 

Oh good, someone who DOES NOT KNOW what it will be like after the patch is arguing with someone who doesn't agree and is now accusing him of NOT KNOWING what it will be like after the patch.

 

Yeah, sounds like the SWTOR forums allright!

[ninjonxb]

Mists of Pandaria did something similar. But I think they went way to far to the simple side of things.

This seems like a middle ground between what WoW did with Mists of Pandaria and the standard skill trees.

 

But at the end of the day the skill trees (in pretty much any MMO I have seen) has always been more about the illusion of choice then actually anything substantive.

Sure you may have had a couple choices here or there. But at the end of the day there were many points that you were pretty much forced to get (by the UI) that really only made a bit of a difference while you are leveling but didn't matter at end game.

From the look of this they are removing the need to mindlessly spend points in things you are forced to spend them in.

[Gardimuer]

Because everyone's builds in this game were so different.

 

Take a look at some of the currently popular hybrids.

[azudelphi]

Because that sounds to me exactly like even MORE hybrid spec

 

 

 

Face it, now you can be one spec then cherry pick skills you like from A COMPLETE DIFFERENT TREE just because you like them

 

 

Why not Jedi with blaster up next then?

 

 

Or how do I like follow up to my Thermal Detonar with a force lighting

 

 

 

OF COURSE

 

 

Hybrid ****fest, here i said it

 

A hybrid build (not saying a good one, but here it is) would be a Commando with Trauma Probe, Supercharge Cells, and Grav Round.

 

A Commando with Trauma Probe, Supercarge Cells, and Suit FOE is not a hybrid build. That's just a Combat Medic with a boost to periodic damage resistance.

 

That's the direction they are going. Flexible utility abilities without changing core identities. At least that's the way it seems.

Edited October 6, 2014 by azudelphi

[Vashforth]

Take a look at some of the currently popular hybrids.

 

Thanks for making his point. Go look and copy someone elses spec.

[MillionsKNives]

Because that sounds to me exactly like even MORE hybrid spec

 

 

 

Face it, now you can be one spec then cherry pick skills you like from A COMPLETE DIFFERENT TREE just because you like them

 

 

Why not Jedi with blaster up next then?

 

 

Or how do I like follow up to my Thermal Detonar with a force lighting

 

 

 

OF COURSE

 

 

Hybrid ****fest, here i said it

 

Yeah, because something like giving all assassins access to "decrease force speed cooldown by 10 seconds" or giving all bounty hunters access to "increase hydraulic override duration by 5 seconds" as optional utility is such a huge hybrid system. Totally comparable to having Jedi using blaster rifles...

[Krewel]

If you want a sneak preview, go play current WoW. That's it, there's your new talent system - less brain cells needed in what/how to play, more options for utility skills. You'll be able to change "specs" (meaning utility skills) from boss to boss in a few seconds, it will be less cumbersome and far more noob-friendly than it already is. Picking mandatory skills like "increase total Cunning by X" will be a thing of the past, and, to be perfectly honest, such skills only provide the illusion of free choice anyway. A skill like that is a perfect example of "filler" and noone will miss it.

[RodneyMcNeely]

If I can just add something to my Guardian that makes me feel a bit more "martial artsy", I will be happy.

 

Maybe something with more elbow, knee, sweep, kick animations?

 

Oh please, oh please, oh please, oh please!!!

[ScarletBlaze]

Maybe wait and see and they are looking to have a video to explain this as well.

 

Developer Update: Introduction to Disciplines | 10.06.2014, 12:37 PM

 

Actually, you sure can see video of it . We are still locking down details but it is our goal to do a special live stream tomorrow to show you Disciplines! We think the best way to understand the system is to show it to you. Our current plan is the stream will go from 2-3PM Central time.

 

-eric

 

http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?p=7709414#edit7709414

[NecrologyX]

holy moly... I'm going to quote an old friend from wow here before they redid talent trees in MoP.

 

Your spec sucks. You somehow managed to click 45 times in the talent tree (or however many points you actually get) but missed the most important skills? You failed. Congrats at being bad. Go respec or get out of my group.

 

Even in ToR today, there is only one correct spec per role. You either pick the "correct" talents or your spec is sub optimal. WoW was like this too. I cant even tell you how many times I'd see hunters go balls deep into survival and somehow skip explosive arrow. Its like "how can you fail that badly, did you play SWG or something?!?!"

 

So yeah, this is a good change.

[Gardimuer]

Thanks for making his point. Go look and copy someone elses spec.

 

I don't see how it makes his point. He's saying "everyone follows a single standard build", and I'm saying there are currently viable alternatives to the standard which BioWare's change will remove. We are going from a situation of some possible meaningful choices to 0 possible meaningful choices.

[DarthTHC]

I don't see how it makes his point. He's saying "everyone follows a single standard build", and I'm saying there are currently viable alternatives to the standard which BioWare's change will remove. We are going from a situation of some possible meaningful choices to 0 possible meaningful choices.

 

Show us two equally viable yet distinctly different specs for the same AC, same tree. Pick any AC & main tree you like.

Edited October 6, 2014 by DarthTHC

[Lotharofxev]

Mists of Pandaria did something similar. But I think they went way to far to the simple side of things.

This seems like a middle ground between what WoW did with Mists of Pandaria and the standard skill trees.

 

Yep. I remember that. (And not fondly)

[Vashforth]

I don't see how it makes his point. He's saying "everyone follows a single standard build", and I'm saying there are currently viable alternatives to the standard which BioWare's change will remove. We are going from a situation of some possible meaningful choices to 0 possible meaningful choices.

 

However, once ANY build becomes known as the best. Its over! Everyone will flock to it. Thats just how it is. I have NEVER in my MMO experience EVER seen 2 specs perform the same....

[Gardimuer]

Show us two equally viable yet distinctly different specs for the same AC, same tree. Pick any AC & main tree you like.

 

That's easy.

 

Assassin/Shadow 27/17/2 tanking build which is currently popular for HM/NiM Brontes and some fights in DP depending on who you ask. The reduced AoE damage taken makes it superior to the standard build in the Brontes fight. The standard tanking build is used for pretty much everything else. Thus both builds are "viable" for different situations.

 

Sniper/Gunslinger 5/18/23 which has been popular in PvP for a while because of its burst potential.

[azudelphi]

That's easy.

 

Assassin/Shadow 27/17/2 tanking build which is currently popular for HM/NiM Brontes and some fights in DP depending on who you ask. The reduced AoE damage taken makes it superior to the standard build in the Brontes fight. The standard tanking build is used for pretty much everything else. Thus both builds are "viable" for different situations.

 

Sniper/Gunslinger 5/18/23 which has been popular in PvP for a while because of its burst potential.

 

Perfect example for the new system.

 

Now you get all the key abilities of the straight tanking build up through Wither / Slow Time, and with your utility points you can grab the reduced AoE damage. So... you're actually potentially in a better spot than you were.

[Reno_Tarshil]

They just took what WoW did in Cata and applied it here.

[Foambreaker]

If I have to relearn all my specs from scratch, on 7x55s, plus pointlessly level to 60, I'll probably switch to something else.

 

Why start over and end up someplace you have already been.

[Gardimuer]

Perfect example for the new system.

 

Now you get all the key abilities of the straight tanking build up through Wither / Slow Time, and with your utility points you can grab the reduced AoE damage. So... you're actually potentially in a better spot than you were.

 

I seriously doubt that. 30% DR on all the significant damage from a boss is way too overpowered for a tank role. I'm guessing that if BioWare keeps the AoE DR choice it will be reduced to 15% or lower.

[DOHboy]

However, once ANY build becomes known as the best. Its over! Everyone will flock to it. Thats just how it is. I have NEVER in my MMO experience EVER seen 2 specs perform the same....

 

I think you are using AC where people are talking spec within the AC.

 

best example pick a Watchman spec. There is one and usally only 1 build that people will use, it just makes sense there are other skills available but most the time they are unused/untaken and everyone who plays watchman uses it.

 

Then you can take combat, there is one and usually only 1 build for that spec.

 

If you play a Sentinel you will use one or the other build. There is little to NO variance withing a Watchman spec same with the Combat spec.

 

If you take a sage healer, there is very little variation (some but not much).

Shadow tank..yup, one spec.

Vanguard tank, yup. single spec with set skills with in a tree. The other skills just not as usefull.

 

What this will do is allow some specs to be more varied. Say have a Watchman spec that will add more AOE damageor a Combat that maybe takes some skills in DoT so less bursty and more constant but not a pure DoT.

 

Will this nerf pure hybrids sure, will it make any two specs the same, probably not. We'll have to wait and see.

[azudelphi]

I seriously doubt that. 30% DR on all the significant damage from a boss is way too overpowered for a tank role. I'm guessing that if BioWare keeps the AoE DR choice it will be reduced to 15% or lower.

 

Well, that's a matter of tuning of course, but the concept is there.

 

If I have to relearn all my specs from scratch, on 7x55s, plus pointlessly level to 60, I'll probably switch to something else.

 

Why start over and end up someplace you have already been.

 

The core rotation remains the same, the passives and ability enhancers are the ones that are now a shared pool for the advanced class.

[GRINnBARRETT]

I will withhold judgement until I see the actual changes but my initial thought is this is a good thing. This game needs a breath of fresh air & it appears the devs are trying to give it.

[EllieAnne]

Here is my problem - who decides what the standard build is?

I always take the "Increase force by 50" or "Aim +9%" options but very rarely waste points on something that will raise crit chance or healing or endurance 1-2%. So is the standard build going to be based on statistics i.e. what skills do most people use? Will it take into account all of the skills we feed points into to get 5 per line? A committee of players or BW employees? If so then what style of play is represented?