The Scam/Not a Scam debate storyline

[Theeko]

I know Lord, just trying to get it clear that everyone keeps arguing about it, they might have missed what I said.

[Anniahilus]

Maybe you should start a thread about the sellers problem, my problem is this one and i believe its very legit to ask for something that will make me as a customer use the systems put in place to do a legit transaction

 

No. I don't think I will. My point of raising that issue is to attempt to let you see the flip side of the coin, and to gauge your reaction. I think by the way that you poignantly avoiding commenting on it, it shows that you have put on some sort of tunnel-visioned crusader glasses to champion this cause. While I appreciate your conviction, you will more than likely lose more support by alienating open-minded people with such narrow viewed opinions.

 

Im a paying custumer and so are many people who have been scammed intentionally and with the purpuse of substracting credits from others using the system put in place by BW and making people ask for some kind of a safeguard

 

Here's an actually idea ... would limiting the visible decimal places on a price per unit display help? Or are you hell-bent on the /ignore function. Just curious.

 

A dissatisfied customer is a bad customer for BW ingame and outside the game and i will make it so this thread stays on top as so will be the thread on the suggestion box until addressed

 

Just a hunch ... it's been in game for how long? And until conquests came out and the material markets went on boon status, why was there never an outcry before? Right or wrong, scam or no scam, I have a feeling that 1000 threads would not make an impact and achieve any sort of outcome you're looking for. Sad to say ...

[LordArtemis]

I know Lord, just trying to get it clear that everyone keeps arguing about it, they might have missed what I said.

 

Fair enough, and It is a good piece of info to boot.

[LordArtemis]

Oh, and yes...getting rid of fractional pricing would solve the problem IMO. There is no need for it. The game does not use fractional currency. The fraction comes from dividing up the cost per unit naturally.

 

They can simply disable the fraction display, make it a whole number only.

[pquadro]

Bububububu weeekend

[khsolo]

I would like to have a filter added to the GTN where it will NOT show any stuff from people i place in my /ignore list who i deem untrustworthy

 

Anyone can price anything the price they want and i respect that but the fact that some do it with the sole intent of scamming makes the that seller untrustworthy for me thus i would like his name be in my /ignore list for GTN is that simple

 

I dont want to do busines with people i deem untrustworthy and since i cant filter per name i rather just /ignore everything you have to sell, that way you can go and sell your stuff and milllions of credits and see if someelse feels thats the right price, your grossy overpriced items wont appear on my list

 

As a matter of fact ill like to have your whole legacy not just one toon in my /ignore

 

And removing the comas wont help, i just dont want to do busines with people who i dont fell i can trust, its that simple

Edited November 8, 2014 by khsolo

[Muljo_Stpho]

These people try to spin off their idea in its own thread to escape the endless stupid arguments in all the other threads about it, and as a result we just get yet another ridiculously long thread full of the same bickering.

[LordArtemis]

I would like to have a filter added to the GTN where it will NOT show any stuff from people i place in my /ignore list who i deem untrustworthy

 

Anyone can price anything the price they want and i respect that but the fact that some do it with the sole intent of scamming makes the that seller untrustworthy for me thus i would like his name be in my /ignore list for GTN is that simple

 

I dont want to do busines with people i deem untrustworthy and since i cant filter per name i rather just /ignore everything you have to sell, that way you can go and sell your stuff and milllions of credits and see if someelse feels thats the right price, your grossy overpriced items wont appear on my list

 

As a matter of fact ill like to have your whole legacy not just one toon in my /ignore

 

And removing the comas wont help, i just dont want to do business with people who i dont fell i can trust, its that simple

 

Would you accept a flag you could place on the characters name, like perhaps a red flag, and then sort that to the bottom of the list no matter what kind of search you do?

 

I also suggested a green flag so you could highlight the sellers you WANT to do business with on a regular basis. They would get sorted to the top of the list.

 

This kind of system still displays the sale in case that seller ever changes their tactics, which I imagine a system like this might effect.

Edited November 8, 2014 by LordArtemis

[khsolo]

Would you accept a flag you could place on the characters name, like perhaps a red flag, and then sort that to the bottom of the list no matter what kind of search you do?

 

I also suggested a green flag so you could highlight the sellers you WANT to do business with on a regular basis. They would get sorted to the top of the list.

 

This kind of system still displays the sale in case that seller ever changes their tactics, which I imagine a system like this might effect.

 

That would be something usefull indeed i like both ideas but obviosully mine is more "permanent" a flag is a visual indicator

 

Any usefull and easy system that would help made the seller trustworthy by whoever is buying will be fine by me

[markcymru]

Second, while I understand your anger, IMO it is misplaced. You clicked to buy the item, you then either clicked OK to the "are you sure?" question box or you disabled the "are you sure" question box. Take responsibility for your actions. Was the seller taking advantage of the appearance of pricing on the GTN? Probably. Was the seller hoping to target someone gullible, and/or tired, and/or absentminded into over-paying? Again, probably. Is that a scam? NO! The word scam is explicitly defined as trying to deceive. The item you bought is the item you wanted. The price for said item is clearly listed. There is no deceit involved. Trickery? Yes Guile? Yes Deceit? No.

It may be a bit late for this, given how long the thread has gotten, but...

Here's what the Oxford Online Dictionary has to say about 'scam': A dishonest scheme; a fraud.

 

And here's what it says about 'deceit': The action or practice of deceiving someone by concealing or misrepresenting the truth

 

So on both counts, 'scam' and 'deceit', I think you're wrong. It is a scam, and there is deceit involved.

[khsolo]

It may be a bit late for this, given how long the thread has gotten, but...

Here's what the Oxford Online Dictionary has to say about 'scam': A dishonest scheme; a fraud.

 

And here's what it says about 'deceit': The action or practice of deceiving someone by concealing or misrepresenting the truth

 

So on both counts, 'scam' and 'deceit', I think you're wrong. It is a scam, and there is deceit involved.

 

I appreciate you clearing up the terminology for everyone to see clearly, at least those who want to see

 

It is a scam with deceit and that should be adressed and since im not asking BW to do this for me im asking BW to give the tools so i can do it for myself

[sxykitten]

props to the person who's doing it lol. gotta give it to them nubs will spam click ok...

 

your fault op gtf over it you clicked ok. you pay the price gg

[_NovaBlast_]

I appreciate you clearing up the terminology for everyone to see clearly, at least those who want to see

 

It is a scam with deceit and that should be adressed and since im not asking BW to do this for me im asking BW to give the tools so i can do it for myself

 

So basically what I interpret you saying is you're not capable to pay attention to what you are doing and you need BW to step in so you can be carless ?

 

No matter how anything is priced there is no reason that anyone should by anything for more than they consider a fair price if that person is taking the proper time to do their research and take care and attention to what they are doing .

Edited November 8, 2014 by _NovaBlast_

[Levram]

im not asking BW to do this for me im asking BW to give the tools so i can do it for myself

 

The Developers have already provided you with three tools:

1. A search feature that allows you to specify the maximum price you are willing to pay.
   
2. The ability to sort listings by unit price from smallest to largest.
   
3. The option to have to double-confirm any purchase.
   

 

So, are you currently making consistent use of all three of these tools and are still making purchase mistakes? If so, you're now asking for a fourth tool to be added so that you can use all four of them to protect yourself?

[LordArtemis]

Well, I am asking for a tool that will allow me to get rid of my "no buy" personal list and allow me to mark the name in the GTN directly.

 

I have a list of players I do not purchase anything from. The reason is...well...they do not deserve it. A tool like a flag would simply allow me to move those names down the bottom of the list, and move the names up I want at the top.

[HelinCarnate]

/ignore people in the GTN is simple and easy and makes the market safer for everyone specially those who do hundreds of transactions a day

 

If its so easy, why don't you set it up for BW? Oh because you don't have the code for the game.....so how do you know how easy of a task this would be?

[HelinCarnate]

It may be a bit late for this, given how long the thread has gotten, but...

Here's what the Oxford Online Dictionary has to say about 'scam': A dishonest scheme; a fraud.

 

And here's what it says about 'deceit': The action or practice of deceiving someone by concealing or misrepresenting the truth

 

So on both counts, 'scam' and 'deceit', I think you're wrong. It is a scam, and there is deceit involved.

 

If the price is clearly marked and you are able to sort by the highest to lowest there is no concealment of the truth. If I walked up to at the electronics store and said, "I see you are looking at TVs. I have that exact model and Ill sell it to you for $80,000" and you are foolish enough to buy it from me was there a scam involved? What if you were not paying attention and didn't hear me correctly even though you had every opportunity to clarify the price before you made the decision to purchase and thought I said $80 and ignored the big price tag on the TV that said $80,000.00. Now does your inability to pay attention somehow turn it into a scam?

[Anniahilus]

*throws up hands in disbelief*

 

I want BW to give me a pop-up confirmation window to prevent me from continuing to post on this thread. It's really their responsibility to be looking out for me, and what I do, and how I spend my time in these forums.

 

/sarcasm

 

So OP, when they give you the /ignore functionality that you're looking for, and you start not seeing items from ppl that you ignored, what then? Will that bring back those credits you lost? Nope, and yet I think that this crusade you find yourself on is not for the greater good of the game. I think it's personal, and that's why you have you're head down, throwing your tantrum at the feet of BW.

 

If you look at the entirety of the thread, there are people that agree with you, there are those that oppose your view, and there are those that have offered ideas and alternatives to help you currently, and possibly in the future. but you continue to reject those for the "/ignore GTN" function bone you're holding so tightly.

 

Kind of feel sorry for you ...

Edited November 9, 2014 by Anniahilus

[Jrr_hypernova]

If the price is clearly marked and you are able to sort by the highest to lowest there is no concealment of the truth. If I walked up to at the electronics store and said, "I see you are looking at TVs. I have that exact model and Ill sell it to you for $80,000" and you are foolish enough to buy it from me was there a scam involved? What if you were not paying attention and didn't hear me correctly even though you had every opportunity to clarify the price before you made the decision to purchase and thought I said $80 and ignored the big price tag on the TV that said $80,000.00. Now does your inability to pay attention somehow turn it into a scam?

 

Fool your logic is no match for stupid of this magnitude!!! Tremble at the power of entitled idiots!!!

 

 

MWHA HA HA HA HA MWHA HA HA HA HA

[markcymru]

If the price is clearly marked and you are able to sort by the highest to lowest there is no concealment of the truth. If I walked up to at the electronics store and said, "I see you are looking at TVs. I have that exact model and Ill sell it to you for $80,000" and you are foolish enough to buy it from me was there a scam involved? What if you were not paying attention and didn't hear me correctly even though you had every opportunity to clarify the price before you made the decision to purchase and thought I said $80 and ignored the big price tag on the TV that said $80,000.00. Now does your inability to pay attention somehow turn it into a scam?

But there is misrepresentation.

 

And to torture your analogy even more... what if the price tag said $80000 and the salesperson said "80K", but you thought they meant "80, 'kay?"

Edited November 9, 2014 by markcymru

[LordArtemis]

People seem to have a bone and run with it on BOTH sides of the argument.

 

First there are those that say "its dishonorable, I need something to prevent making mistakes", and then there are those that say "its your fault, its not Bioware's job to protect you".....

 

And it seems like that is most of the argument.

 

IMO, it doesn't matter why the OP wants a system like this. Nor does it matter whether or not it is the players fault or it is a dishonorable practice.

 

This is how I see it.

 

1) Obviously it is a dishonorable practice. This is commerce. Dishonorable practices are par for the course.

2) Buyer beware. Oldest rule in the book.

3) It would be NICE to punish those that engage in dishonorable practices by denying them sales of ANY kind.

4) It would benefit the game, the market and the economy overall if some kind of system was in place to rate sellers.

 

For me, it is simply annoying to have to keep a character name list (which has 24 names at present BTW). That is an annoyance I can live with, so this is not a required change IMO.

 

But it would be a QoL feature in my eyes.

 

So, the question I would ask those that for some kind of change would be this....

 

Can you live with a simple personal flag system you could use to sort bad sellers to the bottom of the GTN item list?

 

And the question I would ask those that oppose this change....

 

Why do you oppose the change? If something like this were implemented, what do you feel it's impact would be?

[HelinCarnate]

But there is misrepresentation.

 

And to torture your analogy even more... what if the price tag said $80000 and the salesperson said "80K", but you thought they meant "80, 'kay?"

 

That is not the case here. But nice try. The prices are all one standard size in one standard format.

[Borderlad]

I just got scammed out of 8 mil cause of the price setting scam, since whats done its done ill like to ban those sellers that put this prices for appearing at my sellers list, how can i do this pls?

 

Need an option to just right click and ban their names and items from appaering at the GTN list for me pls, ty in advance

 

To all the people having fun blaming the victim: There's no call to pounce on the guy.

Sure, he made a mistake. He could have been more alert about the prices.

.....The prices that someone set at 1000x the reasonable price, counting on that exact mistake. Whether that meets your/BW's/God's definition of a "scam" or not doesn't matter. Whatever you want to label it, a scumbag used a visual deception to take advantage of a buyer. (The fact that most of us know to ignore an email from a Nigerian Prince doesn't change the fact that the person sending the email is a scumbag looking to take advantage of us.)

 

But telling him, "Your fault noob. L2GTN!" is not a helpful thing. (That was a paraphrase, not an actual quote. Don't get pedantic.) It's not helpful, it's mean, plain and simple - just wrapped in a failed attempt to disguise itself as trying to help.

 

There's no need to jump on the guy.

If you read what he's actually asking for, you'll see he's not looking to get anyone banned from the game.

He hasn't asked to get players banned from the game, or even from the GTN.

He hasn't called them out publicly.

He's not trying to get anybody blacklisted.

.....And anyone worried that what he's asking for would lead to blacklisting: Please list all the people who have been so oppressively and unjustly blacklisted from playing by mass coordination of the /ignore mechanic.

 

OP just wants a way to be able to mark certain sellers to not show up in his searches on the GTN.

There is nothing unreasonable or un-sound about that idea...

You find someone you don't want to group with or hear from again: /ignore 'em.

You find a seller you don't want to see pop up on GTN? It would be great to have a parallel mechanic.

 

Would this request be better placed in the suggestion forum? Probably.

 

But sheesh: He made a mistake, thought about something that might help, and asked whether it could be done... which later turned into a pretty reasonable suggestion. He expressed his frustration, but did so without whining or being a donkeybutt about it.

No need to jump his sheep, folks.

Edited November 9, 2014 by Borderlad

[HelinCarnate]

People seem to have a bone and run with it on BOTH sides of the argument.

 

First there are those that say "its dishonorable, I need something to prevent making mistakes", and then there are those that say "its your fault, its not Bioware's job to protect you".....

 

And it seems like that is most of the argument.

 

IMO, it doesn't matter why the OP wants a system like this. Nor does it matter whether or not it is the players fault or it is a dishonorable practice.

 

This is how I see it.

 

1) Obviously it is a dishonorable practice. This is commerce. Dishonorable practices are par for the course.

2) Buyer beware. Oldest rule in the book.

3) It would be NICE to punish those that engage in dishonorable practices by denying them sales of ANY kind.

4) It would benefit the game, the market and the economy overall if some kind of system was in place to rate sellers.

 

For me, it is simply annoying to have to keep a character name list (which has 24 names at present BTW). That is an annoyance I can live with, so this is not a required change IMO.

 

But it would be a QoL feature in my eyes.

 

So, the question I would ask those that for some kind of change would be this....

 

Can you live with a simple personal flag system you could use to sort bad sellers to the bottom of the GTN item list?

 

And the question I would ask those that oppose this change....

 

Why do you oppose the change? If something like this were implemented, what do you feel it's impact would be?

 

I would much rather just have the seller names removed all together. Its a waste of space that people use as a means to hold grudges against others they don't like for whatever reason.

[HelinCarnate]

To all the people having fun blaming the victim: There's no need to pounce on the guy.

Sure, he made a mistake. He could have been more alert about the prices.......

 

And for the most part, had he admitted in the first post that he made a mistake and should have been paying more attention and offered his suggestion to prevent that from happening in the future people would be more understanding. Instead he takes no blame, calls a legitimate transaction a scam and demands a means to seek retribution on those he feels have wronged him. Totally different situation.