Restrictions.

[Alphasgimaone]

The problem with the "X or Y Game does it better argument" is X and Y are different games and set to different standards and criteria such that any comparison is ultimately a false equivalency.

 

The one key factor here is SWTOR offers more content for free than any game that could be substituted into the comparison. Granted, most of that content is leveling content, and one can make the valid argument that, in MMOs, leveling content doesn't matter. But it's a different argument. The fact of the matter is SWTOR's leveling experience is completely unequaled by any game on the market, and EA had to take that into consideration when deciding what would and would not be fair to paying users. And non of the current restrictions are really relevant there. The quickbars, credit caps, color unification, etc. don't really matter when leveling a character.

 

Ultimately, and I've said this so many times now, SWTOR offers eight Bioware-quality stories based on the most popular fiction IP in the entire world for absolutely free. There simply isn't a better deal on the market.

 

The discussion ends there.

[OddballEasyEight]

Again, I queued as a Tank. On three characters. On both factions.

 

Until recently, the most I used to wait was around two minutes or so, unless it was really late in the evening.

 

Claiming or implying that people all over the sudden started to do mostly guild runs of LV55 HM FP's is as unlikely as Steve Jobs descending from the heavens.

 

Never claimed, just suggested it as a possibility.

If it was very recent, I'd blame it on the launch of wildstar.

 

But when it comes to stability, I don't talk about weeks or months. I'm talking about stability over a year or so.

There will always be dips, especially when a new MMO is released.

 

The progenitor was pretty dead for a while when ESO was launched... but then it bounced back.

 

EDIT: Haven't noticed as much of a dip with Wildstar, but maby ESO was more attractive to roleplayers?

Edited June 16, 2014 by OddballEasyEight

[OddballEasyEight]

The problem with the "X or Y Game does it better argument" is X and Y are different games and set to different standards and criteria such that any comparison is ultimately a false equivalency.

 

The one key factor here is SWTOR offers more content for free than any game that could be substituted into the comparison. Granted, most of that content is leveling content, and one can make the valid argument that, in MMOs, leveling content doesn't matter. But it's a different argument. The fact of the matter is SWTOR's leveling experience is completely unequaled by any game on the market, and EA had to take that into consideration when deciding what would and would not be fair to paying users. And non of the current restrictions are really relevant there. The quickbars, credit caps, color unification, etc. don't really matter when leveling a character.

 

Ultimately, and I've said this so many times now, SWTOR offers eight Bioware-quality stories based on the most popular fiction IP in the entire world for absolutely free. There simply isn't a better deal on the market.

 

The discussion ends there.

 

I'd say the general outline of the F2P model of SWTOR is: "You can level up to 50 for free, but you'll have to pay for end-game".

Of course, that's not entirely true, but the general feel of it is that.

And you get 8 pretty damned good single player stories (with Multiplayer options) for free

[Aizagora]

Like I said... PvP server.

 

I imagine that's because the game wasn't as PvP friendly as many thought at launch and the OW PVP is pretty non existant.

So playing on a PvP server is kind of pointless.

That, in combination with the general disgruntled feeling of many PvP players because Bioware isn't focusing on PvP (rightly so if you ask me, since the game isn't a PvP focused game) has driven off most of the people who joined the PvP servers.

And of course, with dwindling server population comes the inevitable character migrations where people simply switch to a more active server.

 

You know I was/am glad they don't focus on pvp, too many other games do it and it feels like an old hat.

[OddballEasyEight]

You know I was/am glad they don't focus on pvp, too many other games do it and it feels like an old hat.

 

I don't like MMO PvP, so I'm happy they didn't focus on that.

 

I loooooove other competetive multiplayer games tho, but MMO PvP is just too much buttonmashing and has way too much focus on the equipment.

[OddballEasyEight]

That said, I still think they could have released more PvP maps.

And I think they consider GSF PvP content so everything released for GSF counts towards their PvP quota, which is a bad thing since most PvP'ers don't seem to like GSF (I have my theories about why, but I don't want to start a forum war)

[theSCARAYone]

waaaaaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh

[MiaRB]

That said, I still think they could have released more PvP maps.

And I think they consider GSF PvP content so everything released for GSF counts towards their PvP quota, which is a bad thing since most PvP'ers don't seem to like GSF (I have my theories about why, but I don't want to start a forum war)

 

I mainly PVP and I love GSF. the reason the PVP forum 'pro's' don't like GSF? because it hurts their whining if they count GSF and arenas as PVP content.

 

6 WZ maps plus 3 arena maps isn't exactly a small amount.

[LordArtemis]

They do... it's called preferred.

 

You know what I meant silly rabbit.

[Thubb]

I paid for this game, and I was probably here long before you. There were no restrictions previously, and I shouldn't be restricted now because they decided to edit their business practices that caused this game to collapse

 

There was no restrictions previously because the game used a subscription model. (monthly pay) Now you can choose to pay monthly (same as before) or play FREE with restrictions , the choice is yours.

[ivanhedgehog]

Yes yes, there's going to be a great flame war because the only people allowed to post in the forums are people that actively pay to play this game, and support the ridiculous restrictions applied to other players.

 

which means to have posted in here complaining..he has to have resubbed, in which case none of those restrictions apply.

[Daekarus]

Most of the restrictions are easily gotten 'round by purchases in-game. I messed around as F2P when I came back but when I realized I could get XP and Reputation bonuses, in addition to all the other perks over F2P, I subbed back up. Now I get a 500CC stipend each month and it's quicker to level alts than before. I levelled a Bounty Hunter to 51 and I got to wear nice looking Cartel armor the whole time. There is more content than you can shake a stick at once you reach 50 and 55. This isn't the game I quit, it's far better and more fun.

[RandomXChance]

This reminds me of a conversation I was having the other day with a friend when they asked if I was going to try ESO or Wildstar.

 

While I do not agree with the ops specific complaints, the days of paying $60+ ($80 for ESO with the almost mandatory mount, or my foolish $150 for SWTOR Collectors Edition pre-order) and then if you feel it is not worth an additional $15/month, you are unable to play the game you paid for at all. I think ESO for sure and probably Wildstar as well will follow suit with some blended model to try and get more people to try them out without the big upfront commitment.

 

While there have been plenty of single player games I have paid $60 for and disliked, at least I always had the option of going back and trying them again later without additional payout. This is not the case with the classic MMO business model these companies are trying to keep alive.

 

While the F2P model in SWTOR has some rather silly restrictions amongst the ones that make sense, at least you get to play the game you paid for without the monthly sub.

[PorsaLindahl]

Technically, if you don't pay, you're not a customer. If you're not a customer, you don't and shouldn't get the same benefits that paying customers have. If you had taken the time to look at Subscription, Preferred, Free-to-Play Features page, you would've known what to expect and not be on here getting flamed.

 

Most of the restricted items (bank tabs, titles, unify colors, hide helmet, character slots, etc) can be purchased at the GTN, and they're usually they're pretty cheap. You still won't be able to use purple mods (unless you already have the item equipped) or get the loot box rewards (like from the Czerka weekly).

 

As far as your characters being moved, would you rather they had been deleted with the server that's no longer active?

 

You're OP rant is based on ignorance.

[Aizagora]

Technically, if you don't pay, you're not a customer. If you're not a customer, you don't and shouldn't get the same benefits that paying customers have. If you had taken the time to look at Subscription, Preferred, Free-to-Play Features page, you would've known what to expect and not be on here getting flamed.

 

Most of the restricted items (bank tabs, titles, unify colors, hide helmet, character slots, etc) can be purchased at the GTN, and they're usually they're pretty cheap. You still won't be able to use purple mods (unless you already have the item equipped) or get the loot box rewards (like from the Czerka weekly).

 

As far as your characters being moved, would you rather they had been deleted with the server that's no longer active?

 

You're OP rant is based on ignorance.

 

The boxes are denied to free to play and preferred player, just an fyi.

 

However, I have noticed that purple gear and mods bought at level 55 I could wear when I was still a preferred player. So I think it only applies to purples while leveling, which isn't so bad. It sucks when one drops, but I just tell myself it's credits in the bank.

 

Also someone made a really nice post about how the 350k cap really helps you balance your spending in game.

 

I also agree that his complaint about his characters being moved as childish. Like you said, they could have just deleted them as he hadn't played in two bloody years.

 

As I said in an earlier post, I do find some of the restrictions silly, even if I bought those unlocks on the GTN. But this isn't the worst model I have seen, nor do I find it to be the best. But this guy was clearly feeling entitled.

[Aizagora]

Though I won't lie it would be nice if preferred players could at least send money to their own characters.

[EduardoJN]

Yes, swtor F2P sucks, welcome back. Edited June 17, 2014 by EduardoJN

[LordArtemis]

Well, I would point out that studies have demonstrated a few things....please, if you want the links to the studies and Bioware statements, look at my post history. Id rather not dig for them again.

 

1) For 2013, the top three games in the MMO market were F2P or hybrid games, in both profits and players.

2) For the same year, an average sub paid 180.00, the average F2P player 280.00.

 

For this game....

 

1) Bioware has said quite plainly that F2P saved this game and gave it the most players in it's history.

2) The game has lost at least 1.2 million subs since launch.

 

However, they also indicated that subs have spent more money than F2P players.

 

Now, I contend that that is true because the F2P system here is so draconian that folks just sign up....and spend less money than they normally would in any other hybrid or F2P game. So in essence, IMO, they are losing money because of the F2P system they have here.

 

I do not believe former players are returning to the game in the numbers they should, and F2P players are not spending the kind of cash they should.

 

So overall, I believe the current setup is not sustainable. Eventually the levels of profit will likely drop substantially. And that is a concern.

[TUXs]

Well, I would point out that studies have demonstrated a few things....please, if you want the links to the studies and Bioware statements, look at my post history. Id rather not dig for them again.

 

1) For 2013, the top three games in the MMO market were F2P or hybrid games, in both profits and players.

2) For the same year, an average sub paid 180.00, the average F2P player 280.00.

 

For this game....

 

1) Bioware has said quite plainly that F2P saved this game and gave it the most players in it's history.

2) The game has lost at least 1.2 million subs since launch.

 

However, they also indicated that subs have spent more money than F2P players.

 

Now, I contend that that is true because the F2P system here is so draconian that folks just sign up....and spend less money than they normally would in any other hybrid or F2P game. So in essence, IMO, they are losing money because of the F2P system they have here.

 

I do not believe former players are returning to the game in the numbers they should, and F2P players are not spending the kind of cash they should.

 

So overall, I believe the current setup is not sustainable. Eventually the levels of profit will likely drop substantially. And that is a concern.

 

I completely agree with you. I don't know what the F2P is like here, I've always been subbed...but the current trend isn't a sustainable one. They need to make F2P far less punishing.

[ivanhedgehog]

I completely agree with you. I don't know what the F2P is like here, I've always been subbed...but the current trend isn't a sustainable one. They need to make F2P far less punishing.

 

+1 you hit the nail on the head

[MSchuyler]

because my brother and friends are playing, and I wanted to join them. Why do I need to state a specific reason for returning?

 

You don't, of course, but the fact is you abandoned the game for TWO BLOODY YEARS and somehow expect everything to be exactly as you left it. It's a miracle you have anything left at all. If it were me I'd delete inactive accounts after a year max and return the names to the available pool as if you never existed. It just amazes me that people think they have some sort of rights to something they abandoned.

 

If you abandoned your girlfriend would you expect to come back after two years and have her been waiting for you? If you left your home town would you expect to come back after two years and have a plaque at the local courthouse saying, "DynastyMaster once lived here!" How about your apartment? If you stopped paying rent for two years would you expect the landlord to keep it vacant for you?

 

Well, that's what you did. You stopped paying rent. Deal with it. Start over. Nobody, including BW, owes you anything.

[Khevar]

or, like me, the op was using his friends account to play the game and only recently decided to make their own account? did you perhaps consider that? or can you only comprehend two options?

Were you able to transfer the characters from your friend's account to your own account?

 

Or did you have to start over?

[Elite-Defender]

Were you able to transfer the characters from your friend's account to your own account?

 

Or did you have to start over?

 

No, I started over.

[scratcha]

No, I started over.

 

OP did not start over ...

 

Where to begin? Yesterday I returned to the game after 2 years to find my home server, Space Slug, was deleted, and all 7 of my characters were transferred without my knowledge or consent to The Harbinger server.

[Hebruixe]

Where to begin? Yesterday I returned to the game after 2 years to find my home server, Space Slug, was deleted, and all 7 of my characters were transferred without my knowledge or consent to The Harbinger server. "Interesting" I thought, and I looked into having my characters transferred to a server of my choice. Apparently, I am forced to pay 20$ per character I own to transfer them. Awesome!

 

So lets look past all of this, lets get into the game and experience the world I know and love. Ah, creating a new character. Wait, what's this? I'm not allowed to choose a Sith Pureblood race unless I pay "Cartel Coins?" But, my Sith Marauder, Thane, is a Sith Pureblood, and I surely didn't pay any money to choose that. Okay, lets just keep it simple, lets choose a human. Everythings normal after that, and I get into the game I knew from so long ago. Doing quest, everythings going normal, check my mail and see my anniversary gifts waiting for me. 2 years worth of goodies, and my pre-order bonus crystal, awesome! Lets continue on, lets get my quest on! Going on, smashing through NPC enemies and completing quest at record times. But wait, what's this now? "Subscribers can choose all quest rewards!" the game spews at me after completing a quest. "huh?" I ask myself. I remember getting all of these credit lockboxes 2 years ago when I played, and I never had to subscribe to anything. Okay then. Oh, this helmet I have is disgusting, lets remove it so I can see my face. What? I have to pay Cartel Coins to REMOVE MY HELMET? Oh, I guess my character's just retarded, and needs help from others to take off her clothes.

 

I can't believe you're treating a customer this way. I can't believe you completely changed this game into a dictatorship, so that I, a pre-orderer customer, am not allowed to make a POST on the forums unless I pay 15$ to subscribe to your game. I can't believe I payed 50$ to support your game before it even launched and now i'm being restricted to such a horrid degree. I can't believe I pre-ordered your game and I'm not given the Hutt Cartel expansion, when my brother paid 20$ to purchase a digital deluxe version of your game to get the Hutt Cartel expansion for free because he's a "subscriber." I, a pre-order customer, am not allowed to make a forum thread when I made them years ago.

 

Do you guys actually support the changes they made to this game? This surely wasn't here from the start, I did NOT have to pay money to choose to be a Sith Pureblood, I did not have to pay money to remove my helmet.

 

I can appreciate your frustration, as I have felt it too.

 

None of these restrictions apply if you are a subscriber. If you're preferred status, you're playing for free, and that's a lot more content than other MMOs like World of Warcraft offer for free. Just pay $15 so you don't have to deal with all the marketing BS.